I honestly think 4 skill points would be alright personally, but its not a big deal.
I am good with that
I'm fine with 4 + Int mod. Anyone object to that?
All good here.
Then let's move on to the Insightful Mind. Toaster, do you have a more recently tweaked version of the Insightful mind than what was last posted. If so, throw it up. Otherwise, I'll maybe throw up my 1/2 caster version (ranger spell progression) which is where you were going originally, before you mentioned using the hybrid casting progression (1st-6th level spells).
The reason i think magus progression is that the magus is in fact the closest comparison in role and power. I say lose every thing quigong swaps, reduce unarmed progression somewhat, drop the good fortitude save, reduce skill points to 2, and give it the magus spell progression plus canny defense and favored/neglected school. It would end up a better caster than the magus, but will lack the versatility and damage power of spellstrike and spell combat. Would it be too much to have 6th level spells (7th for favored school) for all they lose? Keeping in mind canny defense limits the bonus to ac during early levels.
Problem is, that you're going with a monk primary (no casting) and a wizard secondary (full caster). Using the MCA guidelines, you would generally get 1/2 casting, not hybrid casting. If it was Wiz/Mnk you could go with hybrid casting. You'd likely have to drop ALOT to get the hybrid casting, and I'm not sure if flavorwise it warrants the hybrid casting.
Raider, what do you think about swaps for hybrid casting with a monk primary? Doable? Outrageous Swaps required? Go with 1/2 casting?
Doable, but minimal special abilities OR minimal unarmed attack/AC.
I'd say as well, keep touch (damage) spells off the spell list.
What if they were exclusively restricted to their chosen school? I am looking to bump up casting a bit since one of my players said "why wouldn't you just play an unarmed kensei?" That did cause me to pause and reflect. I do want this balanced appropriately since i want play it as a Dmpc in my current campaign.
i agree that the Magus has the best spell list for something like this what if we gave him that list but with only double reduction in spell casting per day
Can't do Magus Spell List. Too many touch spells.
Figure out everything but the spell list. I'll work my magic (HA!) once we're near the finished version of everything else.
's how I usually do it when the guys need a custom list.
Limited to transmutation with a range of touch perhaps? As far as ability scaling, these guys a solid step behind monks in the ac department with canny defense instead of a full modifier right out the gate. Not sure how far to reduce unarmed strike.
thought that was what we where looking for .... now i am confused about the class
Insightful Mind: The Bard spell list would lend itself well to a monk thematic, I think. It's arcane casting and has influence of mysticism present in monk fantasy themes, as well as the arcane elements from wizardliness. Perhaps bard spellcasting with some ability that adds additional spells from the sorc/wiz.
Before Primal Avatar gets too forgotten about, I wanted to voice a concern about temp HP. Are these bonus HPs lost after the 'rage' ends? I didn't see something like that explicitly stated.
@iorthol#Primal Avatar i think it was mist in assumption i sure the temp hp will be lost when rage ends
#Primal Avatar - good catch Iorthol! Yep, as Kyras said, I'd think when the Primal Spirit manifestation ends any temp hp's gained would dissipate.
RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
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#Primal Avatar -
Wait wait! I had one little thing to add!
"The Primal avatar cannot benefit from transmogrify or any other spell that changes his evolutions, even for a short period of time. The evolutions the primal avatar chooses when gaining new evolution points are permanent."
#Primal Avatar -
Wait wait! I had one little thing to add!"The Primal avatar cannot benefit from transmogrify or any other spell that changes his evolutions, even for a short period of time. The evolutions the primal avatar chooses when gaining new evolution points are permanent."
crap, good catch
I shall add all that in.
I'm going to sit on the sidelines while you guys hash out the Insightful Mind with hybrid casting. I still think 1/2 caster would be a better fit, but we'll see what everyone comes up with. Once there is a solid concept, then I'll weigh in.
Ok here's my proposed draft.
I did a fancy with monk ki spellcasting. Hope yall like it.
Primary: Monk
Secondary: Wizard
Alignment: Any
HD: D8
Bonus Skills: Monk skills, selects 4 wizard skills, 4+int.
Weapon and Armor Profs: Monk weapon and armor proficiencies
Unarmed Strike: An Insightful Mind's unarmed strike damage is reduced by 1 dice category, starting at 1d4 instead of 1d6, and remaining 1 step lower than stated on the base monk chart (I'm sure someone can write a better wording for this but yall get the idea)
Kung-Fu Genius: An Insightful Mind gains the canny defense ability. This is identical to the duelist prestige class ability of the same name (Core Rulebook 382), save that he is not required to wield a weapon to gain it's benefits. This bonus to AC also applies to touch and flat-footed AC. This replaces the AC bonus class feature.
Stunning Fist: An Insightful Mind uses his Intelligence Bonus in place of his Wisdom Bonus to determine his Stunning Fist DC. This modifies Stunning Fist.
Bonus Feats: In addition to the normal selection of bonus feats, at 6th level, item creation feats are added to the list of monk bonus feats.
Fast Movement: An insightful mind is not as athletic of a normal monk of his level. At 3rd level he gains a +10ft enhancement bonus on his on his land speed, which increases by 10ft every 6 levels rather than every 3 levels.
Mystic Ki Pool: An insightful mind develops a font of magical energy much like a normal monk, but this energy is more efficiently spent on overt magical abilities than on feats of physical skill. At 4th level he gains a Mystic Ki Pool which contains a number of mystic ki points equal to his Insightful Mind level plus twice his intelligence modifier. Unlike normal ki points, any ability that costs Ki uses twice the number of mystic ki points from the insightful mind's pool (for example, gaining an additional attack during a full round attack costs 2 mystic ki.)
This modifies Ki pool. Taking Extra Ki grants 4 mystic ki points, and each additional taking of Extra Ki grants 3 mystic ki points.
Mystic Spellcasting: In addition to performing impressive feats of physical skill, the Insightful Mind also manifests magical spells, whos energy is drawn from his Mystic Ki Pool. At 4th level, the Insightful Mind may begin scribing spells into a spellbook in order to cast spells as a wizard does. He begins knowing 1 spell free, and then may add spells to his spellbook as a wizard would. At each level, he leans another spell free. The insightful mind prepares a number of spells he knows how to cast that day equal to that of a ranger, and prepares additional spells known if he has a high intelligence score, and gains access to new spell levels at the same rate as a ranger. Rather than having spells per day, the insightful mind spends a number of mystic ki points equal to the spell level of the spell being cast. His caster level is equal to his insightful mind level -3. He may not use metamagic feats for his spellcasting.
This ability replaces Slowfall, Purity of Body, Evasion, Abundant Step, and Tongue of the Sun and Moon.
(This turns out to be an interesting form of spellcasting, providing a very flexible resource for monk powers and for spells. Technically, by spell level, the insightful mind gains fewer spells per day than a ranger, but can pump out more 4th level spells if they dump all their points into it.)
Arcane School: At 5th level the insightful mind may select an arcane school. He gains the school powers. Instead of gaining an extra spell per day per spell level, he gains a number of speciality mystic ki points equal to 1/2 his insightful mind level that may only be spent on spells from his school focus. In addition, spells from the opposition school cost an additional mystic ki point to cast (so a 3rd level spell would cost 4 mystic ki points.)
This ability replaces Purity of Body and Wholeness of Body.
Evasion: At 9th level the Insightful Mind gains Evasion.
Mystic Metamagic: At 11th level the insightful mind may, as a full round action, cast a spell using a metamagic feat. (Ex. An insightful mind could empower a scorching ray by casting it as a 4th level spell, using 4 mystic ki points.)
This ability replaces Diamon Body.
Mystic Flurry: Starting at level 16, the insightful mind may, as part of a flurry of blows, cast a single spell with the target of touch or personal, that deals no damage, on himself, but he takes a -2 penalty to hit on all of his attacks until his next turn. The range of spells with the target "touch" change to "personal" when cast as part of a flurry of blows.
lvl bab fort ref will special spells
1 0 2 2 2 bonus feat, flurry of blows, stunning fist, unarmed strike - - - -
2 1 3 3 3 bonus feat - - - -
3 2 3 3 3 fast movement, maneuver training, still mind - - - -
4 3 4 4 4 mystic ki pool, mystic spellcasting 0 - - -
5 4 4 4 4 high jump, arcane school 1 - - -
6 4 5 5 5 bonus feat 1 - - -
7 5 5 5 5 ki pool (cold iron/silver) 1 0 - -
8 6 6 6 6 (arcane school ability) 1 1 - -
9 6 6 6 6 evasion 1 1 - -
10 7 7 7 7 bonus feat, ki pool (lawful) 2 1 0 -
11 8 7 7 7 mystic metamagic 2 1 1 -
12 9 8 8 8 (arcane school ability) 2 2 1 -
13 9 8 8 8 diamond soul 3 2 1 0
14 10 9 9 9 bonus feat 3 2 1 1
15 11 9 9 9 quivering palm 3 2 2 1
16 12 10 10 10 mystic flurry 3 3 2 1
17 12 10 10 10 timeless body 4 3 2 1
18 13 11 11 11 bonus feat 4 3 2 2
19 14 11 11 11 empty body 4 3 3 2
20 15 12 12 12 perfect self 4 4 3 3
I thought we were going for a hybrid Monk/Wiz casting MCA, not a 1/2 caster? Otherwise I would have posted my 1/2 caster version.
Hybrid casting is a hell of a project. There would be hardly any monk left in it.
I guess I can give it another go.
What do you think of this version of the 1/2 casting?
Yes, hybrid caster is a heck of a project, but that's what we do. This 1/2 caster looks interesting. Need to reread the Mystic Spellcasting again to understand it.
It's simple enough. This version of insightful mind gains twice the number of ki points, but the cost of ki abilities are doubled. In addition he spends a number of ki points equal to the spell level of a spell he wants to cast. He prepares a list of spells he knows how to cast that day from his spellbook during his 1 hour prep time, and otherwise casts spells like a wizard. At 20th level he ends up with about 19 less spells per day than a ranger but can spend all his ki points on 4th level spells if he wanted (which would be able 7-9 I think)
Here's my base concept for the hybrid version of the Insightful Mind. May need to swap more abilities for the hybrid casting to balance it, or genreate new abilities.
Then we'll need Raider's custom spell list. Toaster will need to weigh in and see what he thinks, as it is his concept.
Long ago, a group of the brightest of elves established an acetic order centuries ago. This order utilizes a combination of mental prowess and physical conditioning to access an internal reservoir of arcane power. Unlike the magus, the insightful mind doesn't just seek to blend magic and combat, but to improve themselves as well. In the Golarion setting, such a process would be invented by elves pursuing the “Brightness”.
Primary Class: Monk.
Secondary Class: Wizard.
Alignment: Any.
Hit Dice: d8.
Bonus Skills and Ranks: The insightful mind may select three wizard skills to add to his class skills in addition to the normal monk class skills. The insightful mind gains a number of ranks at each level equal to 4 + Int modifier.
Weapon and Armor Proficiency: The insightful mind is proficient with the brass knuckles*, cestus*, club, crossbow (light or heavy), dagger, handaxe, javelin, kama, nunchaku, quarterstaff, sai, shortspear, short sword, shuriken, siangham, sling, spear, and temple sword*. Insightful minds are not proficient with any armor or shields. When wearing armor, using a shield, or carrying a medium or heavy load, an insightful mind loses his AC bonus, as well as his fast movement and flurry of blows abilities. (*Advanced Player’s Guide)
Illuminated Spellbook: An insightful mind finds less time to research new spells, but has mastered an elaborate manner of scribing those he learns. At 1st level, the insightful mind incorporates illuminated images into her arcane writings. He begins with an illuminated spellbook containing all cantrips plus three 1st-level spells of his choice. The insightful mind also selects a number of additional 1st-level spells equal to his Intelligence modifier to add to the spellbook. Creatures take a –4 penalty on skill checks involving the insightful mind's spellbook. The insightful mind's spells take one extra page each in his spellbook. At each new insightful mind level, he gains only one new spell of any spell level or levels that he can cast (based on his new insightful mind level) for his spellbook. At every odd level beyond 1st, if he has chosen to specialize in a school of magic, the chosen spell must be from his specialty school. At any time, an insightful mind can also add spells found in another insightful mind’s or wizard’s spellbook to his. In all other respects, an insightful mind's spellbook functions as a normal wizard's spellbook.
Spellcasting: Beginning at 1st level, an insightful mind gains the ability to cast arcane spells which are drawn from the insightful mind spell list. An insightful mind must choose and prepare his spells in advance.
To prepare or cast a spell, an insightful mind must have an Intelligence score equal to at least 10 + the spell level. The Difficulty Class for a saving throw against an insightful mind's spell is 10 + the spell level + the insightful mind's Intelligence modifier.
Like other spellcasters, an insightful mind can cast only a certain number of spells of each spell level per day. His base daily spell allotment is given on Table: Insightful Mind. In addition, he receives bonus spells per day if he has a high Intelligence score. When Table: Insightful Mind indicates that the insightful mind gets 0 spells per day of a given spell level, he gains only the bonus spells he would be entitled to based on his Intelligence score for that spell level.
An insightful mind may know any number of spells. He must choose and prepare his spells ahead of time by getting 8 hours of sleep and spending 1 hour studying his illuminated spellbook. While studying, the insightful mind decides which spells to prepare. An insightful mind otherwise learns, prepares, and casts spells as a wizard. This ability replaces flurry of blows, maneuver training, slow fall, high jump, wholeness of body, abundant step, diamond soul, quivering palm, timeless body, tongue of the sun and moon, and empty body.
Arcane School: At 1st level, an insightful mind gains the wizard’s arcane school ability and gains his first listed school power. At 3rd level, he gains his second listed school power. At 8th level he gains his third listed school power. This ability otherwise functions as arcane school and replaces stunning fist, the reduction to his unarmed strike ability, and still mind.
Canny Defense: At 1st level, when wearing no armor and not using a shield, an insightful mind adds 1 point of Intelligence bonus (if any) per two insightful mind levels as a dodge bonus to his Armor Class and his CMD. If the insightful mind is caught flat-footed or otherwise denied his Dexterity bonus, he also loses this bonus. This ability replaces the monk’s AC bonus.
Unarmed Strike: This is exactly like the monk ability of the same name, except that an insightful mind reduces his unarmed damage dice by one step, as shown on Table: Insightful mind.
Bonus Feats: This is exactly like the monk ability of the same name, except that the insightful mind can also choose a metamagic feat, an item creation, or Spell Mastery. The insightful mind must still meet all prerequisites for these feats, including caster level minimums.
Fast Movement: At 3rd level, an insightful mind’s land speed is faster than the norm for his race by +10 feet. This benefit applies only when he is wearing no armor and not carrying a medium or heavy load. Apply this bonus before modifying the insightful mind's speed because of any load carried or armor worn. This bonus stacks with any other bonuses to the insightful mind's land speed. This changes the monk’s fast movement ability.
Ki Pool (Su): This is exactly like the monk ability of the same name, except that an insightful mind uses his Intelligence modifier instead of his Wisdom modifier to determine his ki pool.
Ki Metamagic (Su): At 8th level, an insightful mind can use his ki pool to reduce the spell cost of using metamagic feats. As a swift action, he can spend a number of ki points up to the level increase of the metamagic feat to reduce it by the same amount (minimum 0). For example, a 4th level insightful mind casts burning hands with the Elemental Spell metamagic feat. This would normally expend a 2nd level spell slot (1st–level spell plus the metamagic feat’s +1 level increase). He can spend 1 ki point as a swift action to reduce the Elemental Spell feat’s level increase to 0, allowing him to cast burning hands with the Elemental Spell feat using only a 1st–level spell slot. An insightful mind can only affect a metamagic spell if he can normally cast it using his available spell slots. Thus, a 7th level insightful could not reduce the level increase of a 1st–level spell using the Maximize Spell feat since he has no access to 4th level spell slots. This ability replaces the reduction to the monk’s fast movement ability.
Ki Mastery (Su): At 20th level, an insightful mind can perform any ki ability for 1 ki point fewer (minimum 0) than usual. If the number of ki points to perform an ability is reduced to 0, the insightful mind can perform this ability as long as he has at least 1 ki point. If a ki ability could already be performed as long as he had at least 1 ki point, he can now perform that ability even when he has no ki points. This ability replaces perfect self.
Table: Insightful Mind
Base
Class Attack Fort Ref Will Unarmed Spells per Day
Level Bonus Save Save Save Special Damage 0 1st 2nd 3rd 4th 5th 6th
1st +0 +0 +2 +2 Arcane school, bonus feat, 1d4 3 1 — — — — —
unarmed strike
2nd +1 +0 +3 +3 Bonus feat, evasion 1d4 4 2 — — — — —
3rd +2 +1 +3 +3 Fast movement 1d4 4 3 — — — — —
4th +3 +1 +4 +4 Ki pool (magic) 1d6 4 3 1 — — — —
5th +3 +1 +4 +4 Purity of body 1d6 4 4 2 — — — —
6th +4 +2 +5 +5 Bonus feat 1d6 5 4 3 — — — —
7th +5 +2 +5 +5 Ki metamagic 1d6 5 4 3 1 — — —
8th +6/+1 +2 +6 +6 1d8 5 4 4 2 — — —
9th +6/+1 +3 +6 +6 Improved evasion 1d8 5 5 4 3 — — —
10th +7/+2 +3 +7 +7 Bonus feat, ki pool (lawful) 1d8 5 5 4 3 1 — —
11th +8/+3 +3 +7 +7 Diamond body 1d8 5 5 4 4 2 — —
12th +9/+4 +4 +8 +8 1d10 5 5 5 4 3 — —
13th +9/+4 +4 +8 +8 1d10 5 5 5 4 3 1 —
14th +10/+5 +4 +9 +9 Bonus feat 1d10 5 5 5 4 4 2 —
15th +11/+6/+1 +5 +9 +9 1d10 5 5 5 5 4 3 —
16th +12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +10 Ki pool (adamantine) 2d6 5 5 5 5 4 3 1
17th +12/+7/+2 +5 +10 +10 2d6 5 5 5 5 4 4 2
18th +13/+8/+3 +6 +11 +11 Bonus feat 2d6 5 5 5 5 5 4 3
19th +14/+9/+4 +6 +11 +11 2d6 5 5 5 5 5 5 4
20th +15/+10/+5 +6 +12 +12 Ki mastery 2d8 5 5 5 5 5 5 5
Elgh you snuck up on me!
Just got done adjusting what I had for a hybrid caster.
Primary: Monk
Secondary: Wizard
Alignment: Any
HD: D8
Bonus Skills: Monk skills, selects 4 wizard skills, 4+int.
Weapon and Armor Profs: Monk weapon and armor proficiencies
Flurry of Blows: The insightful mind does not gain the benefit of two weapon fighting, improved two weapon fighting, and greater two weapon fighting from the Flurry of Blows ability, however he may still take those feats using his normal alotment of feats.
Unarmed Strike: An Insightful Mind's unarmed strike damage is reduced by 1 dice category, starting at 1d4 instead of 1d6, and remaining 1 step lower than stated on the base monk chart (I'm sure someone can write a better wording for this but yall get the idea)
Kung-Fu Genius: An Insightful Mind gains the canny defense ability. This is identical to the duelist prestige class ability of the same name (Core Rulebook 382), save that he is not required to wield a weapon to gain it's benefits. This bonus to AC also applies to touch and flat-footed AC. This replaces the AC bonus class feature.
Spellcasting: An insightful mind casts spells as a magus, but uses the sorc/wizard spell list, and can cast 1 fewer spell per day per spell level. Because of the importance of postures and stances involved in the somatic components of insightful mind spells, he may never benefit from the Still Spell metamagic feat or similar abilities.
This ability replaces the bonus feat granted at 1st level, stunning fist, wholeness of body, meneuver training, still mind, abundant step, tongue of the sun and moon, and slowfall.
Arcane School: At 2nd level the insightful mind may select an arcane school, gaining the school's powers and bonus spells, as well as the opposition school's penalties.
This ability replaces the bonus feat gained at 2nd level and evasion.
Fast Movement: An insightful mind is not as athletic of a normal monk of his level. At 3rd level he gains a +10ft enhancement bonus on his on his land speed, which increases by 10ft every 6 levels rather than every 3 levels.
Arcane Ki Pool: The insightful mind gains the ki pool ability, using his intelligence score in place of his wisdom score. In addition to the normal uses of ki, when the insightful mind prepares spells, he may spend ki points when preparing spells using metamagic feats, using a ki point for every increase in spell level cause by metamagic feats. He may not use this ability to increase a spell higher than the highest level spell he can cast.
This ability alters Ki Pool.
Bonus Feats: Item creation feats and metamagic feats are added to the list of monk bonus feats.
Evasion: At 9th level the Insightful Mind gains Evasion.
Mystic Flurry: Starting at level 16, the insightful mind may, as part of a flurry of blows, cast a single spell with the target of touch or personal, that deals no damage, on himself, but he takes a -2 penalty to hit on all of his attacks until his next turn. The range of spells with the target "touch" change to "personal" when cast as part of a flurry of blows.
lvl bab fort ref will special spells
1 0 2 2 2 flurry of blows, mystic ki pool, unarmed strike, mystic spellcasting, kung-fu genius 0 - - - - -
2 1 3 3 3 arcane school 1 - - - - -
3 2 3 3 3 fast movement 2 - - - - -
4 3 4 4 4 arcane ki pool 2 0 - - - -
5 4 4 4 4 high jump, purity of body 3 1 - - - -
6 4 5 5 5 bonus feat 3 2 - - - -
7 5 5 5 5 ki pool (cold iron/silver) 3 2 0 - - -
8 6 6 6 6 (arcane school ability) 3 3 1 - - -
9 6 6 6 6 evasion 4 3 2 - - -
10 7 7 7 7 bonus feat, ki pool (lawful) 4 3 2 0 - -
11 8 7 7 7 diamond body 4 3 3 1 - -
12 9 8 8 8 (arcane school ability) 4 4 3 2 - -
13 9 8 8 8 diamond soul 4 4 3 2 0 -
14 10 9 9 9 bonus feat 4 4 4 3 1 -
15 11 9 9 9 quivering palm 4 4 4 3 2 -
16 12 10 10 10 mystic flurry 4 4 4 3 2 0
17 12 10 10 10 timeless body 4 4 4 3 3 1
18 13 11 11 11 bonus feat 4 4 4 4 3 2
19 14 11 11 11 empty body 4 4 4 4 4 3
20 15 12 12 12 perfect self 4 4 4 4 4 4
It's very similar to what you have, except instead of a fancy spellbook, I deny access to Still Spell and similar abilities, because of how important the gestures are, and I also cut twf, imp twf, and greater twf out of Flurry of Blows (leaving just the full strength bonus and increased BAB)
Also, for the metamagic thing, since normally metamagic is applied to prepared casters while they're preparing spells, I wrote in my ability to just detract from the day's ki pool as a discount on preparing spells with metamagic.
I also nerfed fast movement and murdered slowfall, leaving in a couple of the higher level abilities you removed, and cut into bonus feats too. Because I think that at lower levels it's a little OP to have the Best selectable ability (spells) AND the 2nd best selectable ability (feats).
holy crap did you guys make this difficult to decide, I am going to have to look at this very carefully to see what's closer in concept.
Sorry about that Toasty :P
I would like to see a Prototype spell list for Elghin's before I make my decision...I see my self having to write up a few characters of each version to get a "feel" for it.
Raider, looks like we need your spell list ASAP.
Man, bladed dash and greater bladed dash are awesome spells for gish classes that I never knew about until recently.
It would work great for insightful mind, and runic berserker, and runeforged warrior, and pretty much every other gish class with 2nd to 5th level spellcasting.
This is totally on-topic to the whole spell list and insightful mind thing. Yep yep. =x
This wouldn't be so difficult if it wasn't, like, my favorite character concept EVAR! It even flusters me into using double negatives and mispronunciation.
This wouldn't be so difficult if it wasn't, like, my favorite character concept EVAR! It even flusters me into using double negatives and mispronunciation.
i know that pain is this you next pc?
This wouldn't be so difficult if it wasn't, like, my favorite character concept EVAR! It even flusters me into using double negatives and mispronunciation.i know that pain is this you next pc?
it is a dmpc awaiting introduction in my next campaign. Also i noticed you both used 4 skill points. Seeing as this is an intelligence based caster wouldn't 2 be the standard?
it is a dmpc awaiting introduction in my next campaign. Also i noticed you both used 4 skill points. Seeing as this is an intelligence based caster wouldn't 2 be the standard?This wouldn't be so difficult if it wasn't, like, my favorite character concept EVAR! It even flusters me into using double negatives and mispronunciation.i know that pain is this you next pc?
the 4+ skill points would make it like the alchemist an int-caster/skill-monkey which is something a monk/wiz would fit in to
lol nothing says perma-dm like a army of DMPCs
it is a dmpc awaiting introduction in my next campaign. Also i noticed you both used 4 skill points. Seeing as this is an intelligence based caster wouldn't 2 be the standard?This wouldn't be so difficult if it wasn't, like, my favorite character concept EVAR! It even flusters me into using double negatives and mispronunciation.i know that pain is this you next pc?the 4+ skill points would make it like the alchemist an int-caster/skill-monkey which is something a monk/wiz would fit in to
lol nothing says perma-dm like a army of DMPCs
as long as there is a precedent i am ok with the skills. I dm about 90% of our games despite having the least amount of experience in the group (seriously I freaking DMed the second campaign I participated in). Add to the fact that I only have three to four players(including myself) and I often find myself playing whatever is needed to fill the gaps in the party (it just so happens we currently only have a druid and rogue right now, so arcane martial class works for me).
so i have looked at the other casters spell list alchemist might be one that works best if your are looking for a list of mostly buff, pulse cure spells which is a staple for max level 6 casters or you could use similar wording i used in my assassin MCA spell list
@+5 they got you. i became a DM when i move from my first group, still like the game so i have had to teach, DM, and play most of my games because of lake of players and what not so most of my players look at my DMPCs as Elmister type PC more part of the setting then the game. If that makes scenes
@kyras, Yeah I tend to do all that too. My mistake was turning into a rules lawyer from over reading the players handbook, it became "since you know the rules the best, why don't you DM?" The I do love coming up with campaign concepts, and I quickly learned to stay very flexible with my stories. So alls well that ends well I suppose. As it is, I have been slowly tweaking a series of housereules for a zombie apocalypse campaign I have been planning for 2 years...aaannnndd we should probably leave this stuff for private chat from here on out to prevent further derail.
right so would would it not be better to have a growing spell list as spells come out. which could lead to imbalance rather than a fixed spell list which could be more balanced but mmmmmm fixed spell list thats a lot more work
right so would would it not be better to have a growing spell list as spells come out. which could lead to imbalance rather than a fixed spell list which could be more balanced but mmmmmm fixed spell list thats a lot more work
Raider said he'd tackle it, and I have faith in him.
ASAP, eh? Right, I gotta couple things to do this afternoon, so expect it this evening.
I'm thinking....
Primary- Buff and Utility
Secondary- Battlefield Control
Tertriary- Debuffs
Sound about right?
ASAP, eh? Right, I gotta couple things to do this afternoon, so expect it this evening.
I'm thinking....
Primary- Buff and Utility
Secondary- Battlefield Control
Tertriary- DebuffsSound about right?
if ki arrow found its way onto the list, I wouldn't be too upset ;)
I'll see what I can do >:3
Right, so are we using Elghinn's version? Need to know before I whip this up.
He'd asked for a prototype spell list for Elgh's version, since my version only called for sorc/wizard spell list.
I just wanted an idea on where it was headed though admittedly i was leaning towards Elghins for this MCA...because Iorthols initial ki casting version is giving me ideas for a monk/magus MCA;)
Ki Casting tends to be horrible 9/10 times. No, really, horrible. :c
The archetype they made is prolly one of only three ways to do it right; the other two are either feat-based selection, or single-type limited.
Looking at Elghinns... the big issue is going to be running off of multiple schools. I don't think I -can- set up a spell list that's going to be broad enough to allow for each school to be appropriate for specialization without creating issues; Evocation is most certainly screwed, and Conjuration'll have several dead levels.
Yeah. Even I have limits, El- you're going to have to decide which schools are going to have to be sacrificed.
Abjuration and Transmutation (sans polymorphs) can certainly stay. Necromancy, too.
If I make a list that focuses on those three as the most appropriate for Specialization, I should also be able to fit illusion in as, if not optimal, at least -available- and not, well, "Monk'd." :P Thoughts?
So why don't we include in the Arcane School write-up that he can only specialize in certain schools and list them. Then list the restricted schools that will certainly screw the MCA and nix them. I can't see why acertain schools can't be forbidden, just like we've restricted MCAs from certain mysteries, domains, bloodlines, etc.
So, you figure out the best combo of spells, and even if there are spells from the forbidden schools (which may be good to just include a few from every school anyways, since I'm sure there are those that are evocations or whatever that would still fit) and then they can still be chosen as opposition schools. Just because a school is forbidden, doesn't mean that the spells from that school in the spell list have to be selected as an opposition school.
I don't see why the spell list needs to be altered/complicated. It's a wizard monk. we already sapped away a lot of the monk's abilities, reduced others, and otherwise reduced monk. i dont see why we can't just give the monk free access to sorc/wiz spells? I mean both my build and elg's is less powerful than a magus and summoner, from what I can tell.
I see no issue with a less powerful monk with nerfed abilities flinging a fireball.
Hell if it's that much of an issue, give the monk the magus spellcasting progression and then reduce it, or give him the arcane school powers but not the bonus spells, but then also keep the increased preparation cost for forbidden spells?