What are some village councillor positions?


Pathfinder First Edition General Discussion


I'm just wondering what would be common influential positions in a village council. They don't necessarily have to be official just a major voice in policy making. Any serious suggestions/thoughts greatly appreciated, what I have so far is . . .

Mayor: Head of village and responsible for its well being.

Magi: Spell caster of some description if present (not all villages would have them).

Priest: Voice of the gods.

Arms master: In charge of any weapons belonging to the village and head of its militia.

Guild Head: Appointed as a representative of any local guilds e.g. blacksmith, carpenter etc. Doubt there'd be enough for all roles (as there's likely only one of each) but a respected one the others trust to speak for them.

Adventurer: Like the magi not necessarily present but likely respected enough if ones retired there to run a tavern/farm/what have you.


Most likely, you'd have a guild council that would have a liaison on the town council. You wouldn't want each guild on the town's council.

There should be a trade councilor with responsibilities of taxes, tariffs, and interacting with foreign merchants.

If it has a harbor, the master could either be under the trade councilor, on the guild council, or even have a seat on the town council if it is big enough.

Likewise, the farmers would have the same set-up depending on how important they are to the town and its business.

If the town is on the border of two countries, there may be ambassadors on the council.


MurphysParadox wrote:

Most likely, you'd have a guild council that would have a liaison on the town council. You wouldn't want each guild on the town's council.

There should be a trade councilor with responsibilities of taxes, tariffs, and interacting with foreign merchants.

If it has a harbor, the master could either be under the trade councilor, on the guild council, or even have a seat on the town council if it is big enough.

Likewise, the farmers would have the same set-up depending on how important they are to the town and its business.

If the town is on the border of two countries, there may be ambassadors on the council.

Just to clarify after reading your post when I say village I mean just that not a major town or important landmark. At most there'd probably be no more than a hundred people living in it and the surrounding lands, definately less than 200. Although some of your suggestions would make sense for larger places I don't want this for somewhere of major importance. For example if it has a harbour it just has some fishing boats in it and nothing big enough to justify a permanent position.


If you're talking about that small a town, there would be no need for full time council. The guy running the one inn is probably also the mayor, a local farmer with some years of military service provides a bit of militia training, and there are no guilds. The town shares a blacksmith with a few other tiny villages in the same area. There may be a priest who goes from town to town to provide services and double as the doctor, but I wouldn't expect any kind of arcane casters in such a small place.

There simply isn't enough to do if the town is so small. If it is a tiny village, then that's because there's nothing important there to make people want to move there. If there is nothing important, then there's no reason to need someone to provide full time bureaucratic management of something. It also means very few people around to buy things, so not many craftsmen or the like.

I'm thinking something of that size would have a circle of elders, rather than a town council. Basically anyone above a certain age would have a say and they'd have monthly meetings. There would be one person who is determined to be the leader, whether it is the oldest of the elders, or voted on by the circle, or even whichever member of the circle has oldest claim to land in the area.


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Liam Warner wrote:

Just to clarify after reading your post when I say village I mean just that not a major town or important landmark.

An actual village probably wouldn't have anything as formal as a town council. Depending upon local law and custom, it might have a headman, basically someone whose job it is to report on behalf of the village to higher authority, and to report on behalf of higher authority to the village.

Everything else would be done on the basis of individual personality. In a village of 100 people, there's likely not to be any local guilds at all. What there will be are Ed the blacksmith, his journeyman Edd, and the apprentice Eddy,... and everyone knows that Ed is dumber than a gravy so if you want to talk to someone who makes sense, talk to Double-D. Similarly, you might have Snug the joiner, Starveling the tailor, and Bottom the weaver, but you'd also know which of them are sober and sensible enough to have an opinion you value. If you need law enforcement, there may or may not be an official sheriff, but the person you actually want in a fight might be Flute the bellows-mender, simply because he's 210 cm tall and built like the walls of Troy.

And, frankly, Bottom might be a total moron but his wife Titania might be substantially smarter than he is.... so maybe you want to ask her advice if you're trying to figure something out.


MurphysParadox wrote:


I'm thinking something of that size would have a circle of elders, rather than a town council. Basically anyone above a certain age would have a say and they'd have monthly meetings. There would be one person who is determined to be the leader, whether it is the oldest of the elders, or voted on by the circle, or even whichever member of the circle has oldest claim to land in the area.

Far too formal and unworkable, in my opinion. Most groups of that size run by consensus, and leaders emerge from below as the people who can Get Stuff Done.


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The PRD puts a village's size at 60-200 people. If you allow for some outlying farms and a few folk who work the wilderness, you're probably looking at around 250-300 people total. I don't know there'd be a full-on council, but I'd imagine around four or five people who'd be influential.

The official lord. This would be a Lord Mayor, a knight, or similar. He would have a noble title, but he's at the bottom of the aristocratic hierarchy, and he knows it. He could be a benevolent sort who helps people resolve their problems, or he could be a vindictive lord who acts like the biggest, meanest fish in the smallest pond.

The priest. Even the smallest village is likely to have a shrine or small chapel devoted to one god or another. He takes care of the village's spiritual needs. Probably conservative and focused on tradition. In a small village, he probably also has "useful" occupation, like being a smith, a doctor, or an animal trainer.

The businessman. He might be a legitimate businessman, or he might be a "legitimate businessman." He owns the town inn, general store, bank, or what have you. (In fact, his establishment might be the inn, general store, bank, and tavern all rolled into one). He's probably the most wealthy person in town, and also the one who's most aware of the outside world.

The gadfly. Every little town -- and I mean every little town -- has one of these fellows. This person isn't terribly influential, but he's really friggin' annoying. He constantly questions decisions by the village's official ruler. He doesn't have real power, but he has just enough influence among the town's outcasts (workers, intellectuals, or weird people) that he has a minor influence on the town.

Keeper of the peace. This guy, probably a smith or some other crafts person, is big and strong. He's a combination of wilderness scout, bruiser, and all-round tough guy. He uses physical force and a touch of charisma to settle fights between people. People also turn to him to take care of that wolf that's been eating the sheep. If the town's attacked, he'll probably be at the head of the militia.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Depends on how the village organised itself, or how organisation is imposed on it.

A council could be the heads of the most important families in the area, or the four lords who own the bulk of the farming land. Or the reigning descendants of the four adventurers who retired and settled down centuries ago. It depends largely on how the village came to be.

Or it could be ruled by a Burgomeister who appoints an advisory council that serves totally on his whim. Or he doesn't appoint a council and simply assigns specific duties to specific people. "George, you're the town constable, and Fred, since you're the godly type, you run the church. And Alice, with your cleverness and urge to steal, you're in charge of tax collection." Or he's an obsessive micro-manager and tries to do it all himself.

There are a lot of possibilities.


pennywit wrote:
The PRD puts a village's size at 60-200 people. If you allow for some outlying farms and a few folk who work the wilderness, you're probably looking at around 250-300 people total. I don't know there'd be a full-on council, but I'd imagine around four or five people who'd be influential.

Still too much emphasis on jobs, IMHO. In a village of that size, authority and respect are given to people, not to offices. The official lord might be the official landowner, but if he's a bumbling fool or irrelevant drunkard, no one would pay attention to him at all, except as an object of manipulation when they need his seal on a document. Similarly, just because the businessman owns most of the town, that doesn't mean he's influential. When the businessman who built this vast commercial empire dies, his feckless son might inherit -- and the real person you want to talk to would be his butler/steward/manservant who actually runs everything.

Think of Bertram Wooster and his manservant Jeeves, or of Prince George and his butler Edmund Blackadder. For the Randroids, Jim Taggart from {\em the Fountainhead} was the CEO and an empty suit, while his sister Dagny actually made the trains run on time, and if you needed anything done, you talked to her. Tony Stark may be an engineering genius, but Pepper Potts actually runs the place.

You can hide this in a city of a hundred thousand people, but in a village of a hundred? Everyone will know who actually runs the show.


Orfamay Quest wrote:


Still too much emphasis on jobs, IMHO. In a village of that size, authority and respect are given to people, not to offices. The official lord might be the official landowner, but if he's a bumbling fool or irrelevant drunkard, no one would pay attention to him at all, except as an object of manipulation when they need his seal on a document. Similarly, just because the businessman owns most of the town, that doesn't mean he's influential. When the businessman who built this vast commercial empire dies, his feckless son might inherit -- and the real person you want to talk to would be his butler/steward/manservant who actually runs everything.

I think you mistake my intent. Beyond the official lord and the priest, I'm not focused on jobs as much as I am on roles -- the guy who's officially in charge, the god guy, the person of influence, the gadfly, and the strong guy.


There would probably be a constable and a magistrate, to keep order.
A bank manager, to safeguard the town's coin.
Perhaps a principle land owner, from whom many rent their homes- probably the laird of the manor.
If it's a feudal area, there may be a small standing guard or voluntary militia, so the captain of the guard would have influence.


I think it depends a lot on the culture of the region and the village itself. If you have a strongly feudal system, probably all you have is a headman who reports to the tax collector whenever he comes by.

If the village is more independent with a measure of self government, as you seem to be thinking with a Mayor, most likely his council would be based more on personality than position. The local priest would be likely, but if he is an outsider imposed by a authoritarian church then perhaps not. Similarly, a poor farmer or woodsman might have a reputation for wisdom and good judgement and therefore be a key advisor, even though he has no wealth or other authority.

If you only have 100 people, including children, likely we are talking about 50 adults. In that case everyone being the 'council' is workable, with Greecian style direct democracy.

To answer the question of what village roles might have more status, just based on their 'job.' A village that size might have an inn, especially if on a trade route or something. The innkeeper would likely be a person of importance and wealth.

A general store is unlikely unless something else would cause enough business for it to exist. Whatever the towns economy was based primarily on, the best at that would be a person of importance, if freeholding farmers than the person with the largest farm etc.

A blacksmith is possible and would be important if it existed. Other crafts (cooper, weaver, potter) would probably be spread out among several villages in the area, if this town had one, that person is likely important.

Lastly, anyone who had any kind of magic would have a good shot of being a very important member of the town. Depending on your setting this might well just be an adept, but even a little magic can be a huge deal.


foolsjourney wrote:

There would probably be a constable and a magistrate, to keep order.

A bank manager, to safeguard the town's coin.
Perhaps a principle land owner, from whom many rent their homes- probably the laird of the manor.
If it's a feudal area, there may be a small standing guard or voluntary militia, so the captain of the guard would have influence.

Again, way too much formal machinery Medieval constables in England were appointed at the rate of two per 'hundred," so the entire duchy of Cornwall had fewer than twenty. Similarly, magistrates were responsible for a huge area of up to a hundred or so square miles, so the chance of any 100 person village having a magistrate is pretty small. No one's got the money to afford a standing guard, which is why conscript armies and corvee labor were so common.

And there's a good chance that the principal land owner was the Duke of someplace awfully distant who didn't even know that this particular village existed.

The person responsible for enforcing the lord's will and collecting taxes was typically a "reeve," who was usually a peasant himself. (He would report up through a series of other reeves until his ultimate boss, typically the reeve for the entire shire, or Shire-reeve, or Sheriff.) For law-and-order purposes there might be a single person designated for that ("beadle" was a typical title), and the beadle handled the religious duties that didn't actually require a priest. The priest worked at the parish church, which probably covered several villages. Many times each village had its own church, and he'd do weekly services in rotation -- this week the vicar of Fenchurch Parish might be at Fenchurch St. Peter, next week at Fenchurch St. Paul, the week after at Fenchurch St. Pancras, and then back to St. Pete's.

And that's basically it for official structure. Really, what was the point? Everyone knows everyone else and everyone else's business, and there's not a lot of day to day or even month to month decisions that need to be made.

Really, what else do you need done in this village? If you want to build a new shed, you don't go to the village planning commission -- you just build it.


Dave Justus wrote:


If you only have 100 people, including children, likely we are talking about 50 adults. In that case everyone being the 'council' is workable, with Greecian style direct democracy.

+1


Hmmmmmmmmm food for thought.

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