Sound Striker - Wierd Words Ability questions


Rules Questions

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Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.
James Risner wrote:
TGMaxMaxer wrote:

Cr 6+, you have to factor DR in

can't use bardsong buffs / Can't use arcane strikewith them

I've done the number on DR previously in this thread and they really don't change the average all that much. Unless your GM likes using only monsters with DR as opposed to spreading the love out over the various CR appropriate monsters.

It's been shown how to do Bard Songs with this that I didn't know at the time, and Arcane Strike does work per logic (and per SKR.)

Devilkiller wrote:
Back in down in the realm of less optimized PCs without race specific buff spells I'd guess damage would be more like 1d8+13. That's based on +8 Charisma and +3 for Arcane Strike
Which race specific are you talking about? The trait for +1 gained via Adopted trait? Good Hope isn't a race specific buff tho, just the trait. But sure, I guess if you could use +13 damage for the lowest level of optimization. I just don't know how many people play at the lowest setting.

This was in reference to James's recounting of his Sound Striker in a PvP contest, using the Nymph specific spell to boost Charisma, IIRC.


I thought James was using some spell from ARG, but if it wasn't to boost Charisma or damage maybe it wasn't that significant. Anyhow, I think that while most folks (or at least many folks) could agree that allowing 10 Words on one target would be overpowered many folks also feel that the version of the ability PDT left us is very lackluster compared to other things you might do with a standard action.

A single Word doesn't do enough damage to make it a good option in many situations. That's why I'd been suggesting a 3 Word version of the power. Even two Words would be twice as good as one though. The spirit of compromise is that both sides have to give something, not that one side has to stonewall the other until they dejectedly desist the debate. Of course the abilities being given up by the Sound Striker are fairly petty, so maybe even a limited version of Weird Words would seem like too much to get in exchange. A rewrite of the entire archetype might help balance it better, but that's even less likely than just a tweak to Weird Words itself.

I guess that in the long run having a Bard archetype with one lackluster ability and another useless ability doesn't ruin the game or anything. It is just a disappointment for those interested in idea of a Bard who deals damage with words or musical notes. Honestly I'd rather see Paizo be more rather than less conservative regarding touch attack powers, but I'd expect that any real fixes to the touch attack mechanic would come at a system wide level instead of by monkeying around with individual spells and abilities.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

kinevon wrote:
using the Nymph specific spell to boost Charisma, IIRC.

I think they may mean Nereid's Grace which is Undines and provides a Deflection bonus to AC equal to Charisma bonus.


Ok, if it was for an AC boost that's relevant to the overall PC but not really to Weird Words - sorry for the confusion!


Weird Words doesn't give up patty abilities though, unless you keep them out of context of their use. Fascinate/Suggestion are very, very powerful abilities, but they are best used out of combat as combat will make them useless.

"Put this in the King's meal."
"Open up your vault."
"Leave your guardpost."
"Reveal the secret chamber."

Suggestion can be used to totally mess up social encounters or turn combat encounters into non-combat ones when stealthing. But, again, as a combat ability, Fascinate and Suggestion are very lack luster. Sound Striker trades social dominance for more combat prowess.


I think combat is generally considered much more important than non-combat. Anyhow, a Bard without the Suggestion ability can easily dominate social situations in other ways such as perhaps the 2nd level Suggestion spell. On the other hand, the ability to fire off ranged touch attacks for megadamage (or hardly any damage with the PDT version) is something typically outside of the Bard's repertoire until the Deafening Song Bolts spell comes online at 13th level.


What about at higher levels (say 15?)allowing Weird Words to work as a swift action? Damage stays the same as was recommended by PDT, perhaps limit how many during a swift action, but it keeps the ability relevant and doesn't seem overpowered for damage.


15th level is too long to wait for something like that. Just allowing Weird Words to be performed with the normal action type for a bardic performance would make it more appealing though. I think Paizo was concerned that getting to inflict damage as a move or swift action would be too strong, but really I think it would be fine with the amount of damage being inflicted here.

There was a separate question a while back about whether you can start multiple bardic performances during a single turn. If you can't then a swift action Weird Word would be a fun option which makes the Sound Striker a little more interesting. If you can then you'd more or less have the 3 Words I'd been suggesting (which is another reason I settled on 3). I suspect that the former would be closer to the power balance PDT wanted for this ability.

Grand Lodge

Bump....


*cough, cough*


If there was any money in fixing old content, I am sure this would have been done years ago.

Sadly there is roughly zero money in fixing old content, so you might as well \give up


1 person marked this as a favorite.
CWheezy wrote:

If there was any money in fixing old content, I am sure this would have been done years ago.

Sadly there is roughly zero money in fixing old content, so you might as well \give up

I dunno, I seem to have acquired a large amount of confidence that Paizo will nerf this and other fun, flavorful abilities into the ground.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

Tels wrote:
large amount of confidence that Paizo will nerf this and other fun, flavorful abilities into the ground.

I don't know about whether or not Paizo will issue Errata to make it clear how they wanted us to read it is being read to match, but I'm issuing Errata for the PVP Gencon event. I won last year using the "not how it was intended to be interpreted" way to interpret Sound Striker, and I'll be GMing this year's version. ;-)


I was surprised to see this thread active again. Maybe kinevon felt that since it seems like old FAQs are being changed it might be a good time to bump Weird Words up into PDT's awareness again.

While PDT's intent was evident it might be nice to get an official FAQ answer so that players and DMs seeking guidance on Weird Words will be able to find it in the Ultimate Magic FAQ instead of slogging through this thread for something semi-official.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

Devilkiller wrote:
find it in the Ultimate Magic FAQ instead of slogging through this thread for something semi-official.

I'd love that. But for some reason this topic isn't "sexy" because we have 133 FAQ and no love, yet things with 20 FAQ get answers.


Devilkiller wrote:

I was surprised to see this thread active again. Maybe kinevon felt that since it seems like old FAQs are being changed it might be a good time to bump Weird Words up into PDT's awareness again.

While PDT's intent was evident it might be nice to get an official FAQ answer so that players and DMs seeking guidance on Weird Words will be able to find it in the Ultimate Magic FAQ instead of slogging through this thread for something semi-official.

I doubt we'll get a FAQ because this is basically a re-write of the whole archetype. If anything happens with this, it will be errata done during a re-print.

Grand Lodge

Every time there are a number of FAQs, this thread seems to get active again.

Nobody can really agree how it all works, so I understand.

Also, paizo may be looking for a way to change that, with the littlest amount of changes, as to make it actually possible to put into further printings.

That seems like a hard thing to do with this.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

Maybe that is what we could do. Get a character count of the old ability and start making various versions of "new" versions of the same or less word count.

Grand Lodge

Devilkiller wrote:

I was surprised to see this thread active again. Maybe kinevon felt that since it seems like old FAQs are being changed it might be a good time to bump Weird Words up into PDT's awareness again.

While PDT's intent was evident it might be nice to get an official FAQ answer so that players and DMs seeking guidance on Weird Words will be able to find it in the Ultimate Magic FAQ instead of slogging through this thread for something semi-official.

Wasn't me. My bump was back in November. Tels bumped it this time. I gave up, and have just spent the PP and gold to rebuild my PFS Bard back to a non-Archetyped Bard.

At least he was only 5th level, so only 5 PP to retrain the one swapped ability.

Of course, if I ever get to play or run The Ruby Phoenix Tournament again, and it may happen, it would be nice to know how to handle that one combat with the group of Sound Striker Bards....

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

My bard is about to retire after Of Kirin and Kraken, and possibly one more 7-11 that has yet to be announced. Hard to say. Either way, I won't have to worry about this FAQ anymore.

Grand Lodge

James Risner wrote:
Maybe that is what we could do. Get a character count of the old ability and start making various versions of "new" versions of the same or less word count.

That's sounds like a very good idea.

I think it has a much better chance of success, if the rewording has a relatively similar word count.


A good idea indeed - I'll take the first crack at it.

Sound Striker (Archetye) as written wrote:

They say that words can cut deeper than any blade, and the sound striker proves this true. Using music and words as a weapon, he can focus his performances into a deadly delivery.

Bardic Performance: A sound striker gains the following type of bardic performance. Neither performance can be performed more quickly than a standard action.
Wordstrike (Su): At 3rd level, the sound striker bard can spend 1 round of bardic performance as a standard action to direct a burst of sonically charged words at a creature or object. This performance deals 1d4 points of damage plus the bard's level to an object, or half this damage to a living creature. This performance replaces inspire competence.
Weird Words (Su): At 6th level, a sound striker can start a performance as a standard action, lashing out with 1 potent sound per bard level (maximum 10), each sound affecting one target within 30 feet. These are ranged touch attacks. Each weird word deals 1d8 points of damage plus the bard's Charisma bonus (Fortitude half), and the bard chooses whether it deals bludgeoning, piercing, or slashing damage for each word. This performance replaces suggestion.

Total character count: 1141 (including spaces, excluding the archetype title block).

Wordstike + Wierd Words character count: 811

First attempt at a replacement:
Wordstrike (Su): At 3rd level, the sound striker bard can spend 2 rounds of bardic performance as a standard action to direct bursts of sonically charged words at creatures or object. This performance acts as the scorching ray spell but deals sonic damage instead of fire damage and uses the bard class level as the caster level. This performance replaces inspire competence.
Weird Words (Su): At 6th level, a sound striker may confound the targets of his Wordstrike rather than damaging them. This ability functions as Wordstrike except that enemies struck by Weird Words are confused for 1 round per Weird Word they are struck by (Fortitude negates). This is a mind affecting effect. This performance replaces suggestion.

Wordstrike + Wierd Words character count: 722

I like that it has precedent, comes online & progresses the same as the Scorching Ray spell would for a full caster, and feels familiar. Being sonic damage, it fits thematically and both replacement abilities seem to fit the "Sound Striker" theme without having to change the name. The ability to use it for a second function seems cool to me, but also keeps the character count low by referencing the first ability. =) This ability may be a bit weak, but at least it gives another option. I think consuming 2 rounds for the performance is a fair price to pay for what it does, but I'm admittedly very conservative when it comes to writing new material.

Overall, I'm pretty happy with the idea for the 15 minutes of thought I put into it. Anyone have any critiques, modifications, or suggestions of their own?

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

My First:
They say that words can cut deeper than any blade, and the sound striker proves this true. Using music and words as a weapon, he can focus his performances into a deadly delivery.

Bardic Performance: A sound striker gains the following type of bardic performance. Neither performance can be performed more quickly than a standard action.
Wordstrike (Su): At 3rd level, the sound striker bard can spend 2 rounds of bardic performance as a standard action to direct bursts of sonically charged words at creatures or object. This performance acts as the scorching ray spell but deals sonic damage instead of fire damage and uses the bard class level as the caster level. This performance replaces inspire competence.
Weird Words (Su): At 6th level, a sound striker may make a single ranged touch attack as a standard action and apply that attack to any number of targets within 30 feet. The attack deals 1d8 damage per bard level plus the bard's Charisma bonus and may be divided evenly (round down) between the targets. Each target consumes 1 round of bardic performance and is immune to Weird Words for 1 day. This performance replaces suggestion.

-----------

Original ability is 1152 characters and mine is 1148 characters. This should metric out to about 103 damage average at 20th level divided between targets. No fort save for half (no die rolls to make), just a single to hit that is applied to every target's AC.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

MechE_ wrote:

Wordstrike (Su): 2 rounds of bardic performance

Weird Words (Su): At 6th level, a sound striker may confound the targets of his Wordstrike rather than damaging them.

I like the 2 rounds on the first ability, it balances the large number of uses you have at higher levels. I didn't like the confounding, since I like the aspect of hitting multiple targets. It is just way too broken if you hit multiple targets with the full 1d6+charisma.


Since these abilities are Su I don't think they would offer SR even though Scorching Ray normally does. I'm not saying it should be changed, just pointing it out. I'm not sure if a damaging touch attack ability which ignores SR really needs a save or suck rider effect, but if one is going to be added it should probably be clear if it requires one save per target or one save per "Word".

I think it is also important to know whether a Bard can use the same performance multiple times per round with a swift, move, and standard action. If you can indeed use a performance 3 times per round that way then Weird Words should either have some language preventing that (such as the original version's standard action restriction) or be changed to allow just 1 Word per performance so that you can fire off 3 by using all 3 actions or be a little flexible and possibly fire off 1 or 2 with swift or move actions.

@MechE_ - What you're proposing for Wordstrike isn't terribly far off of what I'd been recommending earlier in the thread and seems pretty much OK to me though I kind of like the 1d8+Cha damage better than the 4d6. I suspect that they'd tend to work out to a similar number anyhow since Charisma in the range of 20 - 30 gives average damage of 9.5 to 14.5 on 1d8+Cha whereas 4d6 average 14.

@James Risner - For months on end I was asserting that allowing 3 Weird Words per round would probably be pretty balanced since it would be a lot like Scorching Ray. As I recall you felt that would be too powerful. Now it appears like you're proposing a solution which pretty much flat out includes a sonic version of Scorching Ray to replace Wordstrike. Has your opinion changed over time, or were we just having some kind of communication problem then or now?

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

Devilkiller wrote:

same performance multiple times per round with a swift, move, and standard action

For months on end I was asserting that allowing 3 Weird Words per round would probably be pretty balanced since it would be a lot like Scorching Ray

Yea, I need to find a way to say that that doesn't use a lot of words.

I'm still of mind that prohibiting swift, move, and standard is required. So 3x per turn is still firmly in my "shouldn't be done" category.


Can we just lift Thundercall straight from the Thundercaller archetype and give it wholesale to the Sound Striker? That's the bardic music based attack everyone wants, and Sound Striker would let you get it without the weird animal/survival business, or those worthless Call Lightnings (Thundercall outdamages it easily anyway).


I think there might still be an open question on whether you can use Thunder Call 3 times per round or just once. If you can only use Thunder Call once then it might make sense to have a different sound themed bardic performance attack which can do more damage without the added stun effect.

I think most folks on this thread would agree that allowing a Scorching Ray analogue to be used 3 times per round for 9 attacks would be over the top (else why bother not allowing the 10 attacks per round with the original ability)


@James - The idea of confusion was to allow you to do something other than dealing damage with it if you wanted. Scorching Ray allows you to hit 2 and 3 targets in time which is intentionally less than 10 targets. I'm not sure I like the idea of being able to divide the damage in your ability James and then the creatures being immune for a day seems rough. Flavor-wise, why would a Sound Striker get such an ability that just deals damage when they already get a very similar ability without the limitation that fires a growing number of rays? I get that this one is limited to hitting a target once, but it seems a bit "gamey" to me. (Side note: perhaps a Will save should negate the suggested confusion effect of Wierd Words - that would overall make the ability better since more monsters have poor Will saves than Fort saves.)

@Devilkiller - Perhaps I'm missing some ability, but doesn't the verbiage following verbiage prevent a Sound Striker from using these inspires more than once per round? "A sound striker gains the following type of bardic performance. Neither performance can be performed more quickly than a standard action." Also, I had recalled seeing the idea basing the ability on Scorching Ray tossed around a while back - Thanks.

@mplindustries - Granted SKR is no longer employed by Paizo, I would not be surprised if some of the other rules guys shared his sentiment that the Tundercaller requires errata.

@Devilkiller - If I am missing something that allows one to bipass the "no faster than a standard action" restriction, then add my name to the list of people who agree that activating it 3 times in a single round is over the top. As is, at level 7 you could start this performance as a standard action, then start another performance as a move action to help your allies. But you'd be consuming 3 round of performance to accomplish that, so that seems fine.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

@MechE_ I may try to reword mine with an effect. I was just trying to model a mass eradication ability. With the rewrite, the Scorching Ray ability is the MVP and the Weird Words is a "mop up" ability. I don't like any save on this ability as it requires lots of additional die rolls.

The core rules on bards has a line that many view limits you to one performance a round anyway. So the idea of blocking it in the abilities "cannot be performed more quickly than a standard action" is for some redundant words. I like it in there because there are some who reject the meaning of the ~a bard may once per turn~ language (I didn't look up the exact phrase in the core, so this is a paraphrase.)

I'm also sure they would do Errata on Thundercaller if it their desire. I seem to recall SKR speaking about it and saying the whole team thought it required Errata.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

My Second:
They say that words can cut deeper than any blade, and the sound striker proves this true. Using music and words as a weapon, he can focus his performances into a deadly delivery.

Bardic Performance: A sound striker gains the following type of bardic performance. Neither performance can be performed more quickly than a standard action.
Wordstrike (Su): At 3rd level, the sound striker bard can spend 2 rounds of bardic performance to direct bursts of sonically charged words at creatures or object. This performance acts as the scorching ray spell but deals sonic damage instead of fire damage and uses the bard class level as the caster level. This performance replaces inspire competence.
Weird Words (Su): At 6th level, a sound striker may make a single ranged touch attack and apply that attack to any number of targets within 30 feet. The attack deals 1d4 damage per bard level plus the bard's Charisma bonus and may be divided evenly (round down) between the targets. Each target is also nauseated for 1 round and immune to Weird Words for 1 day. This consumes 1 round of bardic performance per target. This performance replaces suggestion.

-----------

Original ability is 1152 characters and mine is 1150 characters. I reduced the damage and added nauseated as a condition (no save) to reduce the number of die rolls.


It would be kind of ironic if Weird Words finally got fixed to work in a reasonable way now that my affected PC is long retired. He never retrained it away, so I guess he'd get a little power boost in whatever theoretical adventures a retired PC might take part in.

@MechE_ - You'd left that first line with "Neither performance can be performed more quickly than a standard action" out of the section with your rewrite, so I thought you'd dropped it. I guess actually you just didn't bother to reprint it again in the lower section of your post since it hadn't changed. I'm sorry for any confusion.

@James Risner - I think nauseated is pretty rough. I wonder if making the targets sickened wouldn't be more than enough. Making one attack against multiple targets also strikes me as odd. Maybe Weird Words could just put a rider ability on Wordstrike (like "Starting at 6th level, targets hit by the Sound Striker's Wordstrike are also sickened for 1 round" - if that seems to strong or weak you could add a Fort save, increase the duration, etc)

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

@Devilkiller - I think of this ability more as a 1/day against a target. I find nauseated as a reasonable ability in that light. If moved to a rider on Wordstrike, that would be a needed change (Swap nauseated to sickened). The one attack is just about required, as there isn't anything that slows a turn down like making 10 attack rolls adjudicating each one vs the opponent. I hate the current ability precisely for this reason (20 rolls of a d20 to resolve.) I'd rather have no save and one attack roll. You GM will thank you.

Sovereign Court

I like MechE's version but for weird words replace confusion with sicken and make it a rider in addition to damage.


Modified Sound Striker wrote:

A sound striker bard is capable of speaking potent words that damage the bard's foes.

The soundstriker gains the following performances, replacing inspire competence, suggestion and mass suggestion. Neither performance can be completed more quickly than a standard action.

Word Strike (Su) At 4th level the bard can speak one word per 4 bard levels that deals 4d6 points of sonic damage as a ranged touch attack with a range of 20 ft. plus 10 ft. per 4 bard levels. The bard adds his charisma modifier (and other damage bonuses) to targets struck by the weird words, but only once per target, not once per word. The bard can target all words at a single target or multiple targets, but each word must be unleashed simultaneously. Each word costs 1 round of bardic performance.

Weird Words (Su) At 6th level, the bard can double the amount of words produced by word strike, but each word deals only 2d6 points of damage, plus additional damage modifiers, and a target can be struck only once per round. Each target struck is sickened (no save) for 1d4 rounds, but targets that are already sickened must make a saving throw or become nauseated.

203 words, 1,169 characters.

A little bigger, but I think it's pretty concise and a better ability. Also doesn't allow for stupid high amounts of damage, with a max of 20d6+modifiers to a single target, but damage modifiers apply only once per to a target. So, 20d6 plus... I'd guess around 20 at best? For an average of 90 points of damage on a single target for 5 rounds of bardic performance.

Or they can sicken, then nauseate up to 10 targets, but nauseating them after sickening them requires a total of 10 rounds of performance.

I'm sure I could trim it down to less than the printed version by removing the range of the words and setting it at a standard 30 ft. range with no increase.

[Edit] Managed to trim it down to 199 words and 1,139 characters.

The Exchange Owner - D20 Hobbies

@Tels - Make it close ranged (25 ft + 5/2 levels); At 10 targets that is 10 attacks; sickened for 1d4 rounds should be a static number like 1 round or 2 rounds

The one major flaw with this ability is all the attack rolls, and your version doesn't fix that.


James Risner wrote:

@Tels - Make it close ranged (25 ft + 5/2 levels); At 10 targets that is 10 attacks; sickened for 1d4 rounds should be a static number like 1 round or 2 rounds

The one major flaw with this ability is all the attack rolls, and your version doesn't fix that.

Well... yes and no. The change I make above changes it so that 'Word Strike' is now the primary damaging ability, while Weird Words is secondary. Weird Words is for using on large numbers of enemies, and for a little debuff as well. However, the Bard doesn't have to use all 10 attacks if they don't need to (and it's only available at 20th level anyway, where it's the least useful).

Word Strike scales up to 5 total attacks at 20th level, which isn't that bad. There's no save or SR associated with Word Strike so it's 5 d20 rolls at best, 10 at worst (if every word threatens a crit).

I don't consider the change to Weird Words to be that troublesome as it's probably not going to a primary function of the class. When there are lots of enemies, it's useful to do some minor damage and apply a debuff, but, for the most part, I suspect that Weird Words will see use the most.

Remember too, that each word fired using Word Strike costs a round of bardic performance, so it's not going to be something one can spam in every round of every fight. They'll quickly blow through all of their uses of performance if they do so.

Paizo Employee Official Rules Response

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Thanks to everyone in this thread for discussing the previous proposal. Thanks to you and your ideas, we have come up with a FAQ entry on weird words that speeds up gameplay compared to the original with several advantages over the previous proposal!

FAQ wrote:

Bard: The sound striker’s weird words ability is confusing. Does it work more than once on the same target? And does it require 30 rolls to adjudicate?

Change the text of weird words to the following “At 6th level the bard can start a performance that is always a standard action to speak up to one word per 4 bard levels laden with sonic energy. Each word deals 4d6 points of sonic damage as a ranged touch attack with a range of 30 feet. The bard adds his charisma modifier on damage rolls with weird words. Multiple words that strike the same target stack into a single powerful attack, applying energy resistance and bonuses on damage rolls only once. The bard can target all words at the same or different targets, but he unleashes all words simultaneously. Each word costs 1 round of bardic performance.” This change will be reflected in future errata.

Contributor

So it basically was changed into a sonic version of scorching ray with Charisma to damage?

That seems like a great fix to me.


Nice fix! Was wondering what the reigning top FAQ was.


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Hooray!!

Now they need to tackle the oft requested FAQ for Succubi in a grapple...

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

Aww, just as I was about to go into Of Kirin and Kraken tomorrow. Well, guess I will just have to survive without the nuclear option somehow.


It seems nice.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder Adventure, Rulebook Subscriber

I just wish the progression was tweaked a bit so I could get three words at 11th instead of 12th. Ah well.


Much appreciated, PDT.


TriOmegaZero wrote:
I just wish the progression was tweaked a bit so I could get three words at 11th instead of 12th. Ah well.

I see, I suppose 1d6/level would have been nicer than 4d6/ every 4 levels.


Pathfinder Design Team wrote:

Thanks to everyone in this thread for discussing the previous proposal. Thanks to you and your ideas, we have come up with a FAQ entry on weird words that speeds up gameplay compared to the original with several advantages over the previous proposal!

FAQ wrote:

Bard: The sound striker’s weird words ability is confusing. Does it work more than once on the same target? And does it require 30 rolls to adjudicate?

Change the text of weird words to the following “At 6th level the bard can start a performance that is always a standard action to speak up to one word per 4 bard levels laden with sonic energy. Each word deals 4d6 points of sonic damage as a ranged touch attack with a range of 30 feet. The bard adds his charisma modifier on damage rolls with weird words. Multiple words that strike the same target stack into a single powerful attack, applying energy resistance and bonuses on damage rolls only once. The bard can target all words at the same or different targets, but he unleashes all words simultaneously. Each word costs 1 round of bardic performance.” This change will be reflected in future errata.

This makes it a perfectly reasonable ability. Thank you.


Pathfinder Design Team wrote:

Thanks to everyone in this thread for discussing the previous proposal. Thanks to you and your ideas, we have come up with a FAQ entry on weird words that speeds up gameplay compared to the original with several advantages over the previous proposal!

FAQ wrote:

Bard: The sound striker’s weird words ability is confusing. Does it work more than once on the same target? And does it require 30 rolls to adjudicate?

Change the text of weird words to the following “At 6th level the bard can start a performance that is always a standard action to speak up to one word per 4 bard levels laden with sonic energy. Each word deals 4d6 points of sonic damage as a ranged touch attack with a range of 30 feet. The bard adds his charisma modifier on damage rolls with weird words. Multiple words that strike the same target stack into a single powerful attack, applying energy resistance and bonuses on damage rolls only once. The bard can target all words at the same or different targets, but he unleashes all words simultaneously. Each word costs 1 round of bardic performance.” This change will be reflected in future errata.

I approve of this change!

Will Word Strike get changed at all? The current version is rather useless and pointless as it seems designed to destroy objects, but with the 'half energy damage to objects before hardness' thing, it can barely do something like smash a 2x4 piece of wood.

Also, what about Sound Strikers being unable to use Mass Suggestion because they don't possess the Suggestion ability?

I don't want to come off as unappreciative or greedy, I'm just trying to get one of the coolest Bard archetypes fixed. I really enjoy this change and appreciate the fact it was made more 'user friendly' while also toning down the awesome power the previous version had.


Pathfinder Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I'm curious why it now costs 1 Bardic Performance per 4d6 instead of 1 performance for maximum wordage. Ah well, this version is definitely preferred! Thanks PDT/Paizo!


Xethik wrote:
I'm curious why it now costs 1 Bardic Performance per 4d6 instead of 1 performance for maximum wordage. Ah well, this version is definitely preferred! Thanks PDT/Paizo!

My guess is they didn't want a bard just blasting every single round as a primary ability and want it to be a complimentary ability.

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