Please be Considerate of Others


Pathfinder Society

The Exchange

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Minor rant here.

Recently I was at a PFS event where the inconsiderate behavior did affect my enjoyment of this hobby.

1) Most of the players showed up significantly late. It was over 50 minutes after the scheduled start time. I was just getting ready to leave assuming the game was a bust due to no-shows. I understand sometimes being a few minutes late for traffic, work, or something. But these guys joked that it is normal for them to be an hour late.
2) When everyone had finally arrived, 2 people that had been there for a while decided to leave to get food. Why couldn't they have just done that in the previous 50 minutes?
3) Finally everyone is there and then they have to spend 20 minutes leveling up their characters and buying equipment.
4) The GM was getting irritated because I kept asking him to repeat things that I couldn't hear because several of the guys wouldn't stop talking loudly about some other game that they were playing the next day.

That is actually a very short scenario. We should have been able to complete it in 2.5-3 hours easy since the fights were actually pretty easy for us. It was almost 5.5 hours to finish.

I am a bit disappointed in the GM that let them walk all over him like that. But really I am rather upset at the players doing that to the GM and the rest of us.

I mean come on guys! At least pretend to be adults and behave with a minimum of polite behavior.

This was the second time I've gamed with this group and this level of discourtesy seems to be normal for these guys.

I'm guessing that the next time I realize these guys are the ones that signed up I will fake a call from work and ditch them. I'll have wasted an hour or so getting there and going home, but at least I won't finsih the day more angry than at the start of my relaxing past time.

I don't know what I'll do if it's one of the times I volunteered to GM.

[/rant]

Grand Lodge ***** Regional Venture-Coordinator, Great Lakes aka TwilightKnight

4 people marked this as a favorite.

Well if they are late upwards of an hour and you are scheduled to be the GM, I would just leave. The GM puts WAAAY to much effort into preparing a game to be disrespected like that. Maybe showing up a few times only to find the game is cancelled because of them will have an impact.

In the meantime, I would discuss this issue with the organizer and or primary GMs. Behavior like this should not be tolerated. Additionally, discussions should be had with the players concerned. If they do not correct their behavior, the organizer should take action up to and including banning them from play until they can adhere to the "don't be a jerk" rule.

If the organizer fails to take action or is in fact one of the culprits, you should consult your regional coordinator (Venture-Officer) for assistance.

If none of that helps to your satisfaction, you might have to seek out another group to game with.

The Exchange

There are 3 locations that have PFS events pretty often in my area. We have a pretty large PFS community in my area. Don't know for sure, but I would guess 30-40 people that I see on at least an occasional basis. Somewhere in the ballpark of 15-20 tables a month. I probably average about twice a month.

Over a couple of years, this is only the second time that I have been at a table with all these guys at the same time. When it has been just one or two of them at a full table I haven't noticed much of a problem. But when all five of those close friends were together, I at least found it very annoying. I can't say for sure (since I didn't discuss it with him), but it looked to me like the GM was also getting annoyed.

I don't think I will report it in this instance. Though I think the GM should. They certainly made things tougher for him. I have decided I will avoid the group of them as a player.

If they sign up for one of the times when I am GM, it may be different. If I've got the 3 people ready to start with a NPC Pregen by 15 minutes after, we will begin. If not, game will be called on account of no shows.
I certainly wouldn't put up with guys talking over me while I am trying to run the game. That was just completely rude.

Liberty's Edge ***** Venture-Agent, United Kingdom—England—Chester aka Paz

Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS wrote:
I don't think I will report it in this instance. Though I think the GM should.

If it was bad enough to report as a GM, then it was bad enough to report as a player. We're (almost) all grown-ups; it shouldn't be left to GMs to do all the heavy lifting on promoting good behaviour as well as running the game.

Maybe include the GM's PFS number (on your chronicle) when you send the email, so they can be contacted to have their say.

***** ⦵⦵⦵

2) When everyone had finally arrived, 2 people that had been there for a while decided to leave to get food. Why couldn't they have just done that in the previous 50 minutes?

Usually you have to establish the geek soduko for who has what level characters and what tier you're running at. If you split to get food you're out for that step.

Also people just forget.

It seems like a bad game. They happen sometimes. Doesn't seem to be anything to report.


BigNorseWolf wrote:

2) When everyone had finally arrived, 2 people that had been there for a while decided to leave to get food. Why couldn't they have just done that in the previous 50 minutes?

Usually you have to establish the geek soduko for who has what level characters and what tier you're running at. If you split to get food you're out for that step.

Also people just forget.

It seems like a bad game. They happen sometimes. Doesn't seem to be anything to report.

Depends how its reported, if he goes looking for action then maybe so, but if he presents it as just;

"I felt these players were rude, and they were very late and didnt seem to care. If this is the only occurence of such then that is fine, but I thought it worth bringing to your attention in case this is a reoccurring problem"

That way if the players ARE consistently late but the VL was thinking "hmm I better wait and see if anyone else has this problem with them" then they have their answer. But by the same token if they aren't a problem usually the VL can say "Ok, well it seems like an isolated incident so i will just keep it in mind and let it go for now"

Liberty's Edge ***** Venture-Agent, United Kingdom—England—Chester aka Paz

Clearly I don't know the exact circumstances, but here's how I would act if I was GM, based on how I can best guess events transpired from your description:

Selter Sago de'Morcaine PFS wrote:
1) Most of the players showed up significantly late. It was over 50 minutes after the scheduled start time. I was just getting ready to leave assuming the game was a bust due to no-shows. I understand sometimes being a few minutes late for traffic, work, or something. But these guys joked that it is normal for them to be an hour late.

It sounds like your table had at least 3 players ready to go a few minutes after the set start time; I would've waited till the game was ~15 minutes late and then started.

The late players would've been politely informed that the game was running with the 4 player adjustment and there wasn't room to join.

Quote:
2) When everyone had finally arrived, 2 people that had been there for a while decided to leave to get food. Why couldn't they have just done that in the previous 50 minutes?

I would've let them know there was time for a 5-10 minute break in the middle of the session. If that was long enough they could go then; if not, they should wait till the end.

Quote:
4) The GM was getting irritated because I kept asking him to repeat things that I couldn't hear because several of the guys wouldn't stop talking loudly about some other game that they were playing the next day.

Did you tell the other players to pipe down? While the GM is the person running the session, it's good to have a helping hand in keeping the session running smoothly (unless it turns into one of the players running the table for the GM).

With a table of adults, the responsibility for promoting good behaviour shouldn't all fall on the GM's shoulders.

The Exchange

CathalFM wrote:
BigNorseWolf wrote:

2) When everyone had finally arrived, 2 people that had been there for a while decided to leave to get food. Why couldn't they have just done that in the previous 50 minutes?

Usually you have to establish the geek soduko for who has what level characters and what tier you're running at. If you split to get food you're out for that step.

Also people just forget.

It seems like a bad game. They happen sometimes. Doesn't seem to be anything to report.

Depends how its reported, if he goes looking for action then maybe so, but if he presents it as just;

"I felt these players were rude, and they were very late and didnt seem to care. If this is the only occurence of such then that is fine, but I thought it worth bringing to your attention in case this is a reoccurring problem"

That way if the players ARE consistently late but the VL was thinking "hmm I better wait and see if anyone else has this problem with them" then they have their answer. But by the same token if they aren't a problem usually the VL can say "Ok, well it seems like an isolated incident so i will just keep it in mind and let it go for now"

Yeah I may do it like that after I've had some more time to let the irritation fade. I was pretty ticked off right after it happened. If I had sent anything right away, it would have sounded like the ravings of a lunatic.

***

You might also consider saying something to one or two of the players, mentioning your concerns in a non-threatening/respectful tone, something like "hey, so I know that it doesn't seem like a big deal to you, but I found it somewhat rude when you guy...". It could be likely that no one has ever mentioned anything to them, and if they're at all reasonable, they should say something like "oh. my bad/apologies, I didn't realize that this was an issue", and then try to do better.

All of the above, however, is predicated on your comfortableness with talking directly to people whose behavior you find offensive. If you're not that comfortable with the above, then I would still have that conversation, just with the people who schedule/coordinate the games instead.

The Exchange *****

well... why did everyone wait? How did you even know they were going to make it?

In my area, we actually don't use sign-ups much, so when the start time rolls around we start. If you aren't there, you don't play. If you are, we fit you in. There's actually never even a question about it. But even if there is a Warhorn sign up sheet (something we often have, but almost no one uses) - if someone isn't there at the start time "we give doctors 10 mins., everyone else gets 5 mins...".

Maybe if one of the persons getting ready to start will get a call (as we are setting up tables) from someone "stuck in traffic" or we'll have someone say "my wife in on the way - she's got a 5th level Healer Cleric..." and we save a seat for someone... otherwise it get's filled. And we start. (often 10 minutes late due to " the geek soduko for who has what level characters and what tier you're running at" that BNW mentioned above - but that is normally not over 10 minutes and everyone hates wait that long).

If someone drags in late - and there is a seat open - and the game isn't to far along (10 minusts or so) - he/she might get to dropped in. But we tend to fill tables up, and the late guy/gal is likely to be out of luck.

***** ⦵⦵⦵

CathalFM wrote:


"I felt these players were rude, and they were very late and didnt seem to care. If this is the only occurence of such then that is fine, but I thought it worth bringing to your attention in case this is a reoccurring problem"

I don't see why this needs to happen, at all. Perhaps tell them You can't hear the dm, but we're all adults and if someone isn't on time i assume its for a good reason. Stuff happens.

The Exchange

Paz wrote:

...

It sounds like your table had at least 3 players ready to go a few minutes after the set start time; I would've waited till the game was ~15 minutes late and then started.

The late players would've been politely informed that the game was running with the 4 player adjustment and there wasn't room to join.
...

The GM said he was considering it, but he didn't think that scenario was survivable with the 3 we had on hand. (I don't think it was as tough as he thought it was, but he was trying not to kill us with that decision.)

.
.
Paz wrote:

...

Quote:
4) The GM was getting irritated because I kept asking him to repeat things that I couldn't hear because several of the guys wouldn't stop talking loudly about some other game that they were playing the next day.

Did you tell the other players to pipe down? While the GM is the person running the session, it's good to have a helping hand in keeping the session running smoothly (unless it turns into one of the players running the table for the GM).

With a table of adults, the responsibility for promoting good behaviour shouldn't all fall on the GM's shoulders.

Yes. I asked a couple of them to quiet down several times. They would stop for a few minutes then start up again. They seemed more interested in tales about some other game they were playing the next day.

.
.
Vrog Skyreaver wrote:
... All of the above, however, is predicated on your comfortableness with talking directly to people whose behavior you find offensive. ...

I am not terrible comfortable with that. I can do it, but I find it difficult to remain serious enough to get across my point without going so far that I become the offensive problem.

.
.
nosig wrote:
well... why did everyone wait? How did you even know they were going to make it? ...

These friends had already been in contact earlier that same day. The one person in the group that showed up on time knew they were all on their way. He expected them to be late since that is "more normal for them than showing up on time."

The GM did say that if others had shown up wanting to play he would have started and they would have been out of luck. But there were only the 2 of us as drop-ins.
.
.
BigNorseWolf wrote:
CathalFM wrote:


"I felt these players were rude, and they were very late and didnt seem to care. If this is the only occurence of such then that is fine, but I thought it worth bringing to your attention in case this is a reoccurring problem"

I don't see why this needs to happen, at all. Perhaps tell them You can't hear the dm, but we're all adults and if someone isn't on time i assume its for a good reason. Stuff happens.

I am not yet sure if I will or will not say anything.

But I have seen it both times with that group. The one person of the group that was on time said it was normal for them to be way late, not have their characters ready, and spend most of their time talking about every thing else. They joked about it.

Silver Crusade *****

It sounds like this group has gone overboard and needs to be reigned in. Whether or not they realize it they are showing significant disrespect for the other participants (especially the GM).

You should definitely bring this up with the event organizer and/or the local venture officers. It is unacceptable behavior.

***** ⦵⦵⦵

Selter Sago wrote:
But I have seen it both times with that group. The one person of the group that was on time said it was normal for them to be way late, not have their characters ready, and spend most of their time talking about every thing else. They joked about it.

Perhaps they work right before game time, or have other obligations. They're not taking PFS as seriously as you are but well.. it is a game after all.

Grand Lodge *****

BigNorseWolf wrote:
Selter Sago wrote:
But I have seen it both times with that group. The one person of the group that was on time said it was normal for them to be way late, not have their characters ready, and spend most of their time talking about every thing else. They joked about it.
Perhaps they work right before game time, or have other obligations. They're not taking PFS as seriously as you are but well.. it is a game after all.

Yes, it is a game. But that doesnt excuse the talking over the GM, leaving shortly after they arrived to get food (in the middle of the game), not being prepared for the table, and especially showing up 50 minutes late. That's jerk behavior.

Unless the table is just really late getting started, you know what I tell people who show up 50 minutes late to our events? "Sorry, you're too late to play. Slots start at 11am and 4pm next time on ___ date."

*****

1 person marked this as a favorite.

BNW: do you know this group? Based on what is written here, you're cutting them way more slack than they seem to merit. Showing up late due to stuff happening is excusable - joking that they're always late and they don't care isn't. If it's a home game, fine, but when you sign up for a public game, you have to have some level of respect for your fellow players.

The Exchange

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Seth Gipson, that avatar always makes me think of the paladin Kore from the goblins online comic.

BigNorseWolf wrote:
Selter Sago wrote:
But I have seen it both times with that group. The one person of the group that was on time said it was normal for them to be way late, not have their characters ready, and spend most of their time talking about every thing else. They joked about it.
Perhaps they work right before game time, or have other obligations. They're not taking PFS as seriously as you are but well.. it is a game after all.

No. They specifically stated nothing was going on, they are just always late.

I actually don't take the game that seriously. But I do think it is reasonable to expect a minimal level of polite behavior around others. Especially people you don't know that well.

If you and your friends are all ok with lateness, interrupting, and talking over others when it is just your group; all fine and good. But when someone is doing you a favor (volunteering to GM) and/or you don't really know them (other people at the table), the behavior felt very rude.

Community / Forums / Organized Play / Pathfinder Society / Please be Considerate of Others All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.