Per Day shenanigans


Rules Questions


Just want to make it clear. Spellcasters like Wiz or Sor do get "spells per day" but when they rested 8 hours. They regain those spells back (and prepare new ones for Wiz).

So here is the question. Does this 8 hour rest resets those x per day abilities given as class features such as Bardic Performance, Barbarian's Rage, Inquisitor's Judgments, and also Divine Spells ? (IFAIK, clerics, inquisitors do have to pray and receive spells from their respective deities)

Lantern Lodge

Well...

You could argue it either way. Spells per day though is touchy. It could be interpreted as "Even if you rest 20 hours in a day, you still only get X level 1 spells per day".

The way I think of that is that using arcane or divine magic is taxing in ways that we don't understand, creating the hard cap on spells per day.

But you could also say that rest covers that, and doesn't require a whole day for your ability to cast spells to be regenerated (on average).

With other, daily powers, like a barbarians rage, no. That makes more sense, even if I spend 8 hours resting, then do strenuous raging, then immediately rest and repeat over and over again, I'd eventually die of stress (Can you imagine a barbarian with anxiety issues?) Heart attacks happen often simply because people over tax themselves.

But thats all the theoretical stuff. Just my opinions.


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Spells per day means "spells per day".

Nowhere does it say that rest/preparation requirements override the spells per day limit.

So they don't.

Sovereign Court

This has always been a game of resource management. Spells per day are once per 24 hours, though Sunrise as a houserule is a common hard reset point for abilities that don't require rest (magic items for example).

--Hickory Dickory Dock, the Vrock flew round the clock


Blanket Ghost wrote:
Just want to make it clear. Spellcasters like Wiz or Sor do get "spells per day" but when they rested 8 hours. They regain those spells back (and prepare new ones for Wiz).

I don't think so--they only get those spells if it's the next day. You can't wake up at 6 AM, memorize your daily spells (7am), cast them all, and then rest until 3pm and memorize all your spells again.

It still takes 24 hours to reset spells--the 8 hours of rest is an additional requirement, not a replacement requirement.


Yeah, there was a mention somewhere in a FAQ or summat about a "Recent casting limit", lemme see if I can find it.

Here, from the PRD in the Magic section (I coulda sworn it wasn't always there...)

Quote:
Recent Casting Limit/Rest Interruptions: If a wizard has cast spells recently, the drain on his resources reduces his capacity to prepare new spells. When he prepares spells for the coming day, all the spells he has cast within the last 8 hours count against his daily limit.


Thanks for the replies. Just want to make it clear because I felt that it was somewhat vague and broken that spells per day arcane casters rest for eight hours and got spells refreshed, and the others abilities per day guys have to make do.


Rules do specifically say that all casters cannot use their spells more than every day/24-hours (technically stuff like Pearls of Power could sort-of be considered exceptions, but not really— it's essentially just buying additional slots). It's not the easiest rule to find aside from the whole implication of "x spells per day" but it's totally there (not verbatim as I said it though).

There's also the double confirmation from the description of ring of sustenance. If a RoS user couldn't gain spells more than once every 24 hours, why could someone without the ring get it?

I don't know if I should bother mentioning this, because it's drifting away from the topic, but most/all casters can specifically leave some slots unallocated when they first prepare spells, and that any time later that day, can prepare some more spells (takes generally 15 minutes for cleric/wizard and presumably most others. 1 minute per spell for alchemist)

Someone just posted a topic about this like 2 days ago, and I'm sure there's a bunch more. You probably should have searched before posting


While I'm not fussed either way (How often do you need to use two lots of spells and are able to rest 16 hours in one day without spell overlap anyway?) I am interested by this claim.

Joesi wrote:
Rules do specifically say that all casters cannot use their spells more than every day/24-hours

Citation or quote to back that up?

The Exchange

Aioran wrote:

While I'm not fussed either way (How often do you need to use two lots of spells and are able to rest 16 hours in one day without spell overlap anyway?) I am interested by this claim.

Joesi wrote:
Rules do specifically say that all casters cannot use their spells more than every day/24-hours
Citation or quote to back that up?

From Wizard class description-

A wizard can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Wizard. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Intelligence score (see Table: Ability Modifiers and Bonus Spells).
A wizard may know any number of spells. He must choose and prepare his spells ahead of time by getting 8 hours of sleep and spending 1 hour studying his spellbook. While studying, the wizard decides which spells to prepare.

From Sorcerer-
Like other spellcasters, a sorcerer can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. Her base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Sorcerer. In addition, she receives bonus spells per day if she has a high Charisma score (see Table: Ability Modifiers and Bonus Spells).
Unlike a wizard or a cleric, a sorcerer need not prepare her spells in advance. She can cast any spell she knows at any time, assuming she has not yet used up her spells per day for that spell level.

From Cleric-
Like other spellcasters, a cleric can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. Her base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Cleric. In addition, she receives bonus spells per day if she has a high Wisdom score (see Table: Ability Modifiers and Bonus Spells).
Clerics meditate or pray for their spells. Each cleric must choose a time when she must spend 1 hour each day in quiet contemplation or supplication to regain her daily allotment of spells. A cleric may prepare and cast any spell on the cleric spell list, provided that she can cast spells of that level, but she must choose which spells to prepare during her daily meditation.

In every class description for any spellcaster it says "daily spell allotment is given on Table:XXX". You prep spells in the morning, if you blow them all by noon you are without spells until the next morning. That is why most casters look to conserve some of their power throughout the day and why wands, rods, staves and scrolls are important to casters.


Eh, was hoping for something a little more exciting but yeah, that counts.

Shadow Lodge

Pathfinder Tales Subscriber

One of the interesting things, though, is that divine casters don't have to get the 8 hours of rest to regain their spellcasting. They only have to pray to their deity at the time of day appropriate to that deity, like Sunrise of Sarenrae and Dusk for Kuthites.


Even divine casters are bound by the recent-casting limit, however, so 8 hours of rest is useful for them as well.


Fake Healer wrote:
Aioran wrote:

While I'm not fussed either way (How often do you need to use two lots of spells and are able to rest 16 hours in one day without spell overlap anyway?) I am interested by this claim.

Joesi wrote:
Rules do specifically say that all casters cannot use their spells more than every day/24-hours
Citation or quote to back that up?

From Wizard class description-

A wizard can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Wizard. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Intelligence score (see Table: Ability Modifiers and Bonus Spells).
A wizard may know any number of spells. He must choose and prepare his spells ahead of time by getting 8 hours of sleep and spending 1 hour studying his spellbook. While studying, the wizard decides which spells to prepare.

From Sorcerer-
Like other spellcasters, a sorcerer can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. Her base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Sorcerer. In addition, she receives bonus spells per day if she has a high Charisma score (see Table: Ability Modifiers and Bonus Spells).
Unlike a wizard or a cleric, a sorcerer need not prepare her spells in advance. She can cast any spell she knows at any time, assuming she has not yet used up her spells per day for that spell level.

From Cleric-
Like other spellcasters, a cleric can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. Her base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Cleric. In addition, she receives bonus spells per day if she has a high Wisdom score (see Table: Ability Modifiers and Bonus Spells).
Clerics meditate or pray for their spells. Each cleric must choose a time when she must spend 1 hour each day in quiet contemplation or supplication to regain her daily allotment of spells. A cleric may prepare and cast any spell on the cleric spell list, provided that she can cast...

That's all true, but a day is not defined as a 24 hour period here.

Thus one could cast spells at 11PM, rest until 7am, then cast again at 9AM. Two different "days" yes, but within 24 hours.


From the CORE book:

'Recent Casting Limit/Rest Interruptions: If a wizard
has cast spells recently, the drain on his resources reduces
his capacity to prepare new spells. When he prepares spells
for the coming day, all the spells he has cast within the last
8 hours count against his daily limit.'

simple


Fast Studywould be so broken, if not for that rule.

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