We know which are the cinematographical influences in this new AP, but I would like to know which are the influences coming from science-fiction literature.
A part of the quite not subtle reference towards Dune concerning the relation between the Black Sovereign and the Technic League, which other novels dealing with exhausted future or post-apocalyptic scenarios had been read by the authors?
For example, the Technic League is an evil version of the monks found in A Canticle for Liebowitz and the Foundation series? In my opinion it would had been perfect their concept development was influenced by the Miser from the novel Riddle Walker.
Bonus: Here I leave a moment from the British sci-fi show Doctor Who, belonging to the serial The Face of Evil in were the main protagonist must deal with a primitive civilization which source was the stranded crew of a crashed space ship.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=geMx6y8ctFk&feature=youtu.be
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Thundarr the Barbarian is a great reference for Iron Gods even if it is animated.
As for literary sources, you have jack Vance's Dying Earth, M. John Harrison's Viriconium novels, Gene Wolfe's Book of the New Sun or Camelot 3000 is another great example.
Edit: And let us not forget Metamorphis Alpha!
I recall reading somewhere that Dan Simmons' Hyperion was an inspiration. Though I don't really see how it fits with a super science/fantasy AP so I could be remembering the conversation incorrectly. It's a great book though.
I think that was more in reference to Distant Worlds. I could see Simmons' Ilium and Olympos being sort of useful as inspiration, though.
Creative Director
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Hyperion is absolutely a literary inspiration for Iron Gods.
Ilium and Olympos... not so much, since they're sitting on my bedside table but haven't yet been read by me.
But there are indeed some elements of the Hyperion stories that really inspired Iron Gods.
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Creative Director
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But there are indeed some elements of the Hyperion stories that really inspired Iron Gods.I just this weekend finished reading Hyperion and loved it. Out of curiosity, which parts were the biggest inspiration?
** spoiler omitted **
Not gonna reveal at which point what parts were the biggest inspiration, since that's kinda a spoiler.
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The more important question is are we getting stats for the Shrike?
I presume the attitude and reaction towards high-tech from non-numerians would be similar to that of the englishmen from Poul Anderson's "The High Crusade".
Do we get a hawking mat, or a treeship for druids
Hyperion is absolutely a literary inspiration for Iron Gods.
Ilium and Olympos... not so much, since they're sitting on my bedside table but haven't yet been read by me.
But there are indeed some elements of the Hyperion stories that really inspired Iron Gods.
Sure you will find the Moravecs a great source of inspiration for how to write Aballonite NPCs.
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Creative Director
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Sure you will find the Moravecs a great source of inspiration for how to write Aballonite NPCs.Hyperion is absolutely a literary inspiration for Iron Gods.
Ilium and Olympos... not so much, since they're sitting on my bedside table but haven't yet been read by me.
But there are indeed some elements of the Hyperion stories that really inspired Iron Gods.
I don't envision ever having to create Aballonite NPCs anytime soon. James Sutter, the guy who invented them, HAS read Ilium and Olympos though...
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I know it's not a literary reference, but I've seen very little about "Expedition to the Barrier Peaks" as an inspiration for Numeria and Iron Gods.
I'm pretty sure that if y'all take a look at that, you might see a couple interesting things that may give you a glimpse of what might be happening there, or how the spaceships got to Golarion in the first place.
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Creative Director
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I know it's not a literary reference, but I've seen very little about "Expedition to the Barrier Peaks" as an inspiration for Numeria and Iron Gods.
I'm pretty sure that if y'all take a look at that, you might see a couple interesting things that may give you a glimpse of what might be happening there, or how the spaceships got to Golarion in the first place.
I'm not sure why you haven't seen much about that... maybe just not looking in the right places? Because Expedition is pretty much my number one literary inspiration for Iron Gods. You'll see plenty of examples in the months to come, but they start with an illustration of iconics fighting vegepygmies in a sci-fi dungeon on the first installment's cover!
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I'm not sure why you haven't seen much about that... maybe just not looking in the right places? Because Expedition is pretty much my number one literary inspiration for Iron Gods. You'll see plenty of examples in the months to come, but they start with an illustration of iconics fighting vegepygmies in a sci-fi dungeon on the first installment's cover!
Ermagerd, it's the Voice of God!
Anyway, yeah, I probably just haven't found all the references. I guess what I was talking about is that I have only found a couple posters making the connections, though there may very well be more of them.
Also, AWESOME! Barrier Peaks was my favorite module from AD&D, the second one my Dad ever ran me through. I remember being a Werebear wearing Powered armor and feeling like a Space Marine from 40k. I'm writing a one-off adventure for my players that's happening in Numeria, it's going to be a while before I can get the last few volumes of WotR to run it for them, so they're getting a bunch of one-shot adventures. I hope I don't run afowl of anything you guys establish in Iron Gods, but I can always rework it after the AP is published :)
I'm not sure why you haven't seen much about that... maybe just not looking in the right places? Because Expedition is pretty much my number one literary inspiration for Iron Gods. You'll see plenty of examples in the months to come, but they start with an illustration of iconics fighting vegepygmies in a sci-fi dungeon on the first installment's cover!
Ermagerd, it's the Voice of God!
Anyway, yeah, I probably just haven't found all the references. I guess what I was talking about is that I have only found a couple posters making the connections, though there may very well be more of them.
Also, AWESOME! Barrier Peaks was my favorite module from AD&D, the second one my Dad ever ran me through. I remember being a Werebear wearing Powered armor and feeling like a Space Marine from 40k. I'm writing a one-off adventure for my players that's happening in Numeria, it's going to be a while before I can get the last few volumes of WotR to run it for them, so they're getting a bunch of one-shot adventures. I hope I don't run afowl of anything you guys establish in Iron Gods, but I can always rework it after the AP is published :)
Is a pity for me Jacobs is not familiar with Temple of the Frogs, City of the Gods and Wrath of the Immortals, all them composing a trilogy concerning the impact of a high-tech scientific universe spaceship crew ignoring the Prime Directive and mess with the realpolitik of a Sword and Sorcery world.In my opinion, that would had been a great inspiration source for a possible faction in the shadows.
So far I like the Numerian people would pretty much like those tribes found in Riddle Walker or even that one in Alfred Bester's Tiger,Tiger (a.k.a. The Stars my Destiny) with a good doze of cimmerian. Back to Riddle Walker, it could had been the source for a bard archetype, like the main protagonist, using oral tradition for keep somehow a remembrance of the origin of the disaster and also figure how to recover the knowledge of the ancients. A wizard archetype inspired in Dune's mentats would had been quite rad too.Anyways, Iron Gods is going to remind us all one quite basic truth about the World's oldest roleplaying game and it is great part of its sources came from exhausted future novels more than standard sword and sorcery.
-Bonus material: I know this is not literary, but I found quite amusing how science fantasy used to be a constant in japanese RPG video games. Here you have a good example, the first encounter with the dreadful technology of the ancients in Shinning Force. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JG29OcrOCAg
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Creative Director
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I'm not sure why you haven't seen much about that... maybe just not looking in the right places? Because Expedition is pretty much my number one literary inspiration for Iron Gods. You'll see plenty of examples in the months to come, but they start with an illustration of iconics fighting vegepygmies in a sci-fi dungeon on the first installment's cover!
Ermagerd, it's the Voice of God!
Anyway, yeah, I probably just haven't found all the references. I guess what I was talking about is that I have only found a couple posters making the connections, though there may very well be more of them.
Also, AWESOME! Barrier Peaks was my favorite module from AD&D, the second one my Dad ever ran me through. I remember being a Werebear wearing Powered armor and feeling like a Space Marine from 40k. I'm writing a one-off adventure for my players that's happening in Numeria, it's going to be a while before I can get the last few volumes of WotR to run it for them, so they're getting a bunch of one-shot adventures. I hope I don't run afowl of anything you guys establish in Iron Gods, but I can always rework it after the AP is published :)
Is a pity for me Jacobs is not familiar with Temple of the Frogs, City of the Gods and Wrath of the Immortals, all them composing a trilogy concerning the impact of a high-tech scientific universe spaceship crew ignoring the Prime Directive and mess with the realpolitik of a Sword and Sorcery world.In my opinion, that would had been a great inspiration source for a possible faction in the shadows.
So far I like the Numerian people would pretty much like those tribes found in Riddle Walker or even that one in Alfred Bester's Tiger,Tiger (a.k.a. The Stars my Destiny) with a good doze of cimmerian. Back to Riddle Walker, it could had been the source for a bard archetype, like the main protagonist, using oral tradition for keep somehow a remembrance of the origin of the disaster and also figure how to recover the...
Also not sure where you're getting that idea from... I do happen to have the cover of Temple of the Frog as my desktop background on one of my laptop computers, after all!
AKA: I'm quite familiar with those adventures. Expedition is the one I'm most familiar with, though, so that's the primary inspiration.
...I'm not sure why you haven't seen much about that... maybe just not looking in the right places? Because Expedition is pretty much my number one literary inspiration for Iron Gods. You'll see plenty of examples in the months to come, but they start with an illustration of iconics fighting vegepygmies in a sci-fi dungeon on the first installment's cover!
Ermagerd, it's the Voice of God!
Anyway, yeah, I probably just haven't found all the references. I guess what I was talking about is that I have only found a couple posters making the connections, though there may very well be more of them.
Also, AWESOME! Barrier Peaks was my favorite module from AD&D, the second one my Dad ever ran me through. I remember being a Werebear wearing Powered armor and feeling like a Space Marine from 40k. I'm writing a one-off adventure for my players that's happening in Numeria, it's going to be a while before I can get the last few volumes of WotR to run it for them, so they're getting a bunch of one-shot adventures. I hope I don't run afowl of anything you guys establish in Iron Gods, but I can always rework it after the AP is published :)
Is a pity for me Jacobs is not familiar with Temple of the Frogs, City of the Gods and Wrath of the Immortals, all them composing a trilogy concerning the impact of a high-tech scientific universe spaceship crew ignoring the Prime Directive and mess with the realpolitik of a Sword and Sorcery world.In my opinion, that would had been a great inspiration source for a possible faction in the shadows.
So far I like the Numerian people would pretty much like those tribes found in Riddle Walker or even that one in Alfred Bester's Tiger,Tiger (a.k.a. The Stars my Destiny) with a good doze of cimmerian. Back to Riddle Walker, it could had been the source for a bard archetype, like the main protagonist, using oral tradition for keep somehow a remembrance of the origin of the disaster and also
In another thread you mentioned not being familiar with Temple and City because they came out when you were in college. Maybe I am wrong and was another member of the Paizo staff, but I do have that impression.
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 6, Contributor
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Influences for me include A Canticle for Leibowitz, Hiero's Journey and its sequel, Universe and Common Sense, Starship, and Thundarr the Barbarian. Surely more if I spent more time thinking about it.Starship, Russ? Did you build the city on Rock and Roll?
Hah :) A city-in-a-bottle novel by Brian Aldiss, also called Non-Stop.
...I'm not sure why you haven't seen much about that... maybe just not looking in the right places? Because Expedition is pretty much my number one literary inspiration for Iron Gods. You'll see plenty of examples in the months to come, but they start with an illustration of iconics fighting vegepygmies in a sci-fi dungeon on the first installment's cover!
Ermagerd, it's the Voice of God!
Anyway, yeah, I probably just haven't found all the references. I guess what I was talking about is that I have only found a couple posters making the connections, though there may very well be more of them.
Also, AWESOME! Barrier Peaks was my favorite module from AD&D, the second one my Dad ever ran me through. I remember being a Werebear wearing Powered armor and feeling like a Space Marine from 40k. I'm writing a one-off adventure for my players that's happening in Numeria, it's going to be a while before I can get the last few volumes of WotR to run it for them, so they're getting a bunch of one-shot adventures. I hope I don't run afowl of anything you guys establish in Iron Gods, but I can always rework it after the AP is published :)
Is a pity for me Jacobs is not familiar with Temple of the Frogs, City of the Gods and Wrath of the Immortals, all them composing a trilogy concerning the impact of a high-tech scientific universe spaceship crew ignoring the Prime Directive and mess with the realpolitik of a Sword and Sorcery world.In my opinion, that would had been a great inspiration source for a possible faction in the shadows.
So far I like the Numerian people would pretty much like those tribes found in Riddle Walker or even that one in Alfred Bester's Tiger,Tiger (a.k.a. The Stars my Destiny) with a good doze of cimmerian. Back to Riddle Walker, it could had been the source for a bard archetype, like the main protagonist, using oral tradition for keep somehow a remembrance of the
Nothing more science-fantasy than the Blackmoor setting! I loved City of the Gods (and its 3.5 conversion with weird d20 future bits tacked on), so one can't blame me for hoping some Blackmoorian references appear in the AP! :D And if not, I have a hunch my character for the AP will be an extraterrestrial based being named "Saint Stephen." *Hey, it's possible in Blackmoor's canon!*
Hah :) A city-in-a-bottle novel by Brian Aldiss, also called Non-Stop.Influences for me include A Canticle for Leibowitz, Hiero's Journey and its sequel, Universe and Common Sense, Starship, and Thundarr the Barbarian. Surely more if I spent more time thinking about it.Starship, Russ? Did you build the city on Rock and Roll?
Now you had mentioned "Non-Stop", lets not forget "Orphans of the Sky" by Heinlein.
Also, here I leave some footage belonging to the pilot episode of a canadian sci-fi show taking place in a massive generational starship which was written by Harlan Ellison "The Starlost":https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auCb3tnYiAY
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Right. "Universe" and "Common Sense" were the two novellas combined to make "Orphans of the Sky", so they weren't neglected in my list :)
Shame on me, I didn't realize that when I did read your post, after all I do own the compilation and I have both tales as a unity in my mind.
"The Inverted World" by Christopher Priest could also a good source for people which language and culture is highly dependent on a mix of limited view of the world and dependency on technology barely undestood.Concerning mutants, I guess the best depiction in fiction is "Engine Summer" by John Crowley, most of the characters are barbaric post-humans thanks to previous generations genetic engineering and cross breeding with aliens.
Also, here I leave some footage belonging to the pilot episode of a canadian sci-fi show taking place in a massive generational starship which was written by Harlan Ellison "The Starlost":
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=auCb3tnYiAY
While it's entirely nostalgia speaking, that show rocked on toast when I was very very young and my Dad introduced me to it... (as terrible as history will likely remember this series)
The character of Kane by Karl Edward Wagner comes to mind everytime I read anything about the Black Sovereign. Add in the Bloodstone ring as a control mechanism for the navigator AI(s)to manipulate the Black Sovereign, a group of once technically advanced but now degenerate boggards in the swamp, the Technic League propping up the tyrant after drinking from the liquid blood of the boggards' ancestors who were processed into FTL drive material given their innate intelligence, and it becomes even more clear to me.