Hi guys!
I'm currently preparing the Rise of the Runelords campaign for my party, but me and my party are still new to Pathfinder.
One of the players added a background motivation to his character, even though I advice them all not to do so, because I was not planning on incorporating their story in the campaign - since I never GMed before and I dont't feel confident with myself in doing so (yet!). ^^
However, I'm still trying to see if I can add his story to the campaign - to surprise him, and make the campaign more personalized.
He claims that his elf ranger is trying to find a way to break a curse that transformed all his village into stone. He spent decades reading thassilon books in an old library, and one of the books sent him to Sandpoint.
Is there a way to incorporate his village curse cure within the story of Rise of the Runelords?
Could you give me some ideas?
Thanks guys!
Depending on where his village is if it's in varisia they could have tripped a trap set Karzoug bbeg for that ap also he is a transmuter so that would work with the stone curse and varisia is riddled with that stuff from ancient thassilon
Depending on where his village is if it's in varisia they could have tripped a trap set Karzoug bbeg for that ap also he is a transmuter so that would work with the stone curse and varisia is riddled with that stuff from ancient thassilon
Yes, he is from Varisia. I like that idea! And since he is the last boss, the PC would have that extra motivation to go until the end.
For what I read Karzoug is in statis for 10.000 years, so that would have to be a very old trap. Do you have an idea on why he would have such a trap? Or maybe, it could be some kind of spell to create a stone people army?
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I loved this idea Aeshuura!
But I'm a little bit lost here. I read all the chapter introductions and some of the NPCs' descriptions, but I don't know enough to know where to introduce those clues and how to do it.
Who do you think it should inform the player about the existance of a counter-item? Someone from Sandpoint could have that knowledge?
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First off, make use of Brodert Quink. He is the town sage and expert on all things Thassilonian. However, he would not know about the RF right off the bat. What I would do is to have the PC meet Brodert, then they can have conversations about Thassilon and possibly even offering to research what he can.
Maybe after Burnt Offerings you can have Quink offer that he found a reference to a place that the Runelords' agents would use to do all sorts of magical research.
Then after Skinsaw, you can give another kernel of information. Maybe Quink finds a reference about the war between Bakrakahn and Shalast, causing an "arms race" of sorts.
Hook Mountain, you could drive the point home that there is supposedly a leader of the Stone Giants that has been in direct connection to Thassilon.
After Fortress, the library has info on the RF.
If you are creative enough, you could include a line referring to the weapon in the Scribbler's cave...
Hey Aeshuura! Thank you so much for your ideas.
Sorry I didn't reply to your earlier, but since I didn't read all the campaign yet, I'm still trying to figure out what your suggestions really mean. After your reply I tried to read some more so I could follow your steps.
It got me wondering, does it makes sense to have the item recharged in the Eye of Averice? I understand that it's energy release will cure everyone within the area, but it doesn't seem to have any effect on objects, or even deaths that occur outside the Runewell, and the counter-item would be something that the PC would got outside the Runewell.
I also saw that there is a pool of elemental arcana (page 271 from the RotR: Anniversary Edition) that seems to charge items. So it sounds like it's a good place to have the PC's counter-item recharged instead of the Eye. But the think is, if the PC's fail the %d roll, he risks loosing the counter-item, and that would suck I guess. He would lost his opportunity to save his village. Still, this pool is in the vault of Greed, so it would still make sense with your other suggestion of having Karzoug's wizard (the Greed Runelord) as the creator of the item that caused the PC's village course, and the counter-item to break the same curse.
I'm also wondering how the player would know how to recharge the counter-item (either in the Eye or in the Pool), and regarding the idea of having a scribbler's line referring to the counter-item recharged I also have a question. It seems that his rhymes are made to be a puzzle, so if I present one extra line regarding the counter-item, wouldn't that make PCs confused? I would have the five stanzas and one extra line. Like I said, I'm affraid I can only make sense of all this after I work on this adventure. But I'm currently focusing on "Burnt Offerings" because it's where we are at. So sorry, if my questions seems out of place or misguided. :S
However, if the counter-item is to be recharged in the Pool of Elemental Arcana (chapter 5) that means the item must be found before that. So I'm guessing must be found somewhere within the Fortress of Stone Giants.. would that make sense?
To summarize:
1) Should the counter-item be recharged in the Eye of Avarice or Pool of Elemental Arcana?
2) How does the player be informed about how to recharge the counter-item? Wouldn't confuse the PCs if this information is passed on through Scribble's rhymes?
3) Where can the counter-item be found?
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There are a couple of things that you can do, just brainstorming here, but I would either have the discovery of the item itself in the Runeforge or have it in Karzoug's possession, and just have the notes and schematics in the runeforge.
The Runeforge is a giant laboratory/research facility. Since Karzoug was obsessed with the dimension of Leng, using the Eye of Avarice's connection to the dimension seems like a logical play. Perhaps the counter-item is designed to contain some of the energies to release later and the healing energies will begin the unraveling of the petrification curse.
The reason for this is to make the character driven to finish the campaign before returning home to cure his village. It will also be a nice epilogue to describe the character coming home to his petrified village, setting the item down and flash!
Actually, rather than adding a line, make a stanza and make it something that the PC found in someone's notes in his village. Indicating that the Scribbler had something to do with its placement, might draw a connection when they discover the sinkhole beneath Sandpoint.
Now, to help the PC along, it would be nice to have a wizard in the party, or at least someone with Knowledge (arcana) that you can give information to, if the PC is willing to share his findings, or ask for help in figuring it out. If there is no PC that can fill that role, you could possibly get one or more of the villains to monologue about it, if he asks. Just keep your eye open for opportunities...
Hope this helps!
Thank you!
I'm have some difficulties visualizing some of the things you are saying. Maybe it's because english is not my first language, but specially because I still have not read the other chapters in detail. But I will keep your ideas in mind when I'm dealing with the next chapters, for sure. :)
The reason for this is to make the character driven to finish the campaign before returning home to cure his village. It will also be a nice epilogue to describe the character coming home to his petrified village, setting the item down and flash!
Yes, this makes a lot a sense. And I'll be introducing the last piece of the puzzle (be the counter-item itself, or the energies to charge it) in the end.
Actually, rather than adding a line, make a stanza and make it something that the PC found in someone's notes in his village.
This would be great, but I'm not a creative person myself. I'm very proud that I could translate and adapt every flavour text, dialogues and songs (still maintaing the rhymes) to my native language, but I suck at creating content! I was never good at, and although is something that I would like to practice, I have no confidence whatsoever on doing so. Still, it was a great idea. To have a clue right at the beginning of the game, but still subtle enough to not spoil what's to come. :)
Now, to help the PC along, it would be nice to have a wizard in the party, or at least someone with Knowledge (arcana) that you can give information to, if the PC is willing to share his findings, or ask for help in figuring it out.
The party is composed by a Ranger (the PC in question), Fighter, Druid and a Magus. So Magus at least will have Kwnowledge (arcana). Also, the Ranger will start knowing to read Thassilonian - I don't know if this helps. But still, I didn't understand why you say this would be necessary in this case. :S
Because I'm not a creative person, I like to have everything prepared - I know, not a good habit in a RPG game, where many times you'll just have to wing it. Still, I try! :P So This is what I already had so far - after your first ideas:
Background: PC reads a book in his library village that take him to Sandpoint. He read that he might find more information about the curse in Sandpoint's chapel and he should talk to Ezakien Tobyn. (Oh he's going to have a bad surprise! Heehee)
In Chapter 1: PC knows that Chapel was burnt and father Ezakien Tobyn is dead. Someone tell him about Quink. PC meets Quink, that says he does not have the information needed to help him, but he will do some research in his library, and asks the PC to come later.
In Chapter 2: Quink says to PC that there was a place where the Runelords would do all sort of research (refering to the Runeforge from the chapter 5). (Should Runeforge be referenced? Wouldn't be a spoiler to do so?)
In Chapter 3: ??
In Chapter 4: ??
In Chapter 5: PC finds the counter-item in the Runeforge but sees that the item seems to be out of energy, or something like that.
In Chapter 6: PC must bring the item to the Eye so this could be recharged and be ready to use. (Should he know about this? Or he's just there and after the Energy release he just notice that the item was charged afterall?)
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This would be great, but I'm not a creative person myself. I'm very proud that I could translate and adapt every flavour text, dialogues and songs (still maintaing the rhymes) to my native language, but I suck at creating content! I was never good at, and although is something that I would like to practice, I have no confidence whatsoever on doing so. Still, it was a great idea. To have a clue right at the beginning of the game, but still subtle enough to not spoil what's to come. :)
It's not for some time yet... if the mood strikes me, maybe I will come up with something for you to translate... ;) If I don't, your other options would be to have Quink come up with something that links it together.
The party is composed by a Ranger (the PC in question), Fighter, Druid and a Magus. So Magus at least will have Kwnowledge (arcana). Also, the Ranger will start knowing to read Thassilonian - I don't know if this helps. But still, I didn't understand why you say this would be necessary in this case. :S
Having a wizard or someone with Knowledge (arcana) could help the ranger make sense of the wizards' notes that he might find in the Runeforge. Think of it like looking at a scientist's notes, talking about all kinds of theory, someone without any scientific knowledge or skill would be entirely lost. However, show those notes to someone that understands that kind of knowledge, and he can make sense of it. If the ranger also wants to spend skill points on Knowledge (arcana) that is good, but the magus should have his fair share of that skill, so I think he should be okay. Also using various libraries (either in Sandpoint or elsewhere), they can get a bonus to skill checks, but only if they have ranks in the skill. (At least that is how the rules make sense to me.)
While it is often a waste of time to have everything planned out, it is good to have an outline to follow. The outline should have the major points that you want to cover, and the particulars can be "on-the-fly"...
Background: PC reads a book in his library village that take him to Sandpoint. He read that he might find more information about the curse in Sandpoint's chapel and he should talk to Ezakien Tobyn. (Oh he's going to have a bad surprise! Heehee) Good idea here.
In Chapter 1: PC knows that Chapel was burnt and father Ezakien Tobyn is dead. Someone tell him about Quink. PC meets Quink, that says he does not have the information needed to help him, but he will do some research in his library, and asks the PC to come later. Again, good idea to introduce Quink.
In Chapter 2: Quink says to PC that there was a place where the Runelords would do all sort of research (refering to the Runeforge from the chapter 5). (Should Runeforge be referenced? Wouldn't be a spoiler to do so?) Actually, I would have Quink find reference to a weapon that resembles the effects that took his village here.
In Chapter 3: ?? End of Chapter 3 they may still be in Turtleback Ferry, so no worries there.
In Chapter 4: ?? If they find their own way back, then you can have Quink tell him of the Xaliasa (the Scribbler) and his connection to the weapon. If not, the ranger should be very interested in the library in the Stone Giant's Fortress.
In Chapter 5: PC finds the counter-item in the Runeforge but sees that the item seems to be out of energy, or something like that. In the beginning, you could have the Scribbler respond to questions from the ranger, talking about the weapon... maybe giving a hint about a fail-safe. Then taking that information to Quink, the sage can find the connection to the runeforge.
In Chapter 6: PC must bring the item to the Eye so this could be recharged and be ready to use. (Should he know about this? Or he's just there and after the Energy release he just notice that the item was charged afterall?)
So, the point is, try not to give too much at once. For one, remind the character that he is an elf, a few years is a drop in a bucket for him. Patience should be the constant reminder. If the PC is not being patient, then have the NPCs make comments of how un-elflike he is acting... Not without cause, of course, but all things come in good time. :)
I hope this helps!
Aeshuura has given you some great ideas, and plenty to build on. I just wanted to pipe in with a couple of points:
1. As mentioned, having a detailed outline is not at all a bad idea. Particularly if you are relatively new to GM'ing, an outline and detailed notes will be your best friend. I would; however, plan a few things for when the PCs decide to go off the tracks. This can be as a simple as having a mini quest or even a few "random" encounters planned out ahead of time should the party decide to go off the beaten path. This will enable you to give the appearance that the party is choosing its own destiny, and following its own path without forcing you to improvise on the spot.
2. Don't be afraid of character backgrounds. As you can see here, you'll be able to easily incorporate the Ranger's background into your campaign with relatively little effort, while doing so in a way that makes it seem as though you really are tailoring the campaign to the Ranger's character.
3. Be careful with the background though. The one problem you may run into is that you now have one player who has a background, and campaign that is set to incorporate that background. Ultimately, this might lead the other players to hard feelings as it seems as though the campaign is geared toward them. An easy solution here is to incorporate those players into the ranger's background, or rather, make his background the same for the entire party. Instead of the ranger having been out hunting, the party was out hunting, serving as caravan guards, whatever, and returned to find the village turned to stone. Now they all have a reason to a) stick together and b) follow the campaign through to its end. Plus, each time a clue is uncovered, it will hopefully excite all the players, not just one. I would talk first to the ranger and let him know what you plan, then talk to the group as a whole. Just say "Hey, I know I told you not to do a background, but Ranger here came up with something that I think is pretty cool and will work well . . . " Let the group iron out some details and make a few changes that make everyone happy, and off you go!
4. Make sure you read through the rest of the campaign as soon as possible. Ideally, you'll have read through the entire campaign before you start. This will again help you set things up for later or alert you to any problems that might arise before its too late.
Hope this helps!
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Gargs, thanks for chiming in! Steel Rose just PM'd me today and the other players created some minor backgrounds, and I helped her with ways to tie them all in. I must say there is some great potential there!!!
That is a great point though, make sure that they have plenty of time and reason to become friends, and not just stay together because it's the adventure.
That is one thing that I try to do when I am GMing. There can be conflict between characters, but once you get a serious divide in the group it can make things seem artificial if they stick together, but really dislike each other.
It's like having the Lawful Evil character traveling alongside the Paladin... things are going to split eventually, and you want them to last the entire AP... >.<
I would; however, plan a few things for when the PCs decide to go off the tracks. This can be as a simple as having a mini quest or even a few "random" encounters planned out ahead of time should the party decide to go off the beaten path.
I didn't knew about the random encounter tables until a few days ago, and I'll definitely use them now. However, yesterday I was helping two players filling their character sheets, and they had 15 points to buy abilities (we used the purchase system). And one of them, told me that "I think our characters start too weak, so, before I go doing quests, I'll be wondering around the initial city in order to find random encounter and level up faster"... I wasn't expecting that. Lol. What do you suggest I do?
Be careful with the background though. The one problem you may run into is that you now have one player who has a background, and campaign that is set to incorporate that background
Just like Aeshuura said, all my players have backgrounds. I initially shared only the Ranger background, because I thought it would be the hardest for me to incorporate in the story, so I asked for the communities help.
Other players backgrounds are:
Human Fighter, from Old Korvosa. An orphan educated by a weapon's master, that eventually dies, leaving the PC alone but eager to perfect is combat. Reason to be in Sandpoint: He wants to stay away from his past. He is trying to perfect his combat skills and in his travels he stops at Sandpoint.
Half-Orc Magus (Kensai), the PC still doesn't know where he's from. Had a lonely childhood (in a human town), was found one day by a master from Tian-Min who saw potentinal in him. He teach him how to use a katana and use his inner magic to complement his fighting. But one day his master disapear. Reason to be in Sandpoint: He's is follow the path of self-knowledge (his deity is Irori). In order to improve his art he is travelling through all Golarion. One of his resting points turned out to be Sandpoint.
Half-Elf Druid, from Crying Leaf. Her mother was killed and her father is missing. She was bullyed by other elf children and descriminated by the people of her mother's village. She found herself in better company with the animals from the wild. She now wants to find her father (human). Reason to be in Sandpoint: She hopes to find someone in Sandpoint that knows anything about her father.
Aeshuura already gave me some great ideas, but like you both said to me, I really need to read the whole campaign after I decide to do anything else. Some of the suggestions I cannot understand if I don't have enough information on the subject. So, I'm already on it. I'm readying the whole campaign. :)
Let them know that they will have chances for that, but that the Adventure Path is designed to be set for certain levels. It is designed for 15 pt buy as well, but can be difficult even for 20 pt buy characters as well. (It kind of depends on how optimized the characters are.)
It's the first time me and my players are playing a rpg pen and paper. I do I know if the party is optimized or not? I assume it is, since Druid PC already shown interesting in be a healer, and they have a Fighter that is going to tank mostly. But Magus and Ranger are going to focus less in magic and more on weapons, so I don't know if that can hurt the party.
How can I tell if I should increase the points to 20 or remain with 15?
If you don't mind me asking, Steel-Rose, what is your native language? The reason I do ask is that this campaign has a vibrant community created stuff thread with fan-made maps, music, and hand-out material. Perhaps you'd like to share your translations to make somebody else's life easier. I too GM in another language (Portuguese) and sometimes need to translate large pieces of information.
Honestly, if your party is just beginning, I'd give them the benefit of the doubt and let them start with a 20 point-buy. My party was built with 25 and was fairly optimized and still got beaten by the BBEG of book 2 (the big X).
If you don't mind me asking, Steel-Rose, what is your native language?
Hmm, was something I said that made you suspicious, or was it coincidence? Because I also speak Portuguese. :) I'm from Portugal, and you?
And yes, that is something I had already thought of before. While preparing for my campaign, I found a few Portuguese-Brazillian translations, but still those needed some work to fit my game, and were not suficient enough, so I've been working on translating everything that I need for myself.
I would like to share what I have, but for now, what I have is a work in progress, so there's still a lot of stuff to do. But for future reference, is there a specific place where I could share? I was thinking in making a website, put everything online and just share the link eventually.
We should talk to each other and see if we can help each other out. :)
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I didn't knew about the random encounter tables until a few days ago, and I'll definitely use them now. However, yesterday I was helping two players filling their character sheets, and they had 15 points to buy abilities (we used the purchase system). And one of them, told me that "I think our characters start too weak, so, before I go doing quests, I'll be wondering around the initial city in order to find random encounter and level up faster"... I wasn't expecting that. Lol. What do you suggest I do?
Well, weak is really a relative term. Certainly compared to 20th level characters, they are weak. Compared to starting characters in some other games, they are weak. Compared to what they are expected to face early on . . . not so weak, but rather balanced.
That being said though, it is fairly easy to "mess up" a character by taking particularly suboptimal choices (this can also be part of the fun of roleplaying though as you try to deal with your deficiencies). Given that you have an inexperienced group of players though, there are few things you can do to err on the side of caution (in no particular order):
1. As mentioned, you can let them go with a 20 point buy. This will make them a little more well rounded and likely will result in slightly heartier characters (makes it easier to invest in constitution).
2. Use maximum hit points for the first few levels rather than rolling for them. A friend of mine always awards maximum hit points for the first three levels in an effort to improve the survivability of the group. So if a fighter normally rolls a d10 for hit points, he simply gets 10 hit points (plus any bonus for Constitution).
3. Remember the morale of the enemies. Early on, the party is going to be facing a fair number of goblins (as an easy example). While goblins can be effective against the party, especially an inexperienced party, they are not the bravest of creatures. If your party is struggling in an encounter, maybe have the goblins run off when one of their comrades dies.
4. Occasionally have someone help out the party. This is best done in town (when a guard can run over to help) but in any event, should be used sparingly. After all, you want the players to feel as though they are the heroes.
5. Throw an occasional easy encounter their way through the "random" encounter tables. I put random in quotes because the mere fact that the table is a random roll table, doesn't mean that you cannot simply pick an easy encounter off of it. This will give the party a little bit of additional XP, while also giving them some confidence.
6. Remind them that running is always an option. This is perhaps the hardest lesson for players to learn in my experience. Admittedly, there is an implied contract between the GM and the Players that says the GM will not throw much at the party that cannot be handled by the party. In general, an encounter should not be designed to require the party to run (in my opinion). However, sometimes the fates (a.k.a. the dice) conspire against the party and in favor of the side of darkness. At times, all you can do is live to fight another day.
Do note that in relation to that last point, the party should not have to run away from fights very often unless they are just refusing to rest and recuperate. If they are constantly running away, then there is a problem somewhere. Maybe the encounters are just too hard for the players' skill level (note this is different than character's skill level). Maybe the party just lacks confidence and simply runs the moment things start to look bad.
In the end, if you find that your party really is struggling too much, you can always adjust the encounters to make them easier. Maybe remove a creature from the fight, possibly lower the hit points of the monsters, or even reduce their AC a point or two. Just keep in mind that at the end of the day, the object is for everyone (GM and players included) to have fun. If everyone is having fun, then mission accomplished, regardless of what else is going on.
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Great advice, Gargs!
My take on:
1) I actually start my guys with 15 pts, but then I give them other ways to increase ability scores, AND at 4th, 8th, etc. I give one bump to two scores. (One of the only things I really liked from 4e.)
2) I use the vigor/wound system from Advanced Players Guide, and instead of rolling 1d6/1d8/1d10/1d12 for HD, I have them roll 1d6/1d6+2/1d6+4/ 1d6+6. That it ups the average.
3) Morale of the enemies is important, rarely will they fight to the death (at least in my eyes). Of course, there are a few fanatic enemies that they will run into, and they can fight to the death. As for gobbies, remember that they are easily distracted, and make them so, even in combat.
6) If they do lose, have them wake up in a dungeon, or tied up. Death is not always the best option, even for villains. If the villains gain the upper hand, have them offer terms for surrender. It can be a whole new mini adventure having them try a daring escape! ;)
Hmm, was something I said that made you suspicious, or was it coincidence? Because I also speak Portuguese. :) I'm from Portugal, and you?
Just wishful thinking ;)
I'm Brazillian, actually. I've translated just a few things for RotR (some notes and regional descriptions) but since my players read English pretty well I got kind of lazy.
2. Use maximum hit points for the first few levels rather than rolling for them. A friend of mine always awards maximum hit points for the first three levels in an effort to improve the survivability of the group. So if a fighter normally rolls a d10 for hit points, he simply gets 10 hit points (plus any bonus for Constitution).
I second this. Also,
1) I actually start my guys with 15 pts, but then I give them other ways to increase ability scores, AND at 4th, 8th, etc. I give one bump to two scores. (One of the only things I really liked from 4e.)
this. This allows a character to improve a stat that's not necessarily his main stat. Since the start of the adventure is somewhat easy, they should survive the first encounters, and this can make them a bit stronger on next modules.
I would like to share what I have, but for now, what I have is a work in progress, so there's still a lot of stuff to do. But for future reference, is there a specific place where I could share? I was thinking in making a website, put everything online and just share the link eventually.
We should talk to each other and see if we can help each other out. :)
I use Obsidian Portal to upload some information, particularly those I'd like my players to read and to generate hype during the week for the weekend session (and keep them interested). My campaign page is somewhat outdated but should show you a bit of the available functions. I actually bribe the players (+10% experience) so they'll always write a session log before the next one and that way we can remember any specifics.
Aside from that, most people use googledocs or dropbox to upload docs, images, pdfs, etc.