Sohei Armor Flurry (FAQ Request)

[ArmouredMonk13]

Hello all,

This I have seen a few times around the forums, but from what I can find, hasn't been resolved. So
QuestionCan a Sohei Monk flurry while wearing light armor?

From what I can tell, the sides go something like this

For:The Sohei got armor proficiency, and the restriction is in the Proficiency section. Therefor, the armor proficiency should lead to getting to flurry in light armor.

Against:The Sohei doesn't say that it replaces armor proficiency, so you can't flurry in armor.

So, the question still stands, and hasn't been resolved through FAQ, even thought it is a (relatively) Frequently Asked Question. Also, if they can flurry in light armor, can they flurry in medium/heavy armor? Can they flurry with a shield?

Also, this being able to flurry in armor could give some interesting choices for some of the Monk PrCs.

Any new thoughts?

[Cheapy]

I agree that this is a frequently asked question.

The author has already stated his intention, although that carries no weight in PFS.

[MyTThor]

It hasn't been clarified by FAQ, but one of the devs (Jason Nelson?) has said the intent is not to let Sohei flurry in armor.

[Kazaan]

MyTThor wrote:

It hasn't been clarified by FAQ, but one of the devs (Jason Nelson?) has said the intent is not to let Sohei flurry in armor.

Not that "intent" did the Titan Mauler any good.

[James Risner]

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

For:The Sohei got armor proficiency, and the restriction is in the Proficiency section. Therefor, the armor proficiency should lead to getting to flurry in light armor.

These types of interpretations are definitely not what most people would read and understand.

The basic assertion is because the Archetype says "Weapon and Armor Proficiencies" that is somehow invalidates everything in the original ability even if it isn't related.

If you also extend this to the logical conclusion, then you also need to do this:

Core p58 wrote:

Bonus Feat: At 1st level, 2nd level, and every 4 levels thereafter, a monk may select a bonus feat. These feats must be taken from the following list: ... A monk need not have any of the prerequisites normally required for these feats to select them.

Is replaced by Sohei:

UC wrote:

Bonus Feats: A sohei may select mounted combat feats as bonus feats.

So you lose bonus feats at 1st, 2nd, and every 4. You lose being able to ignore prerequisites. You don't even know how you can select the bonus feats. So it is a no-op.

Plus the real kicker, is that it doesn't say "This replaces Weapon and Armor Proficiencies at 1st level" in the Archetype.

[MechE_]

Cheapy wrote:

I agree that this is a frequently asked question.

The author has already stated his intention, although that carries no weight in PFS.

Author clarification has always been enough for me. That said, it is a frequently asked question and probably should be answered as such. I've clicked the FAQ button.

[ArmouredMonk13]

James Risner wrote:

These types of interpretations are definitely not what most people would read and understand.

The basic assertion is because the Archetype says "Weapon and Armor Proficiencies" that is somehow invalidates everything in the original ability even if it isn't related.

Perhaps, but it that doesn't mean it isn't a Frequently Asked Question that has many times before been asked, but hasn't been answered. Now, if it had said this replaces normal weapon and armor proficiency, there wouldn't be an FAQ, because it would be clear. As Is, it makes people wonder the purpose of light armor proficiency. In fact, when I first read the archetype, I (and others I know)thought that the archetype intended for you to flurry in armor.

[DarkPhoenixx]

Another example of replacing "Weapon and Armor Proficiency" bull... Its not 1 feature, its numerous different feats clumped together.

[blahpers]

Kazaan wrote:

MyTThor wrote:

It hasn't been clarified by FAQ, but one of the devs (Jason Nelson?) has said the intent is not to let Sohei flurry in armor.

Not that "intent" did the Titan Mauler any good.

Not to derail too far, but how did that play out? What was the intent versus the ruling?

[LoneKnave]

The intent was that the Titan mauler gets to use progressively bigger and bigger weapons.

The outcome is that he can not, he only mitigates the penalties for a weapon 1 size larger than him.

[James Risner]

LoneKnave wrote:

The intent was that the Titan mauler gets to use progressively bigger and bigger weapons.

Which comes down to a problem, as that ability would have been far too good. So the concept of doing that was dropped on the cutting room floor.

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

I (and others I know)thought that the archetype intended for you to flurry in armor.

This comes down to reading the rules in a permissive vs non-permissive way. There are hundreds of "well it doesn't say I can't do this uber awesome thing, so that means I can right?" ways to read a rule. Most of them are not intended. Some of them have FAQ. But they probably won't ever address all of them. So switching to the "it must say I can" way of thinking is best.

For example, Magic Missile allows for multiple targets. Pretend that they intended you to hit multiple targets, but they didn't include the following rule "if you shoot multiple missiles, you can have them strike a single creature or several creatures."

In a permissive reading, you would conclude that can you can hit multiple because it doesn't say you can't. But the rules are written for the most part in a non-permissive way. So generally they tell you when you can do something.

[Kazaan]

blahpers wrote:

Kazaan wrote:

Not that "intent" did the Titan Mauler any good.

Not to derail too far, but how did that play out? What was the intent versus the ruling?

The intent was that a Titan Mauler would eventually progress through larger weapons, eventually able to wield even colossal weapons. However, the devs apparently thought it was unbalanced (and probably unrealistic) so they changed the original wording he submitted, such that the Massive Weapons ability only affects the penalty to attack rolls, but not the handiness step-up. For example, if you (as a medium creature) wielded a Large Longsword, you'd treat it as a 2-h weapon rather than a 1-h weapon. If you wanted to wield a Large Greatsword or a Huge Longsword, it's impossible since the step-up goes "above" 2-h. So the Titan Mauler, with Massive Weapons, is able to wield a Large Longsword as a 2-h weapon or a Huge Dagger as a 2-h weapon, but nothing beyond that. The devs confirmed this ruling via FAQ, that Massive Weapons indeed does not allow you to bypass the handedness step-up as many presumed it did. There are other abilities that use different wording; that they let you ignore "penalties" rather than "penalties to your attack roll". Examples include the Tiefling Large Limbs alternate race feature as well as the Redcap monster. The Redcap, specifically, is the exception that proves the rule; it is a Small creature with an ability that lets it wield weapons sized for Medium creatures "without penalty" and its stat block gives it a Medium Scythe. Scythes are 2-h weapons so normally, the step-up for a Small creature would prohibit it from wielding it but the Redcap is able to use it regardless; ergo, "without penalty" means both the attack roll penalty as well as the handiness change penalty. It also only applies to a single size of weapons; medium. So if the Redcap were to try wielding a Large weapon, it gets absolutely no benefit and would be limited to light weapons which can be wielded as 2-h weapons along with -4 attack penalty.

Regarding Sohei, even though the intent may have been for you to have to choose between either light armor or flurry, that just seems like a poor choice to me. From my analysis of other archetypes that change weapon and armor proficiency, both piecemeal and wholesale, I've come to the conclusion that the way Sohei's change reads should be taken as a wholesale replacement of the whole block; basically remove the original wholesale and replace it with the new block which doesn't include the usual prohibition against flurrying with armor. What I conclude from this is that a Sohei can not only flurry in light armor, but could even flurry in medium or heavy armor (though, proficiency with those armors is a separate issue entirely).

[ArmouredMonk13]

You know, thinking about this either flurry or armor choice, it doesn't seem like much of a choice. In armor, a monk is a 3/4 BaB class with only a minor bonus to attack and damage rolls, while also rolling with a d8 HD, only 4+Int skills a level, and not much else going for you other than a really cool mount (if you buy one), and a high init.

[ArmouredMonk13]

DarkPhoenixx wrote:

Another example of replacing "Weapon and Armor Proficiency" bull... Its not 1 feature, its numerous different feats clumped together.

I disagree. Weapon and Armor proficiency (for a monk at least) is more than just a bunch of feats clumped together.

Monk Weapon and Armor Proficiency wrote:

Weapon and Armor Proficiency: Monks are proficient with the club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shortspear, short sword, shuriken, siangham, sling, and spear.

Monks are not proficient with any armor or shields.

When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, a monk loses his AC bonus, as well as his fast movement and flurry of blows abilities.

The bolded bit shows that it clearly is a class feature that limits your options as a monk. Now, in AC bonus and fast movement it states that you can't use the ability in armor, but in FoB, it doesn't, indicating that, at least for a monk, weapon and armor proficiency is more than feats clumped together.

[Mojorat]

Except, the line about flurry of blows is not connected to the line about proficiency. They are seperate statements. Changing one does not change the other.

[Samasboy1]

I think we can all agree that many archetypes are not written clearly. So the first thing is better proof-readers to make sure these (many different) situations stop coming up.

Secondly, while I understand some people accept the author's statement of intent, that isn't errata. You could write a rule with one intent, but it actually producing the opposite effect. There is a way to fix this, errata, not just a writer's opinion. Because one the company pays the writer and publishes the rule, the writer's opinion is just an opinion.

Permissive vs. Restrictive reading causes legitimate differences in opinion. I agree reading things too permissively can cause problems, but no more than reading to restrictively.

[Durinor]

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

You know, thinking about this either flurry or armor choice, it doesn't seem like much of a choice. In armor, a monk is a 3/4 BaB class with only a minor bonus to attack and damage rolls, while also rolling with a d8 HD, only 4+Int skills a level, and not much else going for you other than a really cool mount (if you buy one), and a high init.

I really don't understand the point in giving the sohei an armour proficiency if they can't use their monk abilities while wearing it.

[ArmouredMonk13]

Durinor wrote:

I really don't understand the point in giving the sohei an armour proficiency if they can't use their monk abilities while wearing it.

Neither can I, which is why I originally thought the Sohei was meant to let you flurry in armor. In fact, a Sohei in armor (if he can't flurry), I think might be less viable than a Master of Many Styles in armor (since he can use his really cool style fuse thingy still).

[ArmouredMonk13]

Anybody think that a Sohei Armor Flurry would be broken? I mean, you still won't have a bunch going for you, other than brawling armor becomes more practical if you still want to use unarmed strikes on this build, so you really will be just better than some (but thanks to Zen Archer, not all) monks, in that you are less wisdom-dependent (still need it for ki though).

[Wormser]

Not everything can be perfectly congruent in pathfinder. That is a side effect of having multiple individuals working in a simultaneous development situation with diffused control of the final product(think Apple vs Android environment). Accept that there will be situations where an individual class or archetype has inconsistent features. Your best bet if you would like that feature is to ask the devs to make an explicit break in the rules. This has been done before as I have just found that out with the Qinggong archetype. Since the Qinggong monk allows you to modify almost every ability, it would normally not be allowed to be combined with other archetypes. However, the devs have made an explicit exception where you can combine the Qinggong with all other archetypes by treating the Qinggong modifications as secondary to the other archetypes. You can ask for such an exception with Sohei and flurry

[Mojorat]

From what i understand the light armour is intended to help sohei that choose a lower wisdom. Additionally, many of the weaponsusable by tge sohei cannot be flurried with until 6thlevel.

So, say my goal was to make a sohei that was more around the horse stuff or say a naginata. I can wear the light armour etc then maybe change when 6th.

In general i find its best to go with a non permsive reading unless that reading clashes with comon sense.

That said i dont see issues with flurrying in /light/ armour. But the goal of most of the flurry in armour folks are probably aim8ng for plate.

[James Risner]

Wormser wrote:

You can ask for such an exception with Sohei and flurry

Which I don't think will every happen, as it goes against the "concept" of what Flurry is. It isn't something you do when loaded down with armor (even light armor.)

Allowing it here would be out of the norm and would cause confusion at tables where base Monks would get it because everyone remembered the Sohei got it.

[ArmouredMonk13]

James Risner wrote:

It isn't something you do when loaded down with armor (even light armor.)

Yes, because Wearing 4lb robes is totally being loaded down. I don't get why the flurry couldn't be allowed in light armor anyway. I mean, yeah, I think a full plate flurry would be cheesy, but some light armor doesn't really restrict you that much.

[LoneKnave]

Your name is the ArmouredMonk and you think flurrying in full plate would be cheesy?

To say nothing of the fact that a fighter can just pick up TWF and improved unarmed strike and do it anyway. Well... may need to dip until he gets still mind and monastic legacy, but you get my drift.

[ArmouredMonk13]

LoneKnave wrote:

Your name is the ArmouredMonk and you think flurrying in full plate would be cheesy?

To say nothing of the fact that a fighter can just pick up TWF and improved unarmed strike and do it anyway. Well... may need to dip until he gets still mind and monastic legacy, but you get my drift.

Well, having known just how heavy and hard to maneuver in full plate actually is, yeah, it would be completely unrealistic (though thinking about it, casting ray of frost would be rather silly too IRL). The fighter thing is a good point though, as long as you are OK with wasting more than half of your feats (as a fighter) in getting all of the useful TWF feat trees and the fighter focus/spec stuff with unarmed strike.

[LoneKnave]

To match the Monk you need the two-three TWF feats (third is a waste, imo), improved unarmed, (which you get from your MoMS dip you'll take to lvl 3 or 4 for Still Mind to get-) Monastic legacy.

You put on your Mithral Full Plate of speed and don't even waste any of your DEX bonus to AC :)

Combine with Brawler Fighter for maximum effectiveness. If my calculations are correct, you don't even lag behind the monk unarmed damage (in fact, you should be surpassing it, thanks to delicious feats and brawler-training).

PS.: Dunno what kind of fullplate you were wearing but I could move around in mine just fine. If anything, my pants made kicking harder than the armor did...

[ArmouredMonk13]

@LoneKnave:You also need double slice and the ability to TWF with one Sansetsukon (or eventually, naginata). Also, I think that asking for flurry in all armor is a tad ambitious. Now, don't get me wrong, if they say that you can flurry in all armor, my sohei/fighter won't scream cheese when I buy him full plate. But I am certain SOMEONE would.

[James Risner]

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

But I am certain SOMEONE would.

Yep, cause I'd scream if someone is using Light armor and Flurry.

[ArmouredMonk13]

James Risner wrote:

Yep, cause I'd scream if someone is using Light armor and Flurry.

raises eyebrow?

Really? Even if they said that a Sohei (or other archetype) could flurry in armor if/when this gets a response? Or are you directly opposed to flurrying in a caster big belt or 4lb robes?

[mdt]

Gunman's Duster
Corset of Dire Witchcraft
Snakeskin Tunic

All are body slot not Armor Slot. All grant Armor Bonus (Corset/Duster 4 AC, Snakeskin +1 AC and +2 Dex resulting in +1 AC). None have a restriction on the dex bonus to AC, and all work with both a regular monk and a sohei.

So, save up, work your way up.

[ArmouredMonk13]

mdt wrote:

Gunman's Duster

Corset of Dire Witchcraft
Snakeskin Tunic

All are body slot not Armor Slot. All grant Armor Bonus (Corset/Duster 4 AC, Snakeskin +1 AC and +2 Dex resulting in +1 AC). None have a restriction on the dex bonus to AC, and all work with both a regular monk and a sohei.

So, save up, work your way up.

I know there are other body slot items that give AC bonuses like armor does. Heck, there are these nifty bracers of armor that give armor bonuses and use the (I believe) wrist slot. But that doesn't answer the question of Can a sohei flurry in armor. And it just means that a Monk has to have more cash and magic items to pump AC then a fighter (who can buy any armor in the book that he fancy's). And if they decide that a sohei can't flurry in armor, means that a sohei's light armor proficiency denys him one of his core class mechanics (kind of like giving a wizard/sorcerer archetype tower shield proficiency without giving them the ability to ignore the ASF if you ask me).

[LoneKnave]

Quote:

@LoneKnave:You also need double slice and the ability to TWF with one Sansetsukon (or eventually, naginata)

Err, why? I can see Double slice (one more feat, a pretty ignorable one at that if you just get Agile fist amulet), but why the other two? Because Sohei can? For the record, the fighter will still deal more damage with those since he has 1,5 bonus instead of just 1xSTR.

[ArmouredMonk13]

LoneKnave wrote:

Err, why? I can see Double slice (one more feat, a pretty ignorable one at that if you just get Agile fist amulet), but why the other two? Because Sohei can? For the record, the fighter will still deal more damage with those since he has 1,5 bonus instead of just 1xSTR.

Because you said to match a monk, and a monk can do that.

Also, the "fighter does more damage with +1.5", that is across 4 attacks. So assuming all hit for the fighter, that is essentially Strx6. With the Monk across 7 attacks with just 1xstr, you get strx7 if all hit. 8 if he burns a ki pool point.

Now, you do make a good point that a fighter could devote resources to mimic a monk. I agree that a fighter could make a better (DPS wise) monk. BUT, fighter still doesn't get all the cool monk stuff. I also agree that full-plate flurry wouldn't be UBER-cheese, but I think that it would be a bit more mild cheddar cheese due to the fact that the author said it wasn't his intent.

[mdt]

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

mdt wrote:

Gunman's Duster

Corset of Dire Witchcraft
Snakeskin Tunic

All are body slot not Armor Slot. All grant Armor Bonus (Corset/Duster 4 AC, Snakeskin +1 AC and +2 Dex resulting in +1 AC). None have a restriction on the dex bonus to AC, and all work with both a regular monk and a sohei.

So, save up, work your way up.

I know there are other body slot items that give AC bonuses like armor does. Heck, there are these nifty bracers of armor that give armor bonuses and use the (I believe) wrist slot. But that doesn't answer the question of Can a sohei flurry in armor. And it just means that a Monk has to have more cash and magic items to pump AC then a fighter (who can buy any armor in the book that he fancy's). And if they decide that a sohei can't flurry in armor, means that a sohei's light armor proficiency denys him one of his core class mechanics (kind of like giving a wizard/sorcerer archetype tower shield proficiency without giving them the ability to ignore the ASF if you ask me).

My point was just that if they can't flurry in armor, they can still get these non-armor items at higher levels where the flurry will mean more (IE: When they can flurry with their weapon). So, armor at lower levels, switch at higher. Again, I think RAW (whether RAI or not) they can flurry in armor, but even should the FAQ come down the other way (and who knows how it'll come down, some really weird FAQs lately), there's options.

[James Risner]

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

Sohei could flurry in armor if/when this gets a response?

Never fear, as I'd bet you dinner it doesn't get a reply that it is allowed ;-)

[ArmouredMonk13]

This post is on a bit of a tangent, but if a sohei has improved shield bash, and weapon training (close) can he flurry with a shield and get the bonus to AC?

I mean, even if they say that sohei armor flurry is illegal, you aren't using the shield as a shield, you are using it as a weapon. Further more the Weapon Training I think (and at this point it may just be my opinion alone) saying you can flurry with any weapon you have weapon proficiency with (which MAY* override normal flurry since specific>general). A shield is a legitimate martial weapon, so if you burn the 2feats (Shield Proficiency and Imp. Shield Bash) could you?

Not very related, and nothing I am going to defend very far (I don't think that a shield bashing monk is worth the fight over), just a thought.

*I admit this is a stretch.

[kaisc006]

I've read the author's intent but I think what makes people so confused over it is they can't find any reason why a monk would wear light armor if they cannot flurry. Sure they become less MAD, but they are losing out on the biggest damage feature of the class AND the entire point of being a Sohei which is flurrying with a weapon group. Personally I feel they should be allowed to flurry in light armor. It would make the Sohei a warranted archetype.

[ArmouredMonk13]

kaisc006 wrote:

I've read the author's intent but I think what makes people so confused over it is they can't find any reason why a monk would wear light armor if they cannot flurry. Sure they become less MAD, but they are losing out on the biggest damage feature of the class AND the entire point of being a Sohei which is flurrying with a weapon group. Personally I feel they should be allowed to flurry in light armor. It would make the Sohei a warranted archetype.

+1 I couldn't agree more.

In fact, the only reason I could see for a sohei to wear armor is to wear a mithral chain shirt+AAT and be a sorcerer/sohei/eldritch knight. And even then, it would be inferior because you could instead ditch the chain shirt and get your casting (and quite probably highest) stat to AC if you just were to be an empyreal sorcerer.

[James Risner]

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

you aren't using the shield as a shield, you are using it as a weapon.

Sigh. I'm not sure if your joking or serious.

So I'll assume you are joking, and just laugh off the suggestion with "of course you are still wearing a shield"

kaisc006 wrote:

they can't find any reason why a monk would wear light armor if they cannot flurry.

So my 4th Fighter 1/Monk 3 in PFS with Full Plate doesn't get Flurry and doesn't care. If you ask him why he will say "I want the Monk bonus feats and skils, so I don't need the Flurry."

Just because you can't think of a reason, doesn't mean there are no reasons. It is sad that they gave us options and you take those options as meaning you get to ignore a penalty without a specific rule stating the penalty no longer applies.

[LoneKnave]

But... you get the same amount of bonus feats as fighter + an improved unarmed strike... but you could get that from the unarmed fighter ACF without giving up a BAB (and again, having the same number of extra feats)... I mean, I guess you ignore prereqs? But why take 3 levels? Why not take a monk ACF that replaces Flurry anyway (like the excellent MoMS)? What is even the point of all this aside from showing off that you can make a choice that nobody who thinks about it a bit harder would?

[ArmouredMonk13]

James Risner wrote:

"of course you are still wearing a shield"

Halfling in robes walks (and little to your knowledge, with catch-off guard) up to your fighter/monk with a shield in both his hands and smacks him in the gut screaming "Challenge Accepted"

You don't have to be wearing a shield to attack with it, you just need to smack someone with it. Still, fair enough, that was a bit too much of a stretch I admit.

[kaisc006]

James Risner wrote:

So my 4th Fighter 1/Monk 3 in PFS with Full Plate doesn't get Flurry and doesn't care. If you ask him why he will say "I want the Monk bonus feats and skils, so I don't need the Flurry."

Just because you can't think of a reason, doesn't mean there are no reasons. It is sad that they gave us options and you take those options as meaning you get to ignore a penalty without a specific rule stating the penalty no longer applies.

I'm not sure what type of argument you are making here... You are using a multi-class build which gives you better than light armor prof. to begin with and somehow using that to justify the Sohei gaining light armor prof. Did you multiclass with Sohei? If so why simply for the bonus feats/skills? There are far better combinations for monk dips such as Monks of Many Style ect.

What I'm saying is if the monk cannot wear light armor and flurry, then there is zero incentive for the monk to wear light armor since the whole MAD stat argument is an odd one. Monks are not a MAD class to begin with, people simply choose to play them as such.

[james maissen]

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:

So

QuestionCan a Sohei Monk flurry while wearing light armor?

Any new thoughts?

An old one:

The way of writing archetypes (like they are errata to a class) is a horrid way of doing so.

Forget the flurry question for a second (which RAW has the answer: yes, and the RAI by author answer: no).

Ask yourself this: what bonus feats can they take?

-James

[ArmouredMonk13]

james maissen wrote:

Ask yourself this: what bonus feats can they take?

Interesting question, perhaps enough for another thread. As it stands, I think the flurry in armor should stand as the primary FAQ question, so it can be answered (as a few other threads got derailed and never got an answer I believe). There is as much RAW going for it (the weapon/armor proficiency replaces normal) as there is against it (the weapon/armor proficiency doesn't replace normal).

[James Risner]

LoneKnave wrote:

same amount of bonus feats as fighter + an improved unarmed strike

why take 3 levels?

While the same number of feats, it was required to meet prereqs, and my 5th level will be Fighter 2 and that makes 7th level Fighter 4 so I can retrain a feat and get a total of 3 feats at 7th that all have BAB+6. In other words, I couldn't do the build and meet the required feats without 3 levels of Monk with or without Flurry.

[LoneKnave]

Still, why not pick MoMS that replaces flurry with something you can actually use?

[James Risner]

LoneKnave wrote:

Still, why not pick MoMS that replaces flurry with something you can actually use?

I wanted more feats, so I took Weapon Adept. I hadn't looked at my sheet earlier in this and had forgotten it also gives me Weapon Focus and Perfect Strike. MoMS conflicts with Weapon Adept due to Perfect Self.

[Rynjin]

kaisc006 wrote:

Monks are not a MAD class to begin with, people simply choose to play them as such.

I'd be interested in seeing your logic here.

Unless you willfully give up your main class features (if so, why are you playing a Monk instead of some other class?) or using an archetype without them in the first place, you can't wear armor.

Without armor, a Monk needs Wis to stay even close to competitive in AC.

So, unless you're going for a Dex build (something that won't come together any time soon, really), you need Str/Dex/Con/Wis to FUNCTION, much less thrive.

And with a Dex build, you have a whole slew of other problems, starting with having to play 4 levels before you can stop being a gimped character who relies on his party to keep his skinny ass alive.

[Nefreet]

I've never thought the Sohei could flurry in armor, but I clicked the FAQ anyways. If they could, I bet you the supply of +1 Mithral Brawling Chain Shirts across Golarion would sell out overnight.

[Rynjin]

Nefreet wrote:

I've never thought the Sohei could flurry in armor, but I clicked the FAQ anyways. If they could, I bet you the supply of +1 Mithral Brawling Chain Shirts across Golarion would sell out overnight.

It'd be about time at least some small portion of the Monk (the class based around Unarmed Combat) could benefit from the Unarmed boosting armor enchantment.

Just kinda sad it would be for the archetype that is supposed to be more about weapons than Unarmed Strikes.