Points of Interest


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Goblin Squad Member

I have an interest...in knowing more about Points of Interest.

As someone who has no interest in the management of an entire settlement, but who has run what would have been considered a PoI in Ultima Online (I ran the Yew Community Center), I would like to know what kinds of PoI are going to be possible. I know from the bog that mentioned them, there will be guard towers, taverns, and farms, but the author seemed to suggest that there would be others as well. If we can't get some clarification from the powers that be, perhaps we - as in all of us - could brainstorm some possible PoI and potentially help add to the Devs' list.

What would you like to see as PoI?

Goblin Squad Member

I'd like to see some of the processing facilities pushed out from the town to the outlying hexes, or at least the option to duplicate those functions. So that would include smelters, rock cutting, and sawmills, converting very bulky goods to less bulky goods. (I liked all sawmills and smelters scattered around Skyrim.)

Having said that, part of the purpose for POIs is control of the hex. So POIs might best be things that can be fortified and upgraded with additional fortification. Manor houses. Watch towers. Wizards towers. Those ubiquitous Skyrim military camps. Inns that can be upgraded with walls. Caravanserai's that might have a market within the walls. Hamlets.

Goblin Squad Member

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I know temples or shrines were mentioned at one time. I would fancy something like a more "generic" House of Healing and Sanctuary, perhaps protected by devout knights.

Goblin Squad Member

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Hobs the Short wrote:
(I ran the Yew Community Center)

What were you, an Ent? Looking after those young saplings were ya?

Seriously though, onto POIs:

There seems to be some info that there will be:

Watch Towers
Taverns
Farms
Forts

I'm hoping that there will be:

Churches / Shrines
Monasteries
Stables
Mill Houses
Boat Houses (on rivers and lakes, obviously)
Guild Houses

Of course some of these structures could be dual purpose. I would even like for some to be a possible front for Hideouts, Dens and Safe Houses.

Goblin Squad Member

Bludd,

Yew was the name of the town.

Goblin Squad Member

Hobs the Short wrote:

Bludd,

Yew was the name of the town.

I figured as much, but I could not resist the joke.

Goblin Squad Member

Any number of Mines could be a Point of Interest...not just a collection of nodes in the wilderness, but dedicated mines where larger amounts of a common raw material is found. Stone was mentioned as a bulk good. What about mining silica in order to create glass used by glass blowers for all the vials bottles and beakers leeches and alchemists will need? Mining clay for all the things a potter can make.

Lumber Mills (needs a mill pond to keep the wheels turning)

Grist Mills (same as above)

Stone Quarry (for stone that is not "bulk"...stone used in housing construction, fountains, statuary, aquaducts...

Tannery Might be inside a settlement, but they stink to high heaven and were usually pushed to the outskirts of town at least.

Orphanage Talk about doing good works! Protecting and feeding children (all NPC types of course). You could really tug on some heartstrings helping to operate an orphanage in the River Kingdoms. I am certain there is no orphan shortage.

Military Outbuildings Various and numerous. Barracks, training areas, stables

Ruins Unserviceable structures in disrepair. These could be explored, may have creatures move in, could be used as hideouts

Farm, Grove, Ranch, Fishery

Manor Houses This could be the guild house Bluddwolf mentioned, a headquarters for a militaristic company or a magical experimentation company (don't want all those explosions in town where innocent bystanders could get hurt!)

Entrance/exit to a subterranean passageway to a distant hex All sorts of possibilities here, for good and ill

Goblin Squad Member

Training facilities for wilderness based skills.

Goblin Squad Member

Fanndis Goldbraid,

I think I saw somewhere that the bulk materials needed for building construction were potentially coming from PoI such as lumber mills, mines, etc., or has that changed to outposts? I guess I'm a bit sketchy on the difference between the two in that regard. Are outposts jump-off places for harvesting camps or for bulk resources (like stone)? I'm sure someone (oh Nihimon) can provide the latest info.

Orphanage...my first thought was of concern. Think of all those nasty evil groups coming to capture the poor NPC orphans to use as cheap child labor, a la "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom".

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite wrote:

Training facilities for wilderness based skills.

Do we know if you can place trainers in PoI yet? I would like the variety and realism of it (makes sense to go to the PoI mill to learn how to woodwork), but if PoI are to be more lightly guarded by your NPC guards, it might put trainers at more risk.

Goblin Squad Member

Hobs the Short wrote:

Bludd,

Yew was the name of the town.

What were Yew doing there?

POI's seem to have potential for more autonomy to run so they are interesting areas of the game. Functionally:

1. Watchtower = Useful for control/defence of hex for settlement
2. Outpost = Useful for supply of settlement demand for raw materials
3. Inn = Could be some healing/safe house? I'm not sure how they figure?
4. Farm = In nearby hexes to settlement again demand side
5. Temple = Could be a way for Factions to claim territory then broker a deal with a settlement: If we secede this POI then we get a temple in the settlement: Deal?

I'm guessing if a structure can put up a good argument for a settlement to build one/ally with the CC running it then it is in with a shout.

Goblin Squad Member

For example, cotton is easier to farm than to find. The primary source for these sorts of materials is outposts: semi-permanent structures in wilderness hexes, linked to a holding in that hex.

The outposts themselves are often close to the edge of the hex, located some distance from the central holding in that hex. This should make it desirable to subcontract companies to watch your outposts: they're far enough away that they may be hard to protect against raiders all by yourself.

So I think that outposts will not be a PoI structure if the PoI structure is what "holds" a hex.

Goblin Squad Member

Hobs the Short wrote:

Fanndis Goldbraid,

I think I saw somewhere that the bulk materials needed for building construction were potentially coming from PoI such as lumber mills, mines, etc., or has that changed to outposts? I guess I'm a bit sketchy on the difference between the two in that regard. Are outposts jump-off places for harvesting camps or for bulk resources (like stone)? I'm sure someone (oh Nihimon) can provide the latest info.

Orphanage...my first thought was of concern. Think of all those nasty evil groups coming to capture the poor NPC orphans to use as cheap child labor, a la "Indiana Jones and the Temple of Doom".

No, you're right Hobs. The bulk goods, generic "stone, timber, materials" or whatever else is considered bulk (I'd like to think there aren't many of these, as the more times a crafter gets to interact the better imo) should be PoI items. (Fine sand suitable for smelting into raw glass seems a good possibility.)

The orphanage could be one of those places that ends up being build due to the nature of choices the settlement has to make, like in SimCity when you design a beautiful lot in a residential and a church popped in the block. Dang! No tax revenue! Orphanages could be a construction that adds lots of DI (from the good deeds point of view) and if attacked brings harsh consequences to the attackers. Hospitals and religious structures would have a similar feature (if implemented).

Scarab Sages Goblin Squad Member

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I'd like to see a graveyard/barrow mound as possible POI. It could be a memorial to the fallen to grant a civilization bonus to it's controlling settlement, or a place to perform a nice necromancy ritual to unleash an undead escalation if it is taken by an enemy.

Goblin Squad Member

Given what I'm reading, could then PoI become a sponsored holding for a group that's not technically members of the sponsoring settlement? Could this allow for groups different enough from the sponsoring settlement to find a niche, even if they are not large enough to run their own settlement, or removed enough in focus/philosophy/etc., to not truly "fit" into full membership within the sponsoring settlement's organization?

For instance:

1. A Paladin chapter house in the form of a watch tower attached to a neutral good settlement. The settlement management might see the value in sponsoring the paladins - after all, some of their members would likely be lawful good. However, some of the beliefs or practices of the settlement as a whole might not be palatable to the lawful good paladins, so a home separate from the actual settlement would be ideal. In return, they protect their hex for the settlement and draw other lawful good characters to the area.

2. A public library (if player made books are possible - let's hope) housing in-character PF lore/in-game histories/stories/player made quest hints/etc., out-of-character guides, perhaps maps of known regions, and much more could be stored for player/character consumption. Sure, a group like The Seventh Veil might have one connected to their own settlement, but having regional branches would be a nice public service.

Goblin Squad Member

Druid Groves, as long as they were pretty far removed from the settlement itself (although Druids are pretty stoic, and tend nature wherever possible).

Goblin Squad Member

Hobs the Short wrote:
Given what I'm reading, could then PoI become a sponsored holding for a group that's not technically members of the sponsoring settlement? Could this allow for groups different enough from the sponsoring settlement to find a niche, even if they are not large enough to run their own settlement, or removed enough in focus/philosophy/etc., to not truly "fit" into full membership within the sponsoring settlement's organization?

From "Join together with the band", Smaller or less ambitious companies may instead establish control over a single hex by founding a "point of interest" structure in the hex, such as an inn, watchtower, or feudal manor. These outlying structures may be completely independent, or may be incorporated within the boundaries of a nearby settlement.

I think some independent POI hexes can and will exist. They may be sponsored by neighboring settlements or allies of neighboring settlements. I'd think that if they were antagonistic, they'll eventually fall, unless the settlement has bigger problems.

Even settlement owned POIs might be given to a company as a semi-independent feudal holding. The settlement might not need to micromanage every detail of the outlying hexes: give each hex to a large militant company to defend and hold. There could be an arrangement that the militant company will provide half its strength or more when you call a levy for war. (Some part remains to defend the hex). Let that company work with settlement harvesters to run Outposts and gathering runs.

Goblin Squad Member

Hobs the Short wrote:
Bringslite wrote:

Training facilities for wilderness based skills.

Do we know if you can place trainers in PoI yet? I would like the variety and realism of it (makes sense to go to the PoI mill to learn how to woodwork), but if PoI are to be more lightly guarded by your NPC guards, it might put trainers at more risk.

I suggest it since you asked what we would like to see. I have a tuff time seeing rangers and druids having training facilities inside of big cities. Just doesn't seem "right". There does have to be some give and take in our "suspension of disbelief" but it could be a nice, easy, and sensible solution to some of that.

Why does any particular Trainer need or deserve any more protection than say an outpost manager?

Goblin Squad Member

Shrine to Desna

I think (IMHO) PoI is the general name for shrines, manors, outpost, roadhouse (a tavern along the road), Inn, ….

These may have different elements of hardening and storage. Protection and transportation.

Bludd is right that these are softer targets. Taking them out is port of war on a settlement. But I would expect that this is unsanctioned target if no war/feud/faction is involved. Defending against those who attack would be sanctioned, but striking those unfledged would be unsanctioned.

Goblin Squad Member

Bringslite wrote:
Why does any particular Trainer need or deserve any more protection than say an outpost manager?

If the trainer is a capable adventurer type, and especially if he is training higher level skills, he/she might just kick their butts! And that goes for bandits, ruffians, or groups of Soldiers trying to have an asset war against another settlement. These guys are trainers for a reason and should not be taken lightly!

Goblin Squad Member

Besides guards, spells of illusion and other forms of misdirection could make a 'point of interest' look like a 'point of disinterest' for the uninvited. Of course those with better training in Perception: Hidden skills might see through the cloaking spell or camouflage, but every rank of it trained is an opportunity cost, of course.

Goblin Squad Member

A Hospital. A place for the Healer to heal the wounded. A distinctive landmark that might become a known refuge for those who are in need.

Possibly a necromancer's haunt that appears to be a hospital.

Goblin Squad Member

Hmm. I would think a hospital would be something built in-settlement, as opposed to a standalone structure out in the fields. But perhaps I'm just running with a preconception of what a hospital should be.

Wizard's Tower is one that strikes me as a good inclusion in either the settlement structure or PoI area. Of course, with different wizard's towers having the option to specialize the school of magic they teach.

Goblin Squad Member

Pax Shane Gifford wrote:
Wizard's Tower is one that strikes me as a good inclusion in either the settlement structure or PoI area. Of course, with different wizard's towers having the option to specialize the school of magic they teach.

+1!

Goblin Squad Member

How about some specific structure where bind points can be established? I know that the ability to build them is linked to the "Twice Marked" and that there are a lot of those, but I would like to see limitations on where they could be built. Both to minimize bind camping and to make large battles have a realistic possible end point.


Being wrote:

A Hospital. A place for the Healer to heal the wounded. A distinctive landmark that might become a known refuge for those who are in need.

Possibly a necromancer's haunt that appears to be a hospital.

In a place of Divine Magic, I think there would be Church's instead of hospitals. If people can cast a spell to heal wounds, it doesn't make sense to try and heal them by mundane means.


Pax Shane Gifford wrote:
Wizard's Tower is one that strikes me as a good inclusion in either the settlement structure or PoI area. Of course, with different wizard's towers having the option to specialize the school of magic they teach.

Let's tear down that Wizard's Tower and throw up a Sorcerer's Mansion plz.

Goblin Squad Member

Being wrote:
A Hospital. A place for the Healer to heal the wounded. A distinctive landmark that might become a known refuge for those who are in need.

I think this is largely the purpose of shrines:

GW Blog wrote:
Shrine: A place of worship that provides some healing, some curse and affliction removal, and some religious training.

I could see shrines to some if the god's particularly Sarenrae being available to nearly all players.

Quote:
Known to her faithful as the Dawnflower, the Healing Flame, and the Everlight, Sarenrae (pronounced SAER-en-ray[1]) teaches temperance and patience in all things. Compassion and peace are her greatest virtues, and if enemies of the faith can be redeemed, they should be.
Quote:
Sarenrae counts all non-evil gods as companions, and even communicates with evil deities in the hopes of converting them from their dark ways. She has some distrust for Asmodeus due to arguing over the souls of the dead. Her only true enemy is Rovagug.

There's a reason I shifted from Sarenrae to Ragathiel and Milani. I might switch back at some point as the community reaches a point where I'm more known for mercy than bloodlust, as I was among the GL on Darkfall.

Goblin Squad Member

I just said Wizards because it's the only one of the 4 combat roles they're gonna start with that didn't have a PoI to train at (and possibly rogue, but they could be included in inns). Once Sorcerers come around, by all means include some lovin' for them too.

Goblin Squad Member

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Andius wrote:
Being wrote:
A Hospital. A place for the Healer to heal the wounded. A distinctive landmark that might become a known refuge for those who are in need.
I think this is largely the purpose of shrines:

Okay. I just remember how it was back in the day during invasions where we would drag our dead and dying to the well-defended hospital where the healers could gather and heal/raise them back. Call it a shrine, but I suspect there will be need to not only be able to heal massive numbers of casualties but also to defend those doing the healing. A place where refreshing winds of mana flow, welling from the artifacts like fountains of living water.

Goblin Squad Member

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Nihimon wrote:
Pax Shane Gifford wrote:
Wizard's Tower is one that strikes me as a good inclusion in either the settlement structure or PoI area. Of course, with different wizard's towers having the option to specialize the school of magic they teach.
+1!

That could be fun. Nihimon sets up his Wizard's Tower and I help him setup mundane and magical traps for his tower. :P

Goblin Squad Member

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I like the idea of military or strategic outbuildings that offer a strategic buff to the hex it resides. Possibly as a sub-building upgrade to a fort or watchtower.

Watchtower + armory = upgraded storage
Watchtower + guardhouse = 1 additional npc guard if sponsored by a settlement

Once upgraded to a fort other upgrades become available.

Fort + Hospital/Shrine = healing/regen buff
Fort + Mess/inn = skill recycle buff
Fort + Arena = a few slots for fighter training
Fort + Apothecary = adverse status resistance buff
Fort + Wizard tower = a few slots magic type skill training
Fort + Archery range = a few slots of survival skill training
Fort + Commissary = small market for hex
Fort + Stables = hex wide travel buff (without settlement sponsorship)

Just to name a few possibilities.

Naturally, there would only be two slots for an outbuilding upgrade.

Goblin Squad Member

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Pax Nicoli Larvu wrote:
I like the idea of military or strategic outbuildings that offer a strategic buff to the hex it resides. Possibly as a sub-building upgrade to a fort or watchtower.

I really like that, too. One of the really cool things about Vanguard is the Diplomacy system that gives you buffs when you enter an area where a Diplomat has worked to provide them. I'd love to see PFO add something that Social players can do to provide a buff that applies to everyone in the local hex.

Goblin Squad Member

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Nihimon wrote:
Pax Nicoli Larvu wrote:
I like the idea of military or strategic outbuildings that offer a strategic buff to the hex it resides. Possibly as a sub-building upgrade to a fort or watchtower.
I really like that, too. One of the really cool things about Vanguard is the Diplomacy system that gives you buffs when you enter an area where a Diplomat has worked to provide them. I'd love to see PFO add something that Social players can do to provide a buff that applies to everyone in the local hex.

Maybe something like a Bar Master for a tavern, Cleric for a shrine, etc.

When their active ingame providing services, they activate a passive buff when they are performing their duties onsite and lasts for 12-24hrs.

Goblin Squad Member

Pax Nicoli Larvu wrote:
Nihimon wrote:
Pax Nicoli Larvu wrote:
I like the idea of military or strategic outbuildings that offer a strategic buff to the hex it resides. Possibly as a sub-building upgrade to a fort or watchtower.
I really like that, too. One of the really cool things about Vanguard is the Diplomacy system that gives you buffs when you enter an area where a Diplomat has worked to provide them. I'd love to see PFO add something that Social players can do to provide a buff that applies to everyone in the local hex.

Maybe something like a Bar Master for a tavern, Cleric for a shrine, etc.

When their active ingame providing services, they activate a passive buff when they are performing their duties onsite and lasts for 12-24hrs.

When assassinated: a hit to productivity in the PoI, loss of influence for the Company and and increase in Unrest for the parent settlement. Yum.

Goblin Squad Member

Wurner wrote:
Pax Nicoli Larvu wrote:
Nihimon wrote:
Pax Nicoli Larvu wrote:
I like the idea of military or strategic outbuildings that offer a strategic buff to the hex it resides. Possibly as a sub-building upgrade to a fort or watchtower.
I really like that, too. One of the really cool things about Vanguard is the Diplomacy system that gives you buffs when you enter an area where a Diplomat has worked to provide them. I'd love to see PFO add something that Social players can do to provide a buff that applies to everyone in the local hex.

Maybe something like a Bar Master for a tavern, Cleric for a shrine, etc.

When their active ingame providing services, they activate a passive buff when they are performing their duties onsite and lasts for 12-24hrs.
When assassinated: a hit to productivity in the PoI, loss of influence for the Company and and increase in Unrest for the parent settlement. Yum.

It seems certain that PoI buildings must be 'staffed' by a character, with the output of building (production, DI) depending on that character's skill(s). Assassinating said character will lead to lost bonuses (and unrest unless assassination is legal).

The question then is whether certain (staffable) buildings will provide buffs, such as a hospital removing afflictions. I vote yes!

I'd love to see taverns give bonuses to building management for the next 24 hours or so, so that you'd have that as place where you'll eventually run into everyone important.

Goblin Squad Member

Wouldn't want to put all the eggs in the tavern's basket, though. It already looks like a very important building, by what the blog said about recovering you limited use Power there. Maybe there's something else, like the big important town hall, that serves that function. It'd be nice if your settlement's main building serves as more than just an HP bar for sieges.

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