paizo.com Recent Posts in Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponspaizo.com Recent Posts in Question on Dogslicer, and similar weapons2014-02-12T03:38:38Z2014-02-12T03:38:38ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsLord Balenhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#472014-02-14T07:13:28Z2014-02-14T07:13:28Z<p>Correct me if I'm wrong, so:</p>
<p>- 1s turn into 3s regardless if you use its discard power to add dice to the check</p>
<p>The Dogslicer text says its applied to the any dice rolled with the weapon so it makes sense to do no matter if its in your hand or not. (the dice being rolled are still being rolled with the dogslicer)</p>
<p>- If it is discarded because of either the weapon Power (or condition), it can still be recharged with another power</p>
<p>It all makes sense if you resolve all discards and recharges for that check after the check itself. Which is how I've played for the sake of knowing what's being played and still involved in the phase.</p>Correct me if I'm wrong, so:
- 1s turn into 3s regardless if you use its discard power to add dice to the check
The Dogslicer text says its applied to the any dice rolled with the weapon so it makes sense to do no matter if its in your hand or not. (the dice being rolled are still being rolled with the dogslicer)
- If it is discarded because of either the weapon Power (or condition), it can still be recharged with another power
It all makes sense if you resolve all discards and recharges...Lord Balen2014-02-14T07:13:28ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsHawkmoon269https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#462014-02-14T07:05:53Z2014-02-14T04:37:58Z<p>You were. As long as the weapon's powers are the reason it is discarded, Valeros can recharge it.</p>You were. As long as the weapon's powers are the reason it is discarded, Valeros can recharge it.Hawkmoon2692014-02-14T04:37:58ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsBidmaronhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#452014-02-14T03:12:11Z2014-02-14T03:12:11Z<p>So I was right all along? Somehow I thought i had it wrong (hence my reset my thinking post).</p>So I was right all along? Somehow I thought i had it wrong (hence my reset my thinking post).Bidmaron2014-02-14T03:12:11ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponscsouth154https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#442014-02-14T02:58:49Z2014-02-14T02:58:49Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Bidmaron wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Vic Wertz wrote:</div><blockquote><p> All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.</p>
<p>There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule. </blockquote>Except that if it's being discarded because he rolled a one, he can't recharge it? </blockquote><p>If, after PLAYING it, the end result is Valeros's weapon being discarded, for whatever reason, he can recharge it instead.Bidmaron wrote:Vic Wertz wrote:All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.
There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule.
Except that if it's being discarded because he rolled a...csouth1542014-02-14T02:58:49ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsBidmaronhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#432014-02-14T02:49:03Z2014-02-14T02:49:03Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Vic Wertz wrote:</div><blockquote><p> All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.</p>
<p>There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule. </blockquote><p>Except that if it's being discarded because he rolled a one, he can't recharge it?Vic Wertz wrote:All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.
There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule.
Except that if it's being discarded because he rolled a one, he can't...Bidmaron2014-02-14T02:49:03ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsmlvanbiehttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#422014-02-13T22:20:22Z2014-02-13T22:20:22Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Hawkmoon269 wrote:</div><blockquote><p> There is actually a hint in the rulebook that buried cards can become unburied.</p>
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Rulebook v3 p9 wrote:</div><blockquote>Bury: Put it under your character card (likely losing access to it for the rest of the scenario).</blockquote>So its "likely" you won't be able to access it for the rest of the scenario, but that implies it isn't always the case. Of course, I can't think of anything so far that would un-bury a card.</blockquote><p>Take a look at the rules for dying and the hint there :)Hawkmoon269 wrote:There is actually a hint in the rulebook that buried cards can become unburied.
Rulebook v3 p9 wrote:Bury: Put it under your character card (likely losing access to it for the rest of the scenario).
So its "likely" you won't be able to access it for the rest of the scenario, but that implies it isn't always the case. Of course, I can't think of anything so far that would un-bury a card.Take a look at the rules for dying and the hint there :)mlvanbie2014-02-13T22:20:22ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsQuantumNinjahttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#412014-02-13T18:18:28Z2014-02-13T18:18:28Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Vic Wertz wrote:</div><blockquote><p> All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.</p>
<p>There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule. </blockquote><p>Thank you for this explanation, by the way. It cleared up a lot of timing issues in my mind about things like Valeros' power ("When you play a weapon, recharge instead of discard") and Lini's power ("When you play an animal ally, recharge instead of discard"). Previously I had assumed these were things that trigger immediately when you play a card, but now I get that these are things that happen after the card has already been played and is on its way to the discard pile. It now makes very clear sense to me why Lini's power cannot be used to prevent animals from being buried while at the Farmhouse.Vic Wertz wrote:All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.
There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule.
Thank you for this explanation, by the way. It cleared up a lot of...QuantumNinja2014-02-13T18:18:28ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsBrainwavehttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#402014-02-13T05:51:59Z2014-02-13T05:51:59Z<p>Yeah me too. I thought he was saying that the Dogslicer overruled Valeros' power or wouldn't have even brought up the Amiri thing.</p>
<p>Well more to the point when he quoted the rulebook regarding discarding the Dogslicer being mandatory it didn't seem like recharging it would be an option. Ok guess it is.</p>Yeah me too. I thought he was saying that the Dogslicer overruled Valeros' power or wouldn't have even brought up the Amiri thing.
Well more to the point when he quoted the rulebook regarding discarding the Dogslicer being mandatory it didn't seem like recharging it would be an option. Ok guess it is.Brainwave2014-02-13T05:51:59ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponscsouth154https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#392014-02-13T03:36:39Z2014-02-13T03:36:39Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">QuantumNinja wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Fair enough. What about the question earlier about Amiri's power?</p>
<p>Amiri reveals Dogslicer for her combat check. She uses her power to bury Dogslicer to add 1d10. She rolls a 1, so Dogslicer instructs her to discard it.</p>
<p>I think there's a conflict now. Amiri's says to bury the card, the Dogslicer says to discard it. Amiri's card should take precedence according to the Golden rule, so it should get buried. Right?</p>
<p></blockquote><p>That sounds right to me.QuantumNinja wrote:Fair enough. What about the question earlier about Amiri's power?
Amiri reveals Dogslicer for her combat check. She uses her power to bury Dogslicer to add 1d10. She rolls a 1, so Dogslicer instructs her to discard it.
I think there's a conflict now. Amiri's says to bury the card, the Dogslicer says to discard it. Amiri's card should take precedence according to the Golden rule, so it should get buried. Right?
That sounds right to me.csouth1542014-02-13T03:36:39ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponscsouth154https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#382014-02-13T03:32:43Z2014-02-13T03:32:43Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Vic Wertz wrote:</div><blockquote><p> All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.</p>
<p>There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule. </blockquote><p>Oh...I got something totally different from what you said earlier. Reading it again, I realize that Valeros's power had nothing to do with what you were talking about. Sorry about that.Vic Wertz wrote:All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.
There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule.
Oh...I got something totally different from what you said earlier....csouth1542014-02-13T03:32:43ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsQuantumNinjahttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#372014-02-13T03:30:56Z2014-02-13T03:30:56Z<p>Fair enough. What about the question earlier about Amiri's power?</p>
<p>Amiri reveals Dogslicer for her combat check. She uses her power to bury Dogslicer to add 1d10. She rolls a 1, so Dogslicer instructs her to discard it.</p>
<p>I think there's a conflict now. Amiri's says to bury the card, the Dogslicer says to discard it. Amiri's card should take precedence according to the Golden rule, so it should get buried. Right?</p>Fair enough. What about the question earlier about Amiri's power?
Amiri reveals Dogslicer for her combat check. She uses her power to bury Dogslicer to add 1d10. She rolls a 1, so Dogslicer instructs her to discard it.
I think there's a conflict now. Amiri's says to bury the card, the Dogslicer says to discard it. Amiri's card should take precedence according to the Golden rule, so it should get buried. Right?QuantumNinja2014-02-13T03:30:56ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsVic Wertz (Chief Technical Officer)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#362019-10-04T19:25:41Z2014-02-13T03:15:13Z<p>All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.</p>
<p>There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule.</p>All Valeros's power cares about is what the ultimate disposition of the card would be. Finish one thing before you start something else—in this case, finish doing everything that the weapon card says. At the end of all that, if the card is being discarded, then you can use his power to recharge it instead; if it's not being discarded, you can't.
There's no conflict, so no need to consult the golden rule.Vic Wertz (Chief Technical Officer)2014-02-13T03:15:13ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsQuantumNinjahttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#352014-02-13T03:01:53Z2014-02-13T03:01:53Z<p>Doesn't the Golden rule cover this situation? </p>
<p>Valeros chooses to use his power to recharge the Dogslicer instead of discarding it. He rolls a 1.</p>
<p>Valeros says "I'm recharging you." Dogslicer says "No you're discarding me." Conflict! Consult the Golden rule!</p>
<p>Golden rule says, "Character cards trump other card types (which includes weapons). Valeros wins the conflict!"</p>Doesn't the Golden rule cover this situation?
Valeros chooses to use his power to recharge the Dogslicer instead of discarding it. He rolls a 1.
Valeros says "I'm recharging you." Dogslicer says "No you're discarding me." Conflict! Consult the Golden rule!
Golden rule says, "Character cards trump other card types (which includes weapons). Valeros wins the conflict!"QuantumNinja2014-02-13T03:01:53ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsHawkmoon269https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#342014-02-13T03:00:55Z2014-02-13T03:00:55Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">csouth154 wrote:</div><blockquote> An instruction is not negotiable. If it says "you MAY discard...", it is an optional power and Valeros can recharge if it's a weapon. If it DOESN'T say "you may...", it is a required feature of the card and must be obeyed to the letter. Valeros cannot recharge under this circumstance. Vic has already ruled on this in this thread. </blockquote><p>I don't think you understand what I'm saying. I wasn't saying it was negotitiable and I wasn't saying Valeros can use his power on this sentence: "If any d6 rolled for this weapon is a 1, count it as 3, then discard this card."
<p>What I was saying was that the rulebook does say you ignore an impossible instruction. </p>
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Rulebook v3 p2 wrote:</div><blockquote>If a card instructs you to do something impossible, like draw a card from an empty deck, ignore that instruction.</blockquote><p>And the rulebook says that unless a card says specifically where to discard a card from, it comes from your hand.
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Rulebook v3 p9 wrote:</div><blockquote>If you are instructed to play, reveal, display, discard, recharge, bury, banish, or otherwise manipulate a card, that card must come from your hand unless otherwise specified.</blockquote><p>So here is what I was saying for Valeros and how I thought he played the Dogslicer:
<p>Valeros reveals Dogslicer to roll Melee + 1d6.
<br />
Valeros additionally discards it to add another 1d6.
<br />
Valeros uses his power to instead recharge the Dogslicer. It is now on the bottom of his character deck.
<br />
Valeros rolls the dice and one of the d6s is a 1.
<br />
The Dogslicer says to count it as a 3 then discard the Dogslicer.
<br />
Valeros counts the 1s as 3s.
<br />
Valeros didn't see any specification that the Dogslicer should be discarded from anywhere other than his hand and assumes therefore that he is being instructed to discard it from his hand.
<br />
Valeros no longer has the Dogslicer in his hand, so discarding it would be impossible.
<br />
Valeros ignores the impossible instruction to discard the Dogslicer.</p>
<p>So I'm not saying he applies his power to the part about turning 1s into 3s. I'm saying he applies his power to the discard to get the extra 1d6. And since in doing so the Dogslicer is not in his hand, the instruction of "then discard this card" is impossible for him.</p>
<p>And Vic did not rule on this.</p>
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Vic Wertz wrote:</div><blockquote>So whether you chose only to reveal, or to reveal and discard, any 1s rolled turn into 3s and force you to discard it.</blockquote><p>Vic does not say in there what to do if you recharged it (or buried it for Amiri's sake). He just says that whether you reveal or discard it, if you roll a 1 you end up with it in your discard pile. But he didn't say it ends up there if you recharge or bury it.
<p>Either Valeros doesn't have to discard it if he already recharged it, or Amiri can un-bury it. Which of those sounds more in keeping with the rules and how things work? I think it the first one, that Valeros doesn't have to discard it if he recharged it. I could be wrong, but that is still what I think.</p>csouth154 wrote:An instruction is not negotiable. If it says "you MAY discard...", it is an optional power and Valeros can recharge if it's a weapon. If it DOESN'T say "you may...", it is a required feature of the card and must be obeyed to the letter. Valeros cannot recharge under this circumstance. Vic has already ruled on this in this thread.
I don't think you understand what I'm saying. I wasn't saying it was negotitiable and I wasn't saying Valeros can use his power on this sentence:...Hawkmoon2692014-02-13T03:00:55ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponscsouth154https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#332014-02-13T02:32:49Z2014-02-13T02:32:49Z<p>An instruction is not negotiable. If it says "you MAY discard...", it is an optional power and Valeros can recharge if it's a weapon. If it DOESN'T say "you may...", it is a required feature of the card and must be obeyed to the letter. Valeros cannot recharge under this circumstance. Vic has already ruled on this in this thread.</p>An instruction is not negotiable. If it says "you MAY discard...", it is an optional power and Valeros can recharge if it's a weapon. If it DOESN'T say "you may...", it is a required feature of the card and must be obeyed to the letter. Valeros cannot recharge under this circumstance. Vic has already ruled on this in this thread.csouth1542014-02-13T02:32:49ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsHawkmoon269https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#322014-02-13T02:19:16Z2014-02-13T02:19:16Z<p>There is actually a hint in the rulebook that buried cards can become unburied.</p>
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Rulebook v3 p9 wrote:</div><blockquote>Bury: Put it under your character card (likely losing access to it for the rest of the scenario).</blockquote><p>So its "likely" you won't be able to access it for the rest of the scenario, but that implies it isn't always the case. Of course, I can't think of anything so far that would un-bury a card.
<p>And this is why I thought Valeros, having recharged the card, would not be discarding it (and by extension Amiri would not discard it if she buried it):</p>
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Rulebook v3 p0 wrote:</div><blockquote>If you are instructed to play, reveal, display, discard, recharge,bury, banish, or otherwise manipulate a card, that card must come from your hand unless otherwise specified.</blockquote><p>Dogslicer doesn't say to discard it from anywhere in particular, so we are to assume it must come from our hand.
<p>So, I was thinking the other day that:</p>
<p>If generic character reveals the Dogslicer and rolls a 1, it turns into a 3, and you discard the card from your hand.</p>
<p>If generic character discards the Dogslicer and rolls a 1, it turns into a 3, and the card is already discarded so you ignore the instruction to discard it, but it is still discarded.</p>
<p>If Valeros recharges the Dogslicer and rolls a 1, it turns into a 3, but the card is already recharged so he can't discard it from his hand, so he ignores the instruction to discard it.</p>
<p>If Amiri buries the Dogslicer and rolls a 1, it turns into a 3, but the card is already buried so she can't discard it from her hand, so she ignores the instruction to discard it.</p>
<p>That's just what my thought was. Vic and/or Mike may rule otherwise, and perhaps already did so. But was Vic specifically addressing if Valeros recharged it? He only mentioned revealing and discarding it, not recharging it.</p>There is actually a hint in the rulebook that buried cards can become unburied.
Rulebook v3 p9 wrote:Bury: Put it under your character card (likely losing access to it for the rest of the scenario).
So its "likely" you won't be able to access it for the rest of the scenario, but that implies it isn't always the case. Of course, I can't think of anything so far that would un-bury a card. And this is why I thought Valeros, having recharged the card, would not be discarding it (and by...Hawkmoon2692014-02-13T02:19:16ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsBrainwavehttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#312014-02-13T01:54:36Z2014-02-13T01:54:36Z<p>Yeah that's my take on it too - this pretty much only applies to the Dogslicer, as the other weapon discard powers are all worded differently.</p>
<p>However I'd like to know about FatePAC's question regarding Amiri - if the Dogslicer can overrule Valeros' recharge power then why wouldn't it overrule Amiri's bury power? Seems like pretty much the same situation.</p>
<p>In both cases the card has to remember to do something different once it's already been recharged/buried so I don't see a difference there and while burying might seem like it's a more serious cost then recharging, there's no actual rule saying something can't come back from being buried that I'm aware of...</p>Yeah that's my take on it too - this pretty much only applies to the Dogslicer, as the other weapon discard powers are all worded differently.
However I'd like to know about FatePAC's question regarding Amiri - if the Dogslicer can overrule Valeros' recharge power then why wouldn't it overrule Amiri's bury power? Seems like pretty much the same situation.
In both cases the card has to remember to do something different once it's already been recharged/buried so I don't see a difference...Brainwave2014-02-13T01:54:36ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponscsouth154https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#302014-02-13T01:46:29Z2014-02-13T01:46:29Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Bidmaron wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Ok, resetting my new understanding.(listening hard to Vic)</p>
<p>Just to make sure I have this right, if Valeros plays a longspear and discards it to reroll, he cannot recharge it, right? </blockquote><p>If the card says "you may discard to...", then it's an option for playing the card and he can recharge it. If it instructs you to reroll and then tells you to discard, it's not optional and he can't recharge.Bidmaron wrote:Ok, resetting my new understanding.(listening hard to Vic)
Just to make sure I have this right, if Valeros plays a longspear and discards it to reroll, he cannot recharge it, right?
If the card says "you may discard to...", then it's an option for playing the card and he can recharge it. If it instructs you to reroll and then tells you to discard, it's not optional and he can't recharge.csouth1542014-02-13T01:46:29ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsBidmaronhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#292014-02-13T00:29:38Z2014-02-13T00:29:38Z<p>Ok, resetting my new understanding.(listening hard to Vic)</p>
<p>Just to make sure I have this right, if Valeros plays a longspear and discards it to reroll, he cannot recharge it, right?</p>Ok, resetting my new understanding.(listening hard to Vic)
Just to make sure I have this right, if Valeros plays a longspear and discards it to reroll, he cannot recharge it, right?Bidmaron2014-02-13T00:29:38ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsFatePAChttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#282014-02-12T12:22:13Z2014-02-12T12:22:13Z<p>If valeros has to discard it after he recharges the card, does it mean Amiri can reveal it then bury it with her power then if a 1 is rolled she gets to discard it?</p>If valeros has to discard it after he recharges the card, does it mean Amiri can reveal it then bury it with her power then if a 1 is rolled she gets to discard it?FatePAC2014-02-12T12:22:13ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsHawkmoon269https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#272014-02-12T04:38:31Z2014-02-12T04:38:31Z<p>That's how I do it practically, since I often have to review the played cards to properly assemble the dice. Which is largely why I wasn't totally sure when they technically went somewhere.</p>That's how I do it practically, since I often have to review the played cards to properly assemble the dice. Which is largely why I wasn't totally sure when they technically went somewhere.Hawkmoon2692014-02-12T04:38:31ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponscsouth154https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#262014-02-14T07:03:49Z2014-02-12T04:35:27Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Hawkmoon269 wrote:</div><blockquote><p> So if Valeros recharged it during that step and put it immediately on the bottom of his deck, and then in the next step actually attempts the roll and gets a 1, is he basically getting it back off the bottom of his character deck?
</p>
</blockquote><p>I think technically any discarding or recharging is done after the whole check is complete, so it shouldn't be on the bottom of your deck when you make the roll.
<p>I'm pretty sure that's how it goes, anyway.</p>Hawkmoon269 wrote:So if Valeros recharged it during that step and put it immediately on the bottom of his deck, and then in the next step actually attempts the roll and gets a 1, is he basically getting it back off the bottom of his character deck?
I think technically any discarding or recharging is done after the whole check is complete, so it shouldn't be on the bottom of your deck when you make the roll. I'm pretty sure that's how it goes, anyway.csouth1542014-02-12T04:35:27ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsHawkmoon269https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#252014-02-12T04:32:09Z2014-02-12T04:32:09Z<p>So even if Valeros recharged it, he has to discard it if he rolls a 1? I'm fine with that, but it actually raises a question: I know played spells are kind of in "limbo" until you get to attempt the recharge check. But what about things like this? When do you actually put them on your discard pile?</p>
<p>I'd always thought (though I don't know why) that, technically, weapons with a "you may additionally discard this card to add..." were revealed during the "Determine the die" step and discarded during the "Play cards and use powers that affect the check" step. Though I'd wondered if they were simply discarded during the "determine the die" step.</p>
<p>So if Valeros recharged it during that step and put it immediately on the bottom of his deck, and then in the next step actually attempts the roll and gets a 1, is he basically getting it back off the bottom of his character deck?</p>
<p>Again, I'm fine with that. I just find it odd for some reason. I guess maybe because you don't normally discard the bottom card of your deck.</p>So even if Valeros recharged it, he has to discard it if he rolls a 1? I'm fine with that, but it actually raises a question: I know played spells are kind of in "limbo" until you get to attempt the recharge check. But what about things like this? When do you actually put them on your discard pile?
I'd always thought (though I don't know why) that, technically, weapons with a "you may additionally discard this card to add..." were revealed during the "Determine the die" step and discarded...Hawkmoon2692014-02-12T04:32:09ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponsMike Selinker (Lone Shark Games)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#242014-02-12T04:02:27Z2014-02-12T04:02:27Z<p>Listen to Vic. He speaks wise.</p>Listen to Vic. He speaks wise.Mike Selinker (Lone Shark Games)2014-02-12T04:02:27ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion: Question on Dogslicer, and similar weaponscsouth154https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2qoj5?Question-on-Dogslicer-and-similar-weapons#232014-02-12T03:59:47Z2014-02-12T03:59:47Z<p>Vic already answered this, guys...</p>
<div class="messageboard-quotee">Vic Wertz wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Rules: Playing Cards wrote:</div><blockquote>Any paragraph in the power section of a boon that doesn’t involve playing the card for a particular effect is not itself a power—it’s a mandatory action that you must take when you play the card.</blockquote>So whether you chose only to reveal, or to reveal and discard, any 1s rolled turn into 3s and force you to discard it. </blockquote><p>So basically it's like this: If it says "you may discard to...", that's a power you can play. Valeros can recharge instead of discarding when he uses these.
<p>When it's an instruction such as "..., then discard this card", that is not a cost of a power; it's a mandatory, non-negotiable instruction.</p>
<p>So, with the item in question, whether you gain extra dice by using the discard power or not, if any of the d6's are 1's, they become 3's and then you MUST discard it. So he can get the extra dice and recharge it IF none of the d6's are 1's. Even if he only reveals it, he still has to discard it if any d6's are 1's.</p>Vic already answered this, guys...
Vic Wertz wrote:Rules: Playing Cards wrote:Any paragraph in the power section of a boon that doesn’t involve playing the card for a particular effect is not itself a power—it’s a mandatory action that you must take when you play the card.
So whether you chose only to reveal, or to reveal and discard, any 1s rolled turn into 3s and force you to discard it. So basically it's like this: If it says "you may discard to...", that's a power you can play. Valeros...csouth1542014-02-12T03:59:47Z