Is Magic Jar useful in a big group?


Rules Questions


Magic Jar seems too RANDOM! I'm often in a fairly large group and it seems like the odds of possessing an ally make this spell virtually useless. The other party members could all get Protection From Evil, but then I could easily spend round after round getting bumped back into the Jar. Am I missing something?


The idea is to possess an enemy in another area, away from your party members. Otherwise, the enemies could attack your helpless body.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
WackoYackoDot wrote:
Magic Jar seems too RANDOM! I'm often in a fairly large group and it seems like the odds of possessing an ally make this spell virtually useless. The other party members could all get Protection From Evil, but then I could easily spend round after round getting bumped back into the Jar. Am I missing something?

Magic Jar as a power is really meant as a bad guy weapon against PC parties. Presumably said bad guy would take some precaustions regarding his meat body. And most monsters who have the ability, like Shadow Demons don't have a meat body to worry about.


It's just not a combat spell.

Shadow Lodge

VRMH wrote:
It's just not a combat spell.

Simply not true.

Magic Jar is a fantastically powerful spell; it targets Will, has awesome duration, and is Necromancy (not mind-affecting!). I've seen it used to absolutely devastate groups of enemies, bluff past guards, and wreck a big bad or two.

It's true that it's a terrible idea to just 'wing it' with no thought to preparation while the rest of the party runs around like maniacs. Yes, leaving your lifeless, helpless body on the floor, exposed to terrible violence is a bad move. Who does that anyway?

Suggestions:
-Have someone in the party ready to carry/protect your body. If you don't have a suitably beefy friend, just Reduce Person on yourself. If you can cast 5th level Necromancy spells and you don't have a beefy minion hanging around, just make one. Any self-respecting party should be able to stash a lifeless half-sized body in a backpack or something.

-Be sneaky. Use the party scout to discover what's in the next room before you go in. Have them throw your 'Jar' into the bad guys' midst before they know you're there. Or, let your familiar drag it in. Or, just throw it around the corner and fire it up.
Get the Jar far enough away from the party and it will not be difficult to tell who's who.

-Talk to your party about what you're going to do before you cast the spell. Are you going to start a fight between the bad guys? Are you going to use a bad guy to fool your way past defenses? Is it a scheme to SOS a single enemy? Set it up.

-Make sure you have a plan about what to do with the last bad guy. Their consciousness returns to the body when you return to yours, and they will probably be fairly upset. Make sure they're tied up/prone/almost dead before you end it.

-If you're planning long-term occupancy, make sure someone is ready to hand your spell component pouch to you in your 'new body.' Have a spare spell component pouch on your 'old body' because things will go terribly wrong if you don't.

-Don't get cute and commandeer a huge bad guy and use them to carry your body around. This will not end well.

Edit:
To the OP - Manage Line of Effect and your problem will be solved. There are many ways of doing this, such as throwing the Jar around corners, closing doors, having a scout/familiar carry it far away from the party, and using spells (Wall of Stone, Wall of Force, etc.).


Tomos wrote:
Manage Line of Effect and your problem will be solved.

There's no Line-of-Effect requirement for Magic Jar though, neither when casting nor when "body hopping".


Tomos wrote:
VRMH wrote:
It's just not a combat spell.

Simply not true.

I think he meant its not something you cast in the midst of combat.

Pretty much everything you say supports this. You set the spell up in advance and use some tactics and preparation to make the spell useful. It's a good way to start a combat and surprise some enemies.

It's not good in the thick of combat when you can't tell friend from foe inside the jar.

Shadow Lodge

Claxon wrote:
Tomos wrote:
VRMH wrote:
It's just not a combat spell.

Simply not true.

I think he meant its not something you cast in the midst of combat.

Pretty much everything you say supports this. You set the spell up in advance and use some tactics and preparation to make the spell useful. It's a good way to start a combat and surprise some enemies.

It's not good in the thick of combat when you can't tell friend from foe inside the jar.

Exactly. This is not a "right in the thick of things" spell, it's a "preparation is key" spell.

I may have misunderstood VRMH's meaning, but usually when people say "not a combat spell" they mean that it's either exclusively a utility spell, or only useful out-of-combat.

@VRMH: Magic Jar does have a line of effect requirement, but it's a little unusual. You do not need a line of effect to the Jar (from your body) but you do need line of effect from the Jar to the target life force. However, there's still a Medium Range effect requirement... let the Jar get farther away than that and you die.

Ducking behind obstacles solves the OP's problem.


WackoYackoDot wrote:
Magic Jar seems too RANDOM! I'm often in a fairly large group and it seems like the odds of possessing an ally make this spell virtually useless. The other party members could all get Protection From Evil, but then I could easily spend round after round getting bumped back into the Jar. Am I missing something?

Thanks for the feedback, everyone. This has given me some ideas to bounce off the group.


There's a lot of stuff you can do with Magic Jar. Such as buy a Mammoth, Magic Jar it, and use a Greater Hat of Disguise to turn it into a normal-sized body. You now probably have better physical stats and a hit point pool that isn't really yours, so you are that much harder to kill.

There are tons of ways to sneak your body around so it isn't a problem too.

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