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So my daughter has been asking to play "the dice game" for about six months now and I was considering it's almost time to do so. She is almost reading fluidly, has a basic grasp of math, and loves to tell stories, so I feel like if I can tune the rules down to something she can easily understand, she will really, really enjoy it.
I've decided that creating a half-dozen characters that are based off of her favorite Disney movies would be a good way to start, so I came up with a list:
Flynn Rider: Human Rogue (he was easy, honestly)
Rapunzel: I'm thinking White Haired Witch with lots of healing.
Mulan: Fighter seems obvious, but Swashbuckler (Far more complicated) seems like a better skill set for her.
Hercules: Brawler/Fighter(Brawler)/Monk?
Pocahontas: Druid?
Merida: Ranger or Fighter(Archer)
Elsa: Oracle of Winter
Kristoff: Cavalier?
Help or suggestions or other ideas would be a great boon!
Honestly, I've taught my little sisters to game and Pathfinder is hard for that, at least for me. I've been introducing younger kids to RPGs through FATE (sometimes accelerated edition sometimes CORE) and then graduating them to Pathfinder after a few adventures. I'm not saying you CAN'T teach your daughter through PF, I've just had more success with FATE. Entire way good luck with the little one :D
Pocahontas: Cleric. Possibly of Raven or the earth mother.
Barbarian (Attila the hun)
Monk (Mulan)
Rogue (Aladdin, Esmeralda [which can also be a bard])
Wizard (Jafar, Merlin)
Sorcerer (Elsa)
Party of 7 dwarf fighters and a beautiful sorceress?
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Party of 7 dwarf fighters and a beautiful sorceress?
Considering all the singing she might be a bard... and I'd like to see a party with 7 martials and a bard.
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Party of 7 dwarf fighters and a beautiful sorceress?Considering all the singing she might be a bard... and I'd like to see a party with 7 martials and a bard.
True. But doesn't this mean every disneay char has a bard level or at least a few ranks in perform singing? :D
True. But doesn't this mean every disneay char has a bard level or at least a few ranks in perform singing? :DParty of 7 dwarf fighters and a beautiful sorceress?Considering all the singing she might be a bard... and I'd like to see a party with 7 martials and a bard.
Most likely... except for Flynn, he was pretty half-assed.
Why not try Shreck?
An ogrekin (low on degeneracy) barbarian.
Fiona... well she was good in hand to hand, probably some monk with a few levels in bard and a curse of turning into an ogrekin at night, or a full ogrekin.
The awakened donkey (pony stats and give him a few HD).
Pinocchio could be a small wood golem, but with a mind. Red dragon is red dragon.
Ponkeys(poneys) with half-dragon and young templates.
The Puss in Boots - swashbuckler catfolk converted to small size.
This is the world of Disney, isn't it? The main character (her PC) should have an animal companion regardless of her class!
For simplicity's sake, I'd ask her is she'd prefer to be a:
- strong warrior like Mulan (fighter/no archetypes)
- talented archer like Merdia (fighter with the archer archetype)
- spellcaster like Elsa (sorceress/no archetypes).
(If she has other ideas, like playing a charming rake like Flynn, run with it.)
From there, it's all about story. Obviously you'd have to dial back on the blood/gore and some of the more adult themes; I mean, rather than killing the goblin raiders, she could talk with their king and try to negotiate a peace between their tribe and her town? Perhaps the goblins are only attacking because a wicked necromancer has displaced them from their home? Thus, I'd allow her to gain a class bonus on whatever skills she's trained in to better facilitate the story; otherwise, she's likely going to fail a lot of Diplomacy checks--then again, you can always minimize the dice rolls and resolve most things in-character via roleplay (if she's receptive to that kind of thing).
In Disney movies, there's very little killing, but there's definitely nonlethal damage being dealt--take for instance the scene where Rapunzel and Flynn meet for the first time--Rapunzel knocks Flynn out cold with a frying pan. So, for this reason, and because of the innocence of the setting, I'd allow her character (and others) to deal nonlethal damage without suffering an attack penalty; she likely won't even think to kill the baddies, as she's only a child, so converting all damage into nonlethal damage is probably a good idea... except for the villains, who obviously deal lethal damage (which makes them villains, after all).
There's so much potential in a Disney setting with countless villains and story lines to draw from; I'm sure you'll do a great job if you put your mind to it! Good luck!
I'll assume you let her watch Sophia the First. While the amulet of Avalor might not be available to her at first level(she might spare the life of someone truly bad, then all lethal attacks aimed at her reflects back), she might obtain some one function item.
Blue Mirror Pendant. It opens the heart chakra of the wearer. The wearer and anyone targeting the wearer, must make a will save of 20 plus wearer level, to launch an attack that does lethal or ability damage.
Maybe she saved a goblin who was going to be beheaded or have his hands cut off, and he gave her the pendant, that he didn't really want.
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Honestly, I've taught my little sisters to game and Pathfinder is hard for that, at least for me. I've been introducing younger kids to RPGs through FATE (sometimes accelerated edition sometimes CORE) and then graduating them to Pathfinder after a few adventures. I'm not saying you CAN'T teach your daughter through PF, I've just had more success with FATE. Entire way good luck with the little one :D
I agree that Pathfinder has a steeper learning curve. A rules light system that is not Class based would probably be a lot easier for kids to pick up and less work trying to stuff beloved characters into rigid archtypes.
I'll assume you let her watch Sophia the First. While the amulet of Avalor might not be available to her at first level(she might spare the life of someone truly bad, then all lethal attacks aimed at her reflects back), she might obtain some one function item.
Blue Mirror Pendant. It opens the heart chakra of the wearer. The wearer and anyone targeting the wearer, must make a will save of 20 plus wearer level, to launch an attack that does lethal or ability damage.
Maybe she saved a goblin who was going to be beheaded or have his hands cut off, and he gave her the pendant, that he didn't really want.
... that is an awfully broken item.
But very fitting if you are just running for a young child.
I am actually trying to build PFS legal characters so that she can eventually join us at sanctioned tables.
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I guess it's just me, I wouldn't personally want someone's introduction to the game to be tinted with the bias of "you have this extremely powerful item that makes it very difficult for enemies to challenge you". I think it would only backfire when they were later forced to play without that item and suddenly found the game far more difficult.
I'd prefer to instead simply provide them with toned-down challenges fitting to a single character (or more likely, give them a GMPC ally that plays second fiddle to their character), and play the enemies with less tactical acumen than I would use against a single experienced player, much less an entire table full of them, and provide the newbie player with frequent advice, suggestions, and aid as they/I felt it needed.
The pendant has the drawback that it also affects the wearer. That's why a goblin would want to get rid of it. If you change the DC to 20 minus the level, it would become weaker as they advance.
Honestly I think that Samurai and Winter Witch would be a better fit for Mulan and Elsa respectively. Gonna say Titan Mauler (Barbarian) for Herc, Ranger seems fine for Merida but maybe look for an archtype focusing on archery or survival like a battle scout. think Kristoff would be better off as a ranger personally though I could either way, Pocahontas could easily be a nature oracle if you want to have an easy way to explain Grandmother Willow
Other character options from different Disney movies are
Quasimodo: tiefling/half-orc acrobat
Phoebus: taldan human paladin
Esmeralda: varisian street performer
Aladdin: kelishite acrobat (possibly summoner)
Kenai: kellid bear shaman (druid)
Jim Hawkins: cad
I'd pick classes to teach the class to her more than trying to match the character so she learns the classes.
Make Kristoff a Ranger. He has his pet and even has forest friends he can communicate with. He doesn't fight, but he could be a melee guy.
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You could always ask her what she'd want to try, but considering she may want to play as a Disney character, swapped to Golarion...
A Qadiran enchanter whose metamagic rod is shaped like a cobra?
A conceited Galtic Brawler who only thinks of himself?
An alternate merfolk Sea Witch who can talk people into giving up their save for Steal Voice?
A vainglorious Ratfolk cavalier, all Strength and Charisma, whose steed turns out to be a big cat?
A pirate-styled Rogue/Fighter/Cavalier/Something who takes a nickname from a prosthetic he has, and is prejudiced against the fey?
...Though actually, it'd be better if evil wasn't a suggestion, especially for an introduction.
I'd say to either give her the Bludgeoner feat for free (because it lets you do strike non-lethally with blunt force weapons at no attack penalty), allow more people to be open to bargaining and sensible solutions, or both.
Ravingdork built Elsa long before Frozen came out in the form of Helegur.
Have you ever watched the movie The Princess and the Goblin? (link is to the full movie on YouTube)
It's not Disney, but it's a great kids movie and makes for a great low-level adventure for kids. Basically, peasant miner and the princess stop Goblin invasion of the princess' kingdom. The miner, Curdy, is probably a Bard (he does a lot of singing), and Irene would be a caster of some sort (she is supposed to find her own magic), and Irene's Grandmother is probably an Oracle or Cleric (and possibly a ghost).
I dont think you need the disney front. Your daugther is ready to try playing, making the character her own(and not a copy of a disney one)is easy for kids.
I play RPG with kids from 6-10 at work and they all do great, even if i have to tune my storyline ambisions down from time to time.
How about Beginner Box rules? There's an SRD for them now www.pfbeginner.com though the actual Box is awesome!
Or how about trying an even simpler game? Check out this old thread on settings/games for kids for some ideas...
Just make perform a class skill for everyone. Kinda explains the animal musicians of Dresdin.
Dresdin? Do you mean Dresden in Germany, or perhaps Grimm's "The Musicians of Bremen"?
This is full of win.
Let us know how it goes!
I would not introduce a new young player with archetypes and prestige classes. I would stick with just the base classes in the core book. Any probably only the first couple of levels, maybe 1-5.
Dresdin? Do you mean Dresden in Germany, or perhaps Grimm's "The Musicians of Bremen"?
The second one.
I have a memory problem. I can't remember what it's called.
May I suggest getting the Pathfinder Beginner Box and supplementing your own characters for the one's they provide. That's a really good starting point for new players young and old, because they simplify the rules for you and the pieces they give you are lots of fun. ;)
Aladdin seems to be a good chance for an archeologist bard archetype: he is a roguish type but gets by more due to his charm, luck and wits rather than skills with any skullduggery.
I did a Savage Worlds (a really versatile and simple system BTW) game for my kids along this line. One was Tarzan, I forget who the other one was. I think my wife joined us as Mulan. The villain was Maleficent and she had gone through all the Disney "worlds" causing chaos. You could have fun by letting her rescue various minor characters like Chip the cup or various animal sidekicks.
Dresdin? Do you mean Dresden in Germany, or perhaps Grimm's "The Musicians of Bremen"?The second one.
I have a memory problem. I can't remember what it's called.
I read Grimm's Fairy Tales endlessly when I was young, but its not that I remember the details of them all. The "Town Musicians Of Breman" story just happened to be my favorite. For some reason at six or seven years of age I thought the thief's recounting to his boss of his foray into the house was the most hilarious thing in the world.
I liked how their talent trumped how they were born critters.
So how'd the game go? What did she pick?
Buzz? (Space) Ranger. :)
My personal feeling is that is the player is young and just fluidly reading, it would be best to keep things simple with core (or base) classes without archetypes and multiclassing.
My opinion is to go with rogue. Skill points just increase the dice modifier and the only special thing to remember is sneak attacking. You don't have to remember and understand all the feats associated with most fighters and how and when to use them.
Remember its her character and giving it loads of crazy combos and bells and whistles won't teach her the fundamentals of the d20 system which is where you should start.
Yeah, keep the rules simple. But you might want to let her pick an animal companion or familiar since most of the disney hero(ine)s have some kind of sidekick.
I would skip right over Pathfinder and go for Minimus, the Ladder, or some version of Fudge.
It's not a matter of "dumbing it down" though. It's about signal-to-noise ratio.
There's a lot of cruft and nostalgia baked into PF that can make it especially hard on newcomers.
There are also a lot of systemic assumptions that I think make it a poor fit for a young person. Much of the game assumes all problems are solved with violence. The grid tactical combat system and the enumeration of every dang action tends to put the kibosh on the hyper-creative solutions younger kids naturally generate.
If I were in your position, I would focus on a system that lets you tell a story with numbers and dice, but had as few restrictions on creative storytelling as possible.
I love Pathfinder as a game, but it would never be my introductory RPG for anyone, let alone a small child.