Goblin Squad Member
|
I find the lack of evil guilds in the land rush disturbing. If there are any evil guilds out there I urge you to sign up or send me or any of the other Golgothans a message to open diplomatic ties. With so much good flying around we need to band together against their oppression.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 4 people marked this as a favorite. |
I fully expect evil to be something that is realized over time through the course of actions. Many believe that they are the true and the benevolent, only to be shocked and appalled when they learn this is not the case. Some will reform, but some will also embrace. It is through this process that evil may start small, but will grow steadily in time.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
We need to band together against their oppression.Is this something evil groups would even do more often than not? Aren't they more likely to despise and mistrust each other?
Perhaps we would act this way if we wanted to role play as typical fantasy evil. You know the guys that always loose because they eat each other alive. As happy as that would make some of the people here we have no intention of acting out that trope.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
@Toombstone and others.
Lawful Evil is not Lawful stupid. Many things may bind them together to work efficiently.
Sure but lawful isn't the only evil we'll be seeing. I think the crux of it really is this:
It doesn't seem to me that many people will actually be playing evil characters. That said I think there will be many who will make use of "evil" game mechanics
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Golgotha and UNC are the most outspoken about either being evil or having evil elements. I don't doubt there will be a lack of evil, but I have a feeling, especially those who frequent the forums, see the amount of crap UNC deals with on a daily basis defending the "evil" way of life and decide to remain quiet and in the shadows as to not draw attention to themselves.
If that is the case, I would ask that, if they want to remain silent, then do so, but still vote for one of us (Golgotha or Aragon) in the land rush to ensure you have a "home."
Remember, voting for a settlement in land rush 2 has NO BEARING on any loyalties or membership once the game goes live, it is simply to see who has the most support and would then make the "best" choices for settlements.
Even some of you "good guys" are welcome to support us with your votes to ensure you have a settlement to war against and a place to hunt bad guys in their lands, as opposed to just defending your own lands.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Also of note: Only the players you vote with see your handle. So, for example, I will not know you are evil. Only those who would kill you mercilessly, over and over, whether you were afk or asleep, solo or grouped, in the wild or in your bed will see exactly who you really are, where your live, and have all your contact information at their fingertips until the end of civilization as we know it. ;)
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
I have no problem with Evil characters, only evil players. Golgotha seems to be reputable people, so I have no quarrel with your city. I can't see TEO chasing down Evil outside their lands, unless evil has run up against griefing, which we expect GW to handle.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 2 people marked this as a favorite. |
Golgotha and UNC are the most outspoken about either being evil or having evil elements. I don't doubt there will be a lack of evil, but I have a feeling, especially those who frequent the forums, see the amount of crap UNC deals with on a daily basis defending the "evil" way of life and decide to remain quiet and in the shadows as to not draw attention to themselves.
And yet Golgotha seems to have no such troubles; on the contrary people seem genuinely happy to see them on this forum. Maybe then, just maybe, that's due to a difference in style and presentation, rather than the actual topics?
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Golgotha and UNC are the most outspoken about either being evil or having evil elements. I don't doubt there will be a lack of evil, but I have a feeling, especially those who frequent the forums, see the amount of crap UNC deals with on a daily basis defending the "evil" way of life and decide to remain quiet and in the shadows as to not draw attention to themselves.And yet Golgotha seems to have no such troubles; on the contrary people seem genuinely happy to see them on this forum. Maybe then, just maybe, that's due to a difference in style and presentation, rather than the actual topics?
Yeah, they rarely post.
Then of course, there is also the style of the people who oppose us in any of the topics. For instance, calling someone out and telling them that their style and presentation may be their problem. That couldnt play a part at all, could it?
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Some people handle "opposition" better than others. And most of the "opposition" that UNC has faced has nothing to do with being "evil", or even with anything they're planning to do in-game, but with treating other people like dirt here on these forums.
Thats a stack of nonsense.
You and yours have come after us full force for what we PLAN TO DO IN GAME.
You and yours have used that to call us Evil and Griefers.
What exactly do you expect from that? "Oh I am sorry you feel that way, I will not do it again. I promise never to do anything that makes you think I am a griefer again."
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Actually, most of the arguing IS because we have said we want to be evil. Arguing over the SAD mechanic, over joining the RBA, over our policies we have open for all to see. That is another difference between us and Golgotha, they don't put out their policies and everything for the world to see. We have been open from day one with our intentions and policies and what we plan to do. We are the ONLY one to do that so far. And EVERYTHING we put out there has been scrutinized and torn apart and twisted (in most cases) to make us look bad, or question our motives. If others were treated the way we have been then this forum would be a different place. But then again, NO ONE is as open about being the content for everyone else as we have been. And I doubt anyone will be.
I am willing to bet 90% the reason why golgotha has been so quiet and has so many member is because they are with PAX and PAX is huge. If WE would had changed to be what PAX wanted us to be for our agreement to work, we would have the massive numbers as well.
But the fact that we wouldn't change ourselves into what ANYONE else wants is one of the reasons that alliance failed before it started. We are who we say we are and haven't changed it. If people don't like us for that, then fine, but at least you know what's coming.
Some times I wish I could go back and convince bludd to keep everything behind closed doors like everyone else and then just surprise EVERYONE when we pull stuff that is being discussed on these forums. (Not the greifing but valid and legitimate tactics that people have problems with because it causes them loss and sadness.)
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
It is my hope that with us being as vocal as we have been over the last 18ish months, that people would realized that UNC are not bad people, just playing a role in a game. Some have come to that point of view and we are happy to see that, but there is still a large group that are just waiting for any excuse to accuse us of being griefers, ruining the game for others, and doing all the bad things that they fear will ruin the game. Yet these same people "understand that they need bag guys or PFO will fail." you can't have both. Either we ruin the game, or we are needed. Which is it?
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Yet these same people "understand that they need bag guys or PFO will fail." you can't have both. Either we ruin the game, or we are needed. Which is it?
Since that's basically a quote from me, I'll go ahead and respond.
Actually, most of the arguing IS because we have said we want to be evil. Arguing over the SAD mechanic, over joining the RBA, over our policies we have open for all to see.
Is it truly inconceivable that some people in your organization have a habit of treating other posters like dirt here on these forums while explaining your policies? I have no doubt that you, personally, understand how easy it is to be a "bad guy" without having to insult other posters and twist their words on the forums. Do you really think everyone in UNC has that same understanding? Do you really think I call those others out for being Bandits, or even for promoting a policy of Not-Blue-Shoot-Rob-It? Do you really want me to dredge up the quotes where I have called out members of UNC to show that it has nothing to do with your stated policies or plans in game?
Goblinworks Executive Founder
|
UNC honestly have a communication problem. I will take your word about the fact that maybe, a lot of people attacked you for nothing this past months, I don't know, I wasn't here. I will assume that this is true.
But every time I, personally, came back to the forum, I had friction with you, because of some fairly provocative/insulting a phrase, about PvP. You were making a lot of humiliating comments, about people talking about their desire of a less PvP-chaotic game.
Now, it can be an injustified bad impression, and maybe do you understand that most of the players do not want to play in a hardcore PvP game. One of your own members actually explained it perfectly well, a long time ago : http://www.covenantofthephoenix.com/forums/blog/19/entry-48-desegregation-b reaking-through-the-pvp-game-myth/
"• The non-PvP crowd must accept that there is a level of danger present in PFO not present in non-PvP game that helps drive the player interaction this game uses in place of scripted content. They need to learn to embrace that added bit of danger and let it actually enhance their experience.
• The PvP crowd crowd needs to accept that they are not free to abuse everyone without limitations, and that an environment where people are constantly dying just because they exist is in-fact abusive. The history of MMO's shows PvPers cannot exercise enough self restraint to not run off the greater majority of the game's potential players, so heavier restrictions than most titles with open world / non-factional PvP have had in the past is a requirement."
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
As a witness to most of the last 18 months and someone who's stayed out of the flamewars, the potholes in communication extend beyond UNC or people who rage quit their guilds and joined UNC.
Oh my, that was passive-aggressive.
EVERY DAY WE READ THE FORUMS IS A NEW OPPORTUNITY TO NOT BE A D-
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Just for honesty and transparency:
Golgotha has seen very few members from the Pax Gaming community join us. The majority of our membership has either A. Merged into Pax with us, or B. Applied to Pax Gaming to be a part of Golgotha. The honest trust is that we lost more members than we gained by joining into the Pax gaming community. They left for their own reasons, and we stayed for ours.
As for transparency: If anyone has asked what our stance is on a given topic, we have done the best of our ability to provide an answer that was unclassified.
Golgotha knew how to move and shake before we ever stepped into Pax.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Yet another group who's mission statement is to "keep evil in line" appears on the forums. I wonder if they are aware that there is so little evil right now that they may never actually see an evil player.
Yeah. Other than that thing where one evil guild is at the top of the list for phase 2 land rush settlements and outnumbers the bottom 50 guilds combined there is just SO little evil.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
The Exalted Bastards division of the UnNamed Company is not only the first, declared Chaotic Evil group but it is growing.
There are those that will argue that it is a daunting task to play CE without also being low reputation, and this might be true if the player actions are chaotic evil. That means, if the player kills without regard to whether or not his targets are "sanctioned" by feud, faction, war or some other flag. This I believe is a short sighted view.
Chaotic Evil motives within sanctioned PVP is the key to playing a Chaotic Evil character and still maintaining a moderate to possibly a high reputation.
How does this work:
A Chaotic Evil Mercenary / Assassin works for dirt cheap or even for free. He is not in it for the money, but for the "free kills". He does not care who or what the target is, he has no affiliation as long as the target is made sanctioned by some means.
These killers never show mercy, will always finish off the fallen, and never fight a fair or gentlemen's fight. They will descend upon their prey with near ridiculous numerical advantage. They do not care about efficiency or opportunities lost, it is all about the overwhelming brutality of it. It is about the victim feeling completely helpless and hopeless.
This is the epitome of the Gank Squad mentality, with one exception. They function within sanctioned means.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Yet another group who's mission statement is to "keep evil in line" appears on the forums. I wonder if they are aware that there is so little evil right now that they may never actually see an evil player.Yeah. Other than that thing where one evil guild is at the top of the list for phase 2 land rush settlements and outnumbers the bottom 50 guilds combined there is just SO little evil.
Ah yes the one guild with 60 members compared to the rest of the top ten who have 515 members. Definitely an over abundance of evil.
@toombstone I actually completely agree with you on this. We will probably have a few early wars dedicated to alignment and rp reasons. But eventually pragmatism will hold sway on who goes to war with who.
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Well, basically when 'good' gets bored smashing 'evil' to bits with its 4:1 ratio, their attention will turn to the neutrals. Damn fence sitters need a good thumping!
Either that or alignment will be mostly meaningless and war will be waged simply to get some rocks and trees regardless of the alignment of who currently holds them.
| 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
The Exalted Bastards division of the UnNamed Company is not only the first, declared Chaotic Evil group but it is growing.
There are those that will argue that it is a daunting task to play CE without also being low reputation, and this might be true if the player actions are chaotic evil. That means, if the player kills without regard to whether or not his targets are "sanctioned" by feud, faction, war or some other flag. This I believe is a short sighted view.
Chaotic Evil motives within sanctioned PVP is the key to playing a Chaotic Evil character and still maintaining a moderate to possibly a high reputation.
How does this work:
A Chaotic Evil Mercenary / Assassin works for dirt cheap or even for free. He is not in it for the money, but for the "free kills". He does not care who or what the target is, he has no affiliation as long as the target is made sanctioned by some means.
These killers never show mercy, will always finish off the fallen, and never fight a fair or gentlemen's fight. They will descend upon their prey with near ridiculous numerical advantage. They do not care about efficiency or opportunities lost, it is all about the overwhelming brutality of it. It is about the victim feeling completely helpless and hopeless.
This is the epitome of the Gank Squad mentality, with one exception. They function within sanctioned means.
Just curious, how can Chaotic Evil and Chaotic Good be under the same roof without killing each other?
I also am curious as to how a Chaotic good group would just be cool with a group that is about razing people to the ground or "killing just for the fun of it"
Like wouldn't they be for a second concerned with how other "good" groups see them? My own NG character would look at anyone claiming to be good who lives with a nest of murderers as a bunch of outright hypocrites and liars. I'm not saying this to be a jerk seriously. I'm saying this as a roleplayer to any other roleplayers of your CG group who might be friends with the CE group.
"Oh but we are all promoting positive gameplay, why can't my character be good and run with a den of murderers who do such a thing for fun?"
"That is good, pardon me as I call down the positive power of the sun to burn down the homes of your murderous bretheren"
I'm honestly just curious about the arrangement
|
Goblin Squad Member
|
Honestly, I'm more concerned by the possible disparity between Law and Chaos then by Good and Evil. Evil will find its way into the hearts of those who hear its siren call, if not immediately, in time. But Chaotic alignments, in a game built around participation in social structures and legal frameworks... It's more difficult to imagine how chaos will emerge except where present as strong RP choice; or, as poor RP ability.
It's simple. You don't get wrapped up in rp conflict.
What about the effects of the alignment system?
