Player character wishes to kill me, even though no reason. Asking help to prevent my death.


Advice

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TempNameUntilAnswer wrote:
Asking help to prevent my death.

You are level 8 and should have access to a decent bit of money. Invest some of that money in a life insurance. Make sure that you have a large number of individuals who, in the event of your death or prolonged disappearance/imprisonment(in any way, including polymorph, plane change etc), have access to letters to send.

In these letters lie the activation code for an already paid for assassination of the character that is threatening you. The assassins guild (preferably a larger and honorable one; meaning that they will always honor a contract) has already received your money. The contract stipulates that the assassin needs to know how to defeat undead.

Information provided in the contract shows who the target is (Name, physical description, family line), all known abilities, known spells, favored tactics, as well as magical items on the person. The information is continually being updated by yourself.

The only way to revoke the contract? None, save that you will set an expiration date just about when you would pass of natural causes at an extremely advanced age. If you are turned to a sentient undead, the contract continues. If you are turned into a mindless undead it counts as your death.

When all this is set up and prepared, you inform the character. "in case of my death..." If he kills you know, he does so at the cost of an opponent who is well aware of his strengths, weaknesses, and battle tactics.

P.S. As he is undead, also have a bunch of "in case of my death" letters that are simply being sent to large churches who dislike undeads and employ clerics, paladins, and witch hunters to deal with them. Include the same info as to the assassins guild.

P.P.S. If you want to kill him at some point there are options.
1. As suggested, run away and plink away with your bow.
2. Kill him with fire. Dispel magic first.
3. Hire some ninjas to sneak around you and support you in case you are attacked by either PC.
4. Hire a wizard to nail the PC.
5. Dont stand there to be a target. Run off, come up with a plan, and retaliate.

And off course, if the campaign runs its course, you kill the BBEG, and then the PC tries to kill you...
Stand up, pick up your character sheet, and tell him with a smile and a nice tone that the attack sounds fantastic and you are sure he will succeed. Then go have a drink somewhere else and talk to the other DM about a new campaign. You wont be bothered, but the fellow with the zombie will likely be annoyed for a long time as he probably has planned your demise for weeks and months. Denying him the satisfaction is priceless.


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Buy a greater undead slaying arrow or two, since you are an archery ninja.

The next time you see the offending character, shoot him in the face. Don't talk about killing his character, just do it first chance you get.

Shadow Lodge

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Someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill 'em right back.

Sczarni

Also, unless the homebrew character has special racial qualities, he has to stop and pray to his god in order to replenish his spells at a specific time of day. This prayer is not shorter than a full round action as it is stated that it can be interrupted. Additionally, the time of day is always the same. Figure out when he has to pray to receive his spells for the day and then interrupt it and murder him. A spell-less Oracle = a dead Oracle.


*sigh*

Why do people keep insisting on trying to settle this in-character? It's obviously an OOC issue, and trying to play 'king of the mountain' will just encourage him and ruin the game for everybody.


Kaito Darkborn wrote:
Also, unless the homebrew character has special racial qualities, he has to stop and pray to his god in order to replenish his spells at a specific time of day. This prayer is not shorter than a full round action as it is stated that it can be interrupted. Additionally, the time of day is always the same. Figure out when he has to pray to receive his spells for the day and then interrupt it and murder him. A spell-less Oracle = a dead Oracle.

That's a Cleric, not an Oracle. Oracles don't have gods, and their class description does not actually state what their method of spell-recovery is.


If as a Ninja at level 8 you can not kill an Oracle of similar level, hang up the dice.

You should go first more than likely.

Ready an action to shoot him when he tries to cast a spell.

Short of you critically failing the attack, he should never get off a spell.

Repeat until he dies.

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 16

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OOC problems need to be solved OOC. By choosing to kill his character instead of solving the problem in a rational manner, you're just as disruptive of a player as he is.

Grand Lodge

If he takes double damage from fire, that means he takes 16d6 fire damage from an 8th-lvl ninja sneak attacking with scorching ray. Pick up a wand of it, make sure you can dispel any fire resistance he has, and go to town. Get a scroll of undeath ward while you're at it... if he's not at least the same level as you, he can't even save to get in melee range (with his l33t diseases or whatever).

Also, it's not an OOC matter. As Lazarx pointed out, the entire setup is an exercise in ridiculousness... two antagonistic groups of PCs concurrently run by two GMs using differing rules and play standards. If the OP doesn't want to walk from the whole situation, it's best to oblige him in ways to enjoy the trainwreck.


There is no such thing as "succeeds on all fort saves" if your dm homebrew race has that, he is an idiot, and that character should be level adjustment +10 or higher. Disintegration doesnt care if you are alive,dead, gas, plant, mineral, or even a god. It just freaking disintegrates you if you fail the save.

Sczarni

Zhayne wrote:
That's a Cleric, not an Oracle. Oracles don't have gods, and their class description does not actually state what their method of spell-recovery is.

If there is not a rule stated, then it defaults to the generic divine spell casting requirements, which is what I stated. Oracles are divine casters which means they get their power from a divine source, which falls in line with the rule. Substitute god for idea of law or plants or cosmos. Whatevs. Same as a Cleric without a god.


Zhayne wrote:

*sigh*

Why do people keep insisting on trying to settle this in-character? It's obviously an OOC issue, and trying to play 'king of the mountain' will just encourage him and ruin the game for everybody.

Because, per the additional details in the thread, this is actually an in character issue. Two groups: Guards vs. Thieves. Situation introduces 3rd party BBEG that the two groups need to deal with. Before that happened, one Guard annoyed a Thief and Thief expressed desire to kill Guard. Additional description of Thief indicates very antisocial character, played by a DM friend using a DM created homebrew race. Player talking smack OOC is bad playing in my opinion, and should be ignored.

/cevah


(Choose slot) of Disguise Other - use activated:
"This spell functions as disguise self, except you can disguise either yourself or another creature." no save, no SR, 30 minute duration.

Imagine the possibilities:
Hire a common criminal to turn into your wizard friend and cause a ruckus in town, so your wizard buddy gets a rap sheet.
Turn a bound npc into you to sit by a window and wait for your buddy to kill him in cold blood - thus getting a rap sheet and going to jail.
Disguise your wizard buddy like a troll: how will the town react to seeing a troll wandering down the street?


Okay, I have changed my name. At this time, I am far too involved now and a majority of the issue has changed to the point I would not need that name any further.

As it is, I would like to express my gratitude to everyone for helping me with this issue. Upon seeing the two GMs, I requested some time to speak with them. While only a little was done concerning the player that wants to kill me. As far as it is, that player is not so much an issue to me any further. The Creative DM (and friend to the irritating PC) is now much more aggressive on killing my character. As it is, I have specifically been given multiple weaker buffs and numerous penalties in order to keep me weaker than the rest of the party. He additionally gave a nod to the PC right when I "angered" an NPC and now my bow was stolen from my character by the PC... I now am being attacked by a Large Stone Centaur with three attacks per Full-Round with a "Magical Vorpal Rapier +2". I apparently survived the first attack and was told by the DM that "You will, without doubt, die next time".

While I will continue this campaign until the end or my death, I will probably not continue playing under this DM in any further campaigns. I will also confront this DM vocally, however not in the campaign time itself but prior to, next time we will meet.

EDIT: I am WELL aware that Rapiers cannot have Vorpal. I am going to use this against the DM at the net meeting.


Okay, so clearly, as many suspected from his granting to the other player of a possibly overpowered undead racial type, the GM in question seems to favor the other player, and obviously does not like you on top of that.

Yeah, you just shouldn't play with these guys. They sound like a bunch of babies.


LordGeovanni wrote:

While I will continue this campaign until the end or my death, I will probably not continue playing under this DM in any further campaigns. I will also confront this DM vocally, however not in the campaign time itself but prior to, next time we will meet.

EDIT: I am WELL aware that Rapiers cannot have Vorpal. I am going to use this against the DM at the net meeting.

This seems like a very odd situation: a whole group bullying you in what is supposed to be a relaxed and fun social atmosphere. Are you in the military? A crowded dorm room? I guess what I'm suggesting is that you need better friends, especially ones who respect you.

Quit that game. Go have fun elsewhere.


I agree with the advice of the others here. The game is supposed to be fun, and GMs are not supposed to be retaliatory (or show favouritism, for that matter), particularly when you handled the situation in an appropriate fashion (speaking to the GM privately).

I would strongly recommend that you discontinue playing with this group immediately. No matter the outcome, there is bound to be bad blood if you continue to play.


Bodhizen wrote:

I agree with the advice of the others here. The game is supposed to be fun, and GMs are not supposed to be retaliatory (or show favouritism, for that matter), particularly when you handled the situation in an appropriate fashion (speaking to the GM privately).

I would strongly recommend that you discontinue playing with this group immediately. No matter the outcome, there is bound to be bad blood if you continue to play.

There are really only 2 strong DMs at the college that I go to. With that said, we all know each other and "bad blood" will cause A LOT of trouble for everyone. Regardless of that, I am hoping that if I confront that DM, others may say something similar and get that DM to really consider things. Even if I don't play in his campaigns, he is still a good guy otherwise and I think some One-Shot 4 Hour campaigns might teach me the game more too. In such a short event-campaign, I don't think they could get up to too much without making it obvious in their actions and that I can assure you will get the others against them.


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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

It's too bad that these jerks are such cowards that they can't just tell you you don't mesh with the group, instead of pulling this crap.
I, too, believe you should stop immediately. That'll be an extra week to find another group to play with.


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Hire a bunch of equal level hirelings then its all action economy and there is no way that 1 character of equal level can kill 8. Then whenever he opens his mouth just tell him to try it. Or better yet roll up a new character thats a paladin since this other guy seems evil and then you can be the one who puts him in his place all day every day and he won't be able to do s###.


LordGeovanni wrote:

Okay, I have changed my name. At this time, I am far too involved now and a majority of the issue has changed to the point I would not need that name any further.

As it is, I would like to express my gratitude to everyone for helping me with this issue. Upon seeing the two GMs, I requested some time to speak with them. While only a little was done concerning the player that wants to kill me. As far as it is, that player is not so much an issue to me any further. The Creative DM (and friend to the irritating PC) is now much more aggressive on killing my character. As it is, I have specifically been given multiple weaker buffs and numerous penalties in order to keep me weaker than the rest of the party. He additionally gave a nod to the PC right when I "angered" an NPC and now my bow was stolen from my character by the PC... I now am being attacked by a Large Stone Centaur with three attacks per Full-Round with a "Magical Vorpal Rapier +2". I apparently survived the first attack and was told by the DM that "You will, without doubt, die next time".

While I will continue this campaign until the end or my death, I will probably not continue playing under this DM in any further campaigns. I will also confront this DM vocally, however not in the campaign time itself but prior to, next time we will meet.

EDIT: I am WELL aware that Rapiers cannot have Vorpal. I am going to use this against the DM at the net meeting.

How is it that I keep getting proven right?


I can relate to your situation. Two buds - Eric and Jesse - both knew the system way too well and let each other's characters have way too many good items or special bonuses that the rest of the table didn't get. I stopped playing, because even after making super broken characters, I would still only be doing 25% the dpr at a lower ac, saves, hp, and gear that there characters could do... and they would gloat about being better.

Personally, that is bs about the centaur. The way you describe sounds like your only options are getting your character killed, leaving the table, or playing a significantly weaker character than this person with emotional problems (like go to the doctor-serious issues).

Grand Lodge

Personally, I would just deck him one good one from across the table.


You may already know all this:

Invisibility purge does not break stealth.

Darkness is a lighting condition. Lighting conditions range from 1 (very bright) to 4 (dark). Darkness lowers the lighting condition by 2. If the room is very bright, it will become dim (3) and normal creatures, such as humans without darkvision or low light, can see with a torch.

Oracle has like 20 specialties. His effectiveness really depends on what type of oracle he is. At L8, he has 4 benefits in addition to casting clerical spells similar to a Sorcerer (you know like 6 spells that you can cast without preparation like 6 times per day per spell level) . Oracles are divine spell casters more closely aligned to clerics than druids or rangers. Juju and Bones are two guesses to what his specialty may be, due to him being a zombie. These specialties are all about being a necromancer of a horde of undead.

There is a difference between the thieves guild and the assassins guild. The guy who killed an npc for the 'fun of it' and attempted to kill the mayor clearly sounds like a member of the assassins guild and would turn into a kill on sight person by the guards. Apparently this other 'thief' is also a member of the assassins guild also.

Oracles get medium armor - which reduces speed for everyone but dwarves. Is he a zombie dwarf? Is there a chance his speed should actually be 15, not 20?

Out of the other player's ideas. Kiting the guy sounds like the best idea.

Stealing a weapon is a DC 50 check unless you are sleeping or have dropped it. L8 characters cannot make DC 50 checks on anything except Glibness Bards (Bluff). Stealing is also a combat maneuver now. "Items fastened to a foe (such as cloaks, sheathed weapons, or pouches) are more difficult to take, and give the opponent a +5 bonus (or greater) to his CMD."

L8 Oracle has a CMB of 6+str mod. It sounds like you didn't notice the bow was missing, so he must have improved steal (+2 CMB), greater steal (+2 CMB), and combat expertise as three of his four feats (10+str mod CMB). L8 Ninja has a CMD+5(at least) of 21+str mod+dex mod. I do not believe an Oracle would take these three feats, even given the campaign. L8 Thief with these three feats has a CMB of 10+str mod.

The vorpal thing on the rapier was probably a mistake. There are a f-ton of rules - a great DM can mess up a few times on ultra-specifics like this one.


Don't play his game: Wait for him to attack you. Do nothing. "Hold action" every round and stand there until his character kills yours. Maybe take a bathroom break or go play video games until he's done. Tell him your AC and hot points and ask him to let you know when he's finished.

Seriously, it sounds like he's just doing it to get under your skin, so don't let him. As far as you're concerned, the game ended five minutes before the pvp started, when y'all killed the big bad.


Odds are at 8th level he will be flying, and probably have some sort of defense against fire and arrows up That's why during the combat, you should open up with a scroll of Dispel Magic, or even better, Anti Magic Field. Then hit him with flaming arrows, alchemists fire and the like. Be sure to have your Use Magic Device skill up, and drink a skill-boosting potion to pull it off.


Mapleswitch wrote:

You may already know all this:

Invisibility purge does not break stealth.

Darkness is a lighting condition. Lighting conditions range from 1 (very bright) to 4 (dark). Darkness lowers the lighting condition by 2. If the room is very bright, it will become dim (3) and normal creatures, such as humans without darkvision or low light, can see with a torch.

Oracle has like 20 specialties. His effectiveness really depends on what type of oracle he is. At L8, he has 4 benefits in addition to casting clerical spells similar to a Sorcerer (you know like 6 spells that you can cast without preparation like 6 times per day per spell level) . Oracles are divine spell casters more closely aligned to clerics than druids or rangers. Juju and Bones are two guesses to what his specialty may be, due to him being a zombie. These specialties are all about being a necromancer of a horde of undead.

There is a difference between the thieves guild and the assassins guild. The guy who killed an npc for the 'fun of it' and attempted to kill the mayor clearly sounds like a member of the assassins guild and would turn into a kill on sight person by the guards. Apparently this other 'thief' is also a member of the assassins guild also.

Oracles get medium armor - which reduces speed for everyone but dwarves. Is he a zombie dwarf? Is there a chance his speed should actually be 15, not 20?

Out of the other player's ideas. Kiting the guy sounds like the best idea.

Stealing a weapon is a DC 50 check unless you are sleeping or have dropped it. L8 characters cannot make DC 50 checks on anything except Glibness Bards (Bluff). Stealing is also a combat maneuver now. "Items fastened to a foe (such as cloaks, sheathed weapons, or pouches) are more difficult to take, and give the opponent a +5 bonus (or greater) to his CMD."

L8 Oracle has a CMB of 6+str mod. It sounds like you didn't notice the bow was missing, so he must have improved steal (+2 CMB), greater steal (+2 CMB), and combat expertise as three of his four feats (10+str mod CMB). L8 Ninja has a CMD+5(at least) of 21+str mod+dex mod. I do not believe an Oracle would take these three feats, even given the campaign. L8 Thief with these three feats has a CMB of 10+str mod.

The vorpal thing on the rapier was probably a mistake. There are a f-ton of rules - a great DM can mess up a few times on ultra-specifics like this one.

I only know a little about different things. As such, I can explain as much as possible, however it will need for someone to research a little to even know what spells there are that are causing these effects. I REALLY do not get/understand spells yet.

The biggest concern that I have currently (that is active starting 8PM Eastern time next Wednesday) is the PC stealing my bow. Apparently this was a Ranged-Touch attack to steal using a spell from a distance away from me. It was determined that this was a Combat Maneuver to steal and I have a 22 to that CMD. He should have a CMB of 6 + Strength. He then rolled a "17", or so he said. The end result was apparently a "26" so he should have a Strength of 16 or 17 to give a +3. My CMD was "10 (initial) + 6 (BAB) + 1 (Strength mod from 12 Strength) + 5 (Dex mod from 20 Dex).

If this is understood correctly, it should have been "confirmed" due to his roll and CMB being 26 compared to my CMD of 22. If the spell (which I don't have the name of) doesn't work that way, or if there were bonuses that I should have to prevent the steal, I would not know. I am fairly certain that he does not have those feats. If I should have applied bonuses to the CMD, I did not. In addition to this, my character was under the influence of some drug at the time and was in a "High". So that could be something that "affected" me. Regardless, I had just attacked the "idol" in front of me and would realistically react to the steal attempt.

As for the speed of the character. I am not sure of anything. It is possible that he has Light armor on. This is not completely accurate due to him having an AC of 19 before any of his spell bonuses. (in comparison, I only have an AC 18 and am the "weakest" at this in the whole group.)

He is also still just a "Thief Guild" member and not an Assassin Guild due to the fact that they were paid to kill him. It is more of a "gain money" thing instead of a "hired to kill" thing.

The PC has already expressed that he is a zombie of a Naga form. He still has nothing of the race in question due to being a Salarona. All Feat/Racial Abilities/etc... of the origin race are lost. Only the "Physical form of..." apply. (So he has no legs and just a serpent like body...

As for the Vision problem, he (the PC) has Darkvision as well as his Thief friend. He is planning on casting "Darkness" and possibly "Deeper Darkness" because he thinks that he and friend would be immune to the "SuperDark" Due to Darkvision. I have not corrected this yet. The bigger issue is that I can only see with Low-Light Vision and He wants Darkness to bring the Light to the lowest (dark). Additionally, with "Darkness" he gains concealment 20% and that will stop my Sneak Attack completely. Even if I am Invisible.

Grand Lodge

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You should really just quit playing their game.

As an aside, the character is probably using Pilfering Hand.


TriOmegaZero wrote:

You should really just quit playing their game.

As an aside, the character is probably using Pilfering Hand.

How is Pilfering Hand not considered really strong? Based on what I read, it is (in this case) a 8 + Cha Mod + d20 in place of just the 6 + Str Mod + d20. It also drags the item to you, regardless of your location as long as you are within 25 + 5-(per 2 Levels) feet from the target. That EASILY beats my AC/CMD. I believe his Charisma is around 18 or 19. That means that he has a 55% chance of beating my CMD and stealing my weapon over my Move speed away from me.

The more I learn these spells, the more this system seems broken to me.


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Scroll of control undead. Make him cut off his own head.


You need to ask yourself, Geovanni, "Am I gonna walk away and be the bigger man, or does some part of me really want to kill the gamers (in the pathfinder universe) that have harmed me and rub it in their face?"

If it's the first one, I imagine you would have already walked away from the table. That's probably the best option.

If it's the second one...

That's tricky. Because the DM sounds awful and you can't get your 'revenge' on him. He controls everything and apparently will twist things to his whim.

If he is a sadistic or cruel person, seeing you struggle and cry out against the absurdities and lack of fairness is like a drug to him. He will make judgement calls in the favor of your enemies just to get that high.

Don't play anymore, man. That campaign sounds like a circus.


I agree with Spastic Puma. Your best bet is to walk away from this toxic play environment.


LordGeovanni wrote:
TriOmegaZero wrote:

The more I learn these spells, the more this system seems broken to me.

The game is not broken just the people you are playing with, as the others have said get out, the 2 gm's, players, enivornmemt, PVP, overpowered races/pc's just spells complete and utter disaster to me.

Honest opinion...MMORPG players trying to play a tabletop version of a PVP game. This is NOT pathfinder or anykind of tabletop rpg I know of.

Rubbish, utter, utter rubbish, not my style of game at all.

If you like that kind of thing that's fine I guess though, if not just get out dude and start you're own game.


Well, as it is, the purpose of the campaign is to gather up 8 artifacts that will allow us to become as powerful as the Big Bad. The DM even went out of his way to make my Artifact suck. Even with that, I still killed the god that possessed the Artifact (which prevent me from getting "Champion" status and some buffs) still bestowed me some power by becoming the next god. If they tick me off too much I will just do a "Taking You With Me" act and "Give" both the power of a god and that Artifact to the Big Bad... By stuffing myself down its throat. The other DM will be there and have to agree due to the "Balance" being in the favor of the Big Bad. Then there will be no real time in the campaign (we leave for CHristmas right afterward...) to be able to resolve without ruining the purpose.

"Toxic environment" VS Player with Chip on shoulder and a BIG way to screw everyone... It will irritate them more than they do me. :P


Or, better yet, philter of love combined with a syringe spear.

Hit him once while constantly yelling his name. He will love you (probably in a platonic fashion) forever.

It's worth noting that the philter is not a mind-affecting effect and has no save, so the undead immunity doesn't apply. Also, only a successful hit injects the contents of the syringe spear, so a miss does not.

If it's a big deal about the "drinking" part, make a called shot to the mouth.

If you catch him flat-footed, it should still be doable, though difficult at the -10 penalty. If you have a way of getting a one-use true strike, do that.

Darkvision does not allow them to see through deeper darkness' supernaturally dark level.

Thus, unless you're in normal or bright light already, they can't see either.

As to your question about whether or not things are "broken", it depends entirely on what you want to do.

The spell itself isn't as broken as it seems because casters have to expend one of their limited spell-slots (whereas martials can do it at will), though the fact that they can do so at range is certainly quite a benefit, and probably more than worth it.

In terms of PvP, yes, outside of certain martial builds (which can be quite ridiculous in power), spells can definitely be considered "broken". Pathfinder was not built for PvP, however.

That said, PvP can be fun, two GMs can be fun, and situations tangentially similar to yours can be fun. But the GMs in question need to be fair (and knowledgeable), the situation needs to be "clean" and the people need to be honest. They are not in your case.

You've just got a terrible situation for PvP and a bad GM from everything I've heard.

Also, he's not a member of a Thieves' Guild that's a Thieves' Guild in anything but name only. It's an acting Assassins' Guild. It doesn't matter that it's for the money. Most people don't assassinate others just to kill. They do it for a reason. When a guild, as a guild, accepts assassination assignments for any reason, they, shockingly enough, become assassins by default (because they are engaging in assassination) and thus are an assassins' guild. They might also be a thieves' guild, but they are an assassins' guild by definition of the word assassin.

Also, they're evil. Because, you know, accepting money for killing someone who isn't actively committing evil acts is evil. It doesn't matter their motivation, unless they are deceived, they are evil.

I do want to say that, while I'm siding with you, I'm doing so tentatively. I understand that you're giving us your side of the story. I've no idea what the other side is. They could be "just as justified" as you, if not more so. I don't know how, of course. And, from what you've told us, it's a bad situation, with bad GMing, and bad playing.

My suggestion is to stop caring. Enjoy while you play, but otherwise just don't care. Let your character die if he dies. Relax. Have no worries. And then don't play with those two again.

(But do let them know that their rules-knowledge is either faulty or outright cheating. Don't do so angrily, just matter of factually.)


Tacticslion wrote:

...As to your question about whether or not things are "broken", it depends entirely on what you want to do.

The spell itself isn't as broken as it seems because casters have to expend one of their limited spell-slots (whereas martials can do it at will), though the fact that they can do so at range is certainly quite a benefit, and probably more than worth it.

In terms of PvP, yes, outside of certain martial builds (which can be quite ridiculous in power), spells can definitely be considered "broken". Pathfinder was not built for PvP, however.

That said, PvP can be fun, two GMs can be fun, and situations tangentially similar to yours can be fun. But the GMs in question need to be fair (and knowledgeable), the situation needs to be "clean" and the people need to be honest. They are not in your case.

You've just got a terrible situation for PvP and a bad GM from everything I've heard.

Also, he's not a member of a Thieves' Guild that's a Thieves' Guild in anything but name only. It's an acting Assassins' Guild. It doesn't matter that it's for the money. Most people don't assassinate others just to kill. They do it for a reason. When a guild, as a guild, accepts assassination assignments for any reason, they, shockingly enough, become assassins by default (because they are engaging in assassination) and thus are an assassins' guild. They might also be a thieves' guild, but they are an assassins' guild by definition of the word assassin.

Also, they're evil. Because, you know, accepting money for killing someone who isn't actively committing evil acts is evil. It doesn't matter their motivation, unless they are deceived, they are evil.

I do want to say that, while I'm siding with you, I'm doing so tentatively. I understand that you're giving us your side of the story. I've no idea what the other side is. They could be "just as justified" as you, if not more so. I don't know how, of course. And, from what you've told us, it's a bad situation, with bad GMing, and bad playing.

My suggestion is to stop caring. Enjoy while you play, but otherwise just don't care. Let your character die if he dies. Relax. Have no worries. And then don't play with those two again.

(But do let them know that their rules-knowledge is either faulty or outright cheating. Don't do so angrily, just matter of factually.)

I agree with most that you have said.

For the spells, this particular spell is one of the reasons why I feel that it is so strong. His standard act has stolen my potential damage of about 85% of its total until I get that bow back. In the mean time, I can easily see how the game was not designed with PvP in mind at all.

As to the other Player, He apparently was Chaotic Neutral when the campaign started and turned Chaotic Evil when he "accidentally" killed my first character. Then he was "driven to kill everyone around him" while he still only killed a random NPC and then fixated on killing my new character.

I am just going to focus on getting through the campaign and/or killing everyone in order to make sure that they know I was unhappy. Then I will not play with them again. Unfortunately, that means that I will probably never play again...


Starfinder Superscriber

So (after reading most of this thread) why play with them in the first place? There's surely no way that they can be the only game in town.


Flip this is funny. Especially the giant lobster bit.


DJEternalDarkness wrote:
So (after reading most of this thread) why play with them in the first place? There's surely no way that they can be the only game in town.

Actually... it is. My campus only has around 5k people. People that are interested in games number around only 200. We are happy that we even have about 20 people interested in D&D. With that, and two DMs total, we can only have so many campaigns running at a time. The better DM is also the one with fewer campaigns because it detracts from his study time.


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LordGeovanni wrote:
There are really only 2 strong DMs at the college that I go to. With that said, we all know each other and "bad blood" will cause A LOT of trouble for everyone. Regardless of that, I am hoping that if I confront that DM, others may say something similar and get that DM to really consider things. Even if I don't play in his campaigns, he is still a good guy otherwise and I think some One-Shot 4 Hour campaigns might teach me the game more too. In such a short event-campaign, I don't think they could get up to too much without making it obvious in their actions and that I can assure you will get the others against them.

Correction. There is one strong GM and one bad GM.

Do not verbally *attack* the bad GM. Instead, when the session is about to start, tell everyone what specific issues were placed upon your character *atfer* you asked the GM to handle the problem. Then tell everyone that you will not play with a GM that is not willing to play fair. Then leave. Take your character stuff and exit. Do not let them call you back. This has become a no-win situation. Be sure you tel the others that a GM who is out to destroy your fun is a GM you will not play with.

Don't plan on how to *fix* the other PC. Don't worry about incorrect understanding of the rules. You tried to fix things, and the bad GM decided to get revenge. It is time to leave.

LordGeovanni wrote:
"Toxic environment" VS Player with Chip on shoulder and a BIG way to screw everyone... It will irritate them more than they do me. :P

Screwing it up for everyone will ruin it for everyone. You will be doing to them what the bad GM is doing to you. Don't go there.

LordGeovanni wrote:
I am just going to focus on getting through the campaign and/or killing everyone in order to make sure that they know I was unhappy. Then I will not play with them again. Unfortunately, that means that I will probably never play again...

Leaving the table after telling everyone what caused you to leave will let everyone know you were unhappy, and why. Screwing them all in the process will drop your chances for playing. Doing nothing will improve your chances. Don't let the bad GM's style become yours.

/cevah


Starfinder Superscriber

When I was back in college, there didn't appear to be many gamers, but I started gaming in public and suddenly I had more players than I could easily fit into games and had to go to multiple games.

The final thing I'd say on that, can you DM? If so, start doing so to give people a chance to get awake from the jackaninny who's obviously playing favorites.


Starfinder Superscriber

Also good advice from cevah while I was typing...;)


Read the undead traits out loud, followed by "Huh. It doesn't say sneak attack OR critical hits in there."

His desire to fight is a power play inspired by pure confidence. Break that confidence. And at the same time, you'll find out if the GM is actually going to follow the rules for his special homebrew look how awesome my creation is race.

His CMD/CMB probably suck for the purpose of actually grappling. Grapple him, pin him (oh look, he lost dex to AC), and start pounding his head into the floor.

Liberty's Edge

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Fail GM...

Shadow Lodge

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LordGeovanni wrote:
The more I learn these spells, the more this system seems broken to me.

The more I learn about the group you're playing with, the more that campaign seems broken to me.


DJEternalDarkness wrote:

When I was back in college, there didn't appear to be many gamers, but I started gaming in public and suddenly I had more players than I could easily fit into games and had to go to multiple games.

The final thing I'd say on that, can you DM? If so, start doing so to give people a chance to get awake from the jackaninny who's obviously playing favorites.

I have the same situation right now. To the original poster, try DMing. You'll be able to play without the toxic environment you're in, you'll find more people who enjoy playing, and you might even bring more people in. Not to mention that you'll be saving people from having the same problem you did.

Grand Lodge

ask him to stop , if he refuses. offer him ur character sheet and say if it matters so much rip it up. if he does well you know what kind of person he is.

or talk to gm or host pvp party, a one on one fights. make bracts this could get it out of his system but stick to legal stuff and say heres ur chance.

if that doesn't work talk to the gm about retiring ur character and build a new one


Cevah wrote:
LordGeovanni wrote:
There are really only 2 strong DMs at the college that I go to. With that said, we all know each other and "bad blood" will cause A LOT of trouble for everyone. Regardless of that, I am hoping that if I confront that DM, others may say something similar and get that DM to really consider things. Even if I don't play in his campaigns, he is still a good guy otherwise and I think some One-Shot 4 Hour campaigns might teach me the game more too. In such a short event-campaign, I don't think they could get up to too much without making it obvious in their actions and that I can assure you will get the others against them.

Correction. There is one strong GM and one bad GM.

Do not verbally *attack* the bad GM. Instead, when the session is about to start, tell everyone what specific issues were placed upon your character *atfer* you asked the GM to handle the problem. Then tell everyone that you will not play with a GM that is not willing to play fair. Then leave. Take your character stuff and exit. Do not let them call you back. This has become a no-win situation. Be sure you tel the others that a GM who is out to destroy your fun is a GM you will not play with.

Don't plan on how to *fix* the other PC. Don't worry about incorrect understanding of the rules. You tried to fix things, and the bad GM decided to get revenge. It is time to leave.

LordGeovanni wrote:
"Toxic environment" VS Player with Chip on shoulder and a BIG way to screw everyone... It will irritate them more than they do me. :P

Screwing it up for everyone will ruin it for everyone. You will be doing to them what the bad GM is doing to you. Don't go there.

LordGeovanni wrote:
I am just going to focus on getting through the campaign and/or killing everyone in order to make sure that they know I was unhappy. Then I will not play with them again. Unfortunately, that means that I will probably never play again...
Leaving the table after telling everyone what caused you...

The big issue with that is that the other players will not see the complete level of harassment that I am under. This is CONSTANT roadblocks to everything. When the Thieves were off on their own, the DM that I have a problem with had the Thieves go to a village that had a currency that was different colored rocks. Red rocks were actually pretty good currency. So what happened? The Thieves gathered the lowest color currency in massive amounts and then BLED on them. It raised their "profits" by TWENTY TIMES. They walked in with 1,000g each (due to the assassination of the mayor) and walked out with 20,000g. In the same amount of time, a 6 month period passed and the Guards made 2,000g for their guard duty. I currently only have 770g and that hasn't risen since that day. Which was 5 weeks (4 hours of play a week) ago. There really isn't any Craft either (the campaign is suppose to be only a week in game) and that means that I really have been looking for any simple ways to raise my AC and I still have nothing that wouldn't tank my Dex mod like crazy... The other Guards are getting a little bonus everywhere so that they don't get upset while the Thieves' Guild got away with destroying an entire race's economy...

If I tank the campaign, at least the others will look for a reason. But yeah, they will be quite upset...

Taow wrote:

Read the undead traits out loud, followed by "Huh. It doesn't say sneak attack OR critical hits in there."

His desire to fight is a power play inspired by pure confidence. Break that confidence. And at the same time, you'll find out if the GM is actually going to follow the rules for his special homebrew look how awesome my creation is race.

His CMD/CMB probably suck for the purpose of actually grappling. Grapple him, pin him (oh look, he lost dex to AC), and start pounding his head into the floor.

He (the PC) knows. It is the focus on Darkness. It gives 20% concealment which means no SA...

Addem Up wrote:
DJEternalDarkness wrote:

When I was back in college, there didn't appear to be many gamers, but I started gaming in public and suddenly I had more players than I could easily fit into games and had to go to multiple games.

The final thing I'd say on that, can you DM? If so, start doing so to give people a chance to get awake from the jackaninny who's obviously playing favorites.

I have the same situation right now. To the original poster, try DMing. You'll be able to play without the toxic environment you're in, you'll find more people who enjoy playing, and you might even bring more people in. Not to mention that you'll be saving people from having the same problem you did.

Yeah, I would, however I still don't even really get spells. I really need more experience before that. It is why I am looking into One-Shots. I think designing a few bosses and simple dungeons may help those problems I have...


Friend, read my profile.

Now, as one of the most senior players of D&D still on this mortal coil, I can tell you- this game is not worth it.

There's two ways out:

Send everyone an email saying you're not having fun and wish them all the best. See if anyone else wants to leave.

Or, when they next attack you say "I die". Don't put up a fight. Just say "Ok, you win, fill-in-name-of-character-here is dead" "Thanks for the game. Bye!"

Shadow Lodge

Quote:
If I tank the campaign, at least the others will look for a reason. But yeah, they will be quite upset...

I don't think they are going to have to look far for the reason, my friend.

You will be right there, after all.

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