Agents of Shield


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Sovereign Court

Evan Tarlton wrote:
I like the fact that both Ward and Skye had valid points. She was stirring the pot without regard as to what would happen, but that doesn't negate her point about self-appointed saviors hiding things from people.

True, and I do hope they explore those ideas at some point, rather than just have SHIELD as the out and out good guys.

Liberty's Edge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Am I the only one who was disappointed that the black bald hero with strength and resilience

Spoiler:
was NOT Luke Cage ?

Kalshane wrote:
Avatar-1 wrote:

I had high hopes, but I thought it was kind of ridiculously loaded with cliches.

** spoiler omitted **

The bit with the car at the end was a reference to the original SHIELD story from 1965, a full twenty years before ** spoiler omitted **. The car is from the same era and Coulson makes reference earlier in the episode to it being early spy tech. The fact that a movie copied the design 20 years later doesn't stop it being a reference to the original story and fun nod to fans of the comics.

True, but the way the sequence is filmed is EXACTLY the same as in Return. So it is both a reference to the comics AND the movie.


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It would be nice if they increased the color spectrum a little. The only African-Americans we saw were

Spoiler:
a scientist that was on screen for what a total of 3 minutes or so and the "guy" they were trying to catch who eventually goes all maniac on them (dangerous black guy in a hoody? come one you can do better than that).

I mean I thought the white quota was already pretty high what with generic white agent #23 they recruited, then they bring in some brits, like saying, "We just raised you double white."

The Avengers had a similar issue, which is evident at the beginning when an African American kid is looking at a bunch of Avenger toys and you realize there is no person of color (other than green of course) on the team. Of course they had Fury, but it would be nice to have some variety with the other characters. Of course with the superheroes it is a problem with the comics as with anything. But the Agents show can't really claim that issue when they are making up characters whole clothe.

EDIT: And yes, a couple of Asian women don't cut it. That is basically just more fan service to nerdy white guys as everyone knows.


They are probably saving Luke Cage for the movies...

Shadow Lodge

pres man wrote:
Of course they had Fury, but it would be nice to have some variety with the other characters.

Not saying you are wrong, but being that they have already rewritten history to make Nick black in the first place, it would probably not be well received to start rewriting everyone to fill the race quota. Did the same thing with Heimdall (and even gave him the Soul Reaver), we have a total of 1 pre-existing character, 1 Asian, 2+ Black (I really expect Fury to make a few active appearances, and if Gunn is a main character that's 4), 2 European, and a white Americans. Pretty even split between male and females. I think they are doing fine, personally.

Rynjin wrote:
Beckett wrote:
she full on kicks a random innocent guy in the groin just because.

"Just because"?

** spoiler omitted **

Just sayin'.

:):
Your right. She had just heard on the bull horn that he was getting ready to explode for being emotional, and has seen him stat glowing and flick her van's door of with his pinky, so lets start a food fight in the middle of a crowded station, and instead of, oh, I don't know slap or punch, lets kick him in the junk so we can start a fight with a bunch of innocents to make Sylar mad even more. I mean, it's not like she didn't just hear that he would kill everyone inside or anything. :) Must be awesome to be a rocket scientist. . .

Thanks Rinjin, now I really hate here character, ha ha ha

Shadow Lodge

The black raven - I dunno, I'd have been kinda disappointed if Luke Cage was only as big as J. August Richards. I'm not saying he has to be Thor huge, but bigger than Gunn.


Beckett wrote:
pres man wrote:
Of course they had Fury, but it would be nice to have some variety with the other characters.
Not saying you are wrong, but being that they have already rewritten history to make Nick black in the first place, it would probably not be well received to start rewriting everyone to fill the race quota. Did the same thing with Heimdall (and even gave him the Soul Reaver), we have a total of 1 pre-existing character, 1 Asian, 2+ Black (I really expect Fury to make a few active appearances, and if Gunn is a main character that's 4), 2 European, and a white Americans. Pretty even split between male and females. I think they are doing fine, personally.

To be clear, Fury was made black in the comics first (Earth 616?), and was not made black just for the movies. Heimdall I haven't heard of being black in the comics, but I don't follow them closely anymore.

Spoiler:
I don't see Gunn being a main character, he had defective tech that had to be removed/neutralized and he has a kid to take care of once he gets straightened out. He was the "monster of the week". You might see him make a cameo at some point, but he's not going to be counted on as a regular. Likewise Fury if he makes a cameo (and I honestly can't see Jackson doing anything more than literally calling it in with as busy as he is making movies), he shouldn't be considered a regular. Now if Book becomes a regular that would be something.

Still, the brand new characters didn't need to be white, so no problem with Coulson and Hill. But hell you can have "Europeans" of any racial group. You want a couple of Brits, why not make one of them of say Indian descent or something. Hell look at actors like Idris Elba, there are plenty of racial diversity in other countries.

I don't really have a huge problem with it, I am a white male after all. It just became pretty obvious and it just struck me as lazy casting.

Shadow Lodge

I'd wager on Hill and Doctor "Book" becoming reoccurring characters. Hill probably not until HIMYM ends, though.

I think this show might also act as kind of a testing ground for some of Marvel's B-listers, get a audience reaction to them before putting them in their own show/film. I'd love to see Luke Cage at some point...and if Jessica Jones and/or Danny Rand came along for the ride with him, all the better. Cloak and Dagger would be another couple that might show up (based on the fact that a C+D show was rumored for a while). Agent Carter is also being strongly rumored as a TV show recently...see the Marvel One-Shot on the IM3 blu-ray.


Beckett wrote:


** spoiler omitted **

Spoiler:
Your logic doesn't make much sense here. What would slapping or punching the crazy strong guy do? He got hit with a metal pole and it just pissed him off. The "armor piercing slap" trope only works in comedies.

She saw an opportunity to escape and she took it. There is nothing wrong with that. Most people who've been kidnapped, ESPECIALLY against people they can't fight back against, would have done the same in her shoes.

It's not a reason to hate her character unless you're determined to do so for some reason I can't fathom.

Shadow Lodge

Well, I really don't like her, but it's mostly because I find her character unbelievable and kind of annoying. I was just kind of saying.

I meant slapping or punching the random innocent guy vs kicking him in the junk.

Scarab Sages

Beckett wrote:

Loved all the little inside jokes and references. Liked pretty much all the characters (especially "Preacher") and Gunn, except that hacker girl. Far too over the top, and she full on kicks a random innocent guy in the groin just because. Really just didnt like her at all and hope they ditch her soon.

Shes an asset, and we know what happens to "assets" once the missions over. :)

They should have used the girl from "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo", or somebody very similar.


Her arms were a bit too far away to do so. If you watch the scene again she practically had to go limp and trust Gunn-bot to hold her up as she kicked the guy.

Besides, she probably saved him from an ass-whoopin' by putting him down like that. =)

Sovereign Court

Artanthos wrote:
Beckett wrote:

Loved all the little inside jokes and references. Liked pretty much all the characters (especially "Preacher") and Gunn, except that hacker girl. Far too over the top, and she full on kicks a random innocent guy in the groin just because. Really just didnt like her at all and hope they ditch her soon.

Shes an asset, and we know what happens to "assets" once the missions over. :)

They should have used the girl from "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo", or somebody very similar.

Man I can't stand Naomi Rapace. At all.


As Whedon Pilots go, it was very Whedon Pilot. And not the FIREFLY kind of Whedon Pilot (the only one where he knocked it out of the park, IMO). It was okay. It certainly wasn't awful, but it was very rushed with lots of quickfire character introductions and a lack of a compelling central plot. There was some funny lines and some good potential in a few of the characters, but at this time the ensemble is not gelling as much as I'd like.

Still, early days and it can only get better. Hopefully.

Quote:
And I'm not sure where you get the idea he likes to crap on characters. Kill them off, sure (though his frequent partner Tim Minear has a far deadlier reputation there) but I don't recall him ruining any character's legacy.

Depends on how you define 'ruins'.

Spoiler:
Willow did a lot of evil things. Sure, she spent half of Season 7 atoning for it and the 'evil magic' thing mitigated it a little, but she did go to the dark well quite a lot and it's arguable how much she atoned for it later on.

The planned second season FIREFLY would have had an episode where Inara was gang-raped by Reapers. I'm glad we didn't get that one. There's going 'dark' and then there's going so dark that you can't really come back, and that was on that side of things.

Quote:
They should have used the girl from "The Girl with the Dragon Tattoo", or somebody very similar.

I don't think she'd do it, not with her film career.


From the look and sound of things, they'll be borrowing the "Extremis" project from the Iron Man movies (and the comic prior to that).

Spoiler:
The exploding failed experiments is a dead giveaway. They already featured Maya Hansen in Ironman 3, so the doctor can't be her. It will be interesting to see where they take this as a story arc, especially if the future experiments can do all the things from the comic line, like breathing fire.

Shadow Lodge

Shadowborn wrote:
From the look and sound of things, they'll be borrowing the "Extremis" project from the Iron Man movies (and the comic prior to that). ** spoiler omitted **

It easn't JUST Extremis, it was a big ol' origin McGuffin stew. It had Extremis, Super Soldier serum, Chitauri tech, and gamma radiation.

RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32

Uzzy wrote:
Evan Tarlton wrote:
I like the fact that both Ward and Skye had valid points. She was stirring the pot without regard as to what would happen, but that doesn't negate her point about self-appointed saviors hiding things from people.
True, and I do hope they explore those ideas at some point, rather than just have SHIELD as the out and out good guys.

Actually, since both Ward and Skye are right, exploring those ideas is not exclusive with them both being good guys.

pres man wrote:
It would be nice if they increased the color spectrum a little. The only African-Americans we saw were

Agreed. Agent Ward should have been a black man (and more personable too). ... or better, Ward should have been an Asian man, and Melinda May should have been a black chick. - this better avoids the typical stereotypes.

pres man wrote:
The Avengers had a similar issue, which is evident at the beginning when an African American kid is looking at a bunch of Avenger toys and you realize there is no person of color (other than green of course) on the team. Of course they had Fury, but it would be nice to have some variety with the other characters. Of course with the superheroes it is a problem with the comics as with anything. But the Agents show can't really claim that issue when they are making up characters whole clothe.

Yes, those characters were created in the early 1960s, and "standards" were different then.

pres man wrote:
EDIT: And yes, a couple of Asian women don't cut it. That is basically just more fan service to nerdy white guys as everyone knows.

Beware of making blanket statements like that.

Dark Archive

Kthulhu wrote:
Shadowborn wrote:
From the look and sound of things, they'll be borrowing the "Extremis" project from the Iron Man movies (and the comic prior to that). ** spoiler omitted **
It easn't JUST Extremis, it was a big ol' origin McGuffin stew. It had Extremis, Super Soldier serum, Chitauri tech, and gamma radiation.

If they could have found a way to get some Asgardian DNA in there, they probably would have done that, too!

(And, if they had permission to use them, I'm sure some mutant growth hormone, irradiated spider venom and cosmic rays would have made an appearance!)

Mix it all together and 'Behold my creation! More-messed-up-origin than the love-child of Hawkman and Psylocke Man!' "Bleearggh!"

Shadow Lodge

I think in the comics that they discovered Asgardian DNA can't really be used for anything, but they can clone Asgardians (which doesn't work too well). It's mostly same of the ambient magic of the realm, the *food* they intake, and their magic/science that sets them apart.

The Exchange

They are going with the Two Hour Pilot on Wednesday...it will be like a whole SHIELD Movie.

Sovereign Court

Oh yeah.

Shadow Lodge

yellowdingo wrote:
They are going with the Two Hour Pilot on Wednesday...it will be like a whole SHIELD Movie.

As per usual...what the hell are you talking about? The 1-hour pilot was last Tuesday. The next 1-hour episode is going to be tomorrow (Tuesday). The show won't be on at all on Wednesday.

The Exchange

Kthulhu wrote:
yellowdingo wrote:
They are going with the Two Hour Pilot on Wednesday...it will be like a whole SHIELD Movie.
As per usual...what the hell are you talking about? The 1-hour pilot was last Tuesday. The next 1-hour episode is going to be tomorrow (Tuesday). The show won't be on at all on Wednesday.

Its OK...Australians are getting the first two episodes as a 'two hour pilot on Wednesday.


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I might be in the minority here but i thought the show went even further downhill this week. Sure the plane scene was fun and there are some fun suprises but this show does not measure up to cable shows that have action/suspense in them.

You can argue that sure the cable shows can get away with more in the gore/language etc but the plot itself is not holding me. Similiar network shows such as Lost/heroes were far more compelling

Things that i think the show needs

1. More redshirts. You have this core group of agents and i cant see any of them being in any sort of serious danger. With previous Whedon productions there was a big bad that at least got its hands on a normal person.

2. Villians with powers! I'm not sure what they have for license rights but id like to see some actual powered villians on the scene or even mentioned. Shield exists in the marvel universe and yet the only symbol is on the plane. Why not get some uniforms with a shoulder patch.

3. Improve the sets. Peru felt like a small hollwood set and felt like something out of 1981. Stargate did more with the woods in Seattle.Same with Dr Who. This show is the new jewel for the network

I really want to love this show. I'm not a troll trying to stir the pot. I have liked whedon stuff in the past especailly firefly and Buffy/Angel, I like the Coulson actor, and i love Marvel comics. And maybe its early but i'm worried that if the first 2 episodes are an indicator this show doesnt have staying power.

Dark Archive

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wicked cool wrote:
I might be in the minority here but i thought the show went even further downhill this week. Sure the plane scene was fun and there are some fun suprises but this show does not measure up to cable shows that have action/suspense in them.

I also am unimpressed, as of yet, and I'm generally a fan of Whedon's work (okay, it's a complicated love/hate relationship where I think he's got some great ideas, and then gets bored and starts smashing everything like a child having a tantrum, but still).

This entire episode felt hamfisted in its delivery of this 'we aren't a team yet, we need to learn to work together' message. I haven't seen a show talk down to the audience so badly since they got rid of laugh tracks (or that time I accidentally watched half an episode of Modern Family before it got so painfully preachy that I shorted my lunch hour to voluntarily go back to work).

Every 'surprise,' from the first shocking betrayal to the second shocking betrayal was like, 'Eh. Miles below the ocean, there are deep sea tube worms who don't know what television is who saw that coming...'

The Exchange

Too America Knows best to not be poisoned by it...


Well this episode went a long way toward easing my concerns over their characters. I liked ep.2 a lot better than ep.1.

Silly me for worrying that Whedon wouldn't have considered character.

The show was over the top fun, bravo!

Oh and Wicked Cool, I am sure they will have powers to contend with eventually... it IS SHIELD.

Dark Archive

yellowdingo wrote:
Too America Knows best to not be poisoned by it...

An odd notion, since the team is partially non-American, and the entire Peruvian kerfluffle was Coulson using SHIELDs *international* authority to override Peruvian national jurisdiction. Just because we didn't see the same jurisdictional penis-waving when SHIELD cordoned off part of the New Mexico desert, doesn't mean that SHIELD is an American agency, just that the movie producer wisely didn't insert that sort of politically controversial stuff into the Thor movie.

Indeed, for the Avengers movie, the US Army refused to participate in the military scenes, because SHIELD was squiffily defined as an international organization that had authority on US soil, and not an explicitly American organization.

Sovereign Court

Kinda underwhelming, but still fun regardless. Obviously something horrible happened to Coulson after Loki stabbed him. I think he spent months/years in a regeneration tank, hooked to a simulation of a paradise island.


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Watched half an hour of this show last night.

It would take considerably longer than that to list all the ridiculous problems this show has.


Spoiler:
Hmmm... on later consideration I am curious why they destroyed the Hydra tech cannon. In the movie they had kept all the Hydra weapons, this would have just been one more gun in the lockup.


The only new show better than S.H.I.E.L.D. is Sleepy Hollow--IMO, both are appointment TV.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

This episode was snoozeville. If this played again I would find something better to do.

Sovereign Court

Yeah i found myself texting while i watched this. I usually don't text while watching movies or shows. This annoys my fiance to no end.


I am not saying boring filler episodes are without value, but having the 2nd episode be this, just seems lame. They really should have had a few missions under their belts to realize that they weren't gelling before having a team building episode.


Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook Subscriber
Set wrote:
Kthulhu wrote:
Shadowborn wrote:
From the look and sound of things, they'll be borrowing the "Extremis" project from the Iron Man movies (and the comic prior to that). ** spoiler omitted **
It easn't JUST Extremis, it was a big ol' origin McGuffin stew. It had Extremis, Super Soldier serum, Chitauri tech, and gamma radiation.

If they could have found a way to get some Asgardian DNA in there, they probably would have done that, too!

(And, if they had permission to use them, I'm sure some mutant growth hormone, irradiated spider venom and cosmic rays would have made an appearance!)

Mix it all together and 'Behold my creation! More-messed-up-origin than the love-child of Hawkman and Psylocke Man!' "Bleearggh!"

You reminded me of an old Dragon magazine issue where Phil and Dixie did a documentary on super heroes. They had an amusing "Meta origin'of heroes that combined everything into it, and the result just happened to be a smoking smear where the 'new superguy' was standing after it was done. I guess not everything is compatible ;)


The MacGuffin got destroyed cause it was unstable. Incredibly powerful weapons that can go off without the trigger being pulled are risky to have around, and even riskier if some fool decides to make more of them.

Liberty's Edge

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Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Last night's episode seemed awfully familiar to me. Let me think...a ragtag group of experts with disparate personalities and abilities is brought together by a grizzled veteran, they get pissy with each other and then form a bond as a team when an evil army gets ahold of a super weapon.

I mean, I get that it's a common trope and that's fine. There's nothing wrong with that. My problem is with the execution. Maybe the producers figured audiences would think it's cool or wouldn't notice that the origin story for the team of agents is mirroring the plot of The Avengers. It's just that, after seeing The Avengers, a stripped down, 40-minute version of the same story with fourth-grade reading level dialog and paint-by-numbers storytelling feels like I'm watching an elementary school play version of the movie. Also, the budding romance between Skye and Ward is making me gag. As if I needed any more reasons to hate those characters.

Still, I'm not giving up on this show just yet. If there is any justice in the universe, Dum Dum Dugan and the Godzilla Squad will show up. It'd be the perfect set up for The Avengers 3.


Hama wrote:
Kinda underwhelming, but still fun regardless. Obviously something horrible happened to Coulson after Loki stabbed him.

Yes, he died. My money is on that it really isn't Coulson. LMD with false memories.

Grand Lodge

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Shadowborn wrote:
Hama wrote:
Kinda underwhelming, but still fun regardless. Obviously something horrible happened to Coulson after Loki stabbed him.
Yes, he died. My money is on that it really isn't Coulson. LMD with false memories.

With a lot of true ones. Apparantly at some point the real Coulson's memories were downloaded into a high tech databank. Probably during his "vacation" at Tahiti.


So far it's been...okay. On the other hand, I would say most Whedon shows take a bit to get good, so I will hang in there.

And yeah....I am hoping that we will start getting some novel things from the comics. I like the hydra tech and extremis references as much as the next person, but you have an entire comic universe to play with. Or hell, how about some stuff that is new?

Sovereign Court

QXL99 wrote:
The only new show better than S.H.I.E.L.D. is Sleepy Hollow--IMO, both are appointment TV.

I hope you had a smile on your face when you posted this.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

Wow, what a bunch of sourpusses.
Sounds like most of you should just stop watching now. Two episodes in and it's a shark fest of negativity.
But I'm going to guess that all of you are going to continue watching it, if nothing else so you can keep ragging on it.

I don't know if it has dawned on anyone how stereotypical Comic Store Guy almost all of these posts sound like... think about that for a second and then see where the stereotype comes from.
But, really, if you think it's that bad, then just stop watching. Right now. You'll save yourself (and everyone who has to hear about your complaining) a lot of heartache.

Me? I love it!
But I also don't have weird emotions tied up to the comic books and am just enjoying the start of a show with witty banter, winkwinknudgenudge references and a great backdrop of the movies.

Sovereign Court

I watched it with my mom, who has never read a single comic, just watched the movies. She also said that the show was pretty weak and standing on wobbly legs.

I will keep watching it in hopes that the next episode will blow me away. And Chloe Bennet.

I mean when all of the marvel movies pretty much blow you away with awesomeness, you'd expect the same from the show set in the same universe.

Shadow Lodge RPG Superstar 2010 Top 8

I really liked episode two!

Dark Archive

Hama wrote:

I watched it with my mom, who has never read a single comic, just watched the movies. She also said that the show was pretty weak and standing on wobbly legs.

I will keep watching it in hopes that the next episode will blow me away. And Chloe Bennet.

I mean when all of the marvel movies pretty much blow you away with awesomeness, you'd expect the same from the show set in the same universe.

Perhaps, if they had a 100 million dollar budget per episode then you could get that feeling. But they don't.

Silver Crusade

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Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Oh you big wet blankets.

It's an adventure comedy, with banter and fun and superpowers and if I was a 10 year old kid right now this would be my favorite show ever forever and you fogies with your cynicism turned up so high can just bleh.

If you guys don't realize that this is actually a Star Trek series then I can't help you.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
Pan wrote:
QXL99 wrote:
The only new show better than S.H.I.E.L.D. is Sleepy Hollow--IMO, both are appointment TV.
I hope you had a smile on your face when you posted this.

I am 100% sincere. Of course Arrow is even better, but it's not a new show this year.

The Exchange

Mixed feelings. The Show reminds me of the old UPN shows from way back. Team Knight Rider stuff. But...But...it has hope. The cast is't there yet, it's not showing Whedon's typical 30 plot line pile up I'm waiting on. I think it's light hearted air is kinda hampering it so far. Show needs some seriousness injection soon. What made the Marvelverse for me so far was grim universe...but filled with good people trying to do the right thing.

Kinda the same mentality Angel/Buffy had.

If they can get that feeling again, I'll be hooked.


Pan wrote:
QXL99 wrote:
The only new show better than S.H.I.E.L.D. is Sleepy Hollow--IMO, both are appointment TV.
I hope you had a smile on your face when you posted this.

I know I smiled when I read it.

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