So I've decided that i want to see a thread of things that are allowed by the game rules through feats/class features that are blatently not intended but are allowed
Things like Cleave with a bow, or your 1hd-animate dead zombie with a deaths head taliman.
I am looking in particular at silly things not just OP1337
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I like the idea of a vampire succubus anti-paladin 2, who abuses her charisma of 35.
Yes, that's a +12 to all saves and on all attack rolls when using smite good, as well as an some extra hp. Then their are things such as her energy drain an her spell-like abilities, oh look! They're also charisma based!
The worst place for a human rogue to meet someone is in a dark alley.
"Just sneak attack him!"
"I CAN'T! HE HAS CONCEALMENT!"
XD exactly
Using Shield Master feat to ignore the penalties for negative levels, power attack, combat expertise, fighting defensively, defending weapon quality, etc.
0.0 i just realized that works
"How are you negating my CURSE!"
"I'm just that good"
*edit*
This one's a bit odd,
Human monk 3 Corsair fighter 4
level 1Heritage_>Kobold
Level 1Tail terror
Level 3 Monastic legacy
level 5
level 7 bonus Martial versatility ( Monastic legacy to close weapons group)
level 7 Martial versatility (Dagger/martial versatility--->corsair fighting style)
Not sure how this computes but.... i think it works... unarmed strike damage to a crossbow?
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The "Dead" condition unlike being paralyzed never states you are no longer allowed to take actions.
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Spontaneous Casting: A good cleric (or a neutral cleric of a good deity) can channel stored spell energy into healing spells that she did not prepare ahead of time. The cleric can “lose” any prepared spell that is not an orison or domain spell in order to cast any cure spell of the same spell level or lower (a cure spell is any spell with “cure” in its name).
Obscure Object
Secure Shelter
Arcane Blast
You can convert any spell into an attack.
Prerequisites: Arcane spellcaster, caster level 10th.
Benefit: As a standard action, you can sacrifice a prepared spell or unused spell slot of 1st level or higher and transform it into a ray, targeting any foe within 30 feet as a ranged touch attack. This attack deals 2d6 points of damage plus an additional 1d6 points of damage for every level of the spell or spell slot you sacrificed. 0-level spells may not be sacrificed in this manner.
A 10th level aasimar cleric can take this feat and use it to convert cleric spells into damaging rays.
Lawful Good succubus paladin. Who runs an orphanage for victims of demon attacks.
The idea is an old one from 3E days and a thought experiment of WotC, but I've always been fond of it and love watching players drive themselves nuts as they try to figure out if they should help the succubus or not.
I don't know if it's "valid" but I saw someone claim with a straight face recently that you could two weapon rend with a pair of pistols.
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So I've decided that i want to see a thread of things that are allowed by the game rules through feats/class features that are blatently not intended but are allowed
Things like Cleave with a bow, or your 1hd-animate dead zombie with a deaths head taliman.
I am looking in particular at silly things not just OP1337
Don't know quite what you had in mind for cleave with a bow, but it won't work at range, at least. Because:
As a standard action, you can make a single attack at your full base attack bonus against a foe within reach.
Yeah... ranged weapons don't have any reach... they work on range... If you want to cleave with a bow, you're actually swinging it around as an improvised weapon.Actually there's nothing in the game that say your reach changes when you wield a ranged weapon. You still have the same reach, it just doesn't affect your ranged attacks.
The only things that affect reach are a couple of class features, feats, size, and reach weapons.
I forgot snapshot
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Have a bite attack to cleave with a bow. Its still within reach, and you still threaten it. You provoke for melee firing, but you cleave with a ranged weapon.
As for cheesey RAW,
Vampiric Paldin healing with LoH because it says you may damage undead, not you have to.
Mythic Vital Strike with a scythe for 4xnormal damage because of wording.
Two-Handed Improved Shield Bash.
5 attacks at first level as a TWF tengu going kick/kick/bite/claw/claw, TWFing.
Always doesn't mean without exception. It just means if you meet a vampire, it will be evil.
Alignment, Size, and Type: While a monster's size and type remain constant (unless changed by the application of templates or other unusual modifiers), alignment is far more fluid. The alignments listed for each monster in this book represent the norm for those monsters—they can vary as you require them to in order to serve the needs of your campaign. Only in the case of relatively unintelligent monsters (creatures with an Intelligence of 2 or lower are almost never anything other than neutral) and planar monsters (outsiders with alignments other than those listed are unusual and typically outcasts from their kind) is the listed alignment relatively unchangeable.
Vampire paladin? Good to go!
tail terror was just something i threw in there because i was tired and i copied and pasted something i was working on (DM houseruled that i could have the tail, but only if i took tail terror at first level)
as for vampires, Aasimar with human heritage dhampyr can have a vampiric celestial animal companion... i think there's a way to make it fiendish too
We've got a whole thread going on this one, with strictest RAW you can take tail terror but never use it as you have no tail. Or have I missed something and it's just part of your transference chain getting damage crossbow?
I'd say strictest RAW is that taking Tail Terror via Racial Heritage gives you a tail and a tail attack. There's a lot of things that definitely seem to blatantly disregard RAI with Racial Heritage, mostly by making you into a mutant. Off the top of my head you can gain the ability to transform into both a fox and a kitsune from kitsune, dire bat and regular bat form from Skinwalker, a 10 foot tongue from Grippli, and angel wings from Aasimar.
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I read some weird RAW where a guy stated his spell component pouch contained fire- FIRE- because of some silly interpretation of the item's description and the pyrotechnics spell.
That's "STOOPID"
Spiked armor is a legitimate choice for the duelist's precise strike ability. Which, incidentally, may not actually deal precision decision; it's not spelled out in the ability description.
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Prehensile hair apparently has no trouble reloading two firearms simultaneously within the span of one second.
martial versatility and crusader's flury on daggers allows you to use a shield as a monk weapon, using martial versatility on Quarterstaff master allows you to use any two-handed monk weapon with one hand
as it is written, one of the dragon style feats also gives you elemental fistwith scaling damage.
Martial Versatility does not work with Crusader's Flurry or Monastic Legacy since they are both General Feats and not Combat Feats. Sorry dude :(
90 percent of that nonsense is through extreme corner readings of the rules, most of which has been done to death on the Paizo boards, and don't need more repetition here or anywhere else.So I've decided that i want to see a thread of things that are allowed by the game rules through feats/class features that are blatently not intended but are allowed
I've never seen a thread dedicated to such things, This is a thread for fun not advising us what to do
Martial Versatility does not work with Crusader's Flurry or Monastic Legacy since they are both General Feats and not Combat Feats. Sorry dude :(
oops, my buddy mentioned it during a drink i didn't fact check
@lazarx
Design Manager
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Vampiric Paldin healing with LoH because it says you may damage undead, not you have to.
Paladin: Does a paladin's lay on hands use positive energy?
Yes.—Sean K Reynolds, 02/21/12
Vampiric Paldin healing with LoH because it says you may damage undead, not you have to.Paladin: Does a paladin's lay on hands use positive energy?
Positive energy isn't spelled out to harm undead unless specified otherwise, though negative is specified to heal them unless specified otherwise, at least in the undead type. Leads to some awkwardness. Also you need to have an intelligence score to heal on your own, somehow having a brain or not plays into whether you heal naturally(unnaturally?) or not.
The more you know!
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Vampire paladin? Good to go!Yep ... go right to a game where the DM is an invertebrate.
People who play differently than you don't have spines? Weird. Hmm... Still have one. I must be an exception. I think anyway, I'm no doctor.
In golarion, undead are always evil, with the possible exception of ghosts. That includes vampire ex-paladins.
So, some restrictions on that.
Also, applying the vampire template to a character does turn them evil, you know.
==Aelryinth
Vampire paladin? Good to go!Yep ... go right to a game where the DM is an invertebrate.
Well, I'm usually the DM. Do I get to keep my exoskeleton?
Well, I'm usually the DM. Do I get to keep my exoskeleton?Vampire paladin? Good to go!Yep ... go right to a game where the DM is an invertebrate.
Uhh... Most humans don't come with one, they have an endoskeleton. So your probably good... I think...
Spontaneous Casting: A good cleric (or a neutral cleric of a good deity) can channel stored spell energy into healing spells that she did not prepare ahead of time. The cleric can “lose” any prepared spell that is not an orison or domain spell in order to cast any cure spell of the same spell level or lower (a cure spell is any spell with “cure” in its name).
Obscure Object
Secure Shelter
Oh gods YES.
Vampire paladin? Good to go!Yep ... go right to a game where the DM is an invertebrate.
Not quite the same, but I once threw a group of LG lich paladins (plus one NG lich bard) at a party. It was a fun encounter. Black tentacles were had by all. The liches were guardians of an elven burial site. They were trying to stop the party from raising a dead elven hero as a (CG) banshee. (The party was NG, CG, and N; I was really happy that I got to give them a combat versus good NPCs---paladins even!)
That same campaign had a NG lich conjurer, though he was an ally to the PCs. The undead weren't all good, though. There was a LE graveknight and numerous unnamed, unimportant evil undead.
People who play differently than you don't have spines? Weird. Hmm... Still have one. I must be an exception. I think anyway, I'm no doctor.Vampire paladin? Good to go!Yep ... go right to a game where the DM is an invertebrate.Oh, for goodness' sake. The PC police are out in force this Christmas Eve ... whoops, holiday season. [Rolls eyes.]
Is there some possible contrivance and/or convolution that might allow a vampire paladin? Sure. Is it far more likely that a browbeaten or permissive DM simply says either, "Kewl!" because he's twelve or "OK," because he's not got the cojones to say, "That's ridiculous; no"? Also yes.
I'm not precluding either possibility ... but we both know which one's more likely.
First off is it possible to be a vampire paladin?
YES
Are there detriments?
YES
Are there bonuses?
YES
The fact is that you may be of any alignment when roleplaying, A vampire seeking redemption is the case of the Dhampyr Kinslayer archetype of an inquisitor.
that being said, Lay on hands is a positive energy effect and all positive energy effects have negative effects on creatures of positive energy, because the physics of the pathfinder universe say they cancel eachother out.
There are ways you can gain bonuses by damaging yourself (None off the top of my head but they exist) and as such this could be useful for that.
The character may be seeking to regain his humanity, or orc-manity.. or elf-mani-ahh you get it
Vampiric-mount? Sounds epic!
vampires hunting down legions of undead and trying to stop the sources of negative energy on his plane which will ultimately lead to his own self-sacrifice? That's not exactly a funky character concept.
Massively acclaimed stories have put their protagonists in similar circumstances, be it Frankenstein's monster coping with monstrosity and humanity, or Interview with a Vampire's entire plot.
I'm not a vampire fanboy but i don't discredit that in real world literature and storytelling in general, this is a popular concept with deeper connotations, and that it is actually shown in pathfinder as well with the dhampyr, or with most evil races having "Exceptions to the rule" as per raw. Actually a hellknight can be a tiefling, so can a paladin. Aasimar can be Antipaladins and evil clerics, Drow and draugr can be holy clerics of good and light, fetchlings can worship a god of the sun domain, Trolls can worship gods of the fire domain, Basically i'm saying that this whole thing actually is plausible in both reality and in game
Vampire paladin? Good to go!Yep ... go right to a game where the DM is an invertebrate.Not quite the same, but I once threw a group of LG lich paladins (plus one NG lich bard) at a party. It was a fun encounter. Black tentacles were had by all. The liches were guardians of an elven burial site. They were trying to stop the party from raising a dead elven hero as a (CG) banshee. (The party was NG, CG, and N; I was really happy that I got to give them a combat versus good NPCs---paladins even!)
That same campaign had a NG lich conjurer, though he was an ally to the PCs. The undead weren't all good, though. There was a LE graveknight and numerous unnamed, unimportant evil undead.
That is a butt load of good undead. Couldn't just throw Paladin Ghosts? Had to use Liches?
The fact is that you may be of any alignment when roleplaying, A vampire seeking redemption is the case of the Dhampyr Kinslayer archetype of an inquisitor.
that being said, Lay on hands is a positive energy effect and all positive energy effects have negative effects on creatures of positive energy, because the physics of the pathfinder universe say they cancel eachother out.
There are ways you can gain bonuses by damaging yourself (None off the top of my head but they exist) and as such this could be useful for that.
The character may be seeking to regain his humanity, or orc-manity.. or elf-mani-ahh you get it
Vampiric-mount? Sounds epic!
vampires hunting down legions of undead and trying to stop the sources of negative energy on his plane which will ultimately lead to his own self-sacrifice? That's not exactly a funky character concept.
Massively acclaimed stories have put their protagonists in similar circumstances, be it Frankenstein's monster coping with monstrosity and humanity, or Interview with a Vampire's entire plot.
I'm not a vampire fanboy but i don't discredit that in real world literature and storytelling in general, this is a popular concept with deeper connotations, and that it is actually shown in pathfinder as well with the dhampyr, or with most evil races having "Exceptions to the rule" as per raw. Actually a hellknight can be a tiefling, so can a paladin. Aasimar can be Antipaladins and evil clerics, Drow and draugr can be holy clerics of good and light, fetchlings can worship a god of the sun domain, Trolls can worship gods of the fire domain, Basically i'm saying that this whole thing actually is plausible in both reality and in game
What do dhampir, tieflings, or aasimar have to do with anything? Dhampir are not undead, nor do they have any alignment restrictions. Your parent was undead and evil, doesn't mean you are. Ditto for aasimar and tieflings, except there it's "you're great-great-great-great-great-grandparent was a celestial and good/fiend and evil, your parents are likely human, and why do you care what your ancestor's alignment was anyways?"
That is a butt load of good undead. Couldn't just throw Paladin Ghosts? Had to use Liches?
The lich conjurer was completely unrelated to this part of the campaign. I just threw in the mention because good undead are scary or something.
I used liches instead of ghosts because liches actually make decent martial characters (if you drop the crafting your own phylactery thing). I did lich over graveknight because I wanted the graveknight I had used to stand out. I suppose I could have done ghosts, but I didn't consider it at the time.
Though that reminds me, there was a ghost in that campaign too. She was true neutral.
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There's also one other possibility for a vampire paladin...
They were promised a cure by their deity if they stay the true and narrow path, despite being what they are, and they ultimately prove they will not give in to their nature. At the same time, it brings up the possibility that the very being the vampire paladin is out to slay is the one who turned them into a vampire in the first place.
I'm going to paraphrase a question Paathurnax asked... Is it more noble for someone who is always good to stay good, or for someone with an evil nature to fight that nature every day and be good?
And this isn't a minor concept, either. In real life, there have been wars fought over this question. It is such of a serious question that people have actually died defending their answer to it.
So, you tell me... if a vampire or demon or some other evil creature the paladin class inherently fights against manages to become good, convince a good-aligned deity they're worth actually investing some power in, and sticks to the path to the very end despite the numerous temptations their nature gives them... Does that not make a better story?
If they're doing it for story reasons, and not some amateurish story, then I would allow it, but they have to face the fact that their character will get a LOT of grief over what they are. Amateurish story or just for cheese? No, it's not allowed.
Congratulations, you've just suggested the d&d equivalent of edward cullen. *facepalm* :P
*shudders*
Congrats. You just made me utterly hate the concept.