I suspect that there will be six role card-esque cards, each representing the six mythic paths (archmage, champion, guardian, hierophant, marshal, trickster), and any character that unlocks the mythic ability can choose any one of the cards. That, at least, seems the closest to the way mythic works in Pathfinder, and would be fully backwards-compatible.
Really appreciating the insight the RPG crowd is bringing to this upcoming path. The most interesting thing to me from a game design perspective is how Mike and his team translate the pen and paper mechanics to the card game.
Things like the Cavalier mount, eidolons and the mythic categories should be really fun to transform into the adventure card world. Seems like they had a blast with ships and naval combat in S&S.
I suspect that there will be six role card-esque cards, each representing the six mythic paths (archmage, champion, guardian, hierophant, marshal, trickster), and any character that unlocks the mythic ability can choose any one of the cards. That, at least, seems the closest to the way mythic works in Pathfinder, and would be fully backwards-compatible.Really appreciating the insight the RPG crowd is bringing to this upcoming path. The most interesting thing to me from a game design perspective is how Mike and his team translate the pen and paper mechanics to the card game.
Things like the Cavalier mount, eidolons and the mythic categories should be really fun to transform into the adventure card world. Seems like they had a blast with ships and naval combat in S&S.
Anything else from a mechanics/design perspective we should look forward to that comes from that path? Dont know anything about the Pathfinder RPG.
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
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Look forward to a lot of battling demons, that's for sure!
I am definitely excited to see how Mike and his team deal with the Mythic cards. In the RPG, the way they did it was to award characters "Mythic Tiers" which are sort of like class levels but are a bit more generalized. There are 6 different Mythic paths, and each one matches up to a generalized character "style". So there's a path for straight up damage-dealing warriors, there's a path for arcane casters, there's a path for divine casters, there's a path for more defense-focused warriors to keep your allies safe, there's a "Trickster" path that works well for rogues and alchemists, and there's the "Marshal" which is all about helping your allies be better at combat.
Each of these paths have mythic abilities that you can choose from to customize your character and make them do some truly heroic (and sometimes game-breaking) things.
These could be done using mythic card slots (where you get special card slots only for Mythic cards) or through simply having cards that have a "Mythic" trait, or by having Mythic role-type cards, as isaic16 suggested, or a combination of all three! I can't wait to see how they do it!
Each of these paths have mythic abilities that you can choose from to customize your character and make them do some truly heroic (and sometimes game-breaking) things.
Yeah the mythic abilities range from pretty cool to unbelievable in their power. They can be found here for those who are interested.
I can imagine mythic powers allowing you to do recharge cards easier, adding extra dice to checks (maybe doubling the effects of blessings?) or maybe even auto-passing certain checks?
Mythic RPG rules have an optional 'weakness' element too, where your character is weakened by a certain material (a la kryptonite), type of magic or whatever. I can't see this coming into the card game however as they've mentioned that a theme for S&S is things 'breaking' and falling apart. WotR/mythic seems very epic and over the top and having a similar mechanic to the ship damage system in S&S would possibly harm that flavour.
Mythic banes might require the 'mythic' trait to defeat or have to be defeated numerous times. Someone at the Paizo banquet said that target numbers on some cards for WotR were likely to be in the range of 50 or so.
Mythic weapons might add more damage dice than usual or allow you to recharge/bury for extremely powerful effects.
Anything else from a mechanics/design perspective we should look forward to that comes from that path? Dont know anything about the Pathfinder RPG.I suspect that there will be six role card-esque cards, each representing the six mythic paths (archmage, champion, guardian, hierophant, marshal, trickster), and any character that unlocks the mythic ability can choose any one of the cards. That, at least, seems the closest to the way mythic works in Pathfinder, and would be fully backwards-compatible.Really appreciating the insight the RPG crowd is bringing to this upcoming path. The most interesting thing to me from a game design perspective is how Mike and his team translate the pen and paper mechanics to the card game.
Things like the Cavalier mount, eidolons and the mythic categories should be really fun to transform into the adventure card world. Seems like they had a blast with ships and naval combat in S&S.
A few thoughts off the top of my head:
Rewards for 'good behavior' during scenarios (I'm thinking of a particular part of the first adventure here)Crazy terrain effects, either in scenarios or locations (the abyss is harsh and anarchic)
Possible alignment effects? (Probably not, since alignment hasn't appeared on any cards yet, but don't rule it out)
Redemption effects, possibly (a major theme of the campaign)
Mass combats
City reconstruction
Artifacts with both positive and negative effects
Combat with demon lords (their cards should absolutely make your eyes pop out of your head if done right)
Possession/Domination?
Negotiations with dark forces against greater evils
A meeting with a god
Maze exploration
I doubt anywhere close to all of those make it in, but hopefully that'll give you an idea of some things to expect. (Have I mentioned yet that I love Wrath of the Righteous)
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It would be nice if there was a method to continue the characters that you finished either RotR or S&S with, and WotR has the potential to use a "Mythic" mechanic to make that possible. It might not be a direct continuation, but some sort of evolution/conversion that would still allow the advancement decisions that you had previously made with the characters meaningful to their start in WotR.
I think its likely that they will start over fresh once again, especially given that Organized Play season 1 will start with WotR. Still, the Mythic component seems to be the best option that may ever come along to appease the demand to be able to continue with your characters. Definitely excited to see how things progress, whatever the design decision is/ has been.
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Right now my complete guess as to how mythic may work is to have the six mythic paths as cards, likely ones you will get as a reward for finishing adventure 1. These cards will be like role cards, with a few always on abilities, and a bunch of check boxes. Then I imagine some adventures will award "mythic feats" that let you pick more path powers.
This AP will probably "dial up to 11" in a couple ways - a normal RPG AP takes characters from 1st level up to 13-17, depending on the path. Wrath takes the characters up to 20th, and the 10th "mythic rank." By the end of it the characters are fighting entities on par with demigods, that would be considered "fair" fights for 27th level characters.
So if you think your character at the end of Runelords is strong, I imagine the endgame Wrath version would put them to shame.
well, you could certainly have team deathchicken be an ally card that anyone can use. That would certainly be interesting.
As far as the mythic stuff goes, typically in the mythic rules you have to do something mythic to advance your mythic tiers (defeat a powerful mythic creature, recover a mythic artifact, and so on), so I could definitely see gaining a mythic feat at the end of each deck similar to how you gain a card feat at the end of each deck, with a list of powers to draw from.
Will WotR be another Base Set like RotR and S&S, or will it introduce an advanced ruleset? Seems like a good opportunity to do so if that is the plan.
I am curious what you think should be in an advanced ruleset.
Personally, when we were still speculating what the next Adventure would be, I thought it would be cool if a mythic set came out that would let you continue the game from a previous base set after chapter 6. So is it possible that Wrath of the Righteous might have playable chapters 7 through 12?
Will WotR be another Base Set like RotR and S&S, or will it introduce an advanced ruleset? Seems like a good opportunity to do so if that is the plan.I am curious what you think should be in an advanced ruleset.
The question for me comes down to "Do you want the set to stand alone, to require a previous set, or to work either way?" My answer is the last of those.
I'm sure we are too late to actually influence WoTR, but I hope it is both able to expand on /either/ RotR or S&S and also able to stand on its own if this is the first base set that someone buys. As much as I want a continuation, I don't want it at the expense of sales, and limiting the gameplay of a base set to only those who have purchased a previous set could be detrimental to those sales.
Realizing that this may be some future set instead of WotR, I will try to be more generic. Similar to how the current base set provides a short introductory adventure (Perils of the Lost Coast), this "advanced set" could take new adventurers through and introductory adventure wherein they get introduced to the game and gameplay. Then, Adventure 1 would have a process for converting characters from previous sets. I don't think a direct import would work as well, but some method that would account for at least some of the decisions made in previous adventure paths is key. You have to feel like your previous choices have weight in order to retain the connection to that character.
I actually see this working similar to how character decks have been designed for OP. What you get from the scenarios determines what you get to choose from your character deck as you move forward. This is easy to see translated to cards in the advanced set, but could also be adapted to apply to power, skill and card feats as well.
I do agree that the Mythic mechanic seems to be an ideal fit for this type of advancement, but its a little late to change and a little early to speculate at this point. Well, for those of us who aren't designers, anyway. :)
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As much as I want a continuation, I don't want it at the expense of sales, and limiting the gameplay of a base set to only those who have purchased a previous set could be detrimental to those sales.
+1
I actually see this working similar to how character decks have been designed for OP. What you get from the scenarios determines what you get to choose from your character deck as you move forward. This is easy to see translated to cards in the advanced set, but could also be adapted to apply to power, skill and card feats as well.
Not sure about this...doesn't everyone want to actually use their Robes of Xin-Shalast and other loot cards from the end of the current AP (or futuer APs) in play? Currently it's a bit like getting a Ferrari and being told to park it in the garage.
And all the complaining about not being able to continue on with their characters from Runelords is the angsty teenage son and his conniving friend kicking the Ferarri's bumper and sending it through the window and off an embankment.
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Not sure about this...doesn't everyone want to actually use their Robes of Xin-Shalast and other loot cards from the end of the current AP (or futuer APs) in play? Currently it's a bit like getting a Ferrari and being told to park it in the garage.
That is exactly how I am feeling as some friends and I are nearing the end. And that's exactly how the other guys are feeling about S&S. They're not wanting to buy the next set because they have to start over. I understand that Mike and Co are patterning the APs in PACG after the APs in Pathfinder RPG. And that you need to start over with each AP as they are designed to build you from a new character to a veteran within that campaign path. But I'm willing to start over with the new AP and the new changes to mechanics and classes, etc.
But you're right. It is like getting that Ferrari and being told well done. Then told you have to retire and put the Ferrari in the garage.
And all the complaining about not being able to continue on with their characters from Runelords is the angsty teenage son and his conniving friend kicking the Ferarri's bumper and sending it through the window and off an embankment.
Why would anyone do that? Anyone? Anyone?
All I know is that I hope everybody eventually does get their ability to continue to previous characters... if for no other reason than to see it stop coming up everywhere.
I have been on record stating that I would like to see it at some point and that hasn't changed... espcially getting such awesome loot in AP 6 in RotR - I'd love to use it at some point, but I would play enthusiastically regardless or whether or not I ever got that chance.
Really starting to think we might have straight up mutiny if continuing characters from previous AP's doesn't get added at some point.
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JBiggs78, I think the fact that we keep bringing it up is what Mike (and Co) need to start digging into the mechanics of re-usability of high level characters and reusing the base sets somehow.
Mike, what happens if there's a set of expansion decks that simply build upon a base set and the first 6 adv decks. There are mechanics about banishing and removing less powerful cards and replacing them with the newer ones. The two big issues would be the ridiculous amount of dice you'd be rolling in Adv Deck 7+ and the fact that you're using the current APs as your base themes. And translating that past Adv Deck 6 (Chapter 6) of an AP is completely new material.
JBiggs78, I think the fact that we keep bringing it up is what Mike (and Co) need to start digging into the mechanics of re-usability of high level characters and reusing the base sets somehow.
Mike, what happens if there's a set of expansion decks that simply build upon a base set and the first 6 adv decks. There are mechanics about banishing and removing less powerful cards and replacing them with the newer ones. The two big issues would be the ridiculous amount of dice you'd be rolling in Adv Deck 7+ and the fact that you're using the current APs as your base themes. And translating that past Adv Deck 6 (Chapter 6) of an AP is completely new material.
I think the ridiculous amount of dice required is the biggest reason not to do it. As I played more and more and used all the characters, I've felt that it really isn't something I would be as excited for as I would have been say pre AP4.
Again, that's not to say I wouldn't mind seeing it, but more as a one of AP7 rather than a full blown adventure path.
JBiggs78, I think the fact that we keep bringing it up is what Mike (and Co) need to start digging into the mechanics of re-usability of high level characters and reusing the base sets somehow.
Mike, what happens if there's a set of expansion decks that simply build upon a base set and the first 6 adv decks. There are mechanics about banishing and removing less powerful cards and replacing them with the newer ones. The two big issues would be the ridiculous amount of dice you'd be rolling in Adv Deck 7+ and the fact that you're using the current APs as your base themes. And translating that past Adv Deck 6 (Chapter 6) of an AP is completely new material.
I am fine with the restarting characters and taking them through a new path. Some characters are routinely rolling 6 to 7 dice in the 6th Adventure, how many more can you keep adding before it becomes ridiculous?
There are homebrew options out there for people to take their elite characters on.
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I think if they ever decide to do an official continuation, they would be better off making some "adventure deck 7"s that could be placed at the end of any AP, possibly based off of an existing high level module. That way it could be a one-off thing, kind of like the class decks - not part of the main line, but there if people want it.
When I think of "advanced rules" I think of optional rules- variants to change the game or increase the challenge. Many of the house rules people have come up with regarding death, exploring, building location decks, and so forth could make a decent "advanced" rules section.
I actually see this working similar to how character decks have been designed for OP. What you get from the scenarios determines what you get to choose from your character deck as you move forward. This is easy to see translated to cards in the advanced set, but could also be adapted to apply to power, skill and card feats as well.Not sure about this...doesn't everyone want to actually use their Robes of Xin-Shalast and other loot cards from the end of the current AP (or futuer APs) in play? Currently it's a bit like getting a Ferrari and being told to park it in the garage.
This is actually a good example. Any continuing adventure/ adventure path should definitely have some way to translate the choices made as the last part of a base AP into something meaningful in the new game. For the loot cards in AP6 as an example, there should be an equivalent in the "advanced" AP that you can only pick up if you had it at the end of a base AP. The same should be true for the ending feats that you choose.
Once we see how the character decks actually work in practice, we will be able to determine if this could be similar or if it will need additional tweaks.
The one issue I have with a continuation, whether it is by one adventure deck or an entire AP, is what then? Everyone finishes ADVANCED AP2, Conquering the Multiverse, then clamors for another expansion continuing from there? While I feel that one AP may be too finite, all stories must eventually give way to the next set of heroes.
Now that I think about it, that is probably a better option...I think if they ever decide to do an official continuation, they would be better off making some "adventure deck 7"s that could be placed at the end of any AP, possibly based off of an existing high level module. That way it could be a one-off thing, kind of like the class decks - not part of the main line, but there if people want it.
When I think of "advanced rules" I think of optional rules- variants to change the game or increase the challenge. Many of the house rules people have come up with regarding death, exploring, building location decks, and so forth could make a decent "advanced" rules section.
Much better idea IMHO. I would love to have a set of official rules for a "hardcore mode" to make the game truly challenging.
id just like to point out that the rpgs from what ive seen all have a small synopsis of what could happen after the main adventure. but no stats or anything for example in rotr Marr Masif. why not do something similar for the card game
my idea is that rather than release a new adventure, release an advanced bane/boon box sorta like the rpgs bestiary filled with challenges and items suitable for "adventure 7" play and leave it to players to make something with them.
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In today's Meet the Iconics blog it is revealed that Zadim the Slayer will be a character in WotR.
In today's Meet the Iconics blog it is revealed that Zadim the Slayer will be a character in WotR.
Just checked on google, but it looks like that Zadim is not available in Pathfinder battles as prepainted miniature....
So far i bought for SS:
Lirianne and feiya...
Does anybody know if more prepainted minis are available for the class decks, SS and wraith of the righteous? Zadim is not.
Zadim just got introduced as a character today. No mini of him exists yet.
Chief Technical Officer
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None of the Advanced Class Guide characters have minis yet, painted or unpainted. After all, they're from a book that doesn't even come out for another month. Reaper will begin bringing out unpainted metal minis of them in August—I think they have 4 of the 10 ready, with the rest coming soon. (Reaper has already done unpainted metals of all of the other iconics.)
WizKids prepainted plastic minis for the APG classes are going to take a bit longer, but all of our iconics will get done eventually.
At that moment, there are no minis scheduled in any format for the 3 non-iconic characters in each class deck.
None of the Advanced Class Guide characters have minis yet, painted or unpainted. After all, they're from a book that doesn't even come out for another month. Reaper will begin bringing out unpainted metal minis of them in August—I think they have 4 of the 10 ready, with the rest coming soon. (Reaper has already done unpainted metals of all of the other iconics.)
WizKids prepainted plastic minis for the APG classes are going to take a bit longer, but all of our iconics will get done eventually.
At that moment, there are no minis scheduled in any format for the 3 non-iconic characters in each class deck.
RotR:
From Wizkids all 11 iconics from RotR are available... They will be soon arriving in my mail so I can put these on my playmats :-) ... So RotR is completely covered by Pathfinder Battles.SS:
For SS, i have so far Lirianne, Seltyiel and Feiya.
From RotR, Lem, Valeros, Merisiel and Lini are reappearing.
So 7 out 11 characters are available from Wizkids as prepainted miniatures.
The following 4 are missing: Alahazra, jirelle, Damiel and Oloch.
Vic, do the last 4 mentioned ones belong to the iconics class? I am not the expert here.
If yes, then i can hope for the missing 4 to be released in the near future. So SS set is also then completely covered. Do the pacg AP only include iconics, so 100% covered by wizkids at some time?
Wraith of the Righteous:
I would like to be prepared here. 55 Pathfinder Battles prepainted minis were released for WotR so far. Are there also characters for PACG included?
I would buy these as singles from the paizo store BEFORE they will become unavailable.
Do you have any glue which are these? :-)
Browsing thru the wotr mini list, ALAIN, HUMAN CAVALIER could be another hero, right?
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Chief Technical Officer
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The Iconics are the chief character illustrations for each of the major classes in the RPG. Once the Advanced Class Guide is released in August, there will be 31 of those. (Some people argue that the ninja and the samurai are technically "alternate classes", but either way, they have iconic characters.)
All of the classes in RotR, S&S, and Wrath Base Sets and Add-On Decks use iconics. Each of the Class Decks has 1 iconic and 3 non-iconics. And Ranzak is not an iconic.
So yes, that means all of the characters in the Base Sets and Add-On Decks for the first three APs either already have WizKids prepainted plastic minis, or will eventually.
As far as the characters in Wrath, all I can tell you is that we have explicitly announced two so far: Zadim and Enora. But if you've been paying attention, you may be able to name 4 more.
The Iconics are the chief character illustrations for each of the major classes in the RPG. Once the Advanced Class Guide is released in August, there will be 31 of those.
As far as the characters in Wrath, all I can tell you is that we have explicitly announced two so far: Zadim and Enora. But if you've been paying attention, you may be able to name 4 more.
So zadim, enora and crowe... However, as google states no one of these is released as wizkidds mini yet.
You mentioned 4 more already named characters? I do not know any of the names, but are any of the pacg WotR iconics so far released as Wizkid prepainted miniature?
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Chief Technical Officer
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But if you've been paying attention, you may be able to name 4 more.
...3 of which have already been made into minis from WizKids.
But if you've been paying attention, you may be able to name 4 more....3 of which have already been made into minis from WizKids.
Hurray! New minis available for PACG...
May be you saw my new playmat V5 here.
Pathfinder minis are shown on each playmat.
What are the names of the 3 Wizkids minis so far released for WotR Pacg?
Please :-)
I would like to purchase these from the paizo store asap.
So far we know the summoner, Cleric, paladin, cavalier, arcanist, bloodrager, and slayer for WOTR.
Of those we have the Cleric-Kyra, Paladin-Seelah, and Cavalier-Alain out in preprinted minis
What are the explicit names with the classes you mentioned above? Who is bloodrager, summoner and arcanist?
So kyra, seelah and alain are the 3 prepainted minis so far, right?
Kyra and seelah are already from RotR :-)
I only have to obtain alain ...
When is the next pathfinder battles set being released?
Crowe is the blood rager, Enora is the Arcanist, and Balazar is the summoner.
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Next Pathfinder Battles is out in November. It is Lost Coast. That link has all of the minis that have been announced as of yet and they have not said which iconics will be in that set.
Edit: At least Expected in November.
Next Pathfinder Battles is out in November. It is Lost Coast. That link has all of the minis that have been announced as of yet and they have not said which iconics will be in that set.
Edit: At least Expected in November.
Is there only one iconic released in one set?
Or could there be more?Minis missing:
Oloch, damiel, jirelle, alahazra for SS
Crowe, enora, balazar and zadim for WotR
How about all? :)))
There is usually 2 per but region of winter only had feiya.
BRAD2411,
could you please list all ICONICS released in the Pathfinder Battles series so far ... ?
That would be GREAT !
SO i dont miss any yet being released.
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I posted it in the this thread so we can get away from derailing this thread more then we have.
So far we know the summoner, Cleric, paladin, cavalier, arcanist, bloodrager, and slayer for WOTR.
That's seven down. Just 4 unknown characters left with the add on deck. If Wotr follows the same formula as S&S, we should be getting 7 new characters and 4 returning. So far we know of 5 new classes and 2 from the previous set. That would leave 2 new and two old yet to be named.
I'm speculating that the inquisitor will be in, as she is a part of the Wotr path and would fit with the theme even if she wasn't. As far as the second new class I have no clue.
For the returning classes I would wager that they would be Harsk and Sajan. I'm thinking Harsk because Harsk is serious, as is the adventure path, and he is the only one left from Runelords ( who hasn't already been repeated) that has divine (if only a smidge, and only if you want him to). My guess of Sajan is because he is the only other class left that I think would fit the path, however it could also be Ezren/Seoni, because so far the characters are leaning heavily toward the divine.
Any body else have any speculation about the 4 as yet unnamed classes : ) ? It just accurred to me that perhaps some characters from S&S may make their way into Wotr.
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So then we have:
Returning characters:
Kyra the Cleric
Seelah the Paladin
From Advanced Player's Guide:
Alain the Cavalier
Balazar the Summoner
From Advanced Class Guide:
Shardra the Shaman
Zadim the Slayer
Enora the Arcanist
Crowe the Bloodrager
Leaving 3 slots open (assuming the normal mix of characters).
My feeling is that 2 more will be returning characters. My money is on Sajan the Monk being one of those to return. Ezren the Wizard, Seoni the Sorcerer, Amiri the Barbarian and Harsk the Ranger have also not appeared as returning characters, but most of them should be updated by the time we reach this release because of the class decks. I don't think the second returning class will be any of them, but instead be one of the four returning classes from Skull and Shackles, making it the first and only character that has appeared in all 3 base sets.....or we will see one of the new classes in Skull and Shackles return like Oloch the Warpriest or Alahazra the Oracle.
The last slot I think would go to the last remaining unmade class from the Advanced Player's Guide - Imrijka the Inquistor.
So then we have:
Returning characters:
Kyra the Cleric
Seelah the PaladinFrom Advanced Player's Guide:
Alain the Cavalier
Balazar the SummonerFrom Advanced Class Guide:
Shardra the Shaman
Zadim the Slayer
Enora the Arcanist
Crowe the BloodragerLeaving 3 slots open (assuming the normal mix of characters).
My feeling is that 2 more will be returning characters. My money is on Sajan the Monk being one of those to return. Ezren the Wizard, Seoni the Sorcerer, Amiri the Barbarian and Harsk the Ranger have also not appeared as returning characters, but most of them should be updated by the time we reach this release because of the class decks. I don't think the second returning class will be any of them, but instead be one of the four returning classes from Skull and Shackles, making it the first and only character that has appeared in all 3 base sets.....or we will see one of the new classes in Skull and Shackles return like Oloch the Warpriest or Alahazra the Oracle.
The last slot I think would go to the last remaining unmade class from the Advanced Player's Guide - Imrijka the Inquistor.
Each AP has 4 characters that appear in the art, essentially the 'canon' participants. For WotR, it was Seela, Seoni, Meresiel and Alain. I believe RotR and S&S both had all of the canon party in the adventure. If that continues, the 2 other returning characters will be Seoni, in her first base-set reprint, and Meresiel, as the first 3-set character, ehich fits your prediction perfectly.
There's still one more unannounced iconic from the Advanced Class Guide : the Hunter. I guess (s)he could also be in WOTR. As for Imrijka, I think she's pretty much a sure bet as, like you said, she's the last one remaining from the Advanced Player's Guide but also because her class is a perfect fit for the adventure path and the whole theme of Mendev (the country where the AP starts). My other 2 guesses would be Seoni and Merisiel ... mostly because the original RPG AP was illustrated using Alain, Seelah, Seoni and Merisiel. Then again, that would be a fourth incarnation of Merisiel, so maybe not.
After reading through all the info on all the current RPG APs, Wrath of the Righteous is by far the coolest looking of them all. Very Diabloish!!!
I really hope this AP gets the full accessory treatment!
I want themed Ultra Pro sleeves & AP storage box!
I want themed playmats!
Reaper (metal/Bones) minis for all the AP characters (core/add-on deck) would be nice as well!
I don't see any custom dice for this AP. Are those in the works?