Goblin Squad Member
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It is with great pleasure that I, Areks Kel’Goran, Thane Blade of Pax Aeternum, formally announce the Kingdom of Aeternum’s sponsorship of the UnNamed Company. On the 29th day of Rova, High Thane Ezekial Krows of the Kingdom of Aeternum and Bluddwolf, Master of the UnNamed Company signed these Terms of Alliance. They are known hence forth as formal allies for all intents and purposes, bound to one another by their Terms of Alliance.
By signing these Terms of Alliance, both organizations have entered into a contractual agreement to exchange services for the mutual benefit of both, for as long as that benefit is fully realized equally. The nature of this alliance not only creates a bond between these two organizations, but also maintains their unique identities and ensures an agreed upon level of autonomy. Their common goal will be to support and preserve the settlement that both rely upon for home and hearth, for training and comraderie and for any other social, economic or political goals that may arise.
This proclamation inaugurates the alliance known as the Nation of Aeternum.
Areks Kel’Goran
Thane Blade of Pax Aeternum
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Goblin Squad Member
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I want to say on behalf of The UnNamed Company, that I was honored for my company to be offered the opportunity to develop this relationship over these past 2-3 weeks.
For those in the PFO community or the rank and file members of PAX Aeternum, that may be scratching their heads and asking why? Or perhaps they are asking, How does a Lawful Neutral merchant / trade based nation strike a deal with a Chaotic Neutral to Lawful Evil (CN, CE, NE, LE) Bandit and assassin based company?
The answer is quite long and an interesting one, but I will keep it short for now.
Walk Any Road, Float Any River:
This freedom implies no safety while traveling, especially from the local lord. It merely prevents lords from blocking land and water travel, or charging tolls for passing (except for non-Riverfolk). Of
course, any ruler who doesn’t want people on his roads can bar them without erecting a single block—threats, bribes, political pressure, or hiring “bandits” are just as effective.However, in practice, it means no lord can take his or her people for granted. Most Riverfolk do not leave their homes for anything but essential travel, no matter who is in charge (and poor Riverfolk usually have nowhere else to go), but they might still move to a new kingdom if their lord is abusive. This escape is rarely necessary. A lord who
wants a functioning kingdom knows not to treat subjects too harshly, or the best ones will disappear, leaving a half-empty kingdom behind.
Interestingly enough, if the laws are based on pretty chaotic principles, does it make adherence to those laws a Lawful act or a Chaotic one?
Pax Aeternum and The UnNamed Company have found common ground in following this River Freedom, within the clause that it provides. They are lawful by following it, and we are chaotic by implementing it.
So, to the question as to why have these tow companies come together?
Mutual interest is always the answer for any contractual agreement. We have both seen the advantages of creating an OtherBigTown......
Ahh yes, the "OtherBigTown" scenario and or advise that Ryan Dancey had presented to us, so many weeks ago.
Pax Aeternum, and particularly Krows and Areks, have always understood the true meaning of Ryan Dancey's advise, as did The UnNamed Company.
Pax will have its trade hub, a merchant empire, and it will be protected by wolves. It will have its standing army of formation combat trained infantry and it will utilize banditry and assassin trained roving bands of interdictors to enforce the River Freedoms within its lands.
There will be several types of activities that The UnNamed Company will be performing for Pax Aeternum, but the main one will be:
Interdiction - These contracts will be issued to individuals or companies best suited to intercept cargos of contraband; Resources taken from Aeternum controlled hexes without authorization; or Resources passing through Aeternum controlled hexes for possible delivery to parts unknown. Interdiction Contracts will also cover the investigation and potential interference, dismantling or the pressing into the service of Pax Aeternum, any unauthorized POI placed within Pax Aeternum’s area of influence.
It must be noted that all of these interdiction activities takes place within the controlled territories of Pax Aeternum. As such they are considered by the UnNamed Company to be sanctioned by the lawful authority of Pax Aeternum.
For any party who wishes to lodge a grievance for our activities, I direct your attention to this first:
You Have What You Hold:
In contrast to many other civilizations on Golarion, this freedom draws a moral distinction between robbery and mere stealing. Taking something by force is considered acceptable, even begrudgingly praiseworthy. Burglary, on the other hand, is punishable under common law. The difference is in allowing a victim the ability to resist, the opportunity to face his or her robber, and to plan for repossession if so desired. This allows for a rough honesty, letting Riverfolk know and face their enemies.
So if you will... please do not grieve your loss, but rather, lump praise upon my bandits, for giving you the opportunity to face your enemy.... Better yet, give into our Stand-and-Deliver offers and go about your business in peace, health, and a lighter load to burden yourself with.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Simply, I did not expect the alliance, probably because I'm not in the loop. Certainly, it should make for an interesting pairing. I find it to be an intriguing statement to make to have the UnNamed Company as your very first added CC in the Nation of Aeternum, and wonder how that will factor into their desires for a bandit-for-hire type play. I also wonder what the other developing CC's responses are going to be, if any.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Will this provide the UNC with the privilige of privateering against any non-PAX characters (or allies) in PAX-controlled territories, with PAX turning a blind eye and collecting part of the profits?
As in effectively setting a "Not Blue, Extort It"(NBEI) policy for PAX lands?
Will PAX be able to order UNC around, as in "start a feud with Golgotha and raid the #### out of their lands"
No matter what, I like this development because it is fresh to see groups starting initiatives towards "playing the game" of economical, material and military competition.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Will this provide the UNC with the privilige of privateering against any non-PAX characters (or allies) in PAX-controlled territories, with PAX turning a blind eye and collecting part of the profits?
As in effectively setting a "Not Blue, Extort It"(NBEI) policy for PAX lands?
Will PAX be able to order UNC around, as in "start a feud with Golgotha and raid the #### out of their lands"
No matter what, I like this development because it is fresh to see groups starting initiatives towards "playing the game" of economical, material and military competition.
Although we have different terminology, essentially you seem to understand the working relationship.
Activities within Pax controlled hexes is known and governed by our Interdiction Contract Policy (Which I explained above).
Activities outside of Pax controlled hexes are either freelance (autonomous) or they are called and governed by our Privateer: Letter of Marque Contracts.
The UNC will practice an NBRI (Not Blue, Rob It) policy. Your use of the term NBEI incorrectly implies that we will only use SAD (extortion) as a means to interdict in another's activities. Robbery, on the other hand, can be done through intimidation (SAD) or force (Ambush).
It is also important to note that the alliance between UNC and Pax Aeternum is an exception to the rule (Our's). My company will only enter into one alliance and it will remain in effect for as long as the relationship is mutually beneficial.
The UNC is still open to contracts from other companies or settlements, as long as they are not in opposition of Pax Aeternum, during the duration of our agreement.
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Goblin Squad Member
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You don't forsee any potential conflict between this:
Pax Aeternum exists to be a merchant empire. Whether it involves the selling of finished products, resources, or services we hope as an organization to provide for your needs. This means that our settlement, Callambea, will be set up with NeRDS for as long as it can be feasible specifically to facilitate the most trade we can possibly encourage.
and this?
The UNC will practice an NBRI (Not Blue, Rob It) policy. Your use of the term NBEI incorrectly implies that we will only use SAD (extortion) as a means to interdict in another's activities. Robbery, on the other hand, can be done through intimidation (SAD) or force (Ambush).
If I was a merchant bringing goods to sell in Pax lands or a shopper looking to purchase your products, how will you reassure me that I won't be jumped by the UNC on my journey to or from your "trade hub"?
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Goblin Squad Member
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You don't forsee any potential conflict between this:
Pax Aeternum exists to be a merchant empire. Whether it involves the selling of finished products, resources, or services we hope as an organization to provide for your needs. This means that our settlement, Callambea, will be set up with NeRDS for as long as it can be feasible specifically to facilitate the most trade we can possibly encourage.and this?
If I was a merchant bringing goods to sell in Pax lands or a shopper looking to purchase your products, how will you reassure me that I won't be jumped by the UNC on my journey to or from your "trade hub"?The UNC will practice an NBRI (Not Blue, Rob It) policy. Your use of the term NBEI incorrectly implies that we will only use SAD (extortion) as a means to interdict in another's activities. Robbery, on the other hand, can be done through intimidation (SAD) or force (Ambush).
No
Both groups have obligations to the other and they will be followed.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Hmmm, as a politically neutral merchant I don't like the sound of a NBRI policy. That's obviously a big indicator that I and other like myself should not do business with you, as entering your lands puts me at risk for government-sponsored robbery. At least in another land where UNC is merely raiding I could rely on any guards to assist me against the bandits, rather than assist the bandits should I try to resist or flee.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Hmmm, as a politically neutral merchant I don't like the sound of a NBRI policy. That's obviously a big indicator that I and other like myself should not do business with you, as entering your lands puts me at risk for government-sponsored robbery. At least in another land where UNC is merely raiding I could rely on any guards to assist me against the bandits, rather than assist the bandits should I try to resist or flee.
Well now that depends on your reason for entering PAX territory.
You could also contact Bludd directly through a PM to discuss it further.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Hmmm, as a politically neutral merchant I don't like the sound of a NBRI policy. That's obviously a big indicator that I and other like myself should not do business with you, as entering your lands puts me at risk for government-sponsored robbery. At least in another land where UNC is merely raiding I could rely on any guards to assist me against the bandits, rather than assist the bandits should I try to resist or flee.
Xeen's original response left me with the impression that if PAX asks them to perform their robbery outside of the territory, then you will be safe from UNC within it. They will be respecting PAX law as per terms of alliance, or so it sounds.
From an economic and political perspective, this would drive more traffic through PAX held lands and better facilitate their trade, as well as provide a reliability edge to PAX trade companies for business outside of their territory.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Hmmm, as a politically neutral merchant I don't like the sound of a NBRI policy. That's obviously a big indicator that I and other like myself should not do business with you, as entering your lands puts me at risk for government-sponsored robbery. At least in another land where UNC is merely raiding I could rely on any guards to assist me against the bandits, rather than assist the bandits should I try to resist or flee.
No, as the Interdiction Policy states, if you are in route to or from Pax Aeternum's settlement(s), you will not be molested in any way, other than a stop and investigation.
If however, you are seen in Pax lands, and not authorized to be there, to be passing through or you are suspected of bring aid to rivals, you will be SAD'd or ambushed accordingly.
Interdiction - These contracts will be issued to individuals or companies best suited to intercept cargos of contraband; Resources taken from Aeternum controlled hexes without authorization; or Resources passing through Aeternum controlled hexes for possible delivery to parts unknown. Interdiction Contracts will also cover the investigation and potential interference, dismantling or the pressing into the service of Pax Aeternum, any unauthorized POI placed within Pax Aeternum’s area of influence.
If you are looking to trade with Pax, you will "Blue" to The UnNamed Company. If you prearrange your delivery to a Pax settlement, the UnNamed Company will even provide the service of warding off any other bandits and or escorting you to your destination, for a fee. That fee would be handled by a prearranged SAD fee, granting you both our protection (escort) and the "Victimized" flag.
As for the previous question about the UNC being the exclusive company of bandits in Pax lands, that is our intention.
The UNC plans on being a training company (University of Crime = UNC).for the River Kingdom's fledgling bandit population. The cream of the crop will be offered to join UNC proper. Others will be sent on their way into the world to ply their trade elsewhere.
But we will all come back together when the Outlaw Council meets.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Hmmm, as a politically neutral merchant I don't like the sound of a NBRI policy. That's obviously a big indicator that I and other like myself should not do business with you, as entering your lands puts me at risk for government-sponsored robbery. At least in another land where UNC is merely raiding I could rely on any guards to assist me against the bandits, rather than assist the bandits should I try to resist or flee.Xeen's original response left me with the impression that if PAX asks them to perform their robbery outside of the territory, then you will be safe from UNC within it. They will be respecting PAX law as per terms of alliance, or so it sounds.
From an economic and political perspective, this would drive more traffic through PAX held lands and better facilitate their trade, as well as provide a reliability edge to PAX trade companies for business outside of their territory.
You are safe in PAX territory if you are doing business with PAX. If you are just passing through, stealing their resources, or trying to "teach them a lesson." You will be subject to NBRI... or NBKI (not blue kill it).
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Goblin Squad Member
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You don't forsee any potential conflict between this:
Pax Aeternum exists to be a merchant empire. Whether it involves the selling of finished products, resources, or services we hope as an organization to provide for your needs. This means that our settlement, Callambea, will be set up with NeRDS for as long as it can be feasible specifically to facilitate the most trade we can possibly encourage.and this?
If I was a merchant bringing goods to sell in Pax lands or a shopper looking to purchase your products, how will you reassure me that I won't be jumped by the UNC on my journey to or from your "trade hub"?The UNC will practice an NBRI (Not Blue, Rob It) policy. Your use of the term NBEI incorrectly implies that we will only use SAD (extortion) as a means to interdict in another's activities. Robbery, on the other hand, can be done through intimidation (SAD) or force (Ambush).
The problem is the definition of what is 'Blue' and what is 'Red.' If the UnNamed Company pillaged every caravan coming into Pax Lands that was not Pax, UNC or one of our allies, we wouldn't be much of a Merchant Kingdom, would we?
The purpose of this alliance is to bring together two entities that see a unique advantage to working together. UnNamed Company gains a place to hang their hat, complete training as needed, and reload/refit. Pax Aeternum gains the assistance of a PvP Hardened crew who understand and follow agreements.
Xeen even points out above that it's all about the reason. If you notify the Nation of Aeternum in advance that you are looking to do business with us, I think you can expect reasonable safe passage to our trade city, Callambea.
I say reasonable not because I worry about the UnNamed Company; they've given their word, and this relationship has been built on weeks of discussion and understanding to where both entities feel comfortable with the other.
Reasonable is due to the fact that we aim to be the largest merchant capital in the River Kingdoms. That would probably make for a good target for individual or non-aligned bandit organizations, wouldn't it? Entities that will stay on the borders, preying on choice targets, causing havoc and disappearing into the landscape. The formal military we are building will focus on protecting us from Siege warfare; our Bounty Hunting outfit will look for High Value and High Profile targets. What, then, is the best way to hunt smaller targets who utilize unconventional warfare?
I may be leading the thought process, but if you think about it pragmatically, why wouldn't a large merchant organization ally itself with an organization it not only trusts to leave alone it's own resources, allies and trade partners, but will destroy the riff-raff that will gather around such an organization?
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Goblin Squad Member
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You are safe in PAX territory if you are doing business with PAX. If you are just passing through, stealing their resources, or trying to "teach them a lesson." You will be subject to NBRI... or NBKI (not blue kill it).
Wow, Xeen, it takes my like four paragraphs to make that summation. Much appreciated, Sir :)
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Goblin Squad Member
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I think the three of us all said the exact same things in our own way. Soon enough, we'll be finishing each others sentences. ;)
LOL
I think it takes everything said in different ways for everyone to appreciate what is meant.
I also think this alliance makes sense for both parties. Both groups understand what it takes to run an Empire. Pax will handle the cities, and leave behind the scenes work for the UNC.
The funny part it, I was already looking at PAX for one of my alts.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Firstly, PA and UNC are still two seperate organizations. UNC will operate as directed by PA while in Aeternum terrirtory.
UNC will be used as a deterant against those wishing to circumvent any trade sanctions or embargos. UNC will not be running around searching everyone at random or anything like that.
If its discovered that our goods are being purchased via proxy for those who are red to us, UNC *WILL* recover those goods or as much of them as possible and that proxy will likely gain red status.
Those coming to Calllambea to do trade and leaving after trade is conducted will 9 times out of 10 go unhindered.
Callambea will be a trading hub first. That cannot be understated. It does PA and UNC no good at all to unecessarily harrass those who come to our city to do business.
As to what Xeen has said, those that are just passing through with no intent to do business will be subject to Callambean Law and that law may be exacted by UNC or a PA unit. Callambea is NRDS. Areas of interest that are in our surrounding area may not be. Really, if PA doesn't control that territory directly, UNC can do what they want unless previously directed by us. All we expect is that they stay within the bounds on the ToA.
Here is what you can take to the bank. Callambea will be a trade hub and our actions will foster that. Those wishing to do legitimate business with us will be safe. If you are in our territory and not conducting business with us, expect a face to face visit from us and expect to be subject to Callambean law. That is in line with everything we have said thus far.
Also, unless it is stated by Bluddwolf, Krow, or myself, consider it is that individual's interpretation which may or may not be correct.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The issue I had is how I get defined as a "blue". Is there some big list that I get added to, and that UNC checks when they see people coming into Pax territory? Or are they just going to SAD/ambush without me being part of a player settlement that is allied with you? That's the important part for me; I'm relatively sure I'm not going to commit to one player settlement, so how will the UNC know I'm a merchant and not a smuggler/assassin/all-together-unsavory-sort?
Edit: Ninja'd with a post clearing my inhibitions up. Now, the only thing is to set up a suitable chain of proxies to trade to your reds without it being linked directly to my character (I may have to be one of those you watch closely). :P
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Goblin Squad Member
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The issue I had is how I get defined as a "blue". Is there some big list that I get added to, and that UNC checks when they see people coming into Pax territory? Or are they just going to SAD/ambush without me being part of a player settlement that is allied with you? That's the important part for me; I'm relatively sure I'm not going to commit to one player settlement, so how will the UNC know I'm a merchant and not a smuggler/assassin/all-together-unsavory-sort?
Edit: Ninja'd with a post clearing my inhibitions up. Now, the only thing is to set up a suitable chain of proxies to trade to your reds without it being linked directly to my character (I may have to be one of those you watch closely). :P
Our Standings will align (mostly). We will not need to check a list because as it changes with PAX then it will also change with the UNC. (for the most part)
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Goblin Squad Member
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Shane, if you are coming to do business, you will be fine. If it is determined that you are aiding those that are red to us, you won't be. How we will determine that will depend on varying game mechanics and information networks.
You'll be either blue or grey initially. Very few individuals will start the game red to us.
That being said, you've got to fire the rifle first and see where the bullet lands before you begin making adjustments to hit center mass. This is a process that will be continually refined until it's as close to perfect as possible, but it may be way off the mark initially. Or it may be dead center, only time will tell.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Also, unless it is stated by Bluddwolf, Krow, or myself, consider it is that individual's interpretation which may or may not be correct.
This
I do not completely know what is in our terms of agreement, and I suspect it will change as new dev blogs go out.
I am only at Sargent of Death rank, not an officer. LOL
Need less to say, we will follow PAX laws in their territory.
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Goblin Squad Member
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The part I was having issue with is that Bluddwolf was saying you'll have a NBRI policy, while Areks says it'll be Not Red Don't Shoot (if I understood the acronym; sorry, don't have an EVE background). These seem mutually exclusive to me, as they handle the area in between allies and enemies quite differently. If it's NBRI, then I'd have issues with trading; if it's NRDS, then I'd feel much safer.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Also, unless it is stated by Bluddwolf, Krow, or myself, consider it is that individual's interpretation which may or may not be correct.This
I do not completely know what is in our terms of agreement, and I suspect it will change as new dev blogs go out.
I am only at Sargent of Death rank, not an officer. LOL
Need less to say, we will follow PAX laws in their territory.
This!
;) Everyone will be up to speed soon Xeen, I promise you.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Shane, please check the context of your quote.
Activities outside of Pax controlled hexes are either freelance (autonomous) or they are called and governed by our Privateer: Letter of Marque Contracts.The UNC will practice an NBRI (Not Blue, Rob It) policy. Your use of the term NBEI incorrectly implies that we will only use SAD (extortion) as a means to interdict in another's activities. Robbery, on the other hand, can be done through intimidation (SAD) or force (Ambush).
I stated that Callambea will be NRDS. That will likely carry over to surrounding hexes unless something happens requiring it to be in our best interest to change it. Lone hexes under our control have not been discuessed so I'd just be spit balling and I'd rather not do that.
Hopefully this clears up any misconception you may have.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Thank you, that does clear it up. Now the only issue is, if the UNC has a base of operations, they're more likely to be active around said base of operations, barring contracts or such that send them across the playable world. If they simply prey of merchants of nearby settlements, how will that help to improve your trading network and grow your wealth?
But I'm not looking for a response here, I'm just thinking out loud (feel free to respond if you want to, ofc). I'm confident the people at Pax can create a system so that UNC can get what they want and Pax can get what they want without the two hindering one another. Thank you for the expedient and swift replies, and I hope this alliance works in your favor (you Pax guys seem like a good group).
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Goblin Squad Member
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Golgotha has deemed it worthy to congradulate both organizations on coming to an agreement. I hope this will not cause a loss of relations between Golgotha and both of your organizations. We look forward to continuing to build ample trade and dimplomatic ties with both PAX and the UNC
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Goblin Squad Member
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Golgotha has deemed it worthy to congradulate both organizations on coming to an agreement. I hope this will not cause a loss of relations between Golgotha and both of your organizations. We look forward to continuing to build ample trade and dimplomatic ties with both PAX and the UNC
The Kingdom of Aeternum appreciates Golgotha's congratulations, and I see no reason why we can not continue to build trade and diplomatic ties; in fact, I look forward to future discussion to do just so.
Goblinworks Executive Founder
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I find it interesting that it is literally impossible to want to default on this alliance; once it stope being beneficial to either party, by the terms of the alliance it is over.
Is there a reason that the fair-weather clause was used, rather than either a mutual agreement or unilateral arbitrary end clause?
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Goblin Squad Member
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Pax Aeternum Charter-
4.2.c Reasonable Termination Clauses will be Established - No party wants to find itself locked into an agreement where one or all of the other parties have failed to live up to their side of the agreement. Rather than a confrontational end, Termination Clauses need to be in place for all parties so that a peaceful termination to the agreement may be reached. Other factors can be included within a clause, such as economic fluctuation for a trade agreement, etc.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Anyone would be mistaken to think that all of the UNC activities will be conducted as part of or through the confines of this alliance. Similarly it would be a mistake to assume that the UNC will be of such as size that it would be limited to operating in just one area at the same time.
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Goblin Squad Member
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I can see it now... UNC issues a SAD to a neutral merchant outside of Callambea's borders (offering to escort them for a fee of course). The Merchant sees that they are near the Callambea border and decide to make a run for it. An epic chase ensues, and the Merchant barely makes it over the border ahead of UNC who, due to the alliance and Callambea's NRDS policy, are unable to pursue to conclusion.
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Goblin Squad Member
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@Bludd: I've no doubt that your banditos will be running all over the map. After all, to restrict yourself to a certain area is to give the merchants a clear zone to steer away from. However, I think that unless you set some rules down against it, bandits will tend to hunt for merchants closer to home, as it's less risk to themselves. If they can quickly get into the Pax border they don't have to worry about pursuing authorities, as pursuers will have to become lawbreakers and incite Pax's wrath to attack them. I think that, unless merchant operations around Pax's borders become very quiet (which obviously your buddies at Pax won't want), many of your bandits will tend to hunt in that area thanks to the protection offered.
Of course, this is total speculation on my part, and as long as you have proper systems in place it needs not be an issue.