Combat check and Weapon: Melee die or skill?


Rules Questions and Gameplay Discussion


Hello!
I have a doubt about how to use the weapons in a Combat check.
For example: Valoros faces the Ogre (combat check 14) and he uses the Bastard Sword. The weapon says "reveal this card to roll your Strength or Melee DIE."
Valoros choose Melee (Melee die is the same as Strength die) so it is: 1d10 (Valoros's Strength) + 1d10 (Bastard Sword), but my doubt is whether we must add the bonus of plus 3. The card Melee say DIE, not the skill (Melee = Strength plus 3).
The faq says: "7. Skills and dice are not the same." So it's only a Melee 1d10 without the bonus.
I hope I explained :P
thanks


You've been confused I'm afraid. In your example your "melee die" equals your strength die + 3, so you do get the +3 on melee every time.


Proto Persona wrote:
You've been confused I'm afraid. In your example your "melee die" equals your strength die + 3, so you do get the +3 on melee every time.

On the card says DIE and not check.

It 'the same thing?
thanks


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rockgi wrote:
Proto Persona wrote:
You've been confused I'm afraid. In your example your "melee die" equals your strength die + 3, so you do get the +3 on melee every time.

On the card says DIE and not check.

It 'the same thing?
thanks

A check is the target you are rolling against. A die is not the same as a skill, but a skill can be a die plus a bonus.

When a weapon says to roll your melee die, you use what is defined by your melee skill, the die for melee here being defined as strength + 3. Basically the melee skill on Valeros always grants at least a d10+3 when used for a check.

If a check required your strength die, and you had strength+1, you don't lose the +1 just because it said die and not skill. If you used melee in that case the pluses stack, so it would be d10+4.

As far as I know the cards usually reference rolling dice and not skills, which by this interpretation would make every bonus useless.


I don't know how to quote (epic fail!), but Proto Persona is definitely correct. His last sentence above,

As far as I know the cards usually reference rolling dice and not skills, which by this interpretation would make every bonus useless.

sums it up very nicely.

On a side note, I do feel the game designers REALLY overused the term die at points. When a blessing adds a die, it's just the base die, and NOT the skill bonus, for example. Until you get a feel for it, this can lead to a lot of confusion. ( To go back to the weapon combat example, if you used a blessing on that check, it would be 1d10 +3 for melle, 1d10 for the Bastard Sword, and 1d10 for the blessing [not another 1d10+3]).

Hope I didn't confuse the OP with this, like I said, the term die can be a little confusing until you get a feel for it.

Liberty's Edge

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Dice are dice and modifiers are modifiers. When something says add a die it doesn't say add a modifier.


Thank you, now it is clear.
However, if the card says "Melee die" is ambiguous.


Have a look at this (classic) post and then hopefully it will make more sense:

http://paizo.com/threads/rzs2q4t9?What-is-a-die#34

Basically, a die is just a die. But there are different actions that make up an encounter. Weapons set the die to use as the base die in the "Choose which skill/die you are using" action. You then roll the dice in the "Make the roll" action AND ADD MODIFIERS. This is when you add the +3 bonus that Valeros gets for Melee. And you only add it once, regardless of how many "Melee dice" were in the roll.


Ok, I understand the flow.
In the first step I set the die. (Melee die)
In step "Make the Roll" add the possible bonus for the skill Melee.
thanks


You've got it!


Wow, the right explanation is way more complicated than I would have thought it needed to be. Crazy.


Well, I guess it needs to be 'complex' so it's clear.

Clear can get pretty long-winded. Take the turn sequence docs for example...


h4ppy wrote:

Well, I guess it needs to be 'complex' so it's clear.

Clear can get pretty long-winded. Take the turn sequence docs for example...

I know this is an ancient thread, but about the (very helpful) turn sequence doc: doesn't it need to be revised to incorporate the official ruling that end-of-turn actions occur before resetting your hand?


Never mind. I realized I should post this to the thread specified in the doc.

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