Support Bard Help (level 9) 15 point buy in


Advice


Ok i made a dwarf inquistior but the party may already have to much divide casting between the Alchemist the Oracle and the Paladin

Might need some Arcane in there so i thought as a backup to make a summoner, Witch or Bard

I know how to make a bar but not really Witch or summoner (No Syniest Summoner to much bad taste from the players from that)

So here we go
15 point buy
Gold: 46,000
Level 9
Traits 2 + 1 Campaign Trait
(See here for Campign )https://www.dropbox.com/s/6f7iu69mne9sjjb/Carrion%20Crown%20-%20Player%27s %20Guide.pdf

Also the way this dm and players play Arcane magic is dangerously mistrust any magic really but divide can hide their spells behind a prayer while a wizard can't

A bard might be best since a bard can hide most verbal compenants of magic behind song or playing her instrument

Dark Archive

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Human Bard
Str: 16, Dex: 14, Con: 12, Int: 8, Wis: 10, Cha: 14

Point buy puts you similar to a reach cleric build. You can use a long spear from behind or adjacent to the paladin and the reach will let you generate AoOs (hence the 14 dexterity). You can use your standard actions to buff the party, perform, spot heal, etc. Charisma is only moderate, as you won't need to have high DCs in order to make spells land if you focus on buffs. Put your level adjustments into Strength.

Feat Options: Combat Reflexes, Power Attack, Bodyguard, Discordant Voice(at level 11), Improved Initiative, Meta-magic

Weapons: Longspear and Sling. These are two simple weapons that allow you to utilize your high strength for damage and reach.

Bard Abilities: Versatile Performance: choose Dance and Sing. This will let you perform without instruments and gives you good bonuses to Acrobatics, Fly, Bluff and Diplomacy all from two skill points a level.

Items: Headband of Charisma +2, Belt of Strength +4, Longspear +2, Chain Shirt +2

This would be my recommendation for a solid start to a build.


I got one problem with that build how could someone dance and do all these great skills in speech even though he speaks a broken common with 8 intelligence


Also what spells to pick?


Meet Mr. Drillsargent:

Race: Human
Class: Bard (Arcane Duelist)
Level: 9th

STR: 13 (+1 @ 4th Level)
DEX: 16
CON: 12
INT: 12
WIS: 10
CHA: 13 (+1 @ 8th Level)

1st Human: Toughness
1st ADFix: Arcane Strike
1st Level: Flagbearer
2nd ADFix: Combat Casting
3rd Level: Dodge
5th Level: Lingering Performance
6th ADFix: Disruptive
7th Level: Weapon Focus (Rapier)
9th Level: Improved Init.

Banner of the Ancient Kings 18000 gp
Amulet of natural armor +1 2000 gp
Cloak of resistance +2 4000 gp
Chain shirt +1 1200 gp
Shield, light steel +1 1000 gp
Ring of Protection +1 2000 gp
Scimitar +1 2100 gp
Flagpool 0100 gp
Belt of giant strength +2 4000 gp

Spells:
________________

Level1:
Saving Finale
Dazzling Blade
Grease
See Alignment
Cure Light Wounds

Level2:
Glitterdust
Mirror Image
Silence
Cure Moderate Wounds

Level3:
Hast
Displacement

This build lifes from giving as high as possible bonus on bardic performance as possible. +5 Attack and damage with bardic performance.
Saving Finale as a nice save buff.

Combat look like this:
Round 1: Start bardic performance (move) + Cast spell (Mirror Image or Hast)
Round 2: If any opponent closes in and you think you can handle him ativate arance strike and full attack ...

Breiti

Liberty's Edge

Scaleclaw wrote:
I got one problem with that build how could someone dance and do all these great skills in speech even though he speaks a broken common with 8 intelligence

8 intelligence does not make you a bumbling idiot incapable of proper speech.

Dark Archive

I don't think front-lining with a "support" bard is a good call at all.

Aasimir make the best bards; simply because having a performance be level-increased is pretty huge. @level 9 you'll be giving out +3s (instead of +2s), and have a nice bump in Wis / Cha (or, with the right kind, Int / Cha).

So, here we go:

Ignan (The Int/Cha) Aasimar Archivist Bard
Str: 7 (yes, he's weak, but he studied too much. He doesn't really carry much around, but can hold himself up and carry around some books to read at least).
Int: 16
Wis: 10
Dex: 12
Con: 12 +2 for item = 14
Cha: 20 +2 for item = 22 (18 +2 level-ups)

Level up bonuses: 7 of the 9 go to +1/2 to level for Naturalist ability (I like it because it adds to AC and many keys saves, more useful than damage in many ways, especially at higher levels). 2 extra HP.

Skills:

About 2-3 ranks in each knowledge + Spellcraft (combined with his int and bardic knowledge, and ability to take 10 on all knowledge checks, that lets him offer a 22-23 to any knowledge check; or 4 times per day as a standard action a 33).

Disable Device, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Perception, Perform Oratory, UMD

1-to-2 ranks in random other useful skills (or flavorful skills).

Magic Items:
+2 Charisma Headband
+2 Con Belt
Ring of Invisibility
+3 Cloak of Resistance
Lesser Rod of extend (for heroisms)
Assorted wands of useful spells

Focuses on Perform (Oratory) so he will one day be able to grant free move-and-full round and sonic their weapons via feat. Feats should include swift aid.

Spells:
1) Feather Step, Saving Grace, Grease are the important ones
2) Heroism for each party member is mostly what you will use here, occasionally the Invictus is nice for a group debuff with no "real" save (though this turns you visible).
3) Haste a lot here; I like divining spells too. But mostly just be ready to haste each battle. Fly in case melees need it.

So this bard is the best face you can get, mostly focuses on being invisible and buffing others up (giving long speeches on the weaknesses of monsters). He never learned how to fight, so stays out of the way... but he loves to see new thing. Archivist removes the need for another rogue in tha party (he has trapsense), and he is good about talking to people about their defenses (once buffs are up, "Aid Another" for defense a lot to increase people's AC further).

There you go... flavorful, useful, and probably fun (if you like play smarty-pants Social characters :)).


what baout the traits?

Dark Archive

8 Intelligence does not mean you cannot speak your primary language with fluency. 8 is marginally below-average, just as 12 is marginally above average. This may mean that a character has slight issues with memory or that he was not educated as a child or some other such issue that is completely up to you, but he is not mentally handicapped.

Additionally, dancing or charming people is not related to Intelligence, which is why they are based on Charisma. Look at Forrest Gump. The man was not the brightest, but everyone loved him and he could play ping pong extremely well. Arguably, his Intelligence might have been lower than 8 but his Charisma would have been like 16+.


Scaleclaw wrote:
I got one problem with that build how could someone dance and do all these great skills in speech even though he speaks a broken common with 8 intelligence

Because 8 int isn't that low. Think of a dozen big name actors that didn't start in a high brow scene like Shakespearean acting. At least two of them have int 8 or less. They can dance and talk and in many cases perform intricately choreographed fight scenes just fine.


Breiti wrote:

Meet Mr. Drillsargent:

Race: Human
Class: Bard (Arcane Duelist)
Level: 9th

STR: 13 (+1 @ 4th Level)
DEX: 16
CON: 12
INT: 12
WIS: 10
CHA: 13 (+1 @ 8th Level)

1st Human: Toughness
1st ADFix: Arcane Strike
1st Level: Flagbearer
2nd ADFix: Combat Casting
3rd Level: Dodge
5th Level: Lingering Performance
6th ADFix: Disruptive
7th Level: Weapon Focus (Rapier)
9th Level: Improved Init.

Banner of the Ancient Kings 18000 gp
Amulet of natural armor +1 2000 gp
Cloak of resistance +2 4000 gp
Chain shirt +1 1200 gp
Shield, light steel +1 1000 gp
Ring of Protection +1 2000 gp
Scimitar +1 2100 gp
Flagpool 0100 gp
Belt of giant strength +2 4000 gp

Spells:
________________

Level1:
Saving Finale
Dazzling Blade
Grease
See Alignment
Cure Light Wounds

Level2:
Glitterdust
Mirror Image
Silence
Cure Moderate Wounds

Level3:
Hast
Displacement

This build lifes from giving as high as possible bonus on bardic performance as possible. +5 Attack and damage with bardic performance.
Saving Finale as a nice save buff.

Combat look like this:
Round 1: Start bardic performance (move) + Cast spell (Mirror Image or Hast)
Round 2: If any opponent closes in and you think you can handle him ativate arance strike and full attack ...

Breiti

How does this bard take Flagbearer? The prerequisite is Cha 15.


Scavion wrote:
How does this bard take Flagbearer? The prerequisite is Cha 15.

I took this from a pre build char of mine and changed the stats form point buy 20 to point buy 15. I forgot the requirments ...So the stats have to look like this:

STR: 14 DEX: 13 CON: 12 INT: 12 WIS: 10 CHA: 15

Breiti

Dark Archive

Also, you should look into the Spellsong feat because casting and performing aren't normally considered the same. This will let you perform your spells to deceive onlookers about your casting. Also, I'm not sure that divine casting is just saying a prayer. Most divine spells still have somatic components and would require a bit of hand-waving.


Ok so now the Traits.

and which to go with ack.

Dark Archive

Traits:

Adopted by halflings + Helpful is a win if you like the invisible-guy-aid-another-for AC route (you were abandoned to the earth and raised by halflings, who saw your divine gift and took them into their lives). +4 AC for that and +3 for your naturalist would mean most people = +7 vs any one attack each round.

Otherwise something that increases saves and +2 to Initiative. Or just pick something you like the flavor of. Traits don't matter as much for this build, so you can do as you want.


I get 2 traits + one of these traits http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/campaign-traits/carrion-crown


I get 2 traits + one of these traits http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/campaign-traits/carrion-crown

Ace and Train characters seem nice in 3.5 i normally played halfling bards i also heard gnomes have good racial traits as well.


I like this one quite a bit.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/traits/faith-traits/fate-s-favored
Get a Stone of Good Luck to really get alot of umph out of it.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/h-l/jinga sa-of-the-fortunate-soldier

For another +1 to AC from the trait.

Its just a really solid trait.


I love Thalin build but between a paladin a Orcle and a Alchmist who can cast cure spells do i really need them.

All i need is a spell list.

Looking at the campaign traits i think Chance savior wins

With Adopted and Helpful. i go with Thalin build but now the spell list is all i need now and i'm ready to go


Given you're apparently playing Carrion Crown I'm convinced by some of the builds in this thread.

Based on what you said, your party would benefit from inspire courage but are lacking in control. Damage is likely fine given the paladin and alchemist.

My suggestions:

1. Play a dirge bard, so your enchantments can effect the Undead
2. Play a primary caster bard, secondary buffer, tertiary flanking partner
3. Get Spell Focus Enchantment & Greater Spell Focus Enchantment, and load up on enchantments
4. Optimize your intimidate for Blistering Invective to debuff enemies to make it easier to land your enchantments. Normally bards would use versatile performance, but that's not an option for dirge bards, so instead put a skill point in intimidate every level, take skill focus:intimidate and perhaps the bully trait. This makes human or half elf desirable, although mused touch aasimar are also fantastic as previously mentioned.
5. Flag bearer + Banner of the Ancient Kings is very worth it
6. If people are suspicious of spellcasting like you said then Spellsong is a good feat.
7. Lots of choices for necromancy spells, but Ray of Enfeeblement/Exhaustion are both good debuffs
8. A lesser meta-magic rod of quicken is a good idea, so you can inspire courage, haste and good hope on round #1
9. Do get glibness, it's amazing for social encounters. If you have Spellsong you'll be able to get away with casting it when you shouldn't
11. Do take Discordant voice at 11
12. If you went human and took Focused Study, you might consider the arcane bloodline. It takes a while to come on line, but the extra +2 DCs to one school (enchantment) and the fast metamagic are very nice (you may want to pick up Heighten Spell to jack the DCs in boss fights)


Scaleclaw wrote:
A bard might be best since a bard can hide most verbal compenants of magic behind song or playing her instrument

Human Oracle1(Dual cursed)/Bard7(Animal Speaker)/Diabolist1

STR 07
INT 14
WIS 07
DEX 07
CON 14
CHA 22 (18+2racial+2bumps)

Traits: Irrepressible, Adopted: Halfling (Helpful)

Feats: Divine Scion, Extra Revelationsx2, Flagbearer, Spellsong, Antagonize

Oracle of Lore1: Lame and Legalistic

Character delivers knowledges, and face skills (via versatile performance).

The level of diabolist is up to taste, and you can go with bard8 instead easily enough.

-James


Let's put it this way i had a wizard he got killed by a giant octopus


A possible build might be: Human, Dirge Bard. Grab extra spells with the human favored class bonus. Your primary stat will be Charisma with Dex and Con next.

Traits: Up to you.
1. Focused Study (Intimidate, Knowledge Arcana, Perception)
1. Spell Focus: Enchantment
3. Greater Spell Focus: Enchantment
5. Flag bearer
7. Spellsong
9. Heighten Spell
11. Discordant Voice
13. Eldritch Heritage: Arcane
15. Improved Eldritch Heritage: Arcane - Metamagic Adept
17. Greater Eldritch Heritage: Arcane - Enchantment as school power

You probably want to pick up a couple of masterpieces:

1. Symphony of the Elysian Heart
2. Toccata and Fugue of the Danse Macabre

In combat you'd:
1. Put up buffs (Inspire, Good Hope, Haste), maybe Symphony of the Elysian Heart if needed
2. Use blistering invective for an AE intimidate debuff (if needed)
3. Use various enchantments for control and debuffs
4. Occasionally help somebody flank, although you really don't want to be in the frontlines where you can get interrupted easily.


Scaleclaw wrote:
Let's put it this way i had a wizard he got killed by a giant octopus

Then your party needs someone to deliver knowledge skills.

Also the bard's AC will be better than your old wizard's.

Beyond which.. who targets bards anyway? *wink*

-James


james maissen wrote:
Scaleclaw wrote:
Let's put it this way i had a wizard he got killed by a giant octopus

Then your party needs someone to deliver knowledge skills.

Also the bard's AC will be better than your old wizard's.

Beyond which.. who targets bards anyway? *wink*

-James

Well if the Dm didn't sent him away We would have a party wipe


I don't think front-lining with a "support" bard is a good call at all.

Aasimir make the best bards; simply because having a performance be level-increased is pretty huge. @level 9 you'll be giving out +3s (instead of +2s), and have a nice bump in Wis / Cha (or, with the right kind, Int / Cha).

So, here we go:

Ignan (The Int/Cha) Aasimar Archivist Bard
Str: 7 (yes, he's weak, but he studied too much. He doesn't really carry much around, but can hold himself up and carry around some books to read at least).
Int: 16
Wis: 10
Dex: 12
Con: 12 +2 for item = 14
Cha: 20 +2 for item = 22 (18 +2 level-ups)

Level up bonuses: 7 of the 9 go to +1/2 to level for Naturalist ability (I like it because it adds to AC and many keys saves, more useful than damage in many ways, especially at higher levels). 2 extra HP.

Skills:

About 2-3 ranks in each knowledge + Spellcraft (combined with his int and bardic knowledge, and ability to take 10 on all knowledge checks, that lets him offer a 22-23 to any knowledge check; or 4 times per day as a standard action a 33).

Disable Device, Diplomacy, Intimidate, Perception, Perform Oratory, UMD

1-to-2 ranks in random other useful skills (or flavorful skills).

Magic Items:
+2 Charisma Headband
+2 Con Belt
Ring of Invisibility
+3 Cloak of Resistance
Lesser Rod of extend (for heroisms)
Assorted wands of useful spells

Focuses on Perform (Oratory) so he will one day be able to grant free move-and-full round and sonic their weapons via feat. Feats should include swift aid.

Traits
Adopted by halflings + Helpful is a win

and probably Chance Savior on Campaign traits

Spells:
Level1:
Saving Finale
Dazzling Blade
Grease
See Alignment
Cure Light Wounds

Level2:
Glitterdust
Mirror Image
Silence
Cure Moderate Wounds

Level3:
Haste
Displacement
Scrying
Dispel Magic

Silver Crusade

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Scaleclaw wrote:


I don't think front-lining with a "support" bard is a good call at all.

Agreed. However, it's often quite helpful if the "support" bard inflicts considerable martial damage and exerts minor battlefield control through combat reflexes and reach, while still filling the traditional 'support' role. That's the essence of Ace's Reach bard build proposal, above. This sort of build inflicts front line damage while getting full spell casting (both at the same time), but can not take front line punishment. Thus, long-lived PCs of this template play a cautious tactical game.


yeah the paladin the front line bruiser who i've seen dish over 100 damage if the creature is evil with smite. in a single swing with her magical Maul she the front line punishment character.

The Orcle will buff people nd usually passively or slowly get involved usually with spells but will use his little mace if he has to.

The Alchmist Sneaks up behind people and is the "Flanker" of the party with sneak attacks and step up.

The Ranger usually stays back and shoots with his little long bow.


ok made the character into a sheet any problems?

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=687920

Dark Archive

You should put down "Archivist" as your class, unless you decided against my suggestion. It doesn't have versitile performance (thus why I did not tell you to put down more performances).

You need Heroism as a 2nd level spell. Trust me, the party will LOVE you, and it's great for you as well (saves and checks)... it's a +2 to hit and saving throws AND Skill checks. And incidentally, stacks with bard song. That rod of extend was made strictly so you can give 3 people 3 Heroisms that last 3 hours each (since it would normally last 90 minutes; it's quite a bargain).

I would strike Mirror Image, since you don't really care about self-buff protection (and are invisible anyway); that's more for a melee bard. For similar reasons, I would replace Displacement with Sculpt Sound... this actually enables full party stealth AT ALL TIMES, and makes sure that you are both invisible and silent (and lasts hours/level). If that's not enough, it doubles as a "save or cannot cast spells" to MULTIPLE casters at once (you can sculpt the sound where you don't make sound except for speaking for yourself... and for them sculpt the sound where they cannot cast spells... and with your charisma the save is DC 20). And finally, if there is an alarm someone is about to hit, you can actually make the alarm NOT WORK AT ALL, with no save on it (since it's an object). Like I said, versitile little spell :).

Here's the Archivist:

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/bard/archetypes/paizo---bard-a rchetypes/archivist

It's quite good for the knowledge checks (take 10 even in the heat of battles), and gains the rogue abilities to find traps. And that ability to grant +3 to Supernatural / EX abilities is amazing at high levels (since it affects things like dragon's breath and most monsters).

Finally, you do have to carry some kind of weapon (I use a dagger on my archivist). "Aid another" is an attack roll vs AC 10 (a masterwork dagger and, even with your strength penalty, you'll only need a "2" when you have bardsong up).


What exactly does Ring of invisiablity do does it charges on it or it is use x amount per day?

Also updated what am i missing now any imporments you can make?

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=687920 (I decided against knowledge religion since the pally and Oracle probably have that covered pretty well.

also any racial traits i should take or none?

i got Heavenborn in the sheet

Dark Archive

Ring of invisibility has no charges, it is unlimited use. So as long as you don't attack someone (or cast one of your offensive spells), you're invisible. Even if you do, the next round you can take a standard action to turn it back on. It's perfect for someone who is spending 95% of their time not affecting enemies. Buffs, bardsong, flanking, and doing "aid another" do not turn off your invisibility.

I do like a few "affect other spells (Sculpt Sound above; Blistering Invective is an amazing 2nd level spell that gives you a 1-turn dazzling display that also sets the opponent on fire if they fail their save), but mostly you just make sure your party is fighting on scales levels above where they would otherwise. When you cast one of those just make sure you back away from the monsters first.

Think about this:

You heroism the ranger and paladin (and yourself, so your skills are good) before battle. Their saves are +2, and they are +2 to hit.

You identify anyone who you see and Naturalist bardsong (with the Aasimir level bonus). That's +3 (@ 12th level +4) to their to hit, and against any saves vs Supernatural / Extrodinary abilities (basically any abilities that are not out-and-out spells). They also get that bonus to their Armor Class.

So the ranger / paladin are fighting at all times @ +5 to hit, will often be hasted, and you and they have +5 to saves (Oracle +3) vs most effects.

With 1 casting of Sculpt sound, you and the rest of your party actually move silenty through the dungeon (it lasts 9 hours for 1 casting). Now you can start setting up suprise. During battle you largely do your buff song and block specific attacks with Aid Another (and can use random wands a la UMD, like Enlarge Person is a nice cheap wand the Pally would love).

You're also a champion of out-of-combat (you're a "face", if you will).


Thalin wrote:

Ring of invisibility has no charges, it is unlimited use. So as long as you don't attack someone (or cast one of your offensive spells), you're invisible. Even if you do, the next round you can take a standard action to turn it back on. It's perfect for someone who is spending 95% of their time not affecting enemies. Buffs, bardsong, flanking, and doing "aid another" do not turn off your invisibility.

If you are going with Archivist, then you want to know one thing about your version of inspire courage (named 'Naturalist'):

This language-dependent ability requires visual and audible components.

While naturalist is AWESOME. It will not work on animals/summons if they don't understand your language. It also will not work if they cannot see you (either invis, stealth, or blocked line of sight).

Depending on what feat playroom you have, I still love a level of dual-cursed Oracle of Lore for such a build.

-James

Dark Archive

I was not aware there was a visual component to it; I'm glad I found that out before I got the level to do the invisibility trick myself. So I guess the more "vanilla" bard will have to do if you want to stay invisible. It's fine, the standard bard gets versitile perform (take Oratory, Dance, and Precussion would be a nice setup, max those skills); though the archivist is really good at high levels. You can always stay to the back I suppose; AC either needs to be really good or isn't relevant, and most monsters won't concentrate on "the bard" if they have other targets and you're not being that harmful (a buffer). It does prevent you from doing the aid another setup though, unless you want to do like I did and concentrate on AC (my build is actually a bodyguard-bard build with really good AC).

Actually, you may just enjoy my build-out. Here's how I would look at Level 9 as an archivist:

Dex / Chr Aasimar Archivist:

Str: 7
Int: 14 - 5
Wis: 12 - 2
Dex: 18 (20) - 10
Con: 12 (4) - 2
Chr: 20 (22) - 10

Same skill setup you basically have.

Mithril Benevolent +3 Chain Shirt (12K)
+2 Heavy Darkwood Shield (4270)
Masterworked cestus (300)
Headband of Charisma +2 (4000)
Belt of Dex / Con +2 (10K)
Lesser Metamagic Rod of Extend (3000)
Cloak of Resistance +1 (1000)
Ring of Protection +1 (2000)
Spellstrike Gloves (5000)
Wand of Enlarge Person
Wand of Cure Light Wounds

Feats:

1) Combat Reflexes
3) BodyGuard
5) Arcane Strike
7) Lingering Performance
9) Spell Song (this is for your campaign, since it essentially hides all spellcasting as a song. The ability to spend perforance rounds to concentrate is a nice touch). If you don't want this for campaign specific, I am planning on taking "Swift Aid" so I can give +1 to hit / +3 damage to yet another ally, in addition to everything else I am doing.

Adopted trait (Halfling) - Helpful Trait

Spells (important ones):
1) Saving Finale, Grease
2) Heroism, Blistering Invictus, Glitterdust
3) Haste, Sculpt Sound, Dispel Magic

So what do you do? Well, you're buffing up and "Naturalisting" everyone for +3 to everything while pointing out monster weaknesses.

You also can stand behind the front line and adding more to their AC. So with Helpful+SpellStrike Gloves+Body Guard, you roll an attack vs every attack that comes at one of your adjacent allies. If you do not roll a 1, you grant the Ally this bonus to AC:

+4 (Helpful)
+3 (Spellstrike Gloves)
+3 (Benevolent Armor)

For a total of +10 to their AC. Combine with Naturalist (which gives +3 to their AC) and they get +13 on top of what their AC is listed on thier character sheet. And if the monsters get frustrated and attack you, you can fight defensively (you'll need a 4+ to aid allies, but will have an AC of 31, which should be tough-to-impossible to hit).

For your action, you can either buff, debuff (Blisting Invictus / Sculpt Sound), or if you want to save spells, use that Helpful to aid another on attacks (that's +4 to hit for Helpful and +3 to damage from the Spellstrike Gloves).

Hope that helps :).


Would this help my party act getting so confused about all this. new dude to pathfinder. i just need a http://www.myth-weavers.com sheet i can understand for my game in 26 hours

I just need a character that will help my party greatly
Assimar Paladin (Uses a Maul as her main weapon and longsword and shield as secondary in tight spaces when reach is a problem, heavy bruiser and our tank)

Oracle, He can cause any monster or player to re roll a dice once a day, can buff himself to insane high ac but usually cast buffs like magical circle of protection against evil, Bless, Sprtial ally and if undead a big sunlight spell that one shots undead. ((If in combat he can only speak Celestral and DO NOT cast a heal spell on this guy he sorta like an undead but not really.

Alchmist- He got a tenticle for an extra limb can use Mutantians on other people, possess some spells has 5d8 sneak attack and step up feat, he usually the flanker of our group using his magical dagger to kill stuff

Urban ranger, he has no spells, uses a bow most of the time and has a horse for a companion.

What role to fill out that would balance this party ((Note the paladin is the only one with social skills and the paladin for the most part is roleplayed as a Stick up her butt B-I-T-C-H

I know for knowledge skills no one currently has dungeoneering at all

Divide spells: Alchemist and Paladin and Oracle has access to
Arcane: Alchemist (very limited)
Bruiser: Pally
Tank: Pally (Sword and shield guy could help)
Flanker: Alchemist
Buffer: Oracle
Tracking: Ranger
identifying: Alchemist and Oracle
Control: I don't see much here.
Magical Trap finding: No idea.

Dark Archive

You have an urban ranger; they actually have magical trapfinding so no need here.

To keep things easy for yourself:

*Stay with the original build that you have. Ring of Invisibility. Only difference is your bardsong will be the "Standard" type, with +3 to hit, damage, and saves vs. fear.

*Switch out all skill points in Diplomacy for skill points in Dancing. Use your "Versitile Perforance" for Perform Oratory and Dancing. This will give you +19 to several skills that are otherwise not charisma based (specically Sense Motive, Diplomacy, Acrobatics, and Fly), thanks to versitile perforance.

*"Sculpt Sound" is a 3rd level spell (move it there). Add "Blistering Invictus" as a 2nd level spell (intimidate all enemies within 30 feet; in addition they have to make a reflex save to not catch fire). Remove Dazzling Blade from 1st level spells, switch for Feather Step (handy spell). Switch "Displacement" for "Confusion" on the 3rd level spells.

*Don't worry about the whole "Aid Another" route; it's too complicated for 1st level.

So, here's your setup:

*Start of the dungeon in a dungeon setting (or any enclosed setting), extend Heroism (with extend from your rod) the ranger, and Paladin. That will give each of them +2 to hit / saves / skill checks. If you are certain it is a dungeon area / castle, use a non-extended one on yourself as well.

*Use the last extend to extend a Sculpt Sound on the party. Announce that the party does not make any noise at all except when they talk or if they fall (this will let you be able to locate fallen bodies and such). This should set up easy suprise rounds, even if the paladin walks around in full plate armor. This is at the beginning of every day; with Extend it lasts 18 hours, so unless you are sleeping you should be under the effect of this.

*At the start of each combat, use a move to begin the bardsong. You'll have the "Lingering Performance" feat, so after 1 round let it stop. Repeat this every 3rd round (every 3 rounds counts as 1 performance round for you; and since you get 25 rounds you should never, ever not have bardsong up). Make a little card that says "+3 to hit / +3 Damage / +3 saves vs fear" and put it up every time combat starts.

*If the combat seems easy enough you don't want to waste spells, use your Wand of Enlarge Person on the Paladin. It will give him major reach and increase his damage output greatly, and it's cheap to replace if you ever actually run out of charges.

*If there are lots of casters in a group, cast "Sculpt Sound", announcing they cannot make any noise. This is a Will Save DC 20 or be unable to cast. Go ahead and cast any fighting types around them too (so they can't sound alarms). It's pretty insane.

*Lots of big dumb fighty types? Cast confusion. Watch their line crumble.

*Otherwise, if the fight looks difficult go ahead and use a precious 3rd level spell to haste.

*Your best area-effect spell is blistering Invictus. You're +19 to intimidate, and rolling against (10+their hit dice+their wisdom), so often a "1" will get you a -2 to their to hit and saves. They also have to make a save or catch fire.

And that's it. You should have fun, you'll be the primary face our-of-combat (people like you :)). For feats I would go:

1) Lingering Performance
3) Spell Song (for this campaign, it's a way to say you NEVER look like you are casting spells. It has a residual effect that is useful if you get concentration spells too).
5) Spell Focus: Enchantment
7) Greater Spell Focus: Enchantment
9) Anything
11) Discordant Voice (Your bard song starts adding d6 to every attack; ranger will look like a god :)).

That's the "easy" route to playing the support bard.


What the level 9 feat hmmm?

Dark Archive

You can take a saving throw feat (or toughness), since those are most likely to be what will hurt you; Spell Penetration to increase the odds of affecting certain creatures with your spells, or Angelic Blood so @ Level 11 you can grow wings (via Angelic Wings feat) and be a flying, invisible bard (taking Discordant Voice @ 13). Finally, if you want to be a master of out-of-combat, take Skill Focus: Perform (Oratory). This gives you +3 to Perform (Oratory), Diplomacy, and Sense Motive (a la Versitile Performance). This will go up to +6 next level (giving you +26 to each of those skills).

The choice is yours; there's really no "wrong" answer.


alright can you help me put this on

http://www.myth-weavers.com

Dark Archive

Here are the basics put in (feel free to respend skills):

http://www.myth-weavers.com/sheetview.php?sheetid=688105

Your race is +2 on Spellcraft and Knowledge (Planes), and has resist (Electric, Cold, Acid) 5. You spent your favored class bonuses to enhance your inspire courage to +3. I did the "simple" thing and gave you some save feats and toughness to make you survive really well (invis + sculpt sound should stop most monsters from attacking you).


Alright thank you, i also had a thought on a fighter sword and shield but meh


If he's playing Carrion Crown why is anyone suggesting anything other than a Dirge Bard?


well what traits do you have?

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