Are Wolves 'Exotic'?


Advice

Liberty's Edge RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32

For the purpose of getting a saddle for one being used by a small sized cavalier?

Dark Archive

I'd say no. In the fantasy game, riding dogs are considered a common element, and the differences are rather minor.


No.
It ultimately depends on setting. If you are in the Desert with no forest anywhere around you then maybe, if you are in the Darklands then yes, but otherwise no.
Wolves are one of the most successful species on the planet, and it was because of humanity wiping them out that they are extinct in certain areas. In times passed, which Golarion is annologuing to a degree, wolves were commonplace on every continent in large numbers.


golem101 wrote:
I'd say no. In the fantasy game, riding dogs are considered a common element, and the differences are rather minor.

I'd say yes, because while riding dogs are common, they are bred for that and wolves aren't. "Tamed" wolves are never really tamed.


Vod Canockers wrote:
golem101 wrote:
I'd say no. In the fantasy game, riding dogs are considered a common element, and the differences are rather minor.
I'd say yes, because while riding dogs are common, they are bred for that and wolves aren't. "Tamed" wolves are never really tamed.

Maybe he knows a werewolf, or a druid and the bond is a consensual one.

Maybe the mount IS the Druid, and he is just into that....


Vod Canockers wrote:
golem101 wrote:
I'd say no. In the fantasy game, riding dogs are considered a common element, and the differences are rather minor.
I'd say yes, because while riding dogs are common, they are bred for that and wolves aren't. "Tamed" wolves are never really tamed.

I believe in this instant the issue is the morphology of the wolf considered to be exotic, when compared to the morphology of let's say a riding dog, for the sole purpose of the cost of a saddle.

In that limited context, no, I don't believe it is anymore exotic in shape than a riding dog. Now if you want to ride an owlbear, yes that is going to require an exotic saddle.


I'd say, due to the fact that it is a standard mount option available to you at level 1, and in fact the only option available to you at that level, then it would be a common mount.

Exotic mounts only might come into play when boars are an option, or when you are a beast rider.


Wolves? Yes.
But if you buy a trait explaining why they are common to your character i would allow them to be a normal mount.


I would say no.
The halfling cavalier order of the paw calls out a wolf as a riding mount. So it can´t be that "exotic", when it is a commonly used mount for halflings. From an ingame perspective, it should be available as normal everywhere there are halflings or maybe grnomes around.

Note that some people say everything but a horse is an exotic mount.
In your homegame, you yourself can decide that.
Except when your GM is a humanocentric "racist" and wants to bully smaller people hehe.
Actually a common real world problem. People smaller than the norm have problems buying clothing and shoes and often need to pay a lot more than fat and huge people. Which is totally not logical, since those are using much more material.

Dark Archive

Hayato Ken wrote:
Note that some people say everything but a horse is an exotic mount.

I myself usually go along that baseline, but then again, the camel and the dromedary are pretty common mounts in real world cultures, and boy! they do ride quite differently than the horse, and use very different saddles and equipment.

In a fantasy world where riding dogs are common (even if only in some cultures/races), the saddle and equipment for riding a wolf should differ very little from the norm. Trained animal, tamed animal, or whatever.

Lantern Lodge

Hayato Ken wrote:


Actually a common real world problem. People smaller than the norm have problems buying clothing and shoes and often need to pay a lot more than fat and huge people. Which is totally not logical, since those are using much more material.

Yeah... I've been on the opposite spectrum... 6'7" here, mostly legs, so I need pants with a 38-40 inch inseam (length). About 8 years ago it was impossible to find my size, even in the big and tall stores (I found a couple 40 inch inseams... but they for people a couple hundred pounds heavier than me). They've gotten a little bit better now... but dress pants are still out of the question for in store shopping.


I agree with Taku Ooka Nin; depends on the setting.

Camels are pretty common in parts of North Africa, Middle East, and Central Asia, and finding them or the proper equipment shouldn't be terribly difficult. Now, if you tried looking for the same equipment and animals in Sweden, prepare to jump through hoops.

Wolves as mounts in Pathfinder would most likely be Normal in some regions and Exotic in others.


If it matters, as far as pathfinder is concerned anything other than a horse or camel for a medium sized cavalier is pretty exotic and out of reach, even if they come from a land with nor horses and camels but filled with dinosaurs, and katana is exotic, even if they come from a land with lots of katanas and greatswords and maces are the exotic ones by definition.

That said, I'd say its really just a small amount of gold and I don't see anything saying what is and isn't exotic. So its pretty up in the air and not important enough to fuss over.


Hayato Ken wrote:
. . . Actually a common real world problem. People smaller than the norm have problems buying clothing and shoes and often need to pay a lot more than fat and huge people. Which is totally not logical, since those are using much more material.

And notice how much more expensive swimwear and underwear is, especially for women? Prices based on amount of material would indicate this makes no sense... which I agree it makes no sense.

Wolves? They are common in Golarion. It should be a regular saddle if a riding dog's is.


Te'Shen wrote:
Hayato Ken wrote:
. . . Actually a common real world problem. People smaller than the norm have problems buying clothing and shoes and often need to pay a lot more than fat and huge people. Which is totally not logical, since those are using much more material.

And notice how much more expensive swimwear and underwear is, especially for women? Prices based on amount of material would indicate this makes no sense... which I agree it makes no sense.

I always noticed the same thing about childrens' shoes and clothes. More expensive and its not like children are rare, we all start out as them.

oh and for me not exotic, especially in an area with wolves or lots of halflings, etc. Another example might be a pony saddle for a dwarf. Clearly it would have to be different from a human saddle but I would still call it common.


Verteidiger wrote:
I agree with Taku Ooka Nin;

Link courtesy of me.

Keep in mind that you can ride an animal one size larger than yourself without a saddle, but you fall off if you fall unconscious. It is little more than a safety measure in game terms, but it does give you a negative to your ride checks. So, point is, if you have constant speak with animals then you don't need a saddle.
I tend to think about exotic saddles as something that moves FAR beyond the norm. Instead of using a typical saddle with modifications a major rebuild and redesign is used, E.G. an Elephant Saddle is very different than a horse saddle, but you could probably strap a pony saddle to a wolf and it work fine after minimal modifications.

Exotic Saddles are more for stuff like Spiders, Bats, and other creatures that are so out of the norm (horses in areas that use horses) that the normally used saddles just do not fit. A horse saddle will not work on a Giant Spider saddle, and vice versa.

Silver Crusade

Cathara wrote:
For the purpose of getting a saddle for one being used by a small sized cavalier?

I do not believe you need to pay up for an exotic saddle.


If a riding dog doesn't require an exotic saddle then neither should a wolf. Wolves and dogs are still so closely related that they aren't even really different species, as they can have fertile offspring. Even if they couldn't, their builds are so similar that it would still be a non-issue.

Lantern Lodge

2 people marked this as a favorite.

For saddles, no.

For the purpose of dual weilding, say as a Large creature holding two wolves (maybe by the tail?), wolves are definitely One-Handed Exotic melee weapons.


Jayson MF Kip wrote:

For saddles, no.

For the purpose of dual weilding, say as a Large creature holding two wolves (maybe by the tail?), wolves are definitely One-Handed Exotic melee weapons.

You know, its not a good idea to annoy things that ARE a body disposal unit.

Lantern Lodge

Man, you can't swing a pair of wolves in this thread without hitting some crazy PETA-level dog-lover.


Jayson MF Kip wrote:

For saddles, no.

For the purpose of dual weilding, say as a Large creature holding two wolves (maybe by the tail?), wolves are definitely One-Handed Exotic melee weapons.

No, they are two handed for medium characters. This is because how weapon sizes and their acutal sizes match up. For the intended user, a light weapon is two sizes smaller, a one handed weapon is one size smaller, and a two handed weapon is the same size as the intended user.

An easier way to remember it is this: a medium character's dagger is the size of a cat, their longsword is the same size as a halfling, and their greatsword is as big as their own body.

This is weird yes, and it usually only comes up for things like spells that ask for specific sizes for objects. Can't blame anyone for it not being common knowledge.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Jayson MF Kip wrote:
Man, you can't swing a pair of wolves in this thread without hitting some crazy PETA-level dog-lover.

It might turn out that one or two of the wolves you are swinging around are werewolves and they worship Jezelda....

Though, I wonder if the wolves make a free grapple and trip check when you hit someone with them.
I wonder about a wolf siege weapon: load wolves into catapult and fire them at the enemies. Somehow cast featherfall on them while they fall and see how many people are delicious.

The Exchange

I'd say that the general implication is that "exotic" saddles are a relative term. If you are in the Halfling Kingdoms, or (help!) in a Final Fantasy-inspired game world, a full-sized saddle for a full-sized horse might be 'exotic'. If you're in a very 'realistic' world, a wolf-saddle would probably qualify as exotic.

If you're lucky enough to be off Golarion, in one of the worlds where goblins ride worgs, you can simply raid a goblin lair and outfit yourself with all the wolf-oriented tack you could ever want.


Mike Franke wrote:
Te'Shen wrote:
Hayato Ken wrote:
. . . Actually a common real world problem. People smaller than the norm have problems buying clothing and shoes and often need to pay a lot more than fat and huge people. Which is totally not logical, since those are using much more material.
And notice how much more expensive swimwear and underwear is, especially for women? Prices based on amount of material would indicate this makes no sense... which I agree it makes no sense.
I always noticed the same thing about childrens' shoes and clothes. More expensive and its not like children are rare, we all start out as them.

The only reason things are expensive is the fact that people are willing to pay the price. Sure, there all sorts of reasons to raise or lower the price of something, but in the end, it all comes down to how much the buyer is willing to pay.

Most people are willing to spend more money on what they think is necessary for their children, and, while that's by no means a rule, women are usually willing to pay more for clothes than men are, at least IME.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Advice / Are Wolves 'Exotic'? All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.
Recent threads in Advice