The Flash TV Series


Television

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I never said Thanos' plan wasn't defensible. Most of what he does isn't. I just say, to me, understanding Thanos, it makes sense. The Thinker's plan DOES NOT MAKE SENSE.

Also I would never defend Thanos as a good guy. He's not a good guy. He's never BEEN a good guy. He's just been at best an anti-hero with some very DEEP problems.


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Thomas Seitz wrote:

I never said Thanos' plan wasn't defensible. Most of what he does isn't. I just say, to me, understanding Thanos, it makes sense. The Thinker's plan DOES NOT MAKE SENSE.

Also I would never defend Thanos as a good guy. He's not a good guy. He's never BEEN a good guy. He's just been at best an anti-hero with some very DEEP problems.

I didn't mean to imply that you said he was a good guy. I said I've seen people defending his plan - and his rationale - as though he's a misguided savior. Which, you know... he's really not.

Really it's just that people have been defending an enormous cosmic-tier bully and I don't like that. I apologize for coming off as though I meant you.

Thanos Stuff:
And seriously, for someone who's supposed to have a brilliant scientific mind, his whole "The Universe is FINITE!" thing... he's dead wrong. And even if it WAS, the Gauntlet gives him the power to change that... I just... ARGHBARGLERAGH I know it's comic book science BUT STILL.

And my gosh, yeah, The Thinker's plan is IDIOTIC.


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No I get it now Jem. Believe me, even though I enjoyed Infinity Watch, I was always waiting to see what Thanos was trying to pull. Because honestly, he's not a hero.

But no worries. I'm good now. :)


jemstone wrote:
Thomas Seitz wrote:
At least when Thanos has plans, they make sense.

No. NO THEY DO NOT.

** spoiler omitted **

Short form, both DeVoe and Thanos' plans are utterly psychopathic and aren't based in reality. Marlize was right in the flashback when she called it an extremist's manifesto. He's not a savior, he's a murderer, and he's going to murder the entire planet if he gets his way.

Totally agreed. While we are at it, Palpatine is not the hero either. Despite any retcons by Zahn or Lucas himself. His government was a sexist, specist, military dictatorship, that condoned genocide.

What burns me more, is knowing that many who think Thanos is a hero/savior/whatever think Doctor Doom is a lame character.

Spoiler:

Assuming resources were finite, Thanos' 'solution' is a bandage, not a fix. The universe will just repopulate until it is right back where it started.


Green,

Doom isn't lame. He just can't get it right all the time.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Yeah...The Thinker's plan is maybe the most stupid and illogical thing I have seen from the CWverse (which is saying a lot)

I can't think of any worst hell for a genius than being on a planet full of idiots...

Yet that is what his plan will result in?


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have to say, you compair two sets of gravity powers, Graviton over on SHIELD is a lot more impressive


Grey,

Grativon fought the freaking Avengers. Null hasn't done jack and neither does the Thinker. Though if there was a JLA, I'm pretty sure Batman would win. Because Batman.

Dark Archive

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Damon Griffin wrote:
All of this means he doesn't account for all possible variables, he just thinks he does, which more or less proves Thomas's point about DeVoe's presumed intelligence as well. In some small ways, he's a bit like H.R., whose undisputed intellect never stops him from doing dumb things.

Fictional 'geniuses' like DeVoe (and Harrison, for that matter), who come up with 'genius' ideas in a vacuum that are easily poked holes in by literally the first person to walk into the room, seem to lack the ability to self-edit, or the notion that other people are valuable to challenge one's own ideas (and point out flaws that might have been obvious to someone who *wasn't* the idea's originator).


See this is why Lex Luthor and Doom are better. Sure they fail, but at least their initial premise isn't as FLAWED as these two.


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Thomas Seitz wrote:
See this is why Lex Luthor and Doom are better. Sure they fail, but at least their initial premise isn't as FLAWED as these two.

For real.

Sure, Lex and Doom both place the reason they haven't actually done anything on other people, and they're both absolutely evil, but their science isn't ludicrously bad.

And at least Doom has given incredibly cogent arguments for why the people of Latveria fear him, and why he knows he's a tyrant, but that he still believes he is a good ruler because of his absolute dedication to his people. He's still a nutjob, but you can't doubt his commitment.


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Nope. Doom is a lot of things, but non-committal isn't one of them. He might wait until the world ends before he saves it, but he'll have the best plan to save it. Even if it falls apart in the end.


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I was not happy with the way the writers handled Amunet in this episode. I just did not believe the character at all: apparently forgetting twice that if DeVoe got his way, she'd be as dumbed down as everyone else, and then finally giving in to assist the heroes by giving them a one-shot item and telling them not to miss?

"I'm not completely brainless, I'm just written that way." (with apologies to Jessica Rabbit)

Plus, two useless Councils for Harry, some leads but no concrete progress on Killer Frost, Cisco's super-science is stalled...but huzzah! social media will save the day!

Bangs head against the desk.


Anyone notice that the pre-meta picture she was cosplaying as Tegan Jovanca?

So an end of the world situation is coming. And iris has warned one city. What about the other 7 billion people? Why not warn the President? Or your Superfriends? Has DeVoe accounted for a Master of the Dark Arts?


Thomas Seitz wrote:
Nope. Doom is a lot of things, but non-committal isn't one of them. He might wait until the world ends before he saves it, but he'll have the best plan to save it. Even if it falls apart in the end.

Who knew that I DOOM would be known for my commitment more then any of my other astounding and amazing traits.


GreenDragon1133 wrote:

Anyone notice that the pre-meta picture she was cosplaying as Tegan Jovanca?

I tried not to.

Ugh, Tegan. Ugh.


Agreed.


So my thoughts: Yes Amunet was weirdly handled but it was even MORE weird watching Katee Sackhoff try to do an accent she couldn't keep.

It was good though she did run off. If only because I didn't see why keeping her around helped ANYONE.

And yes the Council of Harrisons was kind of...bleh but the Council of Wells has turned into the a Council of Ricks.

Mostly I'm just wondering when social media decided to be a part of this show instead of you know...background?

Green,

I think the Master of the Dark Arts is currently on the Waverider and thus MIGHT be busy. I could be wrong though.


Ahh, but when is the Waverider?

Dark Archive

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I believe they are supposed to make an appearance in the finale


I guess we'll see in two weeks then.


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Thomas Seitz wrote:
I think the Master of the Dark Arts is currently on the Waverider and thus MIGHT be busy. I could be wrong though.

He's really more of a petty dabbler.


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Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

when they mentioned needing an organic solution to destroy the satellites, my first thought was: HHHMMM...if only you knew a super powerful person who could fly and just laser or punch out the satellites....

Dark Archive

The article is such a horrible idea. They seem hell-bent on shoehorning Iris into being a main character, despite the fact that she really should be a reoccurring character.

The average person can't do anything to help, and as such this is more likely to cause a panic than do anything even vaguely helpful. They say "Devoe won't be able to hide anymore"....sure he can...he doesn't have to look like Devoe.

And Devoe's not even in charge of Team Bad Guy anymore (although Flash and company have no way to know that).

Did the writers test Devoe's stupifying ray on themselves?


Kosh,

It is a horrible idea...but it's also very Iris West. The average person can't fight DeVoe or out think him sure, but right now I'm not sure DeVoe even CARES.

Also I think he's still in charge...just trying to re-adjust his...thinking?

As for the last one, the answer is clearly yes.

MMC,

Yeah but you know then they'd have to help stop Worldkillers...and what have you...


Sounds like the kind of thing that would merit some kind of League. Something like the Junior Lifeguard Association from years ago.


Greenie,

I think you mean Mutliverse League since they're in different universes...


even Some sort of society for justice stationed in america maybe.

Why isn't their a justice league multiverse team. It makes sense that they should have something for that. its not like other multiverses that are almost infinite its not even a 3 digit number.


Vid,

No idea but you talk to CW and the budget office about that one...


So,

Spoiler:
Devoe spends a lot of effort designing and building five satellites that must work in tandem...but then can replace any of them on a moment's notice with a satellite of a completely different design?

Team Flash running around checking launch sites along the 39th Parallel, when DeVoe can just wave his hand and launch all five from Central City?

Blackhawk Island!


Yeah the writing on this episode and especially DeVoe himself seemed...less than smart.

Someone call in Darkseid, I think we proven the Flash can't outthink itself.


On the bright side, I mostly enjoyed the infiltration scene. I'm sick to death of "our guns are useless so let's charge the obviously superior foe and try to hit them with our bare hands", but apart from that it was enjoyably done.


Which infiltration we talking about, DeVoe's or Team Flash?


DeVoe's.

Liberty's Edge RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16

I'm still confused about the Anuet provided zero-tech projectile. Couldn't any old rock have worked just fine if the Flash simply threw it at the satellite? It's not like Killgore's technology controlling power would have worked on that either (or for that matter a turkey drumstick).


Why didn't she immediately reactivate the power-dampener at the moment the gate guards went down? The building was well outside the range we normally see Killgore's powers work.


Bjorn,

Thanks for clarifying. I was moderately okay with it...but not sure I was that happy with it. (Especially the background music choice)

Joel,

Something tells me that Team Flash didn't think Barry could lift a rock that would have enough mass AND force behind it (even at super speeds) to hit the satellites.

Green,

It might have been but again we never did see how much improvement DeVoe's control over other Meta humans he's absorbed is compared to Killgore.


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See if you throw a rock at something at like mach 25 you'd be amazed how little its mass matters in the gran scheme of things. One day we will pay physicists to work on our comic book TV shows and that will be interesting.


Vid,

That may be but again some times people think mass is stronger than speed.

Dark Archive

I wonder if the effects of the Enlightenment are going to be partially undone / cured by A) 'DA Cecil Horton's' telepathic ability to interface with other people perhaps interfacing with *him,* combined with her maternal empathy countering whatever dispassion DeVoe is expecting of his subjects, or B) Harrison accidentally already 'Enlightening' himself and being halfway through 'reboot' when it hits.

They've been foreshadowing both pretty hard, but I have no idea which they intend to go with. (Perhaps both?)


Set,

Both are entirely within the realm of possibility. I mean the entire plan is pretty stupid as I said... so why should the cure be any better?

Scarab Sages

While I've enjoyed having a non speedster as the villain, and think the actor did a pretty good job, I also think this season suffered from too much Thinker. It seems like nearly the entire focus of the season was on him, which ended up hurting more than helping.

Still, it's been enjoyable.

Scarab Sages

And I read somewhere that next season's crossover event with the other shows MIGHT just involve a certain flying mouse infested city, along with a certain red-headed superheroine with the initials K.K.

Dark Archive

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I'm going on the theory that Flash interferes in such a way that causes Devoe's stupifying ray to retroactively affect the entire Arrowverse going back at least 6 years, although with less extreme results. It would help explain a large number of decisions that characters across all the shows have made.


Still don't know how mystery speedster girl fits into all this


No one does other than she's clearly from SOME future. How far and whom is unclear, Grey.

A-zombie, yes the Cross over for all four shows is Batwoman and Gotham. Though unclear who the villain would be...unless Ra's comes back.

SK,

That almost would make sense...


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I was kind of pleased with the way the "good left within DeVoe" dodge was handled. It's like the writers had a tiny spark of clever remaining, where we feared they'd already been dark-mattered into imbecility.


<twitch>.......In Canada the episode has been preempted by the final, 2 hour special, episode of "The Voice"

....
...
.

God I hate network TV priorities


That sucks.

Spoiler:
Ralph! We missed you man!

Would speculations about Tom Cavanaugh in Season 5 fall under spoilers at this point?


Green,

No because we all expect SOME verison of Harrison Wells to show up. Obviously it's not clear if Earth-2 will but if he does, he'll play a similar role Earth-17 did.

In any case I'm glad DeVoe is dealt with but they've STILL not explained why Ralph doesn't have the other metas powers.

I mean the writers confirmed they are dead, but shouldn't their powers still exist?

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