Toughness Feat ruling (sorry!!)


Rules Questions


So I have looked at all the old threads here (and in the advise forum as well) on this and just to make sure here, not any house ruling but the "official" Pathfinder meaning of this feat is........

When chosen from level 1 through 3 as a feat, the PC gets 3 HP in total at that time only. Then starting at level 4 that PC gains 1 HP as an added benefit at this level, and 1 more per level up past 4.

Nothing more and nothing less for this feat.

Seen "various opinions" (on older threads) that are supposed to be the Official standing as they think it means, but can someone point me to where an official PF person posted on this as to this?

Thanks

Again, sorry to bring this up and I can't find/show PC's the "official" ruling on how this feat works here at Paizo

Tom

Dark Archive

That is the official ruling, yes. You get the bulk of 3 HP when you first take the feat, assuming level 1. You will then not gain more HP until 4th level and up at 1 per level. Essentially you should never have more HP from toughness than you have hit dice unless you are level one or two. That's how it works.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.
The Beard wrote:
That is the official ruling, yes. You get the bulk of 3 HP when you first take the feat, assuming level 1. You will then not gain more HP until 4th level and up at 1 per level. Essentially you should never have more HP from toughness than you have hit dice unless you are level one or two. That's how it works.

I have a hard time understanding how one could come to a different conclusion.


Originally, the pathfinder toughness read 3hp + 1 per level, which mean you got 4 extra hp at level 1.


Thanks Beard, is there somewhere that someone who works for PF has posted on this specifically that you know of?

HF

Go search the subject on the forums here and on the net, lots of opinions and house ruled stuff/versions out there........

And as more than a few of the concerned players have read some of them, and want to see an "official" Per the current Pathfinder rules from a PF rep.....

I think you can take it from there as to the "hard to come to a different conclusion" crack.

Tom


Thanks Az, do you know of any "official" reply posted somewhere on the forums perhaps?

Thanks

Tom


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Yes, here is a quote from the Pathfinder Design Team showing you how Toughness works:

Quote:
Benefit: You gain +3 hit points. For every Hit Die you possess beyond 3, you gain an additional +1 hit point. If you have more than 3 Hit Dice, you gain +1 hit points whenever you gain a Hit Die (such as when you gain a level).

You gain 3 HP.

For every HD you have after 3 you get +1 HP.

If you have more than 3 HD, you gain +1 HP whenever you gain a hit die.

There is literally no other way to read the Feat.


What other interpretation can there be?
I ask this honestly.

Liberty's Edge

TRDG wrote:

Thanks Beard, is there somewhere that someone who works for PF has posted on this specifically that you know of?

HF

Go search the subject on the forums here and on the net, lots of opinions and house ruled stuff/versions out there........

And as more than a few of the concerned players have read some of them, and want to see an "official" Per the current Pathfinder rules from a PF rep.....

I think you can take it from there as to the "hard to come to a different conclusion" crack.

Tom

FWIW, the threads that I found were essentially pre-PFRPG, from during the playtest of the PF rules. They have no bearing on how the feat is currently worded in the CRB/PRD.

EDIT: And I wasn't making a crack. I literally have a hard time understanding how anyone can come to a different conclusion regarding how the toughness feat works. Are there any threads that quote the current wording of the feat and come to a different conclusion?


Thanks Ryn, that looks to be a copy/paste from the core rule book, can you link me to that specific, "where the reps talk about it specifically" thread please, I know what the rule as written as is in the Core rule book.

Mr

Just search the forums here and on the net many are older posts and threads granted, but there still seems to be more than a bit of ? out there. Even now between House ruled, earlier versions, plain misunderstood and thee official version of how it works.

So I'd like to find someone as a rep from PF that posted at some point on what this feat does and does not do. So I can then show players what is "Official" per what is posted in their forums, not just the rules blurb in and of itself.

Tom


TRDG, we don't do that here (where "that" is demanding "official" rulings).

We're a fairly large community of people who understand the mechanics of Pathfinder pretty well. If you see a consensus on this forum, it's really rare that it's just plain wrong. The devs have better things to do than post a "it works like the rulebook says" to every single person who has a doubt or argument.


TRDG wrote:
Thanks Ryn, that looks to be a copy/paste from the core rule book

Yes. Yes it is.

TRDG wrote:
can you link me to that specific, "where the reps talk about it specifically" thread please

No. Because there isn't one. Because the devs don't generally clarify things that are this blindingly obvious and not at all ambiguous, unless there are a LOT of people who don't understand how it works. They generally have better things to do with their time.

To my knowledge, you are the only person who does not understand how this Feat works.

TRDG wrote:
I know what the rule as written as is in the Core rule book.

Well if you know that then what's the issue?


2 people marked this as a favorite.

By the way, here's an "official ruling" on my post above.

Liberty's Edge

Rynjin wrote:
Well if you know that then what's the issue?

My hunch is that his players are having issues and not taking his word for it, so he's looking for support.

Liberty's Edge

Oladon wrote:

By the way, here's an "official ruling" on my post above.

Heh, awesome.


If there seems to be an ambiguity, then please outline what that ambiguity is.

The burden is on you to outline where the confusion lies or make an opposing case. We are happy to help but cannot be reasonably expected to hunt down contrary opinions, assemble your position, and then confirm or deny it simply because a text is pointed to and declared to be somehow unclear.

You have been asked how else the text in question can be interpreted, and the most effective response would be to state it plainly rather than asking us to go find the threads ourselves.


Azten wrote:
Originally, the pathfinder toughness read 3hp + 1 per level, which mean you got 4 extra hp at level 1.

This, in my opinion, is how it should work. Obviously it doesn't but still.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Rules Questions / Toughness Feat ruling (sorry!!) All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.