|
4 people marked this as FAQ candidate.
|
Stealth Skill
Stealth Skill wrote: If people are observing you using any of their senses (but typically sight), you can't use Stealth. Against most creatures, finding cover or concealment allows you to use Stealth. If your observers are momentarily distracted (such as by a Bluff check), you can attempt to use Stealth. While the others turn their attention from you, you can attempt a Stealth check if you can get to an unobserved place of some kind. This check, however, is made at a –10 penalty because you have to move fast. Stealth Skill wrote: Creating a Diversion to Hide
You can use Bluff to allow you to use Stealth. A successful Bluff check can give you the momentary diversion you need to attempt a Stealth check while people are aware of you.
Street Performer
Street Performer wrote: Quick Change (Ex)
At 5th level, a street performer can don a disguise as a standard action by taking a –5 penalty on his check. He can take 10 on Bluff and Disguise checks and use Bluff to create a diversion to hide as a swift action. He can take 20 on a Bluff or Disguise check once per day, plus one time per six levels beyond 5th.
This ability replaces lore master.
Heretic
Heretic wrote: Judgment (Su)
A heretic gains the following judgment in addition to the normal list of inquisitor judgments.
Escape (Su): Each time the inquisitor using this judgment hits an opponent with a melee or ranged attack, she can use a move action attempt to create a diversion to hide (see the Stealth skill).
What action is "Creating a Diversion to Hide", and what all is allowed? Is it's action only the diversion, and another action is used to move and hide? Does a diversion action include stealth in it's use on that action?
A Heretic hits with a judgement (Standard) and then creates a diversion to hide (Move), does the Heretic get stealth only if they already have Cover/Concealment? Do they gain no stealth that round, but can make the stealth check the next round? How does this work?
If the Heretic gains steath when using a move action, does the Street Performer gain stealth when doing the same action as a swift? Would the Street Performer have up to a full round of actions (minus that swift) left?
My intention is to make a Halfling Filcher that withdraws after Sleight of Hand checks using Fast Getaway. I'd like to enter stealth doing this.
Please FAQ
Nobody knows how this works, or wants it FAQed?
I'd think a bluff check in combat would use the feint rules which requires a standard action.
For the inquisitor,
Quote: Escape (Su): Each time the inquisitor using this judgment hits an opponent with a melee or ranged attack, she can use a move action attempt to create a diversion to hide (see the Stealth skill). So instead of a standard action it's a move action.
Unfortunately that doesn't address the issue of what a Diversion entails.
Normal:
Standard - Diversion
Move - Get to cover/concealment, roll stealth
Heretic:
Standard - Judgement (Escape)
Move - Diversion
Can make a Diversion, but can't move to cover/concealment to gain stealth? This forces the Heretic's ability to have no use.
Street Performer:
Swift - Diversion
Move - Get to cover/concealment, roll stealth
Now has a Standard Action left?
If the Diversion Action itself includes the "While the others turn their attention from you, you can attempt a Stealth check if you can get to an unobserved place of some kind" portion of it's write-up, how much movement is allowed, and is it extra movement?
Normal:
Standard - Diversion, move X to cover concealment, roll stealth.
Has a Move and Swift left over?
Heretic:
Standard - Judgement (Escape)
Move - Diversion, move X to cover/concealment, roll stealth.
At least now the ability isn't broken entirely.
Street Performer:
Swift - Diversion, move X to cover concealment, roll stealth.
Yet now the Street Performer has a Full-Round of Actions left, sans Swift, with bonus movement allowed from using but a Swift. This seems incredibly powerful. Enough so that my gut says it must be in error.
If a Distraction does not include movement, then the Heretic is broken, if it does include movement, then the Street Performer's use is OP.
As a side note:
Something I find interesting is that a character cannot create a distraction for another to use, and there is no minimum distance that needs to be gained ala the 10' minimum needed by sniping. Other than those, this action seems horribly under thought and broken.
Please FAQ.
Stealth isn't normally an action of itself but is rolled as part of a move action. I think it would be;
Normal: Diversion (standard), stealth (as part of a move action)
"Look over there!", scurry's under the nearest bush.
Heretic, Judgment: (Each time the inquisitor using this judgment hits an opponent with a melee or ranged attack, she can use a move action attempt to create a diversion to hide). Attack (standard action), Diversion (as a move and stealth after a successful attack)
"Have at thee!" (hits opponent with weapon), scurry's under nearest bush.
Street Performer: (use Bluff to create a diversion to hide as a swift action.) Diversion (swift), stealth (as part of a move action), standard action left.
"Look over there!", scurry's around to opponents blind side, Pulls down opponents pants.
Speaker for the Dead wrote: Stealth isn't normally an action of itself but is rolled as part of a move action. I think it would be;
Normal: Diversion (standard), stealth (as part of a move action)
"Look over there!", scurry's under the nearest bush.
Heretic, Judgment: (Each time the inquisitor using this judgment hits an opponent with a melee or ranged attack, she can use a move action attempt to create a diversion to hide). Attack (standard action), Diversion (as a move and stealth after a successful attack)
"Have at thee!" (hits opponent with weapon), scurry's under nearest bush.
Street Performer: (use Bluff to create a diversion to hide as a swift action.) Diversion (swift), stealth (as part of a move action), standard action left.
"Look over there!", scurry's around to opponents blind side, Pulls down opponents pants.
Why do you have the Heretic getting movement and stealth when creating a Diversion, yet the Street performer doesn't?
Or, are you having the Heretic allowed a Diversion as a Free Action?
Stealth
Stealth Skill wrote: Action
Usually none. Normally, you make a Stealth check as part of movement, so it doesn't take a separate action. However, using Stealth immediately after a ranged attack (see Sniping, above) is a move action.
Stealth is part of movement, not a part of any Move Action.
Heretic:
Standard - Judgement (Escape)
Move - Diversion
All the Heretic has left is a Swift, and a 5-Foot-Step.
I guess that 5 feet had best be enough to find cover/concealment for it's ability to work.
I'm just guessing at the authors intent. Being able to create a diversion without being able to make a stealth roll seems fairly useless. The feat says, "she can use a move action attempt to create a diversion to hide", sounds like she can do both as concurrent actions.
The wording is near identical between the Heretic and Street Performer. Creating a Diversion is not the same as making use of that Diversion, or the Street Performer version is broken.
My guess is that different authors had different understandings of how "Creating a Diversion to Hide" works, both in its Action and effect.
This is why it should be FAQed.
I would imagine that all the Stealth using players would be clamoring for clarification, as the ability to re-enter Stealth during combat is highly important for Stealth utility. The lack of prior discussion on this point, or more voices here, is surprising.
Where are all the big-brained rules nerds when you need em?
Recent threads in Rules Questions
|
