Mythic Chacters with Leadership


Wrath of the Righteous


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

So I've been running a game of Wrath of the Righteous and have recently learned one of my players is thinking of getting the leadership feat so that the cohort can be a cleric to help supply the party with some much needed healing and buffs. I'm fine with the PC getting the leadership feat, but I'm worried about the cohort being easily killed later on in the adventure path, once the PCs have both high levels and 5 or so mythic ranks.

So I was just wondering if anyone had any sort of advice as to how to make it at least possible for the cohort to stay alive in the later adventures, or if I need to worry about it at all in the first place.

Thanks in advance!


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

If the cohort dies, the cohort dies. The PCs will learn to keep their cohorts safe.

Scarab Sages

I think this homebrewed mythic leadership feat is okay.


If you want to stick with published material only, Mythic Leadership can allow you to get a mythic cohort.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

If you want to stick with the official Mythic rules, then Leadership allows you to have a Mythic Cohort. However, the Mythic Tiers of the Mythic Cohort count as half a level each, so if you're level 7, then the highest level your Mythic Cohort could be is level 4 with 2 tiers.


So what is the max tiers a cohort can have. It seems with that system the cohort tiers could exceed your own?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

I've no idea. There aren't rules on it; I'm just pointing out how the Mythic Tiers are considered half a level in the rules. And it also depends on the GM.

One thing that I plan on doing is having GMPCs and any Mythic Cohorts require twice the number of Trials to get a new Mythic Tier as the players. Thus to get to Tier 2, they need 2 Trials. Tier 3 and 4 would require 4 trials each. And so forth. This will ensure that a Cohort or GMPC doesn't outshine the heroes.

But that's my own personal houserule.


Anyone know what mythic leadership from the missing mythic core feats looks like?


thotham wrote:
Anyone know what mythic leadership from the missing mythic core feats looks like?

Mythic Leadership:
Even those who follow you are mythic.

Prerequisites: Leadership, character level 7, 2nd
mythic tier.
Benefit: Add your mythic tier to your leadership score.
The cohort you gain from the Leadership feat is a mythic
character with a mythic tier equal to 1/2 your own mythic tier.
Additionally if your cohort dies you may replace him in 24
hours by calling on the source of your mythic power. However,
doing so causes you to have 1 fewer uses of mythic power per
day for the next 30 days.
If you are of the 5th or greater mythic tier, your 10 highest
level followers are also 1st mythic tier.


137ben wrote:
thotham wrote:
Anyone know what mythic leadership from the missing mythic core feats looks like?
** spoiler omitted **

Mmmm very nice although it does bring me back to my wistful dreams of combining leadership, divine source and the wizards familiar (now with mythic leadership) to create a familiar/cohort cleric who gains their powers by worshiping their wizard and goes around trying to convert others to do the same.

I've been hit my cat casts cure critical wounds on me, and as a mythic being in its own right it won't die of old age.


137ben wrote:
thotham wrote:
Anyone know what mythic leadership from the missing mythic core feats looks like?
** spoiler omitted **

I get how it works rulewise, but what about in game? Let's take this Ap.

It means the PCS find/recruit creatures that are mythic and wants to assist them? (Like a mythic unicorn or good outsiders send my their gods to guide them in their grown as mythic heroes?) Or is more like they transfer part of their mythic powers to other allies, making mythic themself? Like giving Irabeth her well deserved first Tier?

Dark Archive

I would say it's more than likely a combination of both. Your cohort perhaps felt a divine calling to seek you out and aid in your task, and you granted them a small portion of your mythic power so they might help you in the task.

I really don't see a necessity for an additional feat. It basically means your cohort is underpowered (potentially fatally underpowered, depending on your party's current Mythic Tier) until you gain enough levels to pick up the mythic version of Leadership, at which point, poof! He's mythic. Good job hiding in the corner for two levels.

I think it should work fine if the cohort remains at the standard cohort level. Obviously their Mythic Tier should have a similar cap as their class level. No higher than your own tier -2 seems fitting. That means a paladin 10/marshal 6 could have a cohort who's a fighter 8/champion 4. The paladin is effectively level 13, while his cohort is effectively level 10.

This might, at first glance, seem to be a pretty wide disparity, but if their tier and levels continue to grow at the standard rate, the gap will never be more than three levels (the paladin's effective level at 20th with all 10 MT's would be 25; the cohort, at fighter 18/champion 8, is 22). This way, your cohort remains within a comparable range of effective power to standard Leadership in a non-mythic setting, and still has mythic power at his or her disposal to defend against mythic threats that would otherwise be looking at him or her as little more than a snack before the main course (roast paladin with a side of pan-seared asparagus).

Dangit, now I'm hungry.


Deimos Phenom wrote:

I would say it's more than likely a combination of both. Your cohort perhaps felt a divine calling to seek you out and aid in your task, and you granted them a small portion of your mythic power so they might help you in the task.

I really don't see a necessity for an additional feat. It basically means your cohort is underpowered (potentially fatally underpowered, depending on your party's current Mythic Tier) until you gain enough levels to pick up the mythic version of Leadership, at which point, poof! He's mythic. Good job hiding in the corner for two levels.

I think it should work fine if the cohort remains at the standard cohort level. Obviously their Mythic Tier should have a similar cap as their class level. No higher than your own tier -2 seems fitting. That means a paladin 10/marshal 6 could have a cohort who's a fighter 8/champion 4. The paladin is effectively level 13, while his cohort is effectively level 10.

This might, at first glance, seem to be a pretty wide disparity, but if their tier and levels continue to grow at the standard rate, the gap will never be more than three levels (the paladin's effective level at 20th with all 10 MT's would be 25; the cohort, at fighter 18/champion 8, is 22). This way, your cohort remains within a comparable range of effective power to standard Leadership in a non-mythic setting, and still has mythic power at his or her disposal to defend against mythic threats that would otherwise be looking at him or her as little more than a snack before the main course (roast paladin with a side of pan-seared asparagus).

Dangit, now I'm hungry.

I think it should be like half of the mythic tier. We don't want Irabeth start granting spells soon, right?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Think back for a second for the closest we've seen of a mythic hero and his sidekick: Hercules, the Legendary Adventures. His companion and sidekick was not Mythic in the least. And it ended up getting him killed.

So too with Cohorts of Mythic Heroes. You're going to get yourself killed with these Mythic heroes. Well, unless you take a backseat roll - a cleric who focuses on healing and buffs (and probably uses Sanctuary a lot), or an archer or the like. They stay back, they avoid being in combat, and they play a role after the fight is over. Otherwise, they die.

Of course, death being cheap in Golarion and Pathfinder, the mythic hero can just bring back their dead buddy, but hey.


Tangent101 wrote:
Think back for a second for the closest we've seen of a mythic hero and his sidekick: Hercules, the Legendary Adventures. His companion and sidekick was not Mythic in the least. And it ended up getting him killed.

Um, Heracles was a cohort or maybe follower himself, in the Argonautica. Along with mythic followers Orpheus, Erytus, Aethalides, Mopsus, Phlias, Nauplius, Polydeuces, and others, and some possibly nonmythic followers.

Contributor

Jason is the iconic "Mythic Leader," for certain. He had plenty of mythic characters underneath him, and the legend of "Jason and the Argonauts" is basically the Greek version of a crossover series.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

Heracles would very likely be a Mythic character who was part of a mythic adventuring group with Jason and the others.


Yep Iolous got killed a lot as I recall and I'd agreee . . .

Hercules -> Monk maybe? divine source, regular leadership, lots of ability points in strength and strength based powers.
Jason -> fighter lots of combat abiliies and mythic leadership.

Ioulous was a regular cohort while Hercule's (and the others) were mythic ones. Of course as a GM who's players have leadership (mythic or regular) you need to remember that they aren't just extensions of that person they're beings with their own goals, dreams and in the case of mythic leadership probably their own tasks and legends. So while they may follow you around a lot (Ioulous) they may also say (particularly the higher level ones) "I'm sorry but I think I'd be better off staying here and co-ordinating the defense of our town/tower/dojo/shrine.

Probably not so much here with the goals being such as they are but aside from specific quests or campaigns they could well decline to do things particularly a "normal" cohort to a mythic hero who could say "I am sorry my friend but if I acompanied you to the abyss I would not be able to provide much aid I will stay here and try to keep these people safe till you return."

Of course if you have mythic leadership, well I'd start off with my characters (at least the one I'm running through to test the modules for GMing and would like to play if I could) adoptive sister (assuming she isn't a PC in her own right sniffle) and then spread it out amongst the other iconic figures like Irabeth as even if they're NPC's who are GM run it makes sense for Irabeth at least to be a mythic being (her power just took longer to awakaen_ and as of the latest modules there's a way to at least temporarily (flavour wise) empower the others as well.

If you were running that way although having the heroes as an adventuring band coming together makes a bit more sense since as I recall Hercule's was voted leader but turned it down in favour of Jason for his own reasons. However since I prefer to run leaderships followers as their own beings (like I said) it could work either way.


Liam Warner wrote:
Hercules -> Monk maybe?

Definitely a barbarian, how often does he lose his temper and kill people out of rage?


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Rulebook Subscriber

We're talking the TV series, not the mythology.

I'd actually script Hercules from the TV Series as a Brawler from the playtest rules.


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
Bobmufin52 wrote:
So I was just wondering if anyone had any sort of advice as to how to make it at least possible for the cohort to stay alive in the later adventures, or if I need to worry about it at all in the first place.

If you want to mitigate the lack of Mythic Tiers on the cohort, I suggest having the cohort take Mythic Companion as one of their feats and having the PC take Mythic Companion as one of their Path Abilities. WOW, those shouldn't have the same name.

That should protect them from "hurt non-mythic" type abilities and give them the option of surging to get through a good attack or save when needed without having to shoe-horn in why they might be as legendary as the PCs.

Mythic Companion Feat:
Despite your non-mythic nature, you're a vital part of the greater mythic world.

Prerequisite: You must be non-mythic.

Benefit: You're considered a mythic creature for the purposes of determining how mythic spells and effects affect you. If you ever become mythic, you gain a +1 bonus on all saves against mythic spells and effects.

Mythic Companion Path Ability:
Select one animal companion, cohort, eidolon, familiar, or bonded mount. That creature can use the surge ability a number of times per day equal to your tier. Its surge ability uses the same bonus die type as you do when you use your surge ability.


A better question could be how to interprete mythic leadership in regard of otherworldy beings, like good outsiders or dragons.
I can easily picture divine beings sending such beings to watch over such promising mortals. Which new options for cohort should be allowed for them, i ask?

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