First, let me say how much I love this AP. It just screams "cool" at every turn, and even if there a bit controversial writing (looking at you, Iomedae) most GMs should easily be able to alter those elements to better suit their tastes and those of their players. However, there is one for me that requires a bit more work, and I was wondering the boards might be able to offer any advice.
I hate Nocticula. Absolutely hate her. I think rivalry between demon lords can be pretty cool, but her whole "coyly helping the PCs for vague reasons" thing just seems so contrived, ESPECIALLY the whole redemption of a demon lord thing. Don't get me wrong here, I probably like the idea of redemption almost as much as Mikaze, but the way that Nocticula's potential redemption is set up just reads to me like she woke up one day and thought to herself "I think I'd like to be chaotic neutral for a change." Then there's the whole "she wants to become a deity of out outcasts, artists and midnight. I don't like the idea that a demigod can decide that being a demon lord just isn't working out for them, so maybe they'll try their hand at something else. I'm sure that's not how it's meant to come off, but as-written, the whole thing seems way to easy for her. Also, her name and appearance make her seem more like she belongs in a gentlemen's bar than ruling an abyssal realm.
So when I run this game, I want to move the Nahyndrian crystals to Hell, either into Avernus or Dis, and then either Barbados or Dispater becomes the party's potential fiendish ally. I want to add in a lot of desperate devil worship within the ranks of the crusaders earlier on, and say that the archfiend has so far allowed the demonic forces to harvest these crystals (pretending not to notice) precisely because the resulting conflict on the material plane steers desperate souls towards them. But now things are heating up, and they need those souls. They need mortals to live their lives so they can be corrupted, and they don't want everything swallowed by the worldwound. So they MIGHT help the party at this point.
I haven't gone through the 4th book in super excruciating detail, so I guess I am wondering how much of a rewrite this would be. Can I just reskin most of the encounters, or would I have to rewrite most of the adventure? I suppose I would have to stat up an archdevil as well, eh?
Well, to be precise, Nocticula does not get redeemed in this AP (much to my chagrin), but if your players behave in the right way, they can lay the seeds which may blossom in another AP into that storyline (according to James). I will agree, however, that getting a permanent +4 morale bonus to Will saves for realizing that you made Nocticula have a nice day seems over the top. :p
I'll disagree to your notion that it is contrived that Nocticula would help out the PC's, since IMO demon lords need not uniformly be "destructive evil". Alushynsharra seems to work out as a more evil version of Sigil, from Planescape. Nocticula herself is the first Succubus, so I would say that her self-image is pretty well chosen. BTW, if you find any ladies working at gentlemen's bars in the real world whose legs weep molten lava, make photos! Not even to mention the multiple barbed tails.
As you may notice, I quite like how Nocticula came off in this AP and I root for her eventual redemption as a CN deity. It was quite the surprising twist for me that this AP would make me like her more than Iomedae!
As for your idea of moving the module to hell, there are some layers of hell which would accomodate the existance of huge metropolis, but the problem seems to me that no hellish ruler would work together with demon lords in a quest which would ultimately result in those demon lords getting way more powerful (or maybe making the jump to being true deities). Especially Baphomet and his minions should not be suffered well in any hell, since Asmodeus should still be somewhat cross at Baphy.
Oh, it can be. ^^ Although it would be completely the wrong conclusion to draw. :p
I'm not saying that I hate the idea of a demon lord meddling in the affairs of another demon lord (I think they should), nor am I against the idea of a demon lord having a shot at a redemption. I think they are cool ideas that were just poorly executed in this specific instance. That is my opinion, and I didn't start this thread to convince you that it should be yours. I am just asking if anyone has advice on moving the setting of the 4th book in this adventure and replacing Nocticula's role in the plot with Babados or Dispater.
I wasn't trying to convince you otherwise, just pointing out from where I am coming when I say that I found Nocticula's portrayal convincing in the modules she appeared in. :)
Since we're not talking about whether its a good idea or not, I will say that it would be a lot of work. To maintain your flow you would also have to change book 5 as well, which wouldn't make much sense.
So...a lot of work, and not worth it.
I don't see it as being difficult. Set it in Dis, change the names of all the locations to locations given in Princes of Darkness, change all the demons to comparable devils, and substitute Nocticula for Dispater.
The only thing this changes in the over all scheme is it removes the "break up the alliance" bit of the plot, which is far and away the least important part of Midnight Isles since Nocticula was never going to ally with Baphomet and Deskari to start with.
I'm rather neutral on the subject of Nocticula, myself; I don't dislike her in and of herself, though I'm not at all a fan of all the shilling she's been getting. I am, however, a much bigger fan of devils than of demons, so the thought of incorporating them and giving them a win in this story, especially over Baphomet, really appeals to me.
Well, my principal objection to this still would be why exactly any archdevil would consent to having a party of high ranking demons lounge around in his realm and harvest crystallized dead demon lords.
Actually, that's a second thing about it... as far as I know, none of the nine hell contains the essence of lots of dead demon lords, that is particular to Nocticula's realm.
Well, that adds a few new layers to it.
Firstly, obviously he wouldn't consent so the demons must be doing this more covertly than they would in the Midnight Isles. Makes ferreting them out a bit more of a quest and challenge than simply having Nocticula tell the party, "Oh, by the way, there' over there.". I'm sure the OP might have some fun delving into that, and would certainly give Dispater a much more concrete motivation to help the PC's than hoping for a favor further down the line.
As for the presence or lack there of of dead demon lords in Hell, sure, in Golarion as written, there probably aren't any or aren't many. But in the OP's home game there are as many or as few as he says there are, and it's easy enough to justify what they might be doing in Dis or Erebus(trophies, perhaps).
And really there's no reason why the crystals need to come from dead demon lords at all; I suspect from a plot perspective that was made to justify going to the Midnight Isles in the first place. The crystals are a macguffin; they can be anything. Blood of dead demonlords is nice for flavor, but even sticking with that theme there's no reason why they couldn't be derived from the essence of a dead Horseman or Archdevil, or any semi-divine being, for that matter. And they don't have to be derived from any of that; it just needs to be some substance that for some reason imparts mythic power to those who consume it and survive.
if you want to remove the Nocticula aspect of the AP, Simply make the Midnight Islands into some sort of neutral ground for demons. I mean it would make sense that, with as much backstabbing as demons do, giving them a a layer of the Abyss that is intentionally left unaligned to any specific demon lord would be smart. This way demons have a relatively safe place to negotiate with others of their kind. It also means that the crystal mining operation would probably be against the rules, explaining why it isn't more heavily guarded.
It would still require some working, but not to the level of "Why are devils allowing ANY demons free range in Hell, especially harvesting a material that really shouldn't exist there and would be extraordinarly valuable means of upgrading the Archdevil's own forces.
I can see how justifying a demonic presence there would be of concern to some, but I think there could be a few ways to go about it. Let's assume that I'm using Dispater here (though I must confess, Barbatos might be my favorite archdevil). We could simply say that he's playing a longer game than Deskari, and he's letting the demons do a portion of his work for them. They don't have to be here without his knowledge - they just have to think they are. Perhaps he's known about the mythic-giving-whatever, but is unsure of how to best use it, but then here comes Arelu Vorlesh with her savvy and she starts distilling it and he thinks "Well hell! I've got an entire hellish realm at my disposal, and I might be able to use whatever she cooks up, so I'll just wait and watch and once she's really perfected her formula, I'll boot her out and we'll use this for Hell's armies." Except then all the business in the Worldwound starts to go down, Dispater notices the chaos that it's causing, and his cult starts popping up all over Mendev as people begin to decide that the good guys are too soft, and they need the power of Hell to serve the greater good. So he sits on it a bit longer because now the chaos that the demons are causing is also bringing a pretty steady flow of followers and souls into the Pit. Now, though, he worries it's beginning to get out of hand, and he realizes he may have waited a bit too long. Maybe with these ubered demons guarding the crystals, his lossess in claiming them himself would be far greater than he'd wish. So when a band of mortals show up in his realm, ones that have been doing a bang-up job of slaying these powerful demons...
Alternatively, perhaps the demons HAVE been undetected because of Baphomet's aid. Dude has spent some time in Hell, and he eluded Asmodeus back in the day. It's conceivable that with his direct oversight he and a small troop of demons could elude the notice of another archdevil.
