#5-05 The elven entanglement gm discussion [spoilers]


GM Discussion

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Shadow Lodge 2/5

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Looking at the "Save the Gnome!" encounter

Spoiler:
Shouldn't the 7-8 Giant-template wolf-in-sheep's-clothing (WISC to the cool kids) have the same 30' reach as the 10-11 WISC? The map shows them "outside of its reach" at 20' and the notes (which are amazing) show a 15' reach

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

thegreatkaz.e wrote:

Looking at the "Save the Gnome!" encounter

** spoiler omitted **

Response:
Because the WiSC identifies the babaus as "no eat, hurt lots to touch," it's very unlikely to try attacking the babaus so long as they don't step next to it. Both subtiers' aberrations should be packing a 30-foot reach for the tentacles, but as far as babau-ambush predator interactions go, it shouldn't matter too much where the babaus hang out.
Liberty's Edge 3/5

Spoiler:
When I first conceived the WISC (ause I'm a cool kid) encounter, I had it a three-way combat, with the WISC and babaus against one another but also against the PCs. I had visions of PCs bull rushing babaus into the WISC's reach, playing out like the battle over the sarlacc. I dropped this during development because Hold Mount Armiya was already a three-way combat. During editing, John added text to make it less like strange bedfellows and more like "the enemy of my enemy is my friend".

Dark Archive 4/5

Full report coming... tomorrow! Tonight is bed.

Dark Archive 3/5

This was quite fun to run, even though my group had a relatively easy time of it. 4 players, all 10-11, all with great fort saves and a character with +18 Survival. Even with them resting once they still only lost one Elf. (Took a bit over 12 hours). The Survival DC's seemed a bit low considering the locale. How would one adjudicate spells like Find The Path and Windwalk for this scenario? Since we couldn't work out Windwalk, they agreed not to use it. Considering that level 11 clerics have access to it, it seems pertinent considering that you move at 60 mph...
For Find The Path, I ruled that it showed the quickest path to their destination, but didn't 'eliminate' the need for checks.

The last combat was a bugger to set up, though! The leeches did nothing as everyone was flying at that point.

Would definitely like to run it again, especially for a low fort/survival group <evil grin>.

Oh, and one last thing; one of my players (whose family is full of archaeologists and professors), implored me to inform the developers that cold iron cannot be made into ingots, which defies the entire purpose of forging it at a lower temperature.

5/5 ⦵⦵⦵

4 legs good, 2 legs bad

100 legs AWESOME!

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

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Dezhem wrote:

This was quite fun to run, even though my group had a relatively easy time of it. 4 players, all 10-11, all with great fort saves and a character with +18 Survival. Even with them resting once they still only lost one Elf. (Took a bit over 12 hours). The Survival DC's seemed a bit low considering the locale. How would one adjudicate spells like Find The Path and Windwalk for this scenario? Since we couldn't work out Windwalk, they agreed not to use it. Considering that level 11 clerics have access to it, it seems pertinent considering that you move at 60 mph...

For Find The Path, I ruled that it showed the quickest path to their destination, but didn't 'eliminate' the need for checks.

The last combat was a bugger to set up, though! The leeches did nothing as everyone was flying at that point.

Would definitely like to run it again, especially for a low fort/survival group <evil grin>.

Yeah, they had a good set of skills and made good use of magic abilities. Good for them.

Quote:
Oh, and one last thing; one of my players (whose family is full of archaeologists and professors), implored me to inform the developers that cold iron cannot be made into ingots, which defies the entire purpose of forging it at a lower temperature.

Now you're speaking to my academic background. First off, yes, ingot as a bar or ox-hide cast would imply complete melting, which would implicitly undo one of cold iron's unique qualities. What the PCs more likely find in the abandoned elven settlement are blooms resulting from the smelting process, at least roughly shaped to reduce the porosity and increase the density for later use. Depending on its intended use, I can also imagine it being drawn into billets for later smithing.

It's also possible that cold iron metal occurs naturally as opposed to as an ore, much like telluric iron. Natural copper (usually from Michigan) or meteoric iron (in my experience most commonly attributed to the Thule people of far northern North Amercia, though I'm certain it happens in many other places) may be more familiar to most readers, but the idea is largely the same; a native metal needs no smelting process and would ready for smithing soon after extraction.

Now then, I'd imagine that given the little information we have on cold iron, it's more likely to be such a native metal. At least in my experience in copper smelting--more practice with that than iron smelting--the smelting temperature and time spent in a reducing atmosphere for proper metal formation and removal of impurities is fairly close to that which is required for melting; in fact, the more efficient smelts that result in a more consolidated bloom instead of just the formation of slag-isolated beads effectively require both slag and metal product to be molten (granted, a lot of these get hot enough to form an ingot anyway). If cold iron needed to be smelted, it would probably lose some degree of its fantanstic property. After taking a moment to double-check some numbers, it looks like iron's smelting and melting temperatures are about 300 degree C seperate--not an insubstantial difference. Even so, I'd hazard that cold iron makes more sense as a natural metal.

So in a rambling explanation, there we have it. Ingot is likely the incorrect word there (in favor of worked bloom or billet), but without knowing more about any exceptional chemical and physical properties of a fantasy metal, perhaps we could all be wrong.

Good to hear from some archaeologists.

Edit: Corrected one of my terms (native metal, John, not naturally formed metal)

Dark Archive 2/5

I'd thought about the potential for the party to use flying magic to bypass large chunks of the scenario. I don't know if you'd actually consider it a problem, but the windwalk mention made me think on it more than I probably should have. Best to be prepared and all that. I came up with 3 possibe solutions.

1. Ask them not to use it, since the sky sort of falls out of the purview of the adventure.

2. The tanglebriar is obviously choking enough to limit light. Maybe it's too thick to follow the map exactly unless they land now and then to make sure they're on course. This one allows them to use their skills to bypass the time limit and forest hazards somewhat (good, imo, for use of player resources) and also lets you still have the encounters (also good, very flavorful encounters in this one. Kudos to Ryan.)

3. The sky is just choc full of demons. Probably a better choice for a non PFS homegame, but it may be a convenient excuse one of the elves could give the party for why doing flyovers is not viable? There is a big angry Vrock out there.

Grand Lodge 3/5

Couple ways on how I plan to handle flying.

The canopy is just too dense and thick to pass through, and flaying under the canopy doesn't grant any bonus besides increased speed. (I think this is covered in the scenario as such)

When they get to the spot where they can flay over, it is only for that spot. From then on the map/directions of the elves rely on landmarks only visible from within the ground. So flying would hurt them as they would get lost. If that still doesn't deter them, if the elf is with them have them mention that Treerazor patrols the skys on occasion and more since the Wardstones failed. If the elf is not there then have them see the a huge dragon like figure with a black oozing axe flaying above :D. That should keep them on the ground.

3/5

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An off-the cuff rhyme in the event Vinst needs to engage in pipe playing to begin combat or respond to combat being initiated. You could use suggestion as it is currently worded, or use fear, at your discretion...

You all look a bit worse for the wear,
Perchance did you fail to prepare?
Your skill is in question,
I've got a suggestion...
Just go wander the 'briar in fear!

or as he trends to the morbid...

You critters have such lovely skin,
Might I make some room to fit in?
A bit of a flay
Is just child's play...
Who first is my only question?

or insulting...

Buffoons, jokers, and clowns,
Your antics give me the frowns.
You're impressively pathetic
Is your confidence prosthetic?
I shall give you the incompetence crown!

That last one is a bit of a stretch, but more fodder and ideas for berating your players.

Dark Archive 4/5 Venture-Agent, Ireland—Dublin aka Kumakawa

CRobledo wrote:

Thanks for all the clarifications John!

For everyone else, monster stats are in the GM Shared Prep folder! This one was quite a doozy to compile. TWO TEMPLATES on the same creature! For shame, Ryan!

Then the Babaus MAYBE drink a potion of cat's grace. And then some pretty crazy 4-player adjustments.

PHEW!

Where is the shared prep folder? Would love to save some time building out those templated monsters!

5/5

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Kumakawa wrote:
Where is the shared prep folder? Would love to save some time building out those templated monsters!

It's a sticky in the GM boards.

3/5 RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

I read over this scenario, and the tactics for Vinzt say he prefers to Wild Shape before entering melee. But what does he Wild Shape into? I've never played a druid, so I'm not sure how to handle that.

3/5 RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

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Christopher Hamilton wrote:

An off-the cuff rhyme in the event Vinst needs to engage in pipe playing to begin combat or respond to combat being initiated. You could use suggestion as it is currently worded, or use fear, at your discretion...

You all look a bit worse for the wear,
Perchance did you fail to prepare?
Your skill is in question,
I've got a suggestion...
Just go wander the 'briar in fear!

or as he trends to the morbid...

You critters have such lovely skin,
Might I make some room to fit in?
A bit of a flay
Is just child's play...
Who first is my only question?

or insulting...

Buffoons, jokers, and clowns,
Your antics give me the frowns.
You're impressively pathetic
Is your confidence prosthetic?
I shall give you the incompetence crown!

That last one is a bit of a stretch, but more fodder and ideas for berating your players.

If any of my players make some bad rhymes, I think I'll just crib some lines from A. E. Housman:

"Oh, good Lord, the verse you make;
it gives a chap a belly-ache!
Pretty friendship 'tis to rhyme
your friend to death before his time!"

Dark Archive 4/5

So I totally said I was going to give a report and then didn't. Sorry for the lateness!

The Party:
I had seven players who averaged out to JUST squeak out high sub-tier. The lowest was an eight, and we had multiple nines, including a summoner, and a level 11 fighter/monk with quite the trip check. The summoner, before we started, informed me of his ring of invisibility, which he activated every minute or so to keep himself invisible at all times. The rest of the makeup was a ninja/monk who did very little the whole time, two barbarian/fighters (one with a reach weapon, and one with vital strike), a wizard with a single druid level, and an arcane sorcerer with an improved familiar.

So it was kind of a mess from the start with 9 characters on the board at all times, one of which was invisible.

The Setup:
The party got their mission, and without worrying much about preparation (and spurred on by exasperated sighs by Aram Zey), they went through the portal. I had printed the letter from Varian on card stock, so no one had actually seen it up to the point where it was delivered.

After finding out that their favour wasn't likely to happen, the party introduced the idea of doing something further to help their case. I allowed a Diplomacy check, and then went on with giving them the mission. Each player purchased one antiplague and antitoxin (ha, they thought this would take an hour). I had them arrange themselves in the teleportation room (the same size as the first encounter box), and then they were off to the first encounter.

The 'Pede:
They arrived and were instantly on guard as a few of them heard the Elven words "Another Demon trick!" They had little time to react to that because of the rumbling in the ground as the centipede burst out. I rolled HIGH on initiative, incidentally.

The sorcerer wanted to stay with her familiar, and so she had her character delay until her familiar's turn. The other player that rolled higher than the centipede elected to delay for the haste buff that was coming from the summoner. The centipede then trampled them all. Its movement wasn't quite enough to get onto them and then out again, but I believe the rule is that he goes back to his last legal occupied space, or the nearest space that is open if its closer. I'm not sure I adjudicated that entirely properly, so if someone wants to correct me feel free!

The end result is everyone took a lot of damage, and was very worried about it happening the next round. Of course I didn't tell them it wouldn't happen the next round, because I was enjoying the panic. Special thanks also to the few that rolled in the very low thirties for their reflex save and STILL took full damage with a shocked expression on their face. :D

The next round featured one of the barbarians using his folio reroll to save on the centipede's poison, and me misreading the rangers tactics (I focus fired on the closest target rather than firing six arrows at six different targets). The wizard went down, but luckily did not die. The centipede went down to a combination of very lethal full attacks and an anemic fireball from the sorcerer, who was very pissed off that a bug should have fire resistance.

After the centipede went down, I allowed Diplomacy checks in initiative to keep the drama going, and after a 30 I had the elves calm down considerably (of course, they would have calmed down anyway!) Numerous charges of cure light wounds were spent to deal with the trample damage, including at least one that was entirely broken.

The Trek:
The PCs started their rescue mission. Thanks to the wizard suggesting that one of the rangers guide them, and the sorcerer sweet-talking her into it, they passed the first survival check easily, and the familiar nearly went unconscious from strength damage. It was at this point that the summoner pulled out a literal mountain of consumables, and started passing out lesser restorations left and right. I will say that I appreciate how much of a team player he was.

They got to the bramble patch, and decided that they didn't have anything that could fly them all over (all of their flight was short term, even the eidolon). They spotted the vrock, and debated shooting it down or sending the eidolon after it; it was deemed too risky by a few party members, who guessed correctly that it might just be a scout. Going around was deemed too slow, so they went through! Cue demon fever for half the group, and much raging against Tanglebriar. Only a few went entirely unscathed, and I have to give credit for making Survival a useful skill to have!

The Village:
Exploring the village, the PCs heard the hooting and laughing coming from the temple, so they buffed up. It was more or less a slaughter; a babau rogue was tripped, and then stymied as the human opponent it was fighting had darkvision goggles. :( The other babau rolled terribly against create pit and fell 30 ft., leading it to teleport to menace the spellcasters the next round. The dire wolf in sheep's clothing grabbed the level 11 fighter/monk and did some great damage to him, but he delayed for a grease that the summoner used and was able to free himself. The wolf managed to pin another player and I was looking forward to laying eggs in his mouth before it was full attacked to a gruesome death. Due to a five-foot step away from the pit, they were easily able to locate the cold iron cache.

On the way out, the summoner pulled out a fully charged wand of mount and proceeded to make the time segment absolutely trivial. Not that I'm complaining, but man can 2 prestige points make for an easy time.

Vinst:
Skipping the optional encounter (this would have taken at least six hours if it had been included), they continued to travel and were instantly suspicious at the uncorrupted green circle. Vinst appeared and began to talk to them; a few players seemed happy to talk with him, while one of the barbarians continued to try to intimidate him into giving them directions. Vinst was a tease, and after they tried to leave once he let out his bear and complained loudly about how little conversation he got about the outside world.

At this point, the barbarian player surprised me by suggesting that he wrestle the bear. Thinking quick: "That sounds like a delightful time, but I left all my oil in another tree!" No problem, as he pulls out some oil of grease. Cue ten rounds of no one making a CMB check ever, until finally the spell wears off. Once the barbarian pinned the bear, I was pretty happy with the way they had appeased him, and with the promise of coming back to wrestle him when they were done their chore, he gave them directions.

The Hezrou:
That last fight is a nightmare. There are too many moving parts, and I was going a bit crazy trying to keep them all in my head. They arrived and instantly were on guard based on the cocoons. In initiative (although they couldn't see any of the enemies), one of the barbarians hacked at one, spilling a deer into the marsh, where it began to drown. The leeches and leech swarms attacked (I love leech swarms), and the other PCs moved up. When the hezrou attacked, I made a grievous mistake of using blasphemy while threatened by one of the reach weapon fighters. Flubbing a concentration check meant losing his best spell AND his turn; on the other hand, we were pretty pressed for time, so maybe it's a good thing it happened. The flying barbarian laid out a brutal full attack, and with the hezrou quite weakened, it was all he could do to lay out the same against the barbarian. Both were quite damaged, but the hezrou didn't have as many allies, and went down the next round. Against the leech swarms, the invisible summoner took at TON of collateral damage from AoE effects. The player was okay with this, and reasoned that his allies couldn't see him and so wouldn't know to aim away from him.

Total travel time: close to 9 hours. With 30 ft. movement speeds before the village and 40 ft. movement speeds after, as well as never botching a Survival check thanks to one of the PCs with ranks in survival, the PCs had a fairly easy time rescuing every captive. They talked the main guy down from his Calistrian revenge, and emerged from Tanglebriar quite victorious.

This is a very good scenario with a lot of great flavour to it. I love the way Tanglebriar is exhibited, and the encounters are all interesting. I think everyone had a good time, although a few were bored with the wilderness trek.

Things I didn't like:
- a few too many weak fortitude saves; I would have preferred fewer but with more relevant DCs
- too many moving parts in the final fight; a few tougher demons would have been easier for me than a lot of giant leeches + quasits; the leech swarms were excellent though!

Things I really liked:
- how deadly the first encounter is
- the wolf in sheep's clothing
- Vinst, for an encounter that can go combat, diplomacy, trickery, or creativity

Things I forgot:
- ranger tactics in the first encounter
- the odd fortitude save while travelling (slight retcon was needed)
- the stench aura on the hezrou

Liberty's Edge 3/5

Thanks Adam, that illustrated that a lot of what the scenario is intended to do comes through. I sympathize about the moving parts in the final encounter, but I think that is more a matter of personal preference. I will agree that the scenario calls for a lot of Fortitude saves. I'm not sure what a work around for that might be, other than maybe alternating between different effects that call for a mix of Fortitude, Reflex, and Will saves.

Great report!

3/5 RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

Any information on what Vinzt uses Wild Shape to turn into? I don't see anything in the scenario.

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

RainyDayNinja wrote:
Any information on what Vinzt uses Wild Shape to turn into? I don't see anything in the scenario.

I imagine turning into a bear would appeal to him. Becoming an air or earth elemental or even a plant creature at higher levels could also fit his personality.

Dark Archive 4/5

GM shared prep has him turn into a huge earth elemental at high tier. At low tier, shared prep turns him into a dinosaur, which while not traditional, is pretty unhinged and so I think it fits Vinzt fine there.

Dark Archive 2/5

You may also want to check around on different wikis or in different books and see what kind of animals are native to the area, for some extra flavor. Vinst is high enough level that he can reasonably wild shape into most animals, so heck, just pick your favorite if you're unsure.

Shadow Lodge 5/5

I played it over the past weekend

The Party:

The Party
Cleric 11 Cayden Cailean
Alchemist 11
Sound striker Bard/ paladin / Hellknight 11
Monk / Sorcerer / Dragon Disciple 11
Roc Riding Sorcerer 11
Archer 7

The Setup:
Confidant in our own abilities we didnt ask very many questions, we cast a few spells and hopped into the TP Circle

The 'Pede:
having an Alchemist with Force Sticky Bombs and an init modfier of +8 made this encounter a Joke... 'Pede failed its reflex save and went prone ... Game over

The Trek:
honestly wasnt that big of a deal ... we as players didnt know about the time factor ... the survival checks were easy and the fort saves were easy as well

The Village:
this was a Massacre ... Flying Alchemist Nearly Soloed the whole thing aside from the Demon that teleported on top of the Bard and cleric... which the Bard screamed 10 swearwords at with a smite evil going - then ranged attacks at a range of 45 feet took the Wolf apart

Trees:
this was the roughest encounter of the scenario ... Mind fog failed to punch the Dwarfs SR who then Dim Doored out the other 2 people caught in it ... while the archer / sorcerer / alchemist dealt with the trees, ... the problem was Finding the derned Plant .. which took most of the Encounter

Vinst:
this encounter had us Rolling ... the Dwarf Cleric offered him some of his personal Stock of Brew, He and the Bard got into a Singing Competition (to which the Dwarf treated as an Epic Rap battle of History) we made the Diplomacy Check with the Dwarf agreeing to come back and Visit - going as far as to write calculations down for a teleport spell

The Hezrou:
we broke the encounter with fly ... everyone in the party had the fly or Overland Flight spell up ... the Halfling Sorcerer and Archer were Riding the Roc the Archer breaking the pod and the Roc Catching it as it fell while the alchemist trurned the Hezrou into a 1 round piece of Patte once it surfaced whiole the Dragon disiple dealt with the quasits handily

Honestly I think we broke the scenario with party Comp and superior Tactics as well as initiative rolls it was fun ... but IMHO Vinst was the part we'll remember for a while

Liberty's Edge 2/5

I recently played this over the past weekend too! (seems like everyone is saying that currently)

We had a party of 5 in the 7-8 range. One dedicated fighter , One Optimised Magus, Sorcerer, Bard and myself playing a Wizard. So no dedicated healer and little melee.

In the first battle v the Centipede we all rolled quite well for init. I cast fly and pulled up and back, sorc attempted to hide in the bushes as elves started to rain arrows on us... then the Centipede moved and Both the Magus and Sorc dropped ( near Death Im to believe) via the trample. The Fighter bunked out having been reduced near unconciousness and it was essentialy left up to my wizard and the Bard to sort this situation out.. I used burning arc mainly as well as a Dragons Breath. The bard kept backing off (the bard is a street performer which I dont know much about.

After patching up relations with the Elves and finding out how little help they might be, we decided to press on to find their friends. I had probably the best survival.. still being a BLoatmage we were not moving fast.

With the Sheep in Wolves clothing encounter, we never found out what it was, although the Fighter was indeed attacked by a tentacle. It died quite quickly due to well placed fireballs. The babaus died in combo to the Magus and Fighter.

We managed to find the ingots and other items with pretty good perception checks.

It appears we missed out on the optional, our next encounter was with some strange.. Satyr. It seemed to like a dirty joke and one of our players , the magus wanted us to move on as soon as possible as the Satyr wasnt going to help us.. just ask us for stories.

The bloatmage (me) was tired from walking and decided to share a bottle of wine with the Satyr. Stories were exchanged and the street performer got to perform.

The final encounter with the Hezrou was interesting. The quasits popped up in round 3 and started to cut the chrysalis loose into the water as the Hezrou itself was having a lot of difficulty hitting the Magus. The bloatmage was being strangely attached by a Leech swarm!. I loved that, he was torn between wanting to capture them for use later and killing them before they drained too much of his valuable blood!. In the end some intesified Burning hands did the trick and the Hezrou after being pummeled by the Enlarged Fighter fled. We managed to save all but one of the changing elves including their leader but had to settle for a Demon Deer being unleashed on Golarion.

We all explained how naughty the elven general had been by basically cutting the band loose so we later found out some.. things had gone down.

3/5

Ran this at a con over the weekend, and had a player break it worse than a druid.

Now, I've GM'd for this player's character before, and I'm sorry to say, this character is frequently useless, and only sometimes good to have along. So when she totally broke the scenario, she was giddy with satisfaction at having her character finally be the Hero.

Bones Oracle. Once they'd survived the Titan 'Pede, now the party had a colossal 12HD 30' reach pet immune to poison and disease with 60' move and an ungodly bite attack and AC. How do you think the rest of the scenario went? Forced them to make some ride checks here and there, but otherwise... arrived at the Hezrou in about 5 hours.

Helped we had a Cleric of Desna that had Aura of Freedom and cast some sort of mass water walking for the bog.

Dark Archive 4/5

rangerjeff wrote:

Ran this at a con over the weekend, and had a player break it worse than a druid.

Now, I've GM'd for this player's character before, and I'm sorry to say, this character is frequently useless, and only sometimes good to have along. So when she totally broke the scenario, she was giddy with satisfaction at having her character finally be the Hero.

Bones Oracle. Once they'd survived the Titan 'Pede, now the party had a colossal 12HD 30' reach pet immune to poison and disease with 60' move and an ungodly bite attack and AC. How do you think the rest of the scenario went? Forced them to make some ride checks here and there, but otherwise... arrived at the Hezrou in about 5 hours.

Helped we had a Cleric of Desna that had Aura of Freedom and cast some sort of mass water walking for the bog.

Amazing. I love it.

I hope the rest of the party was appreciative and not disappointed. I might have also ruled that the Vrock sees that a mile away no matter what.

Grand Lodge 2/5 RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

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Played this yesterday at 10-11. Highlights:
• My cleric plane shifted the centipede to the Abyss to go stomp some demons. Welcome to the 5th Mendevian Crusade, and thanks for volunteering! ;) More seriously, had that not worked... Well, we'd have been in bad shape.
• We had base speeds of 20, 20, 20, 20, 30, 50. (Three halflings, a dwarf, my tiefling, and a monk.) One of the halflings was a druid who wildshaped into a huge mastodon to carry the other three "slow-bies", so our slowest PC (the mastodon) had a move speed of 40ft. Cut us down to about 1/3 of the Fort saves we'd have been making at 20ft. Yay wildshape! Even if the druid had done nothing else the whole scenario, she'd still have been worth it. :D
• Gunslinger got dominated and ordered to kill me. I was already down to single-digit HP. Add this to the list of reasons that all my casters have pilfering hand. Sure, his backup AoE gun still dropped me to negatives, but with his regular one I'd have been swiss cheese.
• All friendlies saved! Hooray!

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

I'm glad to hear about these creative solutions, especially when a character who might otherwise struggle to find a "voice" at the table can suddenly shine.

3/5 RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

I ran a table at the 10-11 subtier at CharCon. It was made up of:

Level 10 buffing Bloatmage
Level 10 Cleric of Shelyn
Level 9 Inquisitor
Level 8 Shadowcaster
Level 7 Amiri

Against the Centipede, the Bloatmage managed to beat it in initiative, and blocked it from trampling with a Wall of Force. It bit an elf in the first round instead, then squeezed between the Wall and the rock to trample, almost killing the Shadowcaster. When the archers opened fire, the Cleric dropped a dome of Holy Ice to seal them off. From there, it was a slugfest.

Against the wolf-in-sheep's-clothing, the Inquisitor got grappled, but managed to make the Fort save to keep from getting implanted. An illusion kept a particularly gullible Babau occupied while Amiri and the Inquisitor did their thing.

The Cleric crushed the Diplomacy check with Vinzt, so that was little more than a speedbump.

In the final fight, the Bloatmage (who had previously identified what a Hezrou could do), prepared a counterspell, and countered the opening Blasphemy (although I later discovered that doesn't work against SLAs). The hezrou nearly killed Amiri with a full-attack, and did some damage to other people when she ran. But finally, after three tries, the Bloatmage succeeded with his Persistent Baleful Polymorph, and turned the hezrou into a bunny rabbit. The fluffy bunny rabit still got off an Unholy Blight before it was reduced to a bloody smear by the Cleric, but didn't manage to kill anyone.

Liberty's Edge 3/5

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Ha! Titan skelepede chauffeur and bodyguard? Titan centipede gets conscripted and shipped to the Abyss? I don't know which I love more!


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Played this yesterday and our party didn’t do so well as some others. Really like some of the creative solutions with the ‘pede mentioned here!

There were four of us going in (Ranger 10, Rogue 10, Evoker Wizard 9 and 7 Ranger). With the average of our party, it worked out for 7-8 subtier. Should be fine, right?

That centipede was devastating, even at 7-8. We were trampled on surprise, beat us on initiative (my second attack from it) and then killed me when I tried to Acrobatics away, failed and therefore provoked. It was either that or receive (probable) full attacks from it.

Fortunately everyone else got away from it, was able to counter and kill it. But all the elves died, and being down to three party members, decided to head back home.

Dark Archive 4/5

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Note: If the centipede actually trampled on the surprise round, everyone needs to reread the trample rules. It's explicitly a full-round action to perform.

Grand Lodge 2/5 RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Hobbun wrote:
It was either that or receive (probable) full attacks from it.

I wonder how many slam attacks a creature with a bazillion legs gets on a full-attack...


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

I’m not sure now if it was on the surprise round. I do know it acted before all of us on the trample. It basically busted out of the ground and trampled.

Dark Archive 4/5

I did roll very high when I rolled initiative for it, so it's definitely possible. It's unfortunate that you failed your tumble, although in the future remember that the bigger they are, the harder it is to tumble away.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Yes, I know. I just didn’t have a lot of options at that point. I thought about going full defense, but I had figured one of it’s (probably) many attacks would get through. I was only at 12 HP at that moment, all it took was one to hit.

Dark Archive 4/5

The truly unfortunate part then is that it actually only has the one attack, and no Combat Reflexes to speak of. Did anyone try to use knowledge checks to figure out what they were dealing with?


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

I’m actually surprised, I thought it would get more attacks than one. Well, made the wrong call, should have gone full defense.

I made a Knowledge check, but only gained one piece of information, it wasn’t how many attacks it has.

Grand Lodge 2/5 RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

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Hobbun wrote:

I’m actually surprised, I thought it would get more attacks than one. Well, made the wrong call, should have gone full defense.

I made a Knowledge check, but only gained one piece of information, it wasn’t how many attacks it has.

Player: "I got a XX on my Knowledge (huge-ass monstrosities) check. What do I know?"

GM: "You know that now would be a good time to make peace with your gods."


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Heh Yeah, exactly. :)

But dying is part of the game. I’ve had a good run with him (in no deaths) until now. And as I said, I had plenty of prestige and gold to bring him back.

I think the biggest disappointment I have is not being able to play this one again. It felt like a wasted scenario as I died in the very first combat and really didn’t get to experience the scenario at all.

Yes, I know you can replay scenarios with GM stars, but don’t have any right now and not sure when I’ll start GMing.

5/5

You can also replay it for no credit, just to experience it! Don't shy away from that either, especially if you help a table make in the future.

5/5

Adam Mogyorodi wrote:
The centipede then trampled them all. Its movement wasn't quite enough to get onto them and then out again, but I believe the rule is that he goes back to his last legal occupied space, or the nearest space that is open if its closer. I'm not sure I adjudicated that entirely properly, so if someone wants to correct me feel free!

That's how I was going to rule it as well, until a player reminded me that creatures of 3 or more size categories different can occupy the same space.

RainyDayNinja wrote:
In the final fight, the Bloatmage (who had previously identified what a Hezrou could do), prepared a counterspell, and countered the opening Blasphemy (although I later discovered that doesn't work against SLAs).

Ignoring the spell-like ability part... how does a 10th level arcane caster counter a 7th level divine spell?... Oh! Just dispel magic? That's pretty sweet actually, given the caster levels.

I'll try to write-up a full report soon, but had an absolute blast running my table through this!

Dark Archive 4/5

Majuba wrote:
Adam Mogyorodi wrote:
The centipede then trampled them all. Its movement wasn't quite enough to get onto them and then out again, but I believe the rule is that he goes back to his last legal occupied space, or the nearest space that is open if its closer. I'm not sure I adjudicated that entirely properly, so if someone wants to correct me feel free!
That's how I was going to rule it as well, until a player reminded me that creatures of 3 or more size categories different can occupy the same space.

Ooh, do you have a link/page number? I was looking for that rule!

Grand Lodge 2/5 RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

It's one of the list items under "Moving Through a Square" in the Combat chapter.

Sovereign Court 5/5

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Card Game, Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Just reporting that I used one of my GM Star Replays on this one because it was awesome.

I got to grapple the titan centipede!

Dark Archive 4/5

Cheers, found it. I'll know for next time.

Sovereign Court 5/5 Venture-Captain, West Virginia—Charleston aka Netopalis

As the Cleric in RDN's report, and as someone who plans to run this soon, I'd like to ask for a bit of clarification in regards to the dispel counterspell. My reading of the glossary was that a SLA could be countered using Dispel Magic, as that functions as a dispel, but that you couldn't cast the same spell to counter. The glossary specifically says that SLAs may be dispelled. Any thoughts? If there's been any definite word on the matter, I'd like to see it.

Grand Lodge 2/5 RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Netopalis wrote:
As the Cleric in RDN's report, and as someone who plans to run this soon, I'd like to ask for a bit of clarification in regards to the dispel counterspell. My reading of the glossary was that a SLA could be countered using Dispel Magic, as that functions as a dispel, but that you couldn't cast the same spell to counter. The glossary specifically says that SLAs may be dispelled. Any thoughts? If there's been any definite word on the matter, I'd like to see it.
Dispel Magic wrote:
Counterspell: When dispel magic is used in this way, the spell targets a spellcaster and is cast as a counterspell. Unlike a true counterspell, however, dispel magic may not work; you must make a dispel check to counter the other spellcaster's spell.

You make a "dispel check", but you're still using it as a counterspell and the effect of a successful check is to "counter" the spell, not to "dispel" it.

3/5 RPG Superstar 2013 Top 16

Netopalis wrote:
As the Cleric in RDN's report, and as someone who plans to run this soon, I'd like to ask for a bit of clarification in regards to the dispel counterspell. My reading of the glossary was that a SLA could be countered using Dispel Magic, as that functions as a dispel, but that you couldn't cast the same spell to counter. The glossary specifically says that SLAs may be dispelled. Any thoughts? If there's been any definite word on the matter, I'd like to see it.

Dispelling and counterspelling aren't the same thing.

Dispel Magic wrote:
Dispel magic can dispel (but not counter) spell-like effects just as it does spells.

Sovereign Court 5/5 Venture-Captain, West Virginia—Charleston aka Netopalis

Ah, there we go. Missed that bit. That definitely makes that encounter 10x harder, given that practically every group will, at minimum, take the STR penalty.

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

RainyDayNinja wrote:
Netopalis wrote:
As the Cleric in RDN's report, and as someone who plans to run this soon, I'd like to ask for a bit of clarification in regards to the dispel counterspell. My reading of the glossary was that a SLA could be countered using Dispel Magic, as that functions as a dispel, but that you couldn't cast the same spell to counter. The glossary specifically says that SLAs may be dispelled. Any thoughts? If there's been any definite word on the matter, I'd like to see it.

Dispelling and counterspelling aren't the same thing.

Dispel Magic wrote:
Dispel magic can dispel (but not counter) spell-like effects just as it does spells.

Further, page 304 of the Bestiary notes that "Spell-like abilities cannot be used to counter spell, nor can they be counterspelled."

Personally, I love counterspelling, especially with dispel magic. Doing so doesn't care about resistances, immunities, ongoing spell effects, etc. In addition, it has some very amusing feat support such as Dispel Synergy and Destructive Dispel. I have not yet played a counterspelling expert in PFS, but I recently started one in a home game.

EDIT: Huh, I think I lost track of which thread I was typing in. My second entry is more appropriate for that "counterspelling expert in PFS" thread.

5/5

Netopalis wrote:
Ah, there we go. Missed that bit. That definitely makes that encounter 10x harder, given that practically every group will, at minimum, take the STR penalty.

If they are extraordinarily lucky, they might have up a silence. I suppose an 11th-level cleric could also ready a quickened silence to stop it.

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