Sleepers


Pathfinder Online

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Goblin Squad Member

For those of you unfamiliar with the term. A sleeper is a placeholder for your character when you leave the game. They have all your inventory and if they die, you will be dead when you come back to the game. In essence, when you log off, your character passes out.

I think it could add two things to the game:
1. Makes people think about where they are logging off. You would basically need to be in a player structure that protects sleepers.

2. Creates a 'sleeper hunt' activity for less reputable players.

You should be able to train abilities to protect your sleeping body, and threaded items will still function the same. You could also set it up so you could rob a sleeper getting access to 100% of the non threaded inventory. This would require training, and be open to failure, each attempt would be a further hit to alignment and reputation.

What do you all think?

Goblin Squad Member

"That's just my game"

Keep characters in-world at all times, even when players are logged off?

Goblin Squad Member

What about this system makes it necessary over, say, a 30 second logout timer? Why would we want to keep the characters standing around in place after that?

Personally, one scenario I can see happening is that hundreds of "sleepers" will be standing around the starting area.

Goblin Squad Member

Pax Shane Gifford wrote:
What about this system makes it necessary...?

Oh, I don't think it's necessary at all. In fact, I have no expectations whatsoever that it will ever happen in PFO, and wouldn't even advocate it in this game. I do think it's an interesting idea, and I would love to see it become a standard feature, but I realize that's going to have to wait on some significant technical advancements.

And for the record, my idea would not have them "asleep", but rather going about their daily business the way NPCs do in most games.

Goblin Squad Member

In Age of Wushu they have another implementation of this: your logged off character has a chance to be assigned an NPC job, like waiter, or guard and you actually earn in-game coin with this: the "hard" type of coin too, whith which you can buy the better perks in the game. Not only will other players see your character doing these menial chores, but this is also where the Kidnap system comes into play: you can decide to kidnap such a logged off character: target ofline player, click button, timer ticks down, a large bag appears over your shoulder. You then have to run with the bag over your shoulder to an NPC that will take these hostages (like a nearby brothel).

You run slower while doing this, have a certain icon over your head and off course the bag over your shoulder: you are a FFA kill during this action. Other players can earn Honor and coin with killing you.

Once you have delivered the hostage you are safe though, and earn some nice in-game coin. It is kinda exiting. :) The kidnapped character does have a slight penalty when he logs in, and obviously logs in at a somewhat different place then he logged out. I also think it stops the payout of any job you were doing.

It was never a real setback to get kidnapped, having earned money with an NPC job was always a nice surprise and it provides some exitement for other players while you are offline.

Goblin Squad Member

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I can not adamantly oppose this enough. Some of us have things that happen in the real world which means we do not get an extra 5 or 10 minutes to find a safe place to log out.

This would quite literally make the game unplayable for me because I could not leave safe regions. The first time I had to go off and cover some minor emergency at home and come back to find all of my non-threaded gear stolen would cause me to cancel my subscription.

I would be fine if the logged out characters would be non-targettable "flavor NPCs". But allowing players to passively lose items because the real world demanded immediate attention is frankly very poor design.

Goblin Squad Member

Lifedragn wrote:

I can not adamantly oppose this enough. Some of us have things that happen in the real world which means we do not get an extra 5 or 10 minutes to find a safe place to log out.

This would quite literally make the game unplayable for me because I could not leave safe regions. The first time I had to go off and cover some minor emergency at home and come back to find all of my non-threaded gear stolen would cause me to cancel my subscription.

I would be fine if the logged out characters would be non-targettable "flavor NPCs". But allowing players to passively lose items because the real world demanded immediate attention is frankly very poor design.

Completely agree. Any benefit of immersion here from being reachable (if you are criminal) or just "filing the world" is greatly off set by the suffering of people that have less time to make everything "perfect" when they log. It is the part about being found and lootable (while helpless) that wrecks it. Most people would be "sleepers" and offline more time than online and able to defend themselves.

Goblin Squad Member

And losing because of 'automated trainable defenses' does not make things any better. I probably could have lived with this when I was a single guy living by myself. But having a family makes this near impossible to work out for me.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

Lifedragn wrote:

I can not adamantly oppose this enough. Some of us have things that happen in the real world which means we do not get an extra 5 or 10 minutes to find a safe place to log out.

This would quite literally make the game unplayable for me because I could not leave safe regions. The first time I had to go off and cover some minor emergency at home and come back to find all of my non-threaded gear stolen would cause me to cancel my subscription.

I would be fine if the logged out characters would be non-targettable "flavor NPCs". But allowing players to passively lose items because the real world demanded immediate attention is frankly very poor design.

Idem. 1 min log-out, like EvE, is enough.

Goblin Squad Member

One minute is a bit excessive when you have a child crying at you, but short enough that unless you were actively fighting folks already you are probably safe leaving the keyboard during that timer. The incidence ratio of being attacked in that one minute should be low enough to be acceptable.

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite wrote:
Lifedragn wrote:

I can not adamantly oppose this enough. Some of us have things that happen in the real world which means we do not get an extra 5 or 10 minutes to find a safe place to log out.

This would quite literally make the game unplayable for me because I could not leave safe regions. The first time I had to go off and cover some minor emergency at home and come back to find all of my non-threaded gear stolen would cause me to cancel my subscription.

I would be fine if the logged out characters would be non-targettable "flavor NPCs". But allowing players to passively lose items because the real world demanded immediate attention is frankly very poor design.

Completely agree. Any benefit of immersion here from being reachable (if you are criminal) or just "filing the world" is greatly off set by the suffering of people that have less time to make everything "perfect" when they log. It is the part about being found and lootable (while helpless) that wrecks it. Most people would be "sleepers" and offline more time than online and able to defend themselves.

Unless Mordenkainen's Magnificent Mansion is a cheap and easy scroll/potion you can just carry around and use at will, I am in agreement with Lifedrgn and Bringslite on this one.

PS. Please, please make MMM a spell/scroll/whatever in the game!! :D

Papa Daz

Goblin Squad Member

Dazyk wrote:
PS. Please, please make MMM a spell/scroll/whatever in the game!! :D

Oh, the lengths that my TT players would go to describing just how magnificent their version of the mansion was and the servants! Boys and Their Toys...

Goblin Squad Member

Nihimon wrote:
Pax Shane Gifford wrote:
What about this system makes it necessary...?

Oh, I don't think it's necessary at all. In fact, I have no expectations whatsoever that it will ever happen in PFO, and wouldn't even advocate it in this game. I do think it's an interesting idea, and I would love to see it become a standard feature, but I realize that's going to have to wait on some significant technical advancements.

And for the record, my idea would not have them "asleep", but rather going about their daily business the way NPCs do in most games.

I realised what you want, was just asking OP what he feels this would add to the game. :)

Goblin Squad Member

Pax Shane Gifford wrote:
I realised what you want, was just asking OP what he feels this would add to the game. :)

I just like the system, Rust introduced me to it, and I enjoyed it. I like things that make you plan ahead, and force players to think more.

I would just have sleepers out in the wild, if you log out in a settlement or POI you could go into that area's 'inventory' so you are only killed or looted if the structure falls. Logging out in NPC controlled territory, or on a road would send you to the nearest NPC city. Unless you are purposefully living out in the wilds, every adventure should start and end in protected territory. I don't know about everyone else, but when I'm in a sandbox I try to never put my self in a position where death will set me back, and if it does, I accept it, I don't get angry about it. If losing your non-threaded inventory ever makes you want to quit the game, a PvP sandbox is not for you. I have a friend that is a firefighter, when I play games with him it is always an eventuality he will get called away, sometimes we both suffer for this, but we don't let it effect us. If you have a limited time to play, or know life will be interrupting you, you should be ready for the consequences.

Most of all this prevents the 'hide and log out' method of escape, if your pursuer doesn't get in range to use an attack.

Mostly, I was wondering what other people here think. I know Nihimon has advocated for player persistence in the past. I was against any kind of it to begin with, until I played Rust and actually enjoyed the system.

Goblin Squad Member

Valkenr, your proposal would not fit well with this statement from Ryan:

Not a meaningful interaction.

Quote:

If you engage me in combat, I can try to run, fight, negotiate, call for help, etc. I feel like I have choices and can affect the outcome.

If you successfully pick my pocket, by definition, I had no meaningful choices or interaction with you - I just got screwed. This elicits as I said a response of anger and sense of loss disproportionate to the likely value. It rapidly degenerates into paranoia and breaks socialization in a game designed to be driven by socialization.

This effect is related to why people have such a strong negative reaction to being ganked.[/url]

Goblin Squad Member

You had a choice, that choice was to put your self into a situation where you body could be easily looted. You made the meaningful choice to gamble with your safety.

Goblin Squad Member

Valkenr wrote:
If losing your non-threaded inventory ever makes you want to quit the game, a PvP sandbox is not for you.

I am happy that you know 10 minutes before you can log off most of the time you are playing a game.

This is an absurd statement. You are not interacting with the game in a sleeper scenario. It is basically being punished for having a life. The reason I say it would make me quit is that about 75% of the time I log off it is suddenly. I have a family, and they do not wait for you to run to the next settlement. And last I knew we weren't going to have "Teleport to Bind Point" options for travel in this game. Losing my non-threaded items is not an issue when I at least have some sense of agency. But for a lot of people this would be a daily occurrence and would reach unbearable frequency.

How about we add a Berserk spell another player can cast on you and it makes the AI play your character completely for the next 10 minutes and you cannot stop it from doing so. Berserk cannot be resisted or blocked. The only way to be safe from a Berserk spell is to be in a safe location. Unless that location is destroyed in a war. Would you be okay with losing your non-threaded items in that scenario?

Goblin Squad Member

Valkenr wrote:
You had a choice, that choice was to put your self into a situation where you body could be easily looted. You made the meaningful choice to gamble with your safety.

When we log off is not always a plannable choice. Perhaps you are more fortunate. But the majority of us are not.

Goblin Squad Member

It is most certainly never a fun choice.

1) logging out somewhere not safe means you may find your looted corpse at login: totally not fun. There is no fun anticipation to be had here at all.

2) Finding a place to log out safely; annoying and not fun; the fact that it is almost required makes it even less fun.

So you wasted skill points and xp to skill up so you are better prepared for this awesome feature: and still it can happen(even more fun?). But it happens less to you then those suckers that do not skill up this skill! I guess everybody should skill up this skill then, pretty much required actually.

I am looking and looking but not finding the fun, the meaningful choice, the interaction. Just not finding it.

Goblin Squad Member

Lifedragn wrote:
Valkenr wrote:
You had a choice, that choice was to put your self into a situation where you body could be easily looted. You made the meaningful choice to gamble with your safety.
When we log off is not always a plannable choice. Perhaps you are more fortunate. But the majority of us are not.

This.

+1, as Nihimon would say ;)

Goblinworks Executive Founder

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Valkenr wrote:
If losing your non-threaded inventory ever makes you want to quit the game, a PvP sandbox is not for you.

Well PFO shouldn't be, a PvP sandbox. It should be a Sandbox, which happen to let us play PvP.

There are already a s!%&load of PvP sandbox. Let us try other things please.

Goblin Squad Member

A game gets boring to me when everything is simply fun. If everything is fun for everybody, then everything is likely easy and safe. For me, I find fun in challenge, and uncertainty. If I log out in the wilds, I would not be surprised to find my body looted, if I log out in a settlement, I would not be surprised that I was killed when the settlement was burned down.

This is the problem when you bring words like 'fun' and 'enjoyable' to conversations like these, it is a pure matter of opinion. What is fun for one person, may be unbearable for another.

Goblin Squad Member

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Audoucet wrote:
Valkenr wrote:
If losing your non-threaded inventory ever makes you want to quit the game, a PvP sandbox is not for you.

Well PFO shouldn't be, a PvP sandbox. It should be a Sandbox, which happen to let us play PvP.

There are already a s&$&load of PvP sandbox. Let us try other things please.

Exactly.

Besides, I am seeing a LOT of this response on the forums in the past week or so, when it simply isn't accurate. Ryan has specifically said that this game will be a HYBRID Sandbox game. So 'Sandboxers' and 'Theme-Parkers' alike need to relinquish their preconceived notions.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Valkenr wrote:

A game gets boring to me when everything is simply fun. If everything is fun for everybody, then everything is likely easy and safe. For me, I find fun in challenge, and uncertainty. If I log out in the wilds, I would not be surprised to find my body looted, if I log out in a settlement, I would not be surprised that I was killed when the settlement was burned down.

This is the problem when you bring words like 'fun' and 'enjoyable' to conversations like these, it is a pure matter of opinion. What is fun for one person, may be unbearable for another.

Losing when not playing is not a matter of challenge.

Goblin Squad Member

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I'll have to put myself as opposed to this idea, as I see many others have done as well. There is no challenge in killing a sleeping target, the "sleeper" couldn't do anything to resist the occurance, and some of us have a life or a job which means that we might have to leave the computer FAST.

Goblin Squad Member

Lifedragn wrote:
Valkenr wrote:
You had a choice, that choice was to put your self into a situation where you body could be easily looted. You made the meaningful choice to gamble with your safety.
When we log off is not always a plannable choice. Perhaps you are more fortunate. But the majority of us are not.

I cannot agree with this more. My wife has some very serious medical conditions and occasionally I have to drop everything to go help her: mid-PvP, mid-Raid, or mid-Whatever. If I was a "sleeper," I'd lose everything more frequently than I'd like, and thus would most likely never leave a safe zone. At that point, what is the point of playing the game?

Goblin Squad Member

This is a terrible idea. Besides the obvious that nobody wants to be killed when they're not even online, I don't want thousands of limp characters littering the landscape looking stupid, being in the way, creating insane server load, and breaking immersion.

Goblin Squad Member

There needs to be a log off timer if you are engaged in any kind of combat to prevent players from logging off in the event of an ambush.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

I think that everyone agree that you shouldn't be able to log-off while there's an ongoing fight, or while running. Again, EvE is the way to go here.

Goblin Squad Member

Phyllain wrote:
There needs to be a log off timer if you are engaged in any kind of combat to prevent players from logging off in the event of an ambush.

This (aside from serious optimization and server hardware issues) is why Earthrise failed. It was set to be the next awesome Sci-Fi FFA sandbox, but everyone just dropped out of game if they were about to die.

Goblin Squad Member

Valkenr wrote:

A game gets boring to me when everything is simply fun. If everything is fun for everybody, then everything is likely easy and safe. For me, I find fun in challenge, and uncertainty. If I log out in the wilds, I would not be surprised to find my body looted, if I log out in a settlement, I would not be surprised that I was killed when the settlement was burned down.

This is the problem when you bring words like 'fun' and 'enjoyable' to conversations like these, it is a pure matter of opinion. What is fun for one person, may be unbearable for another.

I guess GW could make a toggle in the interface for this:

Randomly killed and looted on log in ? yes/no

But they don't need to. Why do you assume safety ? If you log out in a settlement, you could log in to ashes, and enemies waiting, you can totally die that way as it stands. Wilderness, well, something could have wandered your way while you were offline, and there's a pack of wolves in that meadow of flowers you logged out in, you don't need to make it worse dude.

Goblin Squad Member

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Valkenr wrote:
This is the problem when you bring words like 'fun' and 'enjoyable' to conversations like these, it is a pure matter of opinion. What is fun for one person, may be unbearable for another.

Actually most of the problem here is that some people's 'fun' is only achievable by ensuring other people can't have fun. So, can easily bored players be challenged without a feature that makes the game un-fun for others?

I think the answer is a definitive 'Yes'. That is certainly the intent of the designers...to let people take on the level of challenge that they prefer.

I, for one, have a very challenging real life profession. So I'm not looking for over much levels of pretend challenge. I want just enough to relieve some stress without making this another job. You might be different...fine, but don't force me to play your style.

But why would GW implement something that brings you marginally more 'fun' while forcing others to have significantly less 'fun'?

As Pinosaur suggested, how about an optional toggle that let's people play on 'uber challenge' mode...it would let people loot your body while offline if they find it regardless of the state of their toggle. If what you really want is "challenge", then you should definitely make that choice..even if others choose to have less challenge (and get to take your stuff.)

But I suspect that 'more challenge' isn't the real motivation here. I think it is advantage that you are seeking. An advantage created by leveraging the fact that you rarely have RL issues that force you to leave the game quickly.

Maybe I'm wrong...but it sure comes across that way to me.

Goblin Squad Member

+1 to the above sentiments.

Goblin Squad Member

Would be nice to have some kind of AI options that you could set.

1. Find nearest shelter
2. Find place and make camp
3. Return to "job" (I like the having an NPC type job idea).

Whatever.. :)

Of course that doesn't address the folks dumping out to avoid danger.

Goblin Squad Member

Dogan. wrote:
You might be different...fine, but don't force me to play your style.

This can be said from my point of view.

Dogan. wrote:
But I suspect that 'more challenge' isn't the real motivation here. I think it is advantage that you are seeking. An advantage created by leveraging the fact that you rarely have RL issues that force you to leave the game quickly.

It's not advantage, it's enjoyability. The game should not support or account for people that need to leave the game suddenly, because those mechanics will be ripe for abuse by people trying to avoid unwanted encounters. I don't have a perfect life, if I'm logging in at work, or even at home, there is an eventuality that I will be suddenly dragged away. I account for this eventuality and accept the consequences. I won't go out adventuring with my rarest gear that I can't completely thread, unless I know I have a solid window to play. I like to plan ahead.

Goblin Squad Member

Docora wrote:


Of course that doesn't address the folks dumping out to avoid danger.

I'm not sure why everyone thinks this is so complicated:

1) Logging out in a safe area- instant.

2) Logging out in the wilderness, but not in combat- takes 30 sec, during which you can be attacked in PVP or PVE. At 30 sec you are logged out whether or not you are being attacked.

3) You cannot log out if you are in the middle of combat, with the exception of #2.

4) If you're disconnected and not in combat, rules #1 and #2 apply.

5) If you are disconnected in combat, you're character persists until the combat is resolved by your death or you going out of combat (if your team manages to prevail and kept your character alive), at which point you are logged.

Any type of extended vulnerability while you are logged out and cannot defend yourself is just begging for griefing and a toxic community.

Goblin Squad Member

@Traianus Decius Aureus
Take a look at EVE's system

Goblin Squad Member

Traianus Decius Aureus. I didn't say it was complicated, I said my post didn't address it. :) I was just trying to respond about "meaningful" things for my PC to do while I go back to reality. :) It would be kind of cool if they could keep busy.

Valkenr: No offense but I have been trying to play EVE for the last 4 days and found it the most dreadful game I have ever attempted to play. Last night I finally turned it off and will likely uninstall tonight..

Goblin Squad Member

Traianus Decius Aureus wrote:
Docora wrote:
... dumping out to avoid danger.
... At 30 sec you are logged out whether or not you are being attacked.

I expect the folks talking about "dumping out to avoid danger" are thinking your system would allow folks to being logging out as soon as they see danger coming, and it sounds like they're right.

I would expect being attacked, PvP or PvE, to break you out of camping out.

Goblin Squad Member

Docora wrote:

Traianus Decius Aureus. I didn't say it was complicated, I said my post didn't address it. :) I was just trying to respond about "meaningful" things for my PC to do while I go back to reality. :) It would be kind of cool if they could keep busy.

Valkenr: No offense but I have been trying to play EVE for the last 4 days and found it the most dreadful game I have ever attempted to play. Last night I finally turned it off and will likely uninstall tonight..

Did you actually look at the link? The section explains the durations your character remains in the game upon log-off, depending on what you last actions were.

And it takes more than 4 days to get into EVE, there is a strong learning curve, especially if you don't get in with a corporation. There is way more than 4 days of training to get a taste of what the game has to offer.

Goblin Squad Member

Nihimon wrote:
Traianus Decius Aureus wrote:
Docora wrote:
... dumping out to avoid danger.
... At 30 sec you are logged out whether or not you are being attacked.

I expect the folks talking about "dumping out to avoid danger" are thinking your system would allow folks to being logging out as soon as they see danger coming, and it sounds like they're right.

I would expect being attacked, PvP or PvE, to break you out of camping out.

In most games I've played, 30 sec is more than enough to kill an unattended character. So if someone drops to avoid fighting a group they see coming towards them, they are still probably going die. But if you wanted to add a proximity condition to it as well, I wouldn't be opposed to that. Say, the timer jumps to 60 sec if any hostile flagged player is within 100 paces of your character.

In addition, if I'm out harvesting, and someone who is also harvesting sees me coming and they decide to drop rather than fight, its a strategic win for me (I get resources, they didn't). It may not show up on a PVP leader board, but I'll take it. Kills are easy, but when someone would rather log than fight you- that is just sublime.

Goblin Squad Member

Valkenr wrote:


Did you actually look at the link? The section explains the durations your character remains in the game upon log-off, depending on what you last actions were.

And it takes more than 4 days to get into EVE, there is a strong learning curve, especially if you don't get in with a corporation. There is way more than 4 days of training to get a taste of what the game has to offer.

Yep, read it. I have no real stake in the game as far as what happens when you log out. There is no perfect answer. Which is true of 99% of these discussions. No matter what decisions are made someone will take issue with them.

As for EVE, any game that requires more than 4 days of training isn't a game it is a job. ;-) Actually, come to think of it, I don't think I got four days of training on my real job..

Goblin Squad Member

Docora wrote:
As for EVE, any game that requires more than 4 days of training isn't a game it is a job. ;-) Actually, come to think of it, I don't think I got four days of training on my real job..

With that attitude, I think you are going to be in for a rude awakening with PFO. It has the same long-term character development. I'm guessing the learning curve isn't going to be as steep, but nothing near the same as all the theme parks out there.

Goblin Squad Member

Time will tell. I have no issue with long character development but taking days/weeks just to "play"? Part of it may have just been the gameplay itself, I don't know I just wasn't hooked. To each their own, obviously others like it as it has a fairly substantial fan base.

Liberty's Edge Goblin Squad Member

The practical response would be that it takes away precious server resources to track players when they aren't online. I don't see it happening.

Goblinworks Executive Founder

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The idea reminds me of a story in a Dragon magazine, a loooong time ago.

*googles*

It's "Catacomb" by Henry Melton from issue #97 of Dragon magazine May 1985.

If you want to read it, the author put it online to be read (for free) here.

And remember, this is from 1985:
This was written back when both the Mac and the IBM PC were new and years before the web. This was before everyone knew to click a mouse or knew that underlined text was a hyperlink.

Goblin Squad Member

Traianus Decius Aureus wrote:
Docora wrote:


Of course that doesn't address the folks dumping out to avoid danger.

I'm not sure why everyone thinks this is so complicated:

1) Logging out in a safe area- instant.

2) Logging out in the wilderness, but not in combat- takes 30 sec, during which you can be attacked in PVP or PVE. At 30 sec you are logged out whether or not you are being attacked.

3) You cannot log out if you are in the middle of combat, with the exception of #2.

4) If you're disconnected and not in combat, rules #1 and #2 apply.

5) If you are disconnected in combat, you're character persists until the combat is resolved by your death or you going out of combat (if your team manages to prevail and kept your character alive), at which point you are logged.

Any type of extended vulnerability while you are logged out and cannot defend yourself is just begging for griefing and a toxic community.

I would say that if you are attacked while doing number 2 :) then it becomes the same as number 4. You don't drop out of the world until the combat is resolved.

Goblin Squad Member

Valkenr wrote:

For those of you unfamiliar with the term. A sleeper is a placeholder for your character when you leave the game. They have all your inventory and if they die, you will be dead when you come back to the game. In essence, when you log off, your character passes out.

I think it could add two things to the game:
1. Makes people think about where they are logging off. You would basically need to be in a player structure that protects sleepers.

2. Creates a 'sleeper hunt' activity for less reputable players.

You should be able to train abilities to protect your sleeping body, and threaded items will still function the same. You could also set it up so you could rob a sleeper getting access to 100% of the non threaded inventory. This would require training, and be open to failure, each attempt would be a further hit to alignment and reputation.

What do you all think?

I don't like it for a couple of reasons. One is cluttering up the world with 100,000 characters that are logged off. Running a NASA supercomputer you would still get significant lag I bet.

Another reason has been covered by other people - there are times you need to log off quickly and it isn't likely that the area will stay safe until you can log back on (whenever that might be).

Now I am all for you just walking away from your PC and staying logged on 24/7. You have every right to play that way if you really want to :)

Just don't force the rest of us to.

Goblin Squad Member

Andas wrote:
Just don't force the rest of us to.

I really don't see how "what do you guys think?" translates into "you should all play this way" stuff like this keeps popping up around here.

Liberty's Edge Goblin Squad Member

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Valkenr wrote:
You had a choice, that choice was to put your self into a situation where you body could be easily looted. You made the meaningful choice to gamble with your safety.

Overly-punitive crap mechanics tends to make the next meaningful choice a cancellation. Rust is pretty random and there are multiple servers with different rulesets. PFO will have one server and require subscriptions to keep running. Most people have something besides MMOs going on in their lives, and making the game practically unplayable to most people seems bad for business.

On the other side of things, how much fun do you think it would be to have every bit of the NPC settlements covered in naked sleepers? Attack them and NPC guards whack you, and they wouldn't have anything worth taking anyway. The creator of the dummy characters loses nothing by making as many as they have slots for and leaving them lying around to passive-aggressively troll everyone in town. They'll have names to advertise goldfarmer sites, defame players and companies, or simply say rude/inane things. Is GW supposed to hire someone to delete them all? It'll either be a very slow process or one high on false positives.

I'm with Lifedragn on this. There are reasons I don't play Rust, and I wouldn't play PFO either if it incorporated a 'feature' like this.

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