Garuda-Blooded Aasimar...wings...and Flying?


Rules Questions


Reading about the Aasimar bloodlines I came across the Garuda. In the Garuda description is states the following:

"Garudas are noble but impetuous birdlike celestials, and most garuda-blooded aasimars grow graceful feathers during puberty. The majority of these aasimars have shimmering wings; the wings can be of virtually any shade, ranging from metallic colors to muted hues to pure white, or rarely, glossy black. Plumekith are sometimes born with taloned fingers or toes, and occasionally amber eyes like those of an eagle."

If also gives the Garuda the Fly and Acrobatics skills as racial skills.

I know there is a feat that specifically allows the Aasimar to grow wings but apparently based on the "Blood of Angels" book and the Additional Resources document it says the following " All heritages and associated traits on pages 21-23 are legal."

So my question is this. Considering all of the above IF I chose to play a Garuda-Blooded Aasimar would I automatically have wings and if so would I be able to Fly without the feat associated with doing so. I aks because it specifically says that "the majority" of these aasimar have wings - it does not say "all" have wings. Furthermore, if they are able to Fly without the feat because of this heritage/bloodline would their base Fly speed be their standard movement speed? I am considering an aasimar as a PC and I want to know what all my options are. Thanks.

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Just because they have wings doesn't mean they're functional.

If they don't have a racial fly speed (which they don't), then they can't fly without some other ability granting it.


RainyDayNinja wrote:

Just because they have wings doesn't mean they're functional.

If they don't have a racial fly speed (which they don't), then they can't fly without some other ability granting it.

I had a feeling that was the case. It would be kinda broken to just be able to choose a race and bypass the need to get a feat that allows for flight. Oh well, at least I have a few new options for my Aasimar PC.


Without specifically calling out that Garuda have wings that grant them a fly speed, any wings they have would be purely cosmetic unless otherwise enhanced (like by the Angel Wings feat). Even Tengu, who are anthropomorphic ravens and always have wings can't fly without taking a feat.


Plumekith's wings are vestigial. But you may take the racial ability #99 and gain a flight speed of 20.

Dark Archive

In a home game I'd allow you to go with what Bardess stated however I would likely also demand you give up another trait as well for balance purposes.


In the Fly skill, it says:

"You cannot take this skill without a natural means of flight or gliding. Creatures can also take ranks in Fly if they possess a reliable means of flying every day (either through a spell or other magical manner, such as a druid’s wild shape ability)."

Since you must have a natural means of flight to have the skill and Garuda-Blooded Aasimar automatically get this as a skill, (in my head) that means Garuda-Blooded Aasimar have usable wings. This may be me wanting things for free.


rosscook wrote:

In the Fly skill, it says:

"You cannot take this skill without a natural means of flight or gliding. Creatures can also take ranks in Fly if they possess a reliable means of flying every day (either through a spell or other magical manner, such as a druid’s wild shape ability)."

Since you must have a natural means of flight to have the skill and Garuda-Blooded Aasimar automatically get this as a skill, (in my head) that means Garuda-Blooded Aasimar have usable wings. This may be me wanting things for free.

It's a non-sequitur. Just because they get a racial bonus to Fly doesn't mean they have the ability to fly any more than a Sorcerer having Fly as a class skill means they can Fly before they take a spell that grants flight. The vestigial wings make you better at flying, provided you have some other means of flight, compared to most other races, but unless it specifically calls out that you gain a flight speed, you cannot fly.

Here's another example; the Two-Weapon Warrior archetype for Fighter has numerous abilities that revolve around using TWF, but the archetype does not grant TWF nor subsequent feats from the tree as a bonus feat. Would you say that a Two-Weapon Warrior can use the TWF feat or ITWF without actually taking the feats? Of course not. Likewise, a Plumekinth still needs a way to fly to fly and to train flying, but once he has said method, he'll be better at it by default.


Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
Kazaan wrote:
rosscook wrote:

In the Fly skill, it says:

"You cannot take this skill without a natural means of flight or gliding. Creatures can also take ranks in Fly if they possess a reliable means of flying every day (either through a spell or other magical manner, such as a druid’s wild shape ability)."

Since you must have a natural means of flight to have the skill and Garuda-Blooded Aasimar automatically get this as a skill, (in my head) that means Garuda-Blooded Aasimar have usable wings. This may be me wanting things for free.

It's a non-sequitur. Just because they get a racial bonus to Fly doesn't mean they have the ability to fly any more than a Sorcerer having Fly as a class skill means they can Fly before they take a spell that grants flight. The vestigial wings make you better at flying, provided you have some other means of flight, compared to most other races, but unless it specifically calls out that you gain a flight speed, you cannot fly.

Here's another example; the Two-Weapon Warrior archetype for Fighter has numerous abilities that revolve around using TWF, but the archetype does not grant TWF nor subsequent feats from the tree as a bonus feat. Would you say that a Two-Weapon Warrior can use the TWF feat or ITWF without actually taking the feats? Of course not. Likewise, a Plumekinth still needs a way to fly to fly and to train flying, but once he has said method, he'll be better at it by default.

Technically, a TWF warrior archetype can fight as if he had the two weapon fighting feat, he just gets all those nifty penalties. think it's something like -4/-8 for the falcata+shortsword buildy one.


Giving a character racial flying abilities from level 1 can be problematic, since the assumption until level 5 is that no one can fly, and for quite a while after that it also assumes that you can't fly indefinitely.

If you really want to homerule something in, while not doing too much, just throw in something like the tengu glide ability. A DC 15 check to get the effect of feather fall, and maybe another DC 15 to get some forward propulsion while falling. That is enough that I'd say you could train fly, while its actual effects are low enough that it doesn't break the game. It is just a nice little ability.


Bardess wrote:
Plumekith's wings are vestigial. But you may take the racial ability #99 and gain a flight speed of 20.

I know this is an old thread, but we've got one of these builds in our party & I played him tonight. What is & where is this alternate racial ability?


Pathfinder Rulebook Subscriber
DungeonMastering.com wrote:


I know this is an old thread, but we've got one of these builds in our party & I played him tonight. What is & where is this alternate racial ability?

Page 18-19 of Blood of Angels, it would replace their SLA.


Ah, I see. Variant Aasimar Abilities Entry #99; "You have a natural Fly speed of 20 feet (poor)."

Compare that to:

#33 "When coins or other small metal objects pass through your hands, they become perfectly clean and shiny again." Thanks Universe.

or

#6o "You always know the current position of the sun." Uh, ok.

or my personal favorite for Wasted Ability,

75 "You can sense when a creature is pregnant by standing within 10 feet of the creature." This could come in handy...never.


DungeonMastering.com wrote:

Ah, I see. Variant Aasimar Abilities Entry #99; "You have a natural Fly speed of 20 feet (poor)."

Compare that to:

#33 "When coins or other small metal objects pass through your hands, they become perfectly clean and shiny again." Thanks Universe.

or

#6o "You always know the current position of the sun." Uh, ok.

or my personal favorite for Wasted Ability,

75 "You can sense when a creature is pregnant by standing within 10 feet of the creature." This could come in handy...never.

#33: You don't have to worry about all those bloodstains on the coins you took from the Bartender you just murdered in cold blood!

#60: You'll always have the correct time! Haven't you wished you had such an ability without a watch/clock?

#75: Take Profession: Midwife! With that ability, you could always find prospective employers!

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