#5-04 The Stolen Heir GM Discussion [Spoilers]


GM Discussion

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Grand Lodge

Let's start talking about this new scenario! I haven't read it through entirely yet, but want to check my understanding of something on pp. 5-6. It says that Venture-Captain Brackett "is able to make a DC 15 Knowledge (local) check" (p. 5) and "is able to succeed at a DC 15 Knowledge (local) check" (p. 6). I take this to mean that, if asked, he can provide the information in each 10+ and 15+ paragraph, but nothing higher. Does that fit others' interpretation?

4/5 Venture-Captain, South America aka Draco Bahamut

I guess yes. I am very impressed by this adventure, a perfect political thriller. But i cant find the information about the scrying, where it is ?

Grand Lodge 4/5

Doug Maynard wrote:
Let's start talking about this new scenario! I haven't read it through entirely yet, but want to check my understanding of something on pp. 5-6. It says that Venture-Captain Brackett "is able to make a DC 15 Knowledge (local) check" (p. 5) and "is able to succeed at a DC 15 Knowledge (local) check" (p. 6). I take this to mean that, if asked, he can provide the information in each 10+ and 15+ paragraph, but nothing higher. Does that fit others' interpretation?

That's how I understood it.

Hebert Ricardo Magno wrote:
I guess yes. I am very impressed by this adventure, a perfect politial thriller. But i cant find the information about the scrying, where it is ?

It's in the opening section that you read to the PCs.

4/5 Venture-Captain, South America aka Draco Bahamut

Oh yes, now i saw it.


Some errata/clarifications:

On Koriana Verdothia stats, she has "targeted bomb extract" as an extract, I assume that means targeted bomb admixture.

Koriana is not listed as having her formula book on her, so are we to assume that she has it (just not listed) or is it somewhere else not to be found by the PCs in this adventure?

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

Doug Maynard wrote:
Let's start talking about this new scenario! I haven't read it through entirely yet, but want to check my understanding of something on pp. 5-6. It says that Venture-Captain Brackett "is able to make a DC 15 Knowledge (local) check" (p. 5) and "is able to succeed at a DC 15 Knowledge (local) check" (p. 6). I take this to mean that, if asked, he can provide the information in each 10+ and 15+ paragraph, but nothing higher. Does that fit others' interpretation?

Yes, in effect Brackett can help the PCs to fill in the blanks; however, it's structured as part of the Knowledge checks so that the PCs have a chance to shine first.

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

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CRobledo wrote:

Some errata/clarifications:

On Koriana Verdothia stats, she has "targeted bomb extract" as an extract, I assume that means targeted bomb admixture.

Koriana is not listed as having her formula book on her, so are we to assume that she has it (just not listed) or is it somewhere else not to be found by the PCs in this adventure?

Ah, I remember making sure to remark on the head Galtan's spellbook because people kept on asking about that sort of thing, but I neglected to give the alchemist the same treatment. Please include her formula book along with her hidden stash of paperwork; the formula book contains—for the sake of simplicity—any formulae that she has prepared as extracts.


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John Compton wrote:
Ah, I remember making sure to remark on the head Galtan's spellbook because people kept on asking about that sort of thing, but I neglected to give the alchemist the same treatment. Please include her formula book along with her hidden stash of paperwork; the formula book contains—for the sake of simplicity—any formulae that she has prepared as extracts.

Yep, it was nice to see it on the wizard, was hoping for the same on the alchemist.

Related, I added the templated monster stats, spell books, etc... to the GM Shared Prep folder for anyone looking to run this soon.

Grand Lodge

CRobledo wrote:
Related, I added the templated monster stats, spell books, etc... to the GM Shared Prep folder for anyone looking to run this soon.

Awesome, thanks, man. Your work on #5-01 Glass River Rescue was so helpful to me last Friday! :)

Dark Archive

So this came up at a recent gameday, not at a table I was at, but heard about it afterward. Thought it would make an interesting discussion point in case it comes up at another Gm's table. Spoiler'd for plot points.

Spoiler:
What do you do if the PCs charm the mayor and ask him to reveal his plans right out the door? At the table this happend at, it apparently cut the adventure down to like an hour and a half worth of adventure timing. Not sure if it's detailed in the scenario, since I've only played it and haven't read it.


Aaron Mayhew wrote:

So this came up at a recent gameday, not at a table I was at, but heard about it afterward. Thought it would make an interesting discussion point in case it comes up at another Gm's table. Spoiler'd for plot points.

Just what I'd personally do:

Spoiler:
Charm person indicates the target will "generally help you as long as your interests align" and it should be pretty clear to Tercio that, newly friends or not, their interests do not align. If they rely too heavily on the charm they may miss things that contribute to the secondary success conditions. If they secure Tercio's backing while he is charmed once the duration expires I can't see that he would continue to support the pathfinders which might lead to a mission failure. Whether they can prove Tercio corrupt or not this could be considered attacking Tercio causing the Pathfinder's to be imprisoned. It all really depends on the particulars of how it played out. Detect/seek thoughts or divination could also reveal the plot.

Grand Lodge

How I would probably handle it

Spoiler:
Since he doesn't have any stats listed I would probably use the Mayor stat block in the NPC codex. I don't see the mayor allowing people to just cast spells in his manor all willy nilly. So I would have both the mayor and Merton(if there) try to interrupt the casting, and Merton would arrest them. At the same time the other people in the house would call for the city guard.

So it probably wouldn't even last an hour if someone decided to cast a spell on the mayor without his permission. Probably about 5 minutes as everyone is arrested and then chastised by Major Colson Maldris.

Grand Lodge 3/5 ⦵⦵

Starfinder Charter Superscriber

But saying "I read his mind!" doesn't give you any evidence. My group completely suspected the Mayor due to some crazy diplomacy rolls, and still needed to figure out a way to maneuver the situation to their favor. Party had a 3rd-level Kitsune rogue master of disguise (spent the scenario impersonating an Eagle Knight and then the guard Captain Demrick, a 5th-level Rogue/Gunslinger based on the tv show Archer, a 1st-level halfling gunslinger disguised as a little girl, and then the half-orc fighter - the party's 'straight man.'

As you might guess, we had a lot of fun. I needed to stop GMing a few times to laugh helplessly.

1/5

Request for clarification

If area C2, the reward section reads "If the PCs fail to defeat or negotiate with Koriana..."

Is that intended to be read as:

(the PCs fail to defeat)|(PCs negotiate)

or

(the PCs fail to defeat)|(PCs fail to negotiate)?

I think the former, but could use confirmation.

Thanks!

1/5

bugleyman wrote:

Request for clarification

If area C2, the reward section reads "If the PCs fail to defeat or negotiate with Koriana..."

Is that intended to be read as:

(the PCs fail to defeat)|(PCs negotiate)

or

(the PCs fail to defeat)|(PCs fail to negotiate)?

I think the former, but could use confirmation.

Thanks!

Hmmm...that's probably unclear. How about this:

Do the words "fail to" apply only to "defeat," or do they also apply to "negotiate?"

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

bugleyman wrote:

Request for clarification

If area C2, the reward section reads "If the PCs fail to defeat or negotiate with Koriana..."

Is that intended to be read as:

(the PCs fail to defeat)|(PCs negotiate)

or

(the PCs fail to defeat)|(PCs fail to negotiate)?

I think the former, but could use confirmation.

Thanks!

In effect, the "fail" part references both defeat and negotiate. To not lose the rewards, the PCs must either a) defeat Korianna, b) negotiate with Korianna, or c) resolve the encounter in a way that would fall under the "creative solutions" header. Negotiating—taking the "darker" route, as some might see it—should still be treated as a full success.

The two "expected ways in which PCs would not earn the reward would be a) attacking Korianna then failing to defeat her or b) never making it to the encounter due to having abandoned the mission halfway through the scenario.

1/5

John Compton wrote:

In effect, the "fail" part references both defeat and negotiate. To not lose the rewards, the PCs must either a) defeat Korianna, b) negotiate with Korianna, or c) resolve the encounter in a way that would fall under the "creative solutions" header. Negotiating—taking the "darker" route, as some might see it—should still be treated as a full success.

The two "expected ways in which PCs would not earn the reward would be a) attacking Korianna then failing to defeat her or b) never making it to the encounter due to having abandoned the mission halfway through the scenario.

Thanks, that's what I wanted to know.

Scarab Sages 4/5 RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32

Had a ball running this at low tier tonight.The ending is great, the combats are interesting, and the objectives are unusual.

I would definitely suggest reading the mod several times before running it. Players are encouraged to ask many questions, the answers for which sometimes required a lot of page flipping or quick improvisation. I thought I was pretty well prepared, and my players still managed to surprise me several times with questions.

Questions I hadn't thought about:

Spoiler:
  • Who is running against the consul in the election?
  • Why did Thalia stay behind while everyone else was at the festival?
  • Does Thalia have any close friends we could talk to?

Overall, really liked the adventure, and the role that player choice played in it.

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

ChesterCopperpot wrote:
Had a ball running this at low tier tonight.The ending is great, the combats are interesting, and the objectives are unusual.

I encourage you to write a review of the scenario (as I would even if you hadn't had a great time with it). I learn a great deal about what works and what doesn't from these forum threads, but I also keep a close eye on the product pages.

Shadow Lodge 5/5 ⦵⦵ Venture-Lieutenant, California—San Francisco Bay Area North & East aka thistledown

Played through last night, haven't read it yet. While things were complicated by the party make-up, we had enough diplomacy to pull it off. The combats went easily for us, but the investigative work was the heart of it.

Lots of talking at the manor with Durmot and Tyrisiel. Didn't go great but didn't go terribly.

First place we wanted to go was talk to the mayor's rival (Viviana Talwin? GM had a hard time finding it), but after talking to Durmot about the scrying, we just headed to the Sour house.

We talked the Galtian to go away with his two surviving buds.

Went to Koriana's, went in to talk with her for a bit. Got pitched the idea of how bad the timing would be to go on a corruption hunt, and how the military support would be hard. So we left most of the party there, and two of us went to talk to Sandor Brighton. Talked to him about some military stuff, and convinced him to come to Koriana's shop. Did more talking, and announced our decision to side with Thalia. Koriana flips out, so Sandor says he'll support us and keep Thalia safe, while leaving the shop. Some decent sense motive rolls happen, so we let him go and manage to take down Koriana without killing her. Still didn't quite trust Sandor, but seemed like the best option. In the denoument, it sounded like it was.

The extra papers in the Sour house were confusing. Nobody had disable devise so we busted open the box, apparently destroying the contents. I came up with casting mending on them, which got everything but the scroll of blood biography put back together (best caster with it was only lvl 4.) But then nobody had knowledge history or nobility, so we had a hard time trying to link it to the current case.


In prepping this, one thing I really like is the first fight. At first I thought it was weak for the parties I tend to see at my table, but then I realized their tactics are all centered around the hazard. It's an easy trap for for anyone who charges straight at the enemy. It should prove a challenge for the group, while the showing off gives us an in character method of scaling back difficulty if the fight goes against the party. Intelligent tactics are unusual enough, but built in ways to back off are gold. I hope I see more encounters like these.

The Exchange 5/5 Venture-Captain, Washington D.C. aka Grolick

Just curious, but are any of the maps here on a map pack? the scenario doesn't list any names, but thought I'd check.


No map packs or flip matts in this one.


I can't find anything to indicate where the entrance to the cellar is if the PCs don't trip the sinkhole, but the search DC for the lockbox and the conditional description of the place seems to indicate it's possible to get there without caving in the ground. Is there a trapdoor or a staircase somewhere?

Also, what happens if the players simply can't reach a consensus on which ending to aim for? Do I let them hash it out for a bit and then take a vote? Roll a die?

Grand Lodge 4/5

Jeff Mahood wrote:

I can't find anything to indicate where the entrance to the cellar is if the PCs don't trip the sinkhole, but the search DC for the lockbox and the conditional description of the place seems to indicate it's possible to get there without caving in the ground. Is there a trapdoor or a staircase somewhere?

Also, what happens if the players simply can't reach a consensus on which ending to aim for? Do I let them hash it out for a bit and then take a vote? Roll a die?

Top right of page 10:

Quote:
A charred oak door under the stairs—obscured by ash, dust, and lichen (DC 15 Perception check to notice)—provides access to area B3, the cellars underground.


I failed my perception check. Thanks, Jeff. Any takers on the first question?

Dark Archive

Well democracy is in the Andoran spirit of things! :D

4/5 Venture-Captain, South America aka Draco Bahamut

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I ran the scenario last sunday and it went in a very mysoginisc way. Somehow the players commented that Thalia was 30 or something and still single, and considered giving her do Korianna not because of the promise of helping PS, but because she assured them that the Andares daughter would be married to a rich man of a far away land. Thalia was deeply offended.
After the adventure, they encauraged her that as now that she was rich, she should go after the Galtan leader and propose to him (they really thought they were in love with each other, as he bought the book to her and she asked them to not hurt him).

Dark Archive 5/5 ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Minnesota—Minneapolis aka Silbeg

Jeff Mahood wrote:
Also, what happens if the players simply can't reach a consensus on which ending to aim for? Do I let them hash it out for a bit and then take a vote? Roll a die?

I am running this scenario this weekend. If the PCs don't come to a quick decision (at the alchemist's, right?), I would start doing things to escalate the tension. Thalia would be arguing that Koriana's solution is not better than slavery (and if it comes up, she'd be saying that she hasn't married, because in the name of Freedom she refuses to marry for any reasons other than for love. Of course, the writing between the lines would be that her father has arranged to have suitors that didn't meet his standards "removed"). Koriana would counter talking about how if the silly girl knew what was good for her, she would have found a husband already.

The two would start arguing, louder and louder, with the bodyguards becoming more agitated by the moment as well. Eventually, if we are running low on time, I would have Koriana first drink her mutagen (applied to Dexterity so that it doesn't affect her Charisma) to show she's running low on patience, especially if any PCs are getting too uppity), followed by her targeted bomb extract. Basically, she'll keep "prepping" in a very obvious way. Her body guards would be moving forward, slightly, and drawing weapons, based on her "cues".

Of course, if this is breaking "Run As Written", and someone points this out to me here, I'll likely change how I do this. Of course, hopefully, it won't matter.

5/5 RPG Superstar 2008 Top 16 aka Sir_Wulf

I’ve run this one twice: The first time, it worked very well. The second time, events tended to go off the rails, with a ninja party member sneaking into the Consul’s home in the dead of night to search for clues, and others extensively questioned their captured Galtan mercenaries and made repeated visits to the local temple of Abadar.

Players quickly suspected that Thalia faked her kidnapping in order to elope with some swain of whom her father wouldn’t approve. Since she was something of an “old maid” by rural Andoren standards, party members wanted to know why she hadn’t married yet and whether she had a sweetheart. They were initially told that “Thalia’s always been more interested in her books of philosophy than in marriage,” eventually discovering that “Thalia’s father didn’t approve of the suitors she wanted to marry, so she has stubbornly refused to consider marriage with the wealthy landowners he would prefer.” Her father had encouraged “unsuitable” suitors to seek their fortunes elsewhere, ensuring that no one would hire them locally while having his business partners offer them opportunities in distant regions.

The party wanted to know why she didn’t go to the festival with the rest of the household. The Consul advised at first told the party that she didn’t feel well, but Dorabell later admitted that Thalia and the Consul had been arguing earlier in the day (behind closed doors), so she refused to attend the festival with him. “He insisted that she should go, but she claimed that she wanted nothing to do with him and was staying home.” (The Consul sent one of his employees to pass Koriana a coded note that Thalia would be home alone during the festival. The servants didn’t note anything of this, as workers and overseers regularly stop by the estate.)

The player characters wanted to question Thalia’s friends and asked whether she had any teachers or companions who spent time with her and might have information about her recent activities. I decided that a local priest of Abadar had served as her tutor. He knew that she had been looking up information about her family history in the church’s records.


We ran this yesterday, with Diego Winterborg (former VC of Denmark) as GM - and he did an awesome job! :) We all had great fun (6 man party) and even though we're mostly a bunch of combat optimized killers, we almost didn't participate in combat for the entire scenario. And we had a blast!

The scenario seemed very well written with lots of opportunities for roleplaying, and many active choices for the players - which had real impact on the way we dealt with the different encounters. That was really cool to experience. And even though we are, as I said, quite combat optimized, we had a great time.

I'll recommend this scenario to anyone!


Oh man. I ran this at our last Game Day and it was fun! I didn't think that the players would end how they would, but it was great!

They ended up taking Koriana and Thalia to Bryton who, from what I gathered from the info about Koriana's notes, was in on Tercio's deals. He agreed to send Eagle Knight support if they turned over the notes from Thalia's diary, which they gladly did.

Dark Archive 5/5 ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Minnesota—Minneapolis aka Silbeg

I ran this for a group of total newbies on Saturday, and they had a GREAT time. I really played up the antics of the Fren... I mean Galtan mercenaries. They were taunting, showing off, pulling antics that they should never have done were they being "serious" combatants.

Generally speaking, they did very well. The combats, save for the final one at Koriana's, were not very difficult. They did have some issues negotiating at the manor, not quite getting that the kidnapper was saying she was a "runaway Galtan noble", while she was actually the daughter of an Andoran politician.

They also haven't quite grasped what sort of questions to ask at a briefing... I tried to prompt some of the questions, and gave some of the details later, but this may have hampered their investigation.

However, the discussion at Koriana's was quite interesting. One character (their sorcerer) was all for selling Thalia out. Others in the group (especially the Andoran cleric of Erastil) were adamantly against sending her away.

As time was running out, I had Koriana "drink some tea" (which was, of course, her extracts and mutagens, in preparation for the fight - the fact that it was probably not tea was not lost on them). Her bombs were particularly vicious vs level 1 characters, even though it was only 1d6+6... when they only have 10-13hp, that's a LOT! her bodyguards got a few good hits in, and the sorcerer, missing his target by rolling a "1", ended up nauseating himself as he blew up random concoctions on the shelves. Their fighter went down, the paladin fled with 1hp, and the cleric of Erastil did as well. It came down to the fact that Koriana got herself cornered, without bombs.

I guess the mistake I probably made was summing things up without giving them a chance to chase down Bryton... making it hard for them to get the secondary goal. I am considering retconning that for them, via email, giving them a chance to make the roll on that (and thus get the 2nd prestige point).

5/5

Silbeg wrote:
I guess the mistake I probably made was summing things up without giving them a chance to chase down Bryton... making it hard for them to get the secondary goal. I am considering retconning that for them, via email, giving them a chance to make the roll on that (and thus get the 2nd prestige point).

It is *very* tough to track all the different methods of getting the prestige and faction missions (and which of them conflict with each other!)

If you feel they would have gone to Bryton, I'd encourage this.

Dark Archive 5/5 ⦵⦵ Venture-Captain, Minnesota—Minneapolis aka Silbeg

Well, I gave them the chance (via email, etc) to rectify the situation. I recapped the information, gave them the chance to find Koriana's hidden documents. They then made their way to Sander Bryton, and when he asked to "disappear" the documents, he was met with an instant "Done!"

Unfortunately, they rolled a 2 on the die... and failed, even with the +12 for the documents.

Well, I feel better having given them the chance to succeed, at least.


So, I ran this game with an Andoran PC in the group. To say he failed miserably in the written Andoran 'secondary quests' is an understatement. No one searched Thalia's room. No one found the alchemist's notes. So, no proof.

In fact, after an amusing (for me, at least) bit of in-character soul-searching and discussion, he let the alchemist keep Thalia, on gaining the alchemist's word that she would watch over Thalia; and the hopes that the spitfire revolutionary-in-training might come back from exile one day with more power/backing to overthrow her family's corrupt rule.

Said PC made it clear that after all was said and done, he was going to petition his Venture Captain and bring to his attention the obvious corruption going on. This is outside of the scenario's purview, and with no physical proof, does the PC still miss out on the Andoran boon? Does the Venture Captain have his tricorne'd head so far up his own rump to ignore serious allegations of abuse of power in his own country? Or should I still award the Boon to the player?

The Exchange RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

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I ran this adventure this past weekend.

Best bit of dialogue:
PC: Why would you want to send her away?!
Koriana: Have you been listening to her? She doesn't shut up!

A dashing rogue PC decided to make a play for Thalia's affections. She was wooed, and agreed to go with him to Absalom. The player said it would be a great back-story to explain why he was constantly adventuring.

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

Draven Torakhan wrote:

So, I ran this game with an Andoran PC in the group. To say he failed miserably in the written Andoran 'secondary quests' is an understatement. No one searched Thalia's room. No one found the alchemist's notes. So, no proof.

In fact, after an amusing (for me, at least) bit of in-character soul-searching and discussion, he let the alchemist keep Thalia, on gaining the alchemist's word that she would watch over Thalia; and the hopes that the spitfire revolutionary-in-training might come back from exile one day with more power/backing to overthrow her family's corrupt rule.

Said PC made it clear that after all was said and done, he was going to petition his Venture Captain and bring to his attention the obvious corruption going on. This is outside of the scenario's purview, and with no physical proof, does the PC still miss out on the Andoran boon? Does the Venture Captain have his tricorne'd head so far up his own rump to ignore serious allegations of abuse of power in his own country? Or should I still award the Boon to the player?

Telling Maldris that there's corruption does a little to help him decide what to do next, but he can hardly secure a warrant to investigate the corruption officially just by hearsay or limited eyewitness testimony; it's too easy for someone to deny said evidence. Being able to bring in written records, though means that Maldris has something more substantial to wave in front of a judge (or whatever authority) to help get things moving. What you have mentioned is not sufficient to gain the Andoran boon.

Two side points, though: Sending Thalia away by no means writes her out of the story, and I'm intrigued by the idea of her just using her quiet exile as a way to build up revolutionary strength. Also, a lack of evidence merely means that Maldris may have to take matters into his own hands, not trusting "the system" to police its own people.

There are lots of fun directions this scenario's conclusion can take the faction's story.

The Exchange RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

John Compton wrote:

Also, a lack of evidence merely means that Maldris may have to take matters into his own hands, not trusting "the system" to police its own people.

I am surprised he doesn't just ask a group of Pathfinder field agents to murder people. Maybe he's mellowing.

5/5 ⦵⦵⦵

Chris Mortika wrote:
John Compton wrote:

Also, a lack of evidence merely means that Maldris may have to take matters into his own hands, not trusting "the system" to police its own people.

I am surprised he doesn't just ask a group of Pathfinder field agents to murder people. Maybe he's mellowing.

I would be surprised if a lot of groups wouldn't consider that a "Creative solution" to taking the father out of power. Kill the dad ,dump two dead kidnapers outside his window, smear some blood on whatever blunt object is handy in his bedroom and call it a day. He "died from his wounds after beating the location of his daughter out of the schmucks sent to collect the randsome note" and we got his daughter back.

The Exchange RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16

And it's Thalia who gets to decide whether the family springs for a raise dead...

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

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BigNorseWolf wrote:
Chris Mortika wrote:
John Compton wrote:

Also, a lack of evidence merely means that Maldris may have to take matters into his own hands, not trusting "the system" to police its own people.

I am surprised he doesn't just ask a group of Pathfinder field agents to murder people. Maybe he's mellowing.
Quote:

I would be surprised if a lot of groups wouldn't consider that a "Creative solution" to taking the father out of power. Kill the dad ,dump two dead kidnapers outside his window, smear some blood on whatever blunt object is handy in his bedroom and call it a day. He "died from his wounds after beating the location of his daughter out of the schmucks sent to collect the randsome note" and we got his daughter back.

*cough* We're gonna need some more check boxes!

Grand Lodge 5/5 Venture-Captain, Arizona—Phoenix aka TriOmegaZero

Chris Mortika wrote:
John Compton wrote:

Also, a lack of evidence merely means that Maldris may have to take matters into his own hands, not trusting "the system" to police its own people.

I am surprised he doesn't just ask a group of Pathfinder field agents to murder people. Maybe he's mellowing.

Best part of the individual faction missions going away, I think. :)

The Exchange

Played this today, 6 playersa (4 level 1s, two 3s), as a Level 3 witch.
Accidentally shut down the second half of the scenario when, knowing I probably wasn't going to be able to tell if Koriana was lying or not, I discussed just shutting her down and pouring the Elixir of Truth down her throat (after verifying her handwriting based on the items on display in her shop).

Monk grabbed her, and she got slumbered. Guards came in, got totally worked over. Poured the potion down her throat, woke her up, she failed her will save, told a truth, and just gave up. Called the halfing in, and she copped up. Kinda anticlimatic, but such is life. Would have liked a bit more intrigue and investigation, but look forward to running it at some point.

Paizo Employee 5/5 Developer

Belryan wrote:

Played this today, 6 playersa (4 level 1s, two 3s), as a Level 3 witch.

Accidentally shut down the second half of the scenario when, knowing I probably wasn't going to be able to tell if Koriana was lying or not, I discussed just shutting her down and pouring the Elixir of Truth down her throat (after verifying her handwriting based on the items on display in her shop).

Monk grabbed her, and she got slumbered. Guards came in, got totally worked over. Poured the potion down her throat, woke her up, she failed her will save, told a truth, and just gave up. Called the halfing in, and she copped up. Kinda anticlimatic, but such is life. Would have liked a bit more intrigue and investigation, but look forward to running it at some point.

Regarding the bolded text, would you have liked more intrigue and investigation than was written into the scenario or more than your group experienced (thanks to a creative solution)?

Silver Crusade

Just ran this, and the module has just about as much intrigue as a one-off adventure can have; any more and you risk the players zoning out or missing important details. Besides that, she's willing to start ponying up details about what's really going on anyway as a way to make a deal with the characters. The real part of that encounter is the roleplay choice of "Do we help Thalia and seemingly auto-fail the mission, or do we effectively sell her into slavery for the good of the Society?"

The Exchange

John Compton wrote:
Belryan wrote:

Played this today, 6 playersa (4 level 1s, two 3s), as a Level 3 witch.

Accidentally shut down the second half of the scenario when, knowing I probably wasn't going to be able to tell if Koriana was lying or not, I discussed just shutting her down and pouring the Elixir of Truth down her throat (after verifying her handwriting based on the items on display in her shop).

Monk grabbed her, and she got slumbered. Guards came in, got totally worked over. Poured the potion down her throat, woke her up, she failed her will save, told a truth, and just gave up. Called the halfing in, and she copped up. Kinda anticlimatic, but such is life. Would have liked a bit more intrigue and investigation, but look forward to running it at some point.

Regarding the bolded text, would you have liked more intrigue and investigation than was written into the scenario or more than your group experienced (thanks to a creative solution)?

Yeah, since we missed all the lovely discussion with Koriana by jumping her, I feel bad short circuiting the end of the module... but as a witch with an Elixir of Truth handy that we got earlier in the scenario (not to mention the scroll of Seek Thoughts) I kinda felt it was the easiest thing to do - start with some witch shenanigans, force feed her the potion, weaken her saves further and interrogate her. Having read the scenario now, we missed out on a lot of the negotiation and all that, so when I say I would have liked more intrigue and investigation, I mean that I shouldn't have been so creative.

That being said, I think it would have been nice to have some way of having her "brown haired Taldan man" disguise self spell be more of a red herring. Perhaps finding the heir, she could recognize the handwriting as Koriana's but perhaps the description of a brown haired Taldan man could result in a false lead due to a Gather Information check. That way it would be up to the Pathfinders to independently verify the random Taldan's alibi, as well as verifying Koriana's handwriting in order to determine which was the guilty party. Something like that.

That way, if we had, for instance found what we believed to be the person matching the "brown haired Taldan man" description and then jumped him prematurely and forced the Elixir of Truth down his throat... well then whoops, there'd probably be some serious consequences for going the Murder Hobo route...

The Exchange

Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

When does the player handout get distributed? Or is that just for taldan party members ?


Is there an Andoran handout? I've played this and I thought I was given one, but don't see it in the pdf. Going to run this in a few days, so need it if there is one.

The Exchange

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Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber

didnt' see one. but the major is at the briefing to give his instructions in person. the lady gloriana isn't, so i can see taldans being given the handout , but if it happened in text, it wasn't bolded or i missed it.

great investigative and roleplaying mod. but if the pc's miss the rolls to uncover clues, they're kind of S.O.L. at finding things.

Spoiler:

my players missed the roll to find clues in the daughter's room. but got the rumor about a galtan buying books. however, they didn't share what they were looking for with the halfling, so he couldn't recommend directions to the hideout.

having the galtan clue is supposed to give them a +2 to gather information , but its not very clear how that works, do they gather information looking for the hideout, and get a +2 if they know they're looking for galtans and get directed by people to the haunted fields?

they wanted to spend a lot of time checking out other servants, or tracking down the mayor's political adversaries. or finding out if the daughter was seeing someone in town.

approaching the hideout was kinda kablewey too.
they approached at night, having a party with a lot of low-light and darkvision.
and caught the galtans unaware. so they had encounter b1 and b2 happen at the same time.
in which, its hard to have the full fight, if the daughter is screaming that its all a mistake. the combat can be over very quickly.

its hard to have a ceasefire, and start to talk, and then demand money. when the players refused to pay up, the surviving galtans fled rather than fight again.

likewise the shop fight, was just a talking encounter.


it can be a great scenario for low level characters, since they can at least try to talk their way through the whole thing.

for high level characters, i feel sorry if they're itching for a fight, but avoid them all, or only get to fight a few dogs or wolves.

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