The Best Lil' Slugger


Advice

Sovereign Court

Hey boards! What race/class combination would you award with the title of "Best Small Strength-Based Martial Character?"

Limitations:

  • We're looking specifically at small races with a Str penalty. No halfling-descended Aasimars or such. The point is to build around the penalty.

  • We're also looking for martial characters. It's fine if they can cast, but this character needs to stand on or near the front line.

  • Strength must be the primary attribute of the character. That doesn't mean it has to be the highest attribute - a Gnomish Barbarian could easily have more Con than Str - but no Dervish Dancers, no Guided weapons, etc. Damage and to-hit should be based on Strength.

  • "Best" in this case mostly means either "highest DPR" or "biggest awesome/fun factor." Versatility is a plus though.

Have at it!


I am also interested in the answers to this for I have been interested in small bruisers since that guy in Pathfinder Society's First Steps.


I don't know about specific class combinations but the Halfling feat Risky Striker essentially gives them a second Power Attack against Large or bigger monsters for only a -1 AC penalty. I think you can combine this with mostly any class that hits stuff and do really well damage-wise.

Liberty's Edge

Likely a halfling Bbn...though kobolds get some crazy stuff...goblin?

Shadow Lodge

Might I also propose the following limitation of 20 Point-Buy? Just for some standard comparison ground for builds. I'll post a build in a bit.

EDIT:and for builds, what level should be the standard?

Grand Lodge

I agree with Lyra, a combination of power attack, risky striker and big game hunter feats would give a halfling fighter a substantial damage boost, and most non humanoid enemies you fight will be large or larger.

Other options could be helpful halfling cavalier with a body guard archetype wolf mount and a few teamwork feats.

Final idea

Halfling cavalier of the paw 4/ beast master barbarian x

Feats-
5th- boon companion ( barbarian)
7th- horse master (cavalier)

Take a roc animal companion from barbarian, and a wolf from cavalier. The two animal companions advance separately. The roc from the barbarian levels and the wolf from character level courtesy horse master. I would ideally have like to have had 2 wolves, but if the animal companion granted by the barbarian levels is an option from the cavalier levels, the two abilities stack, up to a maximum of your hit dice, negating the entire point of the build.

Anyway, end of the day, you have two large animal companions, full base attack bonus, rage (though it is very delayed), and the opportunity to ride either for multiple types of movement.

Grab some teamwork feats and destroy your engines by tooth and by claw.


And are we looking at a certain level? Or just across all levels?

Grand Lodge

That should be mad dog barbarian, not sure where I got beast master from.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

what level? the winner of this will vary based on what level you're looking at...

- a gnomish ragechemist/barbarian will be pretty solid all the way up. you could either favor alch with a barb dip (and extra rage feat as needed)- and pick up master chymist (and use giant form extracts); or you can favor barb with an alch dip- take beast totem tree, animal fury, and vestigial arms x2 (can wield greatsword/falchion in extra arms while using claw/claw/bite as secondary natural attacks; plus pounce, eventually).

- any race (especially with a bonus to Cha) would do well as a synthesist... crank size and str, go quadruped with arms plus max nat attacks (for pounce=full iteration with 2hander plus tons of secondary attacks).

- a grippli druid. take that shaping focus feat and 4 levels of some combo of barbarian and alchemist. simplest and most thematic to go barb 4; most beneficial would be barb 1/alch 3 (with a couple extra rage feats). this one doesn't really come together until at least 6th (when you can finally stack rage and mutagen with wildshape...)

- cheese.... barb 1/rage chemist 1/synthesist everything else. use synth to up Str (and size) as much as possible. anything that affects you affects your eidolon, so (as long as the eidolon is out first) the bonuses from rage, and mutagen all apply to the eidolon's stats... so by 20th you should have about 46-50 for eidolon (large x2, stat increases all in Str, and a couple ability increases) + 6 alchemical bonus + 4 morale bonus... and that's all without items: the inherent bonus from tomes would (RAW) apply to both you and the eidolon if its summoned while you read it, and there's nothing stopping the eidolon from wearing a Str belt (or getting bull's strength)- so you're looking at total of around 66-70 Str with a +6 belt and +4 tome!


I never finished him off but I started building a Svirfneblin Greatsword fighter that was shaping up pretty nicely. Good AC from the racial +2 Dodge and small size paired with a racial +2 all saves and SR means he should stick around in fights for a while and -2 str really isn't a huge downside and his big stat hit is Cha which for more people would be a dump stat anyway on a fighter. Here's his first five levels. I'd probably take him into the crit feats eventually, 18-20 isn't terrible for feat fishing and keeps his damage dice reasonable (1d10). He actually keeps up pretty well with shield weilders for the first half of his progression, eventually enchanted shields will win out over Dodge + Heavy Armor but it really should so you can't complain.

Svirfneblin Fighter (Two-Handed Fighter)
Str: 16
Dex: 12
Con: 16
Int: 8
Wis: 9
Cha: 5

+2 AC (Dodge)
+2 Saves (Racial)
SR: 11+Level
+2 Stealth, Craft Alchemy, Perception (Racial)
Stonecunning
Svirfneblin Magic: +1 DC to Illusion Spells. Constant: Non Detection, 1/day: Blindness/Deafness, Blur, Disguise Self
Hatred: +1 to hit reptilian and dwarven subtypes
Darkvision 120ft
Lowlight Vision

Traits:
Reactionary: +2 Initiative (Trait)
Defender of Society: +1 AC in Med/Heavy Armor (Trait)

Starting Gear: Great Sword, Scale Mail w/ Armored kilt, 55GP left over

Level 1: Feat: Power Attack , Bonus Feat: Furious Focus
Stat Block -
AC: 21 (10 +2 Dodge +1 Dex +6 Armor +1 Size +1 Trait)
Attack: +5 (+1 BAB +1 Size +3 Str) 1d10+4 19-20/x2
Saves: Fort +7 Ref +3 Will +1 SR 12
Level 2: Shattering Strike, Bonus Feat: Improved Sunder
Stat Block -
AC: 21 (10 +2 Dodge +1 Dex +6 Armor +1 Size +1 Trait)
Attack: +6 (+2 BAB +1 Size +3 Str) 1d10+4 19-20/x2
Saves: Fort +8 Ref +3 Will +1 SR 13
Level 3: Feat: Weapon Focus (Greatsword), Overhand Chop
Equipment: Upgrade to Full Plate & Masterwork Great Sword
Stat Block -
AC: 24 (10 +2 Dodge +1 Dex +9 Armor +1 Size +1 Trait)
Attack: +8 (+3 BAB +1 Size +3 Str + 1 Masterwork) 1d10+6 (Overhand chop ever hit) 19-20/x2
Saves: Fort +8 Ref +4 Will +2 SR 14
Level 4: Bonus Feat: Weapon Specialization (Great Sword), Str +1
Stat Block -
AC: 24 (10 +2 Dodge +1 Dex +9 Armor +1 Size +1 Trait)
Attack: +9 (+4 BAB +1 Size +3 Str + 1 Masterwork) 1d10+8 (Overhand chop ever hit) 19-20/x2
Saves: Fort +8 Ref +4 Will +2 SR 14
Level 5: Feat: Dodge, Weapon Training Heavy Blades +1
Stat Block -
AC: 25 (10 +3 Dodge +1 Dex +9 Armor +1 Size +1 Trait)
Attack: +11 (+5 BAB +1 Size +3 Str + 1 Masterwork + 1 Weapon Training) 1d10+9 (Overhand chop ever hit) 19-20/x2
Saves: Fort +8 Ref +4 Will +2 SR 15

Sovereign Court

Let's say 20 point buy and try for the best builds at 5th, 10th, and 15th level.

Also, here's a fairly simple Gnomish Mounted Fury Barbarian build I came up with a while back. Not optimal, but it would be hilarious to watch your enemies flee in terror of your 3-foot tall gnome.

The Scary Barbarian:
Gnomish Mounted Fury Barbarian
Explorer racial trait (+2 on climb & 1 knowledge instead of hatred/obsessive)

Str 14
Dex 12
Con 16
Int 10
Wis 12
Cha 13

Traits
Suspicious (+1/CS sense motive)
Armor Expert (-1 Armor Check Penalty)

Skills
Key: Ride, Intimidate, Perception/Sense Motive
Secondary: Climb, Handle Animal, Know: Nature, Swim, Survival

Weapon: He's not too picky. +X Ferocious Greatsword/ +X Keen Ferocious Falchion, whatevs. Lucerne hammers are nice. Bow for good measure. Maybe a lance.
Armor: Agile Breastplate w/ armor spike

Feats & Rage Powers
1F Intimidating Prowess
2R Intimidating Glare
3F Power Attack
4R Fiend Totem, Lesser
5F Boon Companion
6R Ferocious Beast
7F Mounted Combat
8R Terrifying Howl
9F Cornugon Smash
10R Ferocious Beast, Greater
11F Trick Riding
12R Spirit Steed
13F Furious Focus
14R
15F Mounted Skirmisher
16R
17F Dreadful Carnage

Wolf Feats:
-Narrow Frame
-Intimidating Prowess
-Blind Fight
-Toughness

Shadow Lodge

5th level Halfling Fighter:
Halfling Two-Handed Fighter 5
Stats:
Str18(17-2Racial+1Level+1Belt)
Dex14
Con14
Int10
Wis10
Cha10

Skills:
Knowledge[Engineering]+8
Knowledge[Dungeoneering]+8

Feats:
Iron Will
Power Attack
Weapon Focus[Greatsword]
Weapon Specialization[Greatsword]
Risky Striker
Improved Iron Will

Gear:
+2 Belt of Giant Strength
+1 Greatsword
+1 O-Yoroi Armor
+1 Cloak of Resistance
~1.5k gold leftover

Class Features:
Shattering Strike+1
Overhand Chop
Weapon Training(Heavy Blades)

Attacks:
Greatsword+11(2d6+10)
*Power Attack+9(2d6+16)
**Risky Striker+9(2d6+20)
***First Attack+9(2d6+22)

Alternate Racial Traits:
Fleet of Foot
Underfoot

AC=22(23 v. large enemies, 20 or 21 with Risky Striker)
HP=58
Will+4
Fort+7
Ref+3
CMB+9
CMD21

This is a build I threw together. Nice AC, good damage, standard 5th level WBL. I can make this build at higher levels as well, but it will take a little bit.

Shadow Lodge

10th Level Halfling Fighter:
Halfling Two-Handed Fighter10
Stats:
Str21
Dex14
Con14
Int10
Wis10
Cha10

Feats:
Iron Will
Power Attack
Weapon Focus[Greatsword]
Weapon Specialization[Greatsword]
Risky Striker
Improved Iron Will
Furious Focus
Big Game Hunter
Greater Weapon Focus
Improved Critical[Greatsword]
Vital Strike

Class Features:
+2 Shattering Strike
Overhand Chop
Weapon Training[Heavy Blades, Polearms, Spears]
Backswing

Gear:
+4 Belt of Giant Strength
+2 Greatsword
+3 O-yoroi
+2 Ring of Protection
+3 Cloak of Resistance
+2 Amulet of Natural Armor
~3K gold

Greatsword+19/+14[2d6+14/+16]
*Power Attack+19/+11[2d6+23/+25]
**Risky Striker+19/+11[2d6+29/+31]
***Vital Strike+19[4d6+31]
***Big Game Hunter+21/+13[2d6+31/33]

AC=29(26 with Risky striker)
HP=94
CMB+15
CMD27
Fort+12
Will+8
Ref+6

Basically an upgrade of my previous build.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

wow... i had a barb/alch/synth almost completely written up in this window and my (3 year old) son touched one button on my keyboard and the whole thing vanished :(

i am not going to re-type all that... suffice it to say that at 5th level with rage and mutagen his str was at 29 and he could pounce with a greatsword and 3 natural attacks (and power attack).

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