Which trumps the other RAW? Can I Wish to enter a dimensional locked area or does Dimensional Lock block Wishing in or out?
Also does having spell resistance allow me to resist the lock? Can I try to plane shift in/out and if I succeed on a SR check vs the caster can I enter/exit with teleport effects?
1. Depends on the wish. Is the caster duplicating a spell or attempting something more in line with older editions, such as "I wish I could enter that area"?
If the caster duplicates a spell, follow the rules for that spell. Duplicating a teleportation spell probably won't work, since dimensional lock specifically prevents such methods from working. Duplicating a dispel magic would have the same effect as simply casting dispel magic.
If the caster uses the "transport travelers" option, then it works; that spell is stated to work in spite of local conditions.
If the wish is something else that doesn't fall under the spell's bullet points, it's up to the GM. I'd probably allow it if the caster took any care as to the wording of the wish.
2. Yes. The spell description indicates that spell resistance applies.
I'm pretty much in total agreement with what blahpers has stated, if you use Wish to duplicate another spell as per one of the bullet points listed in the description of the Wish it is treated as the duplicated spell for saves and SR as is normal for that spell except the DC will be based on that of a 9th level spell i.e. the level of Wish. With this use of Wish it will NOT ignore Dimensional Lock any more than the spell duplicated would which is to say it will not.
Dimensional Lock:
School abjuration; Level cleric 8, sorcerer/wizard 8
Casting Time 1 standard action
Components V, S
Range medium (100 ft. + 10 ft./level)
Area 20-ft.-radius emanation centered on a point in space
Duration 1 day/level
Saving Throw none; Spell Resistance yes
You create a shimmering emerald barrier that completely blocks extradimensional travel. Forms of movement barred include astral projection, blink, dimension door, ethereal jaunt, etherealness, gate, maze, plane shift, shadow walk, teleport, and similar spell-like abilities. Once dimensional lock is in place, extradimensional travel into or out of the area is not possible.
A dimensional lock does not interfere with the movement of creatures already in ethereal or astral form when the spell is cast, nor does it block extradimensional perception or attack forms. Also, the spell does not prevent summoned creatures from disappearing at the end of a summoning spell.
That said Wish also has the following text and effect:
Quote:
You may try to use a wish to produce greater effects than these, but doing so is dangerous. (The wish may pervert your intent into a literal but undesirable fulfillment or only a partial fulfillment, at the GM's discretion.)
which pretty much opens the door to anything you can imagine if the DM allows it ... including lifting you (and your party etc.) out of an area under Dimensional Lock.
As for this bullet point specifically:
Quote:
Transport travelers. A wish can lift one creature per caster level from anywhere on any plane and place those creatures anywhere else on any plane regardless of local conditions. An unwilling target gets a Will save to negate the effect, and spell resistance (if any) applies.
Up to your GM. It's certainly reasonable to consider Dimensional Lock as a 'local condition' but it is also rather vague as to what is meant by local condition and whether Dimensional Lock qualifies is up to your GM. Personally I'd make you sweat a bit and allow a well worded Wish to transport you (and others) out of (or into) an area warded by Dimensional Lock.
I do not know of any FAQ clarifying further what is meant by local conditions nor do I find it likely there will be one made if that's what you mean by "officially addressed".
Why should this not be address by the faq then? It is a vague term which leaves room for misinterpretation which I think is easily fixable with a simple statement. I would love to know the intention of which effect trumps the other.
Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
blahpers wrote:
1. Depends on the wish. Is the caster duplicating a spell or attempting something more in line with older editions, such as "I wish I could enter that area"?
If the caster duplicates a spell, follow the rules for that spell. Duplicating a teleportation spell probably won't work, since dimensional lock specifically prevents such methods from working. Duplicating a dispel magic would have the same effect as simply casting dispel magic.
If the caster uses the "transport travelers" option, then it works; that spell is stated to work in spite of local conditions.
If the wish is something else that doesn't fall under the spell's bullet points, it's up to the GM. I'd probably allow it if the caster took any care as to the wording of the wish.
2. Yes. The spell description indicates that spell resistance applies.
May also depend on the power of a wish. Whether the wish power comes from a mortal spell or another source. It can also depend on the power of the dimension locking effect. A divine level forbiddance may very well be nigh impassable to anything less than mythic stature.
The phrase "regardless of local conditions" needs to be thought of in a very simple way: bad weather doesn't interfere with any other form of teleportation, so it must not be what they are talking about when they say "local conditions."
Similarly, you can go through the entire list of things which might be considered "local conditions" and find that basically none of them other than things that specifically mention being a hindrance to normal forms of teleportation could possibly be what they are referring to.
Could it be clearer? Yes, it could have specifically listed out every single effect that it happens to ignore and be updated any time a new effect/spell gets released to append that to the list.
Is it unclear? Not in the slightest. Nothing that can be defined as a "local condition" interferes with the travel of a Wish spell. Same result as the above list approach, but never requires any updating of the spell text to append new local conditions.
Why should this not be address by the faq then? It is a vague term which leaves room for misinterpretation which I think is easily fixable with a simple statement. I would love to know the intention of which effect trumps the other.
Fixing this one question with a simple statement would be, er, simple, but the nature of wish invites hundreds of similar questions that would need to be addressed separately. The spell is designed and intended to be versatile and open-ended--more so than any other spell in the game--, and open-ended areas of the rules require far more from the GM than simple, well-defined mechanics.
Why should this not be address by the faq then? It is a vague term which leaves room for misinterpretation which I think is easily fixable with a simple statement. I would love to know the intention of which effect trumps the other.
Fixing this one question with a simple statement would be, er, simple, but the nature of wish invites hundreds of similar questions that would need to be addressed separately. The spell is designed and intended to be versatile and open-ended--more so than any other spell in the game--, and open-ended areas of the rules require far more from the GM than simple, well-defined mechanics.
Again I think blahpers and thenobledrake have pretty much hit the nail on the head. It is deliberately vague to allow each GM to decide what it means for his campaign.
For me a non permanent spell effect is probably not going to fall under 'local conditions'. But that's just me. A couple of examples that I would consider as examples of 'local conditions':
The Underdark has regions which disallow teleportation magic over greater distances (at least the Underdark of Faerun and probably Oerth where the original "Descent into the Depths" series was placed).
Within a few hundred miles of the center of the Plane of Concordant Opposition (specifically thinking of the Planescape setting), but likely not within a 100 miles (as I recall the 'local conditions' to be stated in that setting).
Note the very campaign specific nature of these effects. Writing text to fit effects as potentially varied as these are is by necessity vaguely or perhaps broadly stated.
Defining local conditions is all that is needed. Stating it is any condition that may/could affect teleportation effects defines/fixes the biggest problem with the spell while leaving it still relatively vague. I don't see that as unnecessary.
Defining local conditions is all that is needed. Stating it is any condition that may/could affect teleportation effects defines/fixes the biggest problem with the spell while leaving it still relatively vague. I don't see that as unnecessary.
I am sorry if this sounds offensive, I don't mean for it to be. I simply cannot think of any other way to say this: It's a role-playing game, not a dictionary. It doesn't have to define every word it uses - just the ones it uses in a way not already defined in a dictionary.
I am sorry if this sounds offensive, I don't mean for it to be. I simply cannot think of any other way to say this: It's a role-playing game, not a dictionary. It doesn't have to define every word it uses - just the ones it uses in a way not already defined in a dictionary.
No offense taken. I understand, you disagree with my view. Thats perfectly acceptable. I agree an RPG doesn't need to define every word used. I also agree with your final statement, they need to define words used in a way besides how they are defined in a language. I just happen to think the term "local conditions" is so vague it warrants a little further definition. I find it too vague. It's fine for anyone to disagree I just hope the devs don't lol
Please note that Wish is 9th level, but Dimensional Lock is 8th. Since Wish does have the Transport Travelers choice, I think it's greater spell level should let it work.
Wish is not really a 9th level spell. It is a cast any 8th level spell you want out of a 9th level slot.
It also has a few other options for travel, healing, and stat boosts and items.
Dimensional lock blocks gate witch is the most powerful core travel spell.
Planetary teleport is non core travel option of that level an it is blocked.
Does the 25k allow it to do more then other 9th level effects with out DM fiat?
Local conditions would be things like a dead magic plane.
Can you wishport travelers you do not have LoS or LoE to?
