I've been wanting to roleplay in the dragon age setting lately.
I'm aware that a Dragon Age RPG has been published, but as I have neither the resources to acquire new books, nor the time and energy to get acquainted with a new system, I decided I'd ask if there was anyone out there willing to DM a dragon age game using either Pathfinder, D&D 3.5e, or d20 modern. That last one would probably need heavy modification to work, but I think it could wind up being great.
I feel that E6 would fit the setting well, but that would be entirely up to the DM.
As for the story, I would love to participate in an epic journey that included moral and ethical dilemmas, interesting adversaries, and characters devoted to the completion of their task. And Flemeth.
Were I to run one (I'm not), there wouldn't even be a question of system. The amount of conversion work you'd have to do for 3.5 / Pathfinder is silly, especially when there is already the AGE system, which captures Dragon Age perfectly. The AGE system is rather simple / elegant and promotes storytelling and cinematic experience over a ton of rules, and isn't expensive, so I'd recommend just getting that. I'd definitely be interested in playing a game if someone was to run one using that system. Anything else just seems like it would take a lot of work for not really much payoff. My few cents, at least.
Interesting, but I would prefer pathfinder to the age system. It did not impress me much. But to play a dragon age game I would put up with it.
Conversion of the game is an issue, but need not be that daunting.
Well, as long as magic doesn't do anything entirely setting-braking, I think the d20 fantasy systems (3e and PF) can play pretty much like any fantasy setting you'd want to.
I see three problems with using pathfinder or 3.5.
1) it lacks a blood mage
2) it lacks a templar
3) higher than 3rd level spells or so doesn't seem to exist in setting.
1 and 2 could probably be done with homebrew feats, or an archetype. 3 would be fixed by E6.
Everything else could be overlooked.
In short, I'm not looking to play a game with the video game mechanics of the dragon age franchise.
I'm looking to play a game that's set in Thedas. I'm more than willing to overlook that mages don't spam their spells.
Well there is a spirit healer spell that resembles breath of life I think, and some of the high end attack spells resemble firestorm to some extent (energy type changes), but I take your point. E6 woild be a good fit for it.
Here is a few ideas
Drop all divine classes except as follows
Ranger loses its spells, I think that archetype already exists
Paladin becomes templer, loses spells but gains spell resistance and some dispelling ability
Arcane classes
Combine sorcerer and wizard as follows
Use sorcerer spell casting, but give wizard skills.
Rewrite bloodlines to reflect the different flavors of mage
Use witches, except no familiar. Change patrons to reflect game.
Bards lose spellcasting, gain rogue talents, trap finding
Keep rogue, barbarian, fighter, cavalier, lose monk.
Alchemist now archetype of rogue. Lose sneak attack, gain bomb, lose evasion and trapfinding and trap sense, gain skill focus alchemy, poison use and brew potion.
Just thinking.
I actually started creating an E6 variant for this. Put it up over here.
I like this, easy and gives the flavor of the world.
You could add spirit healer, assassin and alchemist to the specialist list. Also shape shifter.
The last tier of spirit healer could have breath of life, the closest thing dragon age has to raise dead (actual game has a spell that seems to do that, can't remember its name), also mass cure light wounds.
I updated the project, got an aproximation of all the specializations down. I must admit I like to pretend DAII didn't happen, so I'm basing things mostly on Origins mechanics.
I would be keenly interested in this, should it ever develop.
Dibs on the city elf rogue. :)
I was actually thinking about this today, when I started a new file on DAO. I could DM this, but be warned that this would be my first time DMing a PbP, though not first time DMing (I have run my own little homebrew setting for 2 years now).
The way I see it, we would play Epic 8, with the caveat that spells could also be known instead of a feat gained (Or rather mages can take the expanded arcana feat).
Players could choose Fighter, Rogue, or Mage, just like the classic games and choose a package that reflects training in one specialization at level 2, with one more earned at level 6, but delayed in power. If it comes to that more specializations could be earned in place of 2 feats. I would work with players on these specializations, but it would work like a modified gestalt, with the specialty limited by which class is chosen, only with out the spells of the second class and possibly reduced or modified abilities. Generally speaking, you'd get the core mechanic of the class, but with adjustments of that core mechanic starts at a level higher than 1. The extent of how much of the second class you get will be determined later, but minimum you'd get weapon/armor prof and core mechanic. Modifying prestige classes would also work for some, depending on the power level. This is something that would need to be presented and discussed.
Mages will have a limit in spells known, but 50% larger than the sorcerer table, but at a wizard like progression (2nd level spells at 3). Class skills are that of a wizard + heal. I'll also employ a spell point system tbd. Cure, Inflict, Resoration, Remove disease/curse, and other divine spells that could be mage spells but escape me at the moment would be added to the wizard spell list. Teleportation wouldn't be allowed, as this is part of the lore. Some spells will be specialization only. Mages would get a main school, modified from the existing schools (present to me and I will approve or make changes). They would get the object arcane bond, but can be applied to any object they use to focus on, rather than one they bond with.
Regarding spells known, there will also be a rule on spell evolution. You cannot learn a new spell without a) knowing the last spell in the line. b) know a related spell of 1 lower level, or c) know a spell of the same level, same school
Charisma will be the ability for DC's, wisdom for bonus mana, and Intelligence for minimum ability score needed to cast a spell. Yes there is a lot of MADness there, but it reflects the DAO system. This will be mitigated by a bonus ability point every even level.
Staves will become a weapon that is a ranged touch that does 1d6 + Cha and crits on 20 x2
Arcane warrior would go with a modified magus, getting heavy armor and lower proficiencies and no failure in a certain mode that adds some part charisma or int to the to-hit, starting with light and max +1, but increasing to heavy and all bonus by 8th. 3/4 BAB when in that mode. Blood mage could be discussed, but it would be using hit points for mana + some access to some nice spells, like a hold person that does damage, dominate, etc. Spirit healer would be cleric, sans bab and armor proficiencies and access to the healing domain. Shapeshifter would get wild shape but that's all they get. Would only get 3/4s BAB while polymorphed. Force mage would get some bonus spells and some abilities we'd need to make up. Witches can be used as well.
Rogues could choose bard, ranger, alchemist (sans mutagen and mutation related discoveries), slayer (for assassin), or swashbuckler(duelist).
Fighters could choose barbarian, a modified paladin, bloodrager (reaver), cavalier (for champion).
We would also use a few house rules I am partial to, the wounds and vigor system, an injury system that would reflect DAO's, and more skills at first level according to background (+3 ranks for everyone at first level only)
Races would be Elves, Humans, and Dwarves, plus Tieflings (if you decide to play and abomination, with variants according to type) and possibly skinwalkers (as were creatues are a part of the lore). And if someone built a golem race from the race creation rules, I's certainly look at it.
Builds would be 20 point buy
If you are willing to DM this I won't be fussing over what kind of system we use within pathfinder - but did you note I put up a conversion of patfinder I made for dragon age e6 a few posts back?
At any rate, glad to see you're here! What kind of story would you be interested in DM-ing?
Sounds intersting. I'll play it if it starts. How would you handle multiclass. I can see some good reasons to not allow it.
Dragon whats your beef with da2. It certainly had its problems, all dungeons are the same was a big one, the prince archer should have been strangled at birth, but I thought the story was ok.
I had enormous fun with a Pathfinder Dragon Age game on this board not too long ago before the GM vanished without warning. I'd love to join another. This is the Alias I made for the game, I'll probably try to re-use him, subject to setting changes.
Sure the story was ok. It was more about survival than origins, which had a more epic feel to it.
DAII wasn't bad because of the story, it was bad because of the caves and the combat. So I'd like to avoid to port things from its combat.
At any rate, what I play will depend a lot of what kind of story we will be telling. But I must admit I'm partial to the templar.
I didn't see it when I posted, sorry.
Here would be my changes from yours/my revised rules
-Epic 8 (There are some nice 4th level spells that make great capstone spells, like stone skin, cone of cold, etc.)
-Spell Points including the rules on vitalizing when we go above level 1. Sorcerer progression.
-No limitations on schools, but there will be a specialization trade off/ associated school powers. Players can base these off the wizard's school abilities, modified to fit the setting.
-Spell evolution (emulates DAO's system). You cannot learn a new spell without a) knowing the last spell in the line. b) know a related spell of 1 lower level, or c) know a spell of the same level, same school
-50% larger known table for mages, round up. Select divine spells can be taken.
-Cha for DC's, Wis for bonus points, Int for minimum score to know spells.
-use your spell lists as guidelines. If player thinks a spell would fit, or there is a spell missing (see winter's grasp), they can make one up or use a spell not on the list, pending approval.
-I like your specializations. Lets use yours and also allow players to try to build their own. But with one change - lets make it like multiclassing. A level in specialization counts toward your level count, but gives you different abilities than your normal class. Each would need their own class skills/HD/saves. Treat as prestige classes a bit in terms of saves. We could do epic 8, but then allow players to take specializations to go beyond that with exp. The drawback to specialization is you don't get fighter feats, rogue talents/sneak attack/new spells unless they level up in their base class. Players can make up their own, using similar rules, for the missing specializations from DAOA and DA2, like keeper, force mage, etc.
-Alternatively, keep yours the same and make them feats players can take. This fits right in with the epic system. Actually, this may be better than the multi class idea
-Fighters get the short end of the stick, give them weapon training at 3,6 and 8. Capstone at 8.
-Rogues get proficiency in all bows. Imp Evasion at 6, Master strike as capstone.
-Mages capstone will be their level 8 school abilities.
-Heal is class skill for mages on top of wizard's skills.
-Spirit healers group heal may be changed to channel positive energy as a cleric.
-Elves, dwarves, humans, skinwalkers, qunari (will make later) are playable. Tieflings/aasimar will be the system's version of abominations/possessed.
-Builds are 22 point buy. No that's not a typo
-Ability score increase every even level.
-Choose a origin: tower mage, apostate, chasind, templar-in-training, chantry priest/ess, Grey Warden initiate, dwarf noble/commoner, noble, city elf, dalish, sten, saarrebas or something I didn't think of. Choose an feat appropriate to the backstory. This feat would need approval, but can be a specialization feat. Other specializations would require a tutor. Also you get 3 extra skill ranks at first level that reflect your training before you were an adventurer. Humans will also need an ethnicity.
-Will use wounds and vigor, the spell point system, and an injury system tbd.
Some of this stuff may seem a little too powerful, but I tend to make my fights equally as powerful in comparison.
I don't know exactly what exactly I would run, but I am open to ideas. My best one so far is to do one based around the first blight and make the players some of the first Grey Wardens, but pre blood ritual and Right of Conscription, fairly early on. I would be an epic like DAO, trying to convince others to join their cause, to band together, constructing Weisshaupt, battling darkspawn. If we get far enough, maybe even slay Dumat.
My other idea is to something in between 2 and 3 in all the chaos of the conflict between mages and templars. I'd base the world off my own saves, so Hawke would be a mage who sided with mages, Alistair is king with Anora, Mages would have already been free in Ferelden etc.
The first blight? You don't even know how excited I am to hear you voice that thought!
I've always thought the Anderfells would be an exciting place to adventure.
It runs into some slight problems with chronology, though. The tevinter empirium could still be at their hight of power back then, or it could even have yet to rise. That might mean immortal Elvhen. Of course, if you believe the Chantry, some of their best mages just got big-time corrupted, so it might on the decline because of that.
The Chantry as we know it didn't exist (they followed Andraste, so it actually might, come to think of it. Although by Andraste's time, the black city had become black.) The Inquisition might be kicking, which would also be awesome.
It follows that no Andraste and no chantry-inquisition covenant, no circles of magi.
I read the wiki a bit. I could use it literally, or I could play it a little fast and loose, considering much of the in game information is suspect.
Here's what I am thinking:
Andraste is just rising to power now. There is much anti mage sentiment among humans. May blow up eventually. Players may start to hear the first chants. Their campaign against Tevinter would not be happening during the game though.
Tevinter is having troubles due to the blight, losing many mages as the original darkspawn and are being attack from the Deep Roads Still a large empire, but very shaky.
Many elves sleep, ready to give up on the world. Would have to convince them to wake and fight.
No chantry circles, with the guarded mage and the righteous templars, but something similar to templars may be just beginning to rise. Not as chantry templars though. Circles can still be a thing, as groups of mages could still form them, with a similar organization to future Circles.
Golems are new and will be playable later if your dwarf decides to become stone.
At the start of the game, the blight would be in full swing. The Wardens themselves have only been around for a few years and are not well known. Right now they are nothing but a band of dwarves and humans that have been driven from thaig and villages running around fighting darkspawn. Players would be either Wardens or travelers and refugees that are attacked. The two groups would be thrust together in battle during the first scene or so. Possibly the refugees will be conscripted.
This is playing fast and loose with the time line, but it makes it more interesting. The first blight spanned 200 years with many interesting world events. I kind of want to shorten it a bit. In this frame, the blight has been around for 50 years and it is up to the new Wardens to force these factions to fight together.
That sounds very cool.
We would be starting at level one in the Anderfalls, yes?
I might make an elven ex-slave who's sought refuge from the tevinter in the deep roads.
Or a blood mage's apprentice who fled after his master tried to sacrifice him with blood magic.
Or I could make an inquisitor who got caught up with the wardens after investigating the darkspawn.
Should a new thread be started? or should official recruitment go on this thread?
Either way, use the rules above to create characters at level 1, with the added line: 2 traits can be taken, plus 1 with drawback.
Specializations will be feats, not multiclass. One per customer unless they spend experience to earn extra specializations. Specs are here, as well as some spell guide lines. Feel free to create your own setting appropriate spec, like force mage, keeper, etc, to be approved. Ignore the other rules (sorry Dragon) except the rules on the stave and sepll lists (as guidelines). I will add a golem spec, but it is not available to 1st level players and will be dwarf only.
Lets shoot for 6 players.
Races are dwarf, elf, human, and qunari.
In addition to what I said in the other post, fighters choose between armor and weapon training at 3,6, 8 and choose either armor or weapon mastery at 8
Qunari are half orcs, statistically. Instead of toothy, they can get a gore attack.
Players start in the Anderfels. Though in the Dragon age, these areas are hot and arid wastelands and steppes, in this time they are rich farming areas, with rolling hills and some forests. However in some areas, it is already starting to transform into desert.
So, a spells kown chart for the mages would look like this?
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-
-
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lvl|0|1|2|3|4
1 |4|2|-|-|-
2 |5|3|-|-|-
3 |5|4|2|-|-
4 |6|5|3|-|-
5 |6|6|4|2|-
6 |7|7|5|3|-
7 |7|8|5|4|2
8 |8|9|6|4|3
I took the liberty of evening things out a bit, but you gain +50% of what you would on my table, although 4 is double of your 3 level spells, not +50%. Could you clarify what you said about how spellcasting (points per day, save dc and so on) works?
That table looks fine.
Vancian Magic doesn't fit the DA setting, so to me, spell points are the way to go. You have a certain amount of points a day for spells you can spend, according to the tables here.
Each spell level has a minimum mana needed to cast. For level 1 spell, its just one mana, but for 2, its 3, 3, its five and so on. A spell cast using x amount of mana is cast at x CL, regardless of actuall CL. The max CL for any spell is the character's CL, excepting blood magic.
Bonus mana is derived from your wisdom stat (as it is pathfinder's will power).
The DC for any spell is 10+SL+Cha, as cha is this Pathfinder's magic stat
The minimum intelligence needed to cast a spell is equal to 10 + SL. Caster's will also want this for skills.
So here is an example:
Let's say Hawke was a level 5 mage. His mental stats are Int 14 Wis 16 and Cha 18. His mana is 19 from class plus 9 from high wisdom (see tables). His DC for his spells is 14+SL.
Let's say he wants to cast Burning arc. The minimum mana needed for this spell is 3, as it is second level, giving it a CL of 3. Because he is a fifth level mage, he can pump more mana into the spell, the normal limit being 5. This would raise the effective CL to 5. He, however, does not need to do this - he can still cast the spell for less mana
Now, let's say Hawke decided to dabble into blood magic. Under spell point rules, lets say the cost of using blood for a spell is double mana. Maybe with a feat or item, this could be decreased to 1.5 or zero. So casting a spell as a 5 CL spell would cost hawke 10 hp. I am also going to say that when using bloodmagic, not all of the cost of the spell need be in blood or mana, they can do both at the same time.
Blood mages would also be able to expend blood to go beyond CL limits or add to DC. For CL, triple each each point of mana beyond the normal range. So if Hawke casts Burning arc as a 7th CL spell, it would cost 10(for his normal range) + 6 (for each point above his max) = 16 hp. DC can be increased by squaring the addition to the DC.
During the fight, he expends 14 mana. This puts him at half mana, which means he is now fatigued. If he spends 7 more, he is exhausted. He must rest to regain his mana. Resting for an hour would give him back 1/3 his mana back. Another gains him the next 1/3. The last third takes 6 hours of rest.
Hmm. I like spell points, but they screw over primalists (who are already getting the short end of the stick) and help out entropists. (who really, really don't need it)
Also, the templars just got yet another leg up on those pesky mages. (this is probably not a bad thing.)
Blood magic is les powerful, but as you pay for much of that power with the unofficial "and every civilized being who isn't tevinter hates your guts" clause in the original setting, it should probably be fine. I imagine blood magic is less of a taboo because the chantry hasn't gotten around to banning it yet.
Edit: shouldnt hawke be paying 20 points? 7*2 for normal range, +6 for blood magic increase?
Edit2: Disregard that. Brainfart.
Here are also the rules of Wounds and Vigor, a la me. The orginal rules can be found here. Mine are mildly modified.
Your wounds score is twice your con score. Your Vigor is derived from you class. Mages get 6/level, Rogues get 8. Fighters get 10. Favored class bonus goes to Vigor.
Attacks go through you Vigor first. Once you have no Vigor, you start taking wound damage. When you reach half your wounds, you are staggered and must make a DC 10 constitution check each round, or become unconscious. At this stage, each standard or move action incurs 1 wound. At zero wound, you die.
Critical hits act as normal, but also do damage to wounds equal to their multiplier.
Cure spells can either restore vigor, in which it operates as normal, or restore wounds, which only heals 1 wound pont per die. Resting for 8 hours restores all vigor and 1 wound point. I also have a houserule: for con mod times per day, you can rest for 15 minutes and recover 1/4 your vigor.
The heal skill is now useful as you need it to treat wounds non magically. A DC 15 heal check made over 8 hours recovers wounds equal to 1 per hour, or 8, or double that if the check exceeds the DC by 10.
Some feats are modified (see link). There is also a new feat, Vigorous, that increase vigor similar to how toughness increases wounds. Both can be taken.
Constitution bonuses from items or spells still act as they did before, giving 1 vigor/modifier/level, but only permanent effects increase wounds.
Edit: Another house rule of mine, bleed damage goes directly to wounds, but does not reoccur.
You know what, I am second guessing with what I said for blood magic. I am going to say that it is a 1.5:1 conversion on mana and by expending 1 wound, they can increase the DC or CL by 1.
Well remember, for a lot of DC based spells, duration is a factor. But I get your point.
Are vigor points per level modified by you constitution modifier?
What you said about spells suggest they are. But I didn't see it in your first post.
I have been also thinking about spells from DAO. Here are a few example conversions:
Winters Grasp: 1st level primalist
1d4/CL cold ray. max 5d4 (Boring, yes, but it Pathfinder is missing some cold 1st level spells. Alternative: 1d6/2 and target's speed is halved for 1 round Fort negates)
Stone fist: 2nd level Primalist
As Hydrolic push, plus 1d4 bludgeoning/CL.
Crushing Prison, 4th level spiritualist
see constricting coils
Vigor isn't modified by constitution. The houserules on spell and bonuses to constitution was to make those items not useless.
I like this system because it deemphasizes con to survive and it makes early character able to survive a stiff wind. And it is a little more realistic. But if no one likes it, we can go vanilla. Same for the spell point system.
The anderfels are still part of the tevinter empirium, right? I noticed the similarity between the symbol of the inquisitors (downward pointing sword, open eye) and the heraldy of the anderfells (downward pointing sword on shield) and thought that maybe the inquisitors in the anderfells are tied in with what remains of the rebbellion (the anderfells broke off from the imperium during a 35 year period some hundred or so years ago. They were recaptured, though.)
I'm sorry if I'm inserting the inquisition in places it shouldn't be. I just thought they'd be a neat stand-in for templars, given what we know of the ancient inquisition.
Yes, it is still a part of Tevinter. And you can have your inquisitor. It works well to have it starting during this time. Since I am already playing fast and loose with the timeline, I don't have much of a problem including it. But I am going to say that at this point, there is no large organization, but a new discipline to combat mages. Some would know each other, but they do not cooperate on the large scale.
How are you running darkspawn? Undead, aberrations, monstrous humanoids or something else? And can rangers have species enemy darkspawn.?
Here's the bare bones of Rane. His fluff isn't done yet, but I'm sleepy now, so I'll do it tomorrow.
Edit: Do you guys know how I can change the title of the thread to reflect that Sawyer has been kind enough to DM?
I'll make a +1 CR template and apply it to animals and npcs alike. Later, I'll start pulling out dire templates as well. Humanoid darkspawn will be one class, others will be their base creature, so a blight wolf would be an animal.
He's done now. I might continue to tweak his details, the feats in particular, but there's noting about his character that will fundamentally change.
Excellent. 1st character found, 5 more to go. Minimum, I'd like 4 with at least one of each mage, rogue, and fighter. If we get 6, I'd like them to be distributed evenly, but its not necessary.
For specs, I am also going to allow the taking of one class skill associated with the spec. So a rogue that takes Ranger, they could take Nature or Survival. Templars could take Religion or Arcana. Champions could take nobility and so on.
We may want to create a new recruitment thread so you can codify all the houserules into one post. I think I'd be confused by now if I hadn't been following this as close as I have.
Fair enough. I'll do it now.
The official thread is up here
This thread is now closed.