On the round following a successful grapple check, when you successfully maintain the grapple, can you also use an attempt of this feat?
Stunning Fist forces a foe damaged by your unarmed attack to make a Fortitude saving throw (DC 10 + 1/2 your character level + your Wis modifier), in addition to dealing damage normally. A defender who fails this saving throw is stunned for 1 round (until just before your next turn).
Damage
You can inflict damage to your target equal to your unarmed strike, a natural attack, or an attack made with armor spikes or a light or one-handed weapon. This damage can be either lethal or nonlethal.
The language is a bit vague and I can definitely see this happening in a real fight, thematically. I'm still leaning towards no based on an incredibly strict interpretation of the wording, but it'd be nice to be surprised on this.
I think there is a feat for that in ultimate combat.
Edit: Stunning Pin lets you as a swift action whenever you pin your opponent.
I think your talking about stunning pin :
Benefit: Whenever you pin an opponent, you can spend a swift action to make a Stunning Fist attempt against that opponent.I always took that to mean when you bin someone you can spend a swift action to make an unarmed attack, that you have to use stunning blow for.
That being said I don't think you can use stunning blow when you use grapple to inflict damage. Stunning blow has to be used on someone damaged by your unarmed strike and grapple just deals the same amount of damage as your unarmed strike. You're not actually hitting them with an unarmed strike.
I could easily be wrong though.
Well, yes, you are wrong.
Grapple doesn't do damage, that part is right. But once you grapple, you are allowed to attack with unarmed strikes (among other things). Stunning fist is unarmed attack, so it's clearly allowed (albeit at a -2 to attack from being grappled against a target with a -4 penalty to dex from being grappled). What's the problem?
The only problem some of you might be having (besides not knowing that you can attack while grappling) is that stunning fist also has a stun feature to it. So what? What language is a bit vague? Because it doesn't specifically mention Stunning Fist as allowed? It's an unarmed attack, which is allowed.
It's good to remember that rules are written in plain language, not technocrat language where every single option is spelled out. If it says unarmed attacks, it means unarmed attacks, and if that unarmed attack has a special feature, then it maintains its special feature.
Reading too much into things I think.
Correct, if you are the grappler the rules state you MUST use a standard action to maintain the grapple unless you release it as a free action.
You are only inflicting damage equal to your unarmed strike, this is important that it does not say you may make an unarmed strike and therefore cannot use Stunning Fist. The Stunning fist feat says that you must declare the feat before making an attack roll. Since a grapple check to cause damage is not an attack roll, then you can't declare the use of that feat. Again...denied Stunning Fist.
If you are the grappled then you can choose to break or reverse the grapple, or make an attack at -2. In which case you CAN Stunning Fist.
Since a grapple check to cause damage is not an attack roll, then you can't declare the use of that feat. Again...denied Stunning Fist.
Why is a grapple check not an attack roll? It is a combat maneuver and all combat maneuvers are combat rolls which is why you can crit with them and auto miss with them on a natural 1.
Or has this changed?
Because it is a check. Not an attack roll. It's right there in the wording. Check.
Because it is a check. Not an attack roll. It's right there in the wording. Check.
Technically, I believe a combat maneuver, such as a grapple, is counted as a type of attack. I could be wrong, though.
A grapple is...but the wording for subsequent rounds says it is a check to maintain the grapple.
Oh geez. Here is the grapple flow chart from D20 website, which is quite good. As you'll see from page 2 of the flow chart, on the attacker's turn you can maintain the grapple. If you succeed, one option is to inflict damage to the defender from an unarmed strike.
If it was unclear, the question was about maintaining a grapple. On the initial grapple attempt, you can't use stunning fist unless you also have the "grab" ability. The grappled defender may use stunning fist in response to being grappled, or can do other things like try to break the grapple.
Maintaining a grapple is not a standard action. If anything, it's a free action since releasing a grapple is a free action. If you maintain, you can then attack, and using unarmed strikes like stunning fist.
It's crystal clear. You just can't do stunning fist in the same round as you initiate the grapple without the grab ability.
Maintaining a grapple is a standard action unless you have the appropriate feat.
Other than that you are completely correct Moondragon.
If you do not release the grapple, you must continue to make a check each round, as a standard action, to maintain the hold.