The Sorcerer Unchained! Let's get the Sorcerer in Pathfinder Unchained


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Lets face it, how many times has it been said that the wizard(and every full spellcaster) is "better" then the sorcerer class. I would love to see what the guys(and girls) at Paizo would do with an alternate version of one of my favorites classes. The main thing I would like to see is a version that focuses more on the bloodline powers. I would like to see more supernatural, spell powers, and other abilities that would fit the theme of there bloodline. I would like to see better skill points, more class skills, and maybe even make this version a d8 with a 3/4 BA. But of course this would mean a lower level spellcasting(bard progression) or maybe loose spellcasting for more specialized abilities like a supernatural energy blast ability like the old Warlock class from 3.0/3.5. If it looses spellcasting then it should gain it's bloodline spells as spell like abilities once per day. If not a new version of the sorcerer class then a new class, maybe for a later book.


Eh?

What is there to unchain? Maybe lose 9 level spell progression and look into other stuff?


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Hmmm...

You had me up until giving it half caster progression. I'd be very against that. I love the sorcerer and prefer it to the wizard. I love that it's the other side of the coin as far as full casters go. That's my draw to it and changing it from a full caster would kill the class for me. I think it should stay a full caster.

That said, I'd like to see bloodlines similar to the Oracle Mysteries. A kind of "choose your blood power" thing. Better skill points is cool. Class Skills are fine I think, but more skill points is nice. But yeah, bloodlines could be a bit better.

Though perhaps the issue isn't the other casters, but the wizard. Maybe we need a chained wizard.


I would like the Oracle version of choose your power plus the feat option of getting extra ones. Though I think the final bloodline power(lv 20 cap) should stay the same. but wouldn't be cool if you want to play a fey blooded sorcerer and could choose from a list of abilities that fits your wants and needs. Like you could choose fairy like wings, invisibility, low-light vision, animal companion(-3lv?), familiar, fairy sight(see invisible), DR2-5/cold iron, spell powers, energy resistance, spell resistance, change shape(animal or humanoid), etc.


Actually yeah, making Sorceror d8 hit die would be pretty cool and they really should have 4 skill points per level.

For a second I thought this was a troll thread, but some good points are made.

+1


Thank you Insain Dragoon for agreeing with me on some of these points and no this is not troll thread.


Insain Dragoon wrote:

Actually yeah, making Sorceror d8 hit die would be pretty cool and they really should have 4 skill points per level.

For a second I thought this was a troll thread, but some good points are made.

+1

Yeah I'd be fine with this.


Hum..
I could go with 6spell levels, if they could gain some really awesome SLA/SU stuff.

Though honestly this whole thing sounds more like a new class rather than any sort of altering sorcerer.

Like Bloodmancer, controls the power in the blood to do various SLA/SU stuff. I guess like that 3.5 class people always mention . A supernatural energy blaster class would be cool for people who like it but don't want to be formal caster. I love eldritch blast, but it's really not that good.
I could see it built similiar to an alchemist. Instead of bombs they get that blast, then various bloodlines that express that blast in different ways. With some spells, all of which less utility and more violent and maybe blood themed.

i doubt sorc will show up in that book, unless they cover every class in it. Which would be cool but one thick book.

in general on Sorcerers, yeah I wish they were more bloodline centric.
I always kinda felt like : wizards big on spells, sorcerer big on powers, and now arcanist big on altering spells.
thats not really how it goes, but just how the ideas feel to me


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The wizard is better, but bringing everyone up to wizard level is not a good idea IMHO. I would give the sorcerer more skill points, and not make him use a full round action to apply metamagic feats. I might even let him learn spells at odd instead of even levels. That is as far as I would take it. They are already a very powerful class.

Grand Lodge

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Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Maps Subscriber; Starfinder Charter Superscriber

I agree with the 4 skill points a level and having bloodlines be similar to mysteries in choosing your powers. Haivng d8 HD would be cool but not needed.


Heck I already do both of those things Wraith and I can't say I've had any problems with them. I'm all for such suggestions becoming official.


Personally, I'd get rid of the Human favored class bonus and just adjust the base spells known progression to work like the 3.5 favored soul, but learning 1 spell of a particular level at the odd levels.

So at level 13 it's 9/6/6/6/5/4/3/1

At 20 it's 9/6/6/6/6/6/6/6/5/4.

Also, the bloodline spells shouldn't be set, but should come out of a pool of thematically related spells. When you gain a bloodline spell, you can pick any that is of a level you can cast.

Metamagic shouldn't increase the casting time, because the sorcerer has been practicing his tricks for a long time; it's why his spell complement only changes when he levels up.

For the arcane bloodline, their metamagic adept ability should be replaced with the metamagic mastery ability of the universalist wizard.

The capstone becomes a combination of the Eldritch Insight mythic path ability from Pathfinder Player Companion: Mythic Origins and the Master Staff and Master Wand feats from the 3.5 SRD.


And at some point their first and possibly second level spells should become usable at will.


It really only needs 3 simple fixes.

One, bloodline spells become available once the spell level is reached instead of the one after.

Two, bloodline powers come from a pool of abilities that the player can pick and choose from similar to oracle revelations.

Third, an addendum that states these powers can't ever be taken by a wizard and any future feats or magic items that would do so are to be ignored as obvious editing errors.


Orthos wrote:
Heck I already do both of those things Wraith and I can't say I've had any problems with them. I'm all for such suggestions becoming official.

I actually use let them get spells at odd levels, and I don't force metamagic feats to take up a full round. It works for me.

Just remember to adjust your dragons and anything else with sorcerer levels. :)


In my opinion, the bloodlines need an overhaul. I'm tired of getting claws I'm NEVER going to use with my poor BAB. Maybe set up bloodlines like Oracle mysteries where you can pick what you want.

It has been said that being a spell level behind the wizard is a detriment that makes the class almost unplayable. I don't agree. Maybe change it up to where at odd levels they get a spell known of the next level but have to use multiple spell slots that equal to the level of the spell to cast it. Or at odd levels give them spells per day of the next level (but not spells known) that allows them to use lower level spells in granting them the benefits of Heighten Spell.

Just some thoughts.


Fnipernackle wrote:

In my opinion, the bloodlines need an overhaul. I'm tired of getting claws I'm NEVER going to use with my poor BAB. Maybe set up bloodlines like Oracle mysteries where you can pick what you want.

It has been said that being a spell level behind the wizard is a detriment that makes the class almost unplayable. I don't agree. Maybe change it up to where at odd levels they get a spell known of the next level but have to use multiple spell slots that equal to the level of the spell to cast it. Or at odd levels give them spells per day of the next level (but not spells known) that allows them to use lower level spells in granting them the benefits of Heighten Spell.

Just some thoughts.

Having run a sorcerer into the high teens, it is most certainly not unplayable. Sounds like more hyperbole from the forum echochamber ;)

I think the sorcerer spells are fine. It's the bloodlines that could take a looking at.


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Odraude wrote:
Fnipernackle wrote:

In my opinion, the bloodlines need an overhaul. I'm tired of getting claws I'm NEVER going to use with my poor BAB. Maybe set up bloodlines like Oracle mysteries where you can pick what you want.

It has been said that being a spell level behind the wizard is a detriment that makes the class almost unplayable. I don't agree. Maybe change it up to where at odd levels they get a spell known of the next level but have to use multiple spell slots that equal to the level of the spell to cast it. Or at odd levels give them spells per day of the next level (but not spells known) that allows them to use lower level spells in granting them the benefits of Heighten Spell.

Just some thoughts.

Having run a sorcerer into the high teens, it is most certainly not unplayable. Sounds like more hyperbole from the forum echochamber ;)

I think the sorcerer spells are fine. It's the bloodlines that could take a looking at.

I don't believe it is unplayable, and I believe the way they work, if built correctly, they are better than wizards. I have proven that many times over. Thus why I don't agree with many of the viewpoints on the forums. But I have seen way too many people say that being a level behind the wizard severely gimps the class.


Fnipernackle wrote:
Odraude wrote:
Fnipernackle wrote:

In my opinion, the bloodlines need an overhaul. I'm tired of getting claws I'm NEVER going to use with my poor BAB. Maybe set up bloodlines like Oracle mysteries where you can pick what you want.

It has been said that being a spell level behind the wizard is a detriment that makes the class almost unplayable. I don't agree. Maybe change it up to where at odd levels they get a spell known of the next level but have to use multiple spell slots that equal to the level of the spell to cast it. Or at odd levels give them spells per day of the next level (but not spells known) that allows them to use lower level spells in granting them the benefits of Heighten Spell.

Just some thoughts.

Having run a sorcerer into the high teens, it is most certainly not unplayable. Sounds like more hyperbole from the forum echochamber ;)

I think the sorcerer spells are fine. It's the bloodlines that could take a looking at.

I don't believe it is unplayable, and I believe the way they work, if built correctly, they are better than wizards. I have proven that many times over. Thus why I don't agree with many of the viewpoints on the forums. But I have seen way too many people say that being a level behind the wizard severely gimps the class.

It is not a severe gimp, but it is noticable. As for being better I think wizards are better, having played both, but sorcerers are good enough to for me if I don't feel like doing the book keeping.


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If anything I believe Sorcerors and Oracles are more fun than their prepared counterparts.


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Played a lot of Sorcerers (and Wizards) and I already think that Sorcerers are superior to Wizards, why?

Spontaneous casting is way better than prepared casting in my view (although one of the beauties of the game is both mechanics have different strengths/strategies and they do compliment each other really well).

Metamagic being a full round action has NEVER been a problem for me in a game, so where is the real disadvantage?

I've seen wizards sitting there with a near full quota of useless spells near the end of an adventure fairly often (or not have enough of an absolutely crucial spell), however a well designed sorcerer with spells that are highly likely to be useful will almost always have a spammable option (and that has saved just about every party I've played a sorcerer in at some point).

Slower spell progression & fewer spells known? The Sorcerer can cast a greater total number of spells usually and as said previously if you know spells you are highly likely to need (and try to avoid duplication) then you will always have some kind of option beyond the first few levels (where wizards are no great shakes either). Also yes, the Human favoured class bonus is IMMENSE for a Sorcerer.

So changing Sorcerers? The Oracle 'revelations' idea I like for each blood line but aside from that I think they are fine. On the skill point issue remember Wizards also get 2+Int Bonus skill points (although yes, Int is their casting stat) so more is hard to justify.

D8 Hit Points? Again why? I know in 3.5 there was a 'combat sorcerer' who had less spells but more combat ability (including d8 hit points) so it could be doable as an archetype I suppose but I would caution if allowed in conjunction with the Human Favoured Class bonus.

Overall gimme a Sorcerer to play over a Wizard anyday.


DM/Paizo fiat: Paragon Surge is now available for everyone!

And lo, there was much rejoicing in the land, at least until someone was smacked over the head with a heavy book.


wraithstrike wrote:
Orthos wrote:
Heck I already do both of those things Wraith and I can't say I've had any problems with them. I'm all for such suggestions becoming official.

I actually use let them get spells at odd levels, and I don't force metamagic feats to take up a full round. It works for me.

Just remember to adjust your dragons and anything else with sorcerer levels. :)

Yes that's exactly what I said I do as well =)


I like the idea of them getting there bloodline spells at the same level they get new spells like 1st, 4th, 6th, etc.

It has always bothered me that there is such a gap with there bloodline powers between level 3 and 9. That is a long wait for something interesting to happen.

The spellcasting has never bothered me it's the lack of skill points and class skills. Also why is it if there supposed to be so charming and a strong personality but they don't get diplomacy as a class skill. I would like to see them get more class skills through there bloodline like the Oracle get's through there mystery.

Sovereign Court

Yeah, more generous skill points and class skills would be nice.

Bloodline spells as soon as you could cast them. Your iconic spells should be the first ones you get access to.

If you get something like claws as a bloodline ability, maybe you should get an accompanying BAB boost - "act at full BAB when using these claws" perhaps. At least do something about those abilities that feel like "this would be useful if only I was playing a totally different class".


Give them leather or studded leather armor proficiency and better weapon proficiencies and I'm with you...


And the ability to cast in it without spell failure.


Orthos wrote:
And the ability to cast in it without spell failure.

Ah yes. I forgot about that momentarily. That would be nice too, but not completely necessary. Perhaps an improved ASF percentage.

My only concern with d8 and 3/4 BAB is that you get close to the Magus territory. But I'm ok with that. Really, a bloodline that gave the weapons and armor stuff I mentioned would be good enough for me. D8 hp and 3/4 BAB would be icing on the cake.


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If you get claws then they should be usable at will not 3+cha mod rounds. Though I can see the extra energy damage with the claws usable only 3+cha mod rounds.

I would much rather have them get a constant mage armor effect that scales with level. Level 1 would be +1 armor bonus and it would increase at an additional +1 every odd level to a max of +10 armor bonus at level 19.

It is also a shame we never got any feats that improved those 3+cha mod abilities and maybe even granted additional uses of those powers with extra cost.


hhhmmm

I'm going to be a bit of a Debbie Downer and say that of the classes not already known to be in PU, I personally believe that Sorceror probably isn't in need of an unchained treatment.

If you take the principal that unchained is about radically altering classes without caring about backwards compatibility, Sorcerer isn't commonly derided as being weak (like rogue or monk), overpowered (like Summoner) or overcomplicated (I guess for Barbarian).

I mean don't get me wrong, you could do a completely new version of sorcerer in it, I just don't think its as widely called for as other classes, and would largely be for flavor reasons. Not that their is anything wrong with doing it for flavor reasons, but then you could argue the same for just about any class probably, depending on how individuals felt about it

Really if they were going to do unchained treatments of 9 level casters, they should really do new versions of all of them, and try to bring down the power level. Although I do hope there are some more magic systems and other stuff here for playing casters


Dark Katydid wrote:

DM/Paizo fiat: Paragon Surge is now available for everyone!

And lo, there was much rejoicing in the land, at least until someone was smacked over the head with a heavy book.

Actually, in a recent FAQ, this was nerfed.


Dragon78 wrote:

I like the idea of them getting there bloodline spells at the same level they get new spells like 1st, 4th, 6th, etc.

It has always bothered me that there is such a gap with there bloodline powers between level 3 and 9. That is a long wait for something interesting to happen.

The spellcasting has never bothered me it's the lack of skill points and class skills. Also why is it if there supposed to be so charming and a strong personality but they don't get diplomacy as a class skill. I would like to see them get more class skills through there bloodline like the Oracle get's through there mystery.

It's actually possible to be charming, but terrible with people. If you watch the show Borgia (not The Borgias), Juan Rodrigo is a great example of this. When it comes to whooing women, he is top notch. But when it comes to literally any form of Diplomacy, he falls flat on his face and Cesare has to help him.

Oceanshieldwolf wrote:
Give them leather or studded leather armor proficiency and better weapon proficiencies and I'm with you...
Orthos wrote:
And the ability to cast in it without spell failure.

Why? Sorcerer is a full caster. They aren't a half caster like the bard and magus, who do wade into battle. Sorcerer is just a wizard that doesn't need a spellbook. Sorcerers have a lot of defensive options between mage armor/shield, mirror image/displacement, etc. I just don't think these options are necessary, especially since it feels like you're taking away a weakness a full caster has. And taking away caster weaknesses doesn't sit well with me.

I'm down for better bloodlines and skill points. But truth be told, it seems less like the sorcerer needs help and more that the wizard needs to be toned down a lot.


By that logic Clerics have no weaknesses.

Paizo does have a serious case of favoritism for Divine casters. The majority of them have the best saves in the game, have a d8 or higher hit die, are not restricted by armor, and have very powerful spells.


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Insain Dragoon wrote:

By that logic Clerics have no weaknesses.

Paizo does have a serious case of favoritism for Divine casters. The majority of them have the best saves in the game, have a d8 or higher hit die, are not restricted by armor, and have very powerful spells.

Divine casters and arcane casters have fairly different spell lists. While the cleric does have some powerful spells, many of their spells are buffing spells. Arcane full casters have a wider utility of spells that they can cast from. And the arcane caster that can use armor have altered spell lists to compensate for that.

And considering that divine casters were brought down in power from the 3.5 transistion, I'd hardly call divine casters their favorites.


The only "loss of power" from 3.5 was that clerics no longer have heavy armor proficiency. But the cleric got channeling which is much better then 3.0/3.5 turning.

Also the wizard isn't the only class that people deem more powerful then the sorcerer.
-Cleric- Two good saves, med. armor prof., armor casting, shields, channeling, domain powers, though just as bad in the skill department.
-Oracle- is a spontaneous caster with more special abilities, armor prof. and armor casting, shields, curse, better skill points, better class skills.
-Witch- has hexes wich are supernatural abilities with little limit on there uses, arcane caster with healing spells, familiar is it's spell book, improved familiar more worth it then any other class.
-Arcanist- Do I need too say anything about this one.
-Druid- Two good saves, wild shape, armor prof. and armor casting, shields, animal companion or domain, immunity to poison and magical aging, nature themed abilities, good skill points, good class skill selection.


Dragon78 wrote:

The only "loss of power" from 3.5 was that clerics no longer have heavy armor proficiency. But the cleric got channeling which is much better then 3.0/3.5 turning.

Also the wizard isn't the only class that people deem more powerful then the sorcerer.
-Cleric- Two good saves, med. armor prof., armor casting, shields, channeling, domain powers, though just as bad in the skill department.
-Oracle- is a spontaneous caster with more special abilities, armor prof. and armor casting, shields, curse, better skill points, better class skills.
-Witch- has hexes wich are supernatural abilities with little limit on there uses, arcane caster with healing spells, familiar is it's spell book, improved familiar more worth it then any other class.
-Arcanist- Do I need too say anything about this one.
-Druid- Two good saves, wild shape, armor prof. and armor casting, shields, animal companion or domain, immunity to poison and magical aging, nature themed abilities, good skill points, good class skill selection.

It was more than just losing HAP. I remember there being a list of divine spells that were toned back when Pathfinder came out. I'd have to find it.

Honestly, I think the sorcerer could use some buffs. But a lot of what is being suggested seems unnecessary. Bloodline focus is definitely the key, as are more skill points. But more hit dice, more BAB, casting in armor while still having the same spell list as a wizard feels like too much. And it feels like it would step over the toes of the bard and magus. Buffing is great, but the last thing I want is to bring something up to brokeness.


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Musing on this more, I think my issue is less with it becoming overpowered (though there would be some unintended consequences with increasing HP, BAB, and armor), and more about it losing it's role focus. The sorcerer has always been the foil to the wizard. Both are robed casters, but the sorcerer's spells come from talent. Ultimately, they are the opposite of the martial role. I feel like upping the stats that are traditionally used for martials would have it pull away the role of the "physically frail caster", and instead, it would expand its role and survivalbility in melee. And I don't see why a full arcane caster that has 9th level spells needs to have this role. And I also don't see why the sorcerer should be the only full arcane caster that can cast 9th level spells.

Ultimately, I think increasing the sorcerer's martial stats (Hit Die, BAB, Armor Proficiencies) would really muddle the role of the class and have unintended consequences to the sorcerer's power level. I really like your idea about changing the bloodlines and I think that's really the area of the sorcerer that we should focus on.


If all the sorcerer is, is a foil for the wizard, then there is no class more deserving of a "unchained" version then the sorcerer.

It would be nice for a sorcerer to get some offensive supernatural abilities like energy blasts or hex like mechanic abilities. I am tired of having to make concentration checks to do every thing for the class so I will not provoke, or be completely useless in a grapple, or area with silence and no silent spell meta-magic.


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Dragon78 wrote:
Lets face it, how many times has it been said that the wizard(and every full spellcaster) is "better" then the sorcerer class.

My 2¢ on this: Wizards are the slightly stronger class. Sorcerers are the better class, by a mile.


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Dragon78 wrote:

But the cleric got channeling which is much better then 3.0/3.5 turning.

That is incredibly debatable. Channel Energy just means you can be a healbot even if you don't want to. Turning had cool options and you could be pretty good at turning if you built for it.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

I'll play a Sorcerer every day of the week over a Wizard. The only thing that Paizo needs to "unchain" on the Sorcerer is more bloodlines. ^^


The idea of making a Sorcerer that was not a spellcaster appeals to me. Though I'd want the bloodlines to be backwards compatible, just ignoring the bonus spells.

No idea how I'd make the class though.


magnuskn wrote:
I'll play a Sorcerer every day of the week over a Wizard. The only thing that Paizo needs to "unchain" on the Sorcerer is more bloodlines. ^^

That and grant the human FC bonus to all races. At least to haflings and gnomes. I would also let them get a free skill point to their blood line skill. Also I think all sorcerers should have a set of feats they could pick in place of a blood line feat. Feats such as expanded arcana, a feat that grants more skills, feat that speads up meta magic casting a number of times per say, etc.

Frankly, the class is rock solid. The only problem I can see are the blood lines. Some are really weak and some are good.

Silver Crusade

I think most of you are crazy :-).

The last thing we need is for any of the more powerful and versatile classes to be unchained. Arguing whether a wizard or arcanist or cleric is better than a sorcerer completely misses the point. They're ALL very, very powerful and versatile classes that need, if anything, MORE chains and not less.

Sure, like everybody else, I wish the sorcerer had more skill points. If only there was a way to get its spell casting to be based off intelligence. Oh, wait, there is.

Or a way to build sorcerers good in melee. Oh, wait, there is.

What you're asking for is a power up, pure and simple. And the sorcerer mist definitely does NOT need that.


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Zark wrote:
magnuskn wrote:
I'll play a Sorcerer every day of the week over a Wizard. The only thing that Paizo needs to "unchain" on the Sorcerer is more bloodlines. ^^
That and grant the human FC bonus to all races.

Given the vast amount of homebrew races in my group's setting, we long ago just threw the doors open and made any race's FC bonus available to any other race (unless there's some physical limitation as to why they couldn't take it - something based on the race's anatomy. And even then, it'd still be open to other races who had the same/a similar anatomical feature).


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Disclaimer!
Sorcerers are great the way they are! I'm perfectly happy with them.

That said if they change anything I'd like...
4+INT skills
Bloodlines that function like Oracle Revelations.(scaling with level)

i'm fine with the d6 HD.

i feel bad complaining though because i love PF sorcerer over 3.5 sorc
More bloodlines would be great fun though.

also get rid of Eldritch Heritage and stop giving away their nice things.
or give me a featchain that grants me Divine Grace or Arcane Discoveries.


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I'm fine with the way sorcerers as is. It is already a helluva lot of fun. In fact, they are already unchained from 3.5 with the inclusion of bloodlines. Previously, their only class feature was summon familiar. Also, having d6 hit dice has unchained them from the previous d4 hit dice.

Sure, it would be cool if the bloodline powers were customizable like oracle mysteries, but if they spend time on the sorcerer it would take time, manpower, and resources away from the classes that truly need unchaining such as the rogue.


The 2+int skill points thing I have had issue with any class that has it, but ever since the Oracle came out I wish sorcerer bloodlines worked like there revelations. I would love to get to choose from a list of abilities and the choice to get all those abilities with feats if I want.

Yeah, Eldritch Heritage gives sorcerer bloodlines to anyone. So why can't sorcerers get uncanny dodge, evasion, trap sense, wild empathy, etc. Why can't we get other classes abilities through feats or is that sorcerers are the only ones they will mess with.

I have never understood people's complaints about rogues, I have seen them used to devastating effect all the time. The only problems I have is the lack of a good fort or will save and some more bonuses to skills to make then the skill monkeys there supposed to be.


pauljathome wrote:

I think most of you are crazy :-).

The last thing we need is for any of the more powerful and versatile classes to be unchained. Arguing whether a wizard or arcanist or cleric is better than a sorcerer completely misses the point. They're ALL very, very powerful and versatile classes that need, if anything, MORE chains and not less.

Sure, like everybody else, I wish the sorcerer had more skill points. If only there was a way to get its spell casting to be based off intelligence. Oh, wait, there is.

Or a way to build sorcerers good in melee. Oh, wait, there is.

What you're asking for is a power up, pure and simple. And the sorcerer mist definitely does NOT need that.

Straight-up Int-based casting is superior to Cha casting with 2 extra skills.

And only the most odd archetype of the most boring bloodline can do it.

I don't feel the sorcerer needs more straight-up power in the form of d8 hit die or 3/4 BAB, but rather a little bit more flexibility in build options. For example, the 2 extra skill points make many sorcerer concepts possible other than "I take Spellcraft, UMD, and Knowledge (arcana)." I seriously don't recall ever having enough skill points to take advantage of my bonus class skill.

Likewise, bloodlines could have a bit more flexibility in their spells and abilities. For example, one Abyssal sorcerer could have cause fear, bull's strength, rage, stoneskin, dismissal, transformation, greater teleport, unholy aura, and summon monster IX, while another could have ear-piercing scream, darkness, dispel magic, bestow curse, teleport, acid fog, ethereal jaunt, greater shout, and implosion.
An infernal sorcerer could have the standard protection from good, scorching ray, suggestion, charm monster, dominate person, planar binding (devils and fiendish creatures only), greater teleport, power word stun, and meteor swarm, or swap some of those out and get disguise self, detect thoughts, fireball, charm monster, summon infernal host, hellfire ray, blasphemy, demand, and meteor swarm.

Likewise, we want the favored class bonus to stop dictating what races make good sorcerers and what don't.

Etc., etc., etc.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

It's a bit late out the gate to argue for inclusion when the book is done. As it rather have to be if it's being introduced at Gen Con.

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