Oh god i was going over a gestalt slayer/investigator and i realized how much that can wreck by 4th level.Is it the +3 to Hit +3 to damage bonus and 2d6 Studied Sneak Attack?
I know they synch well and can be very useful but I dont know why this is insanely good over just really goodI had honestly been thinking that myself. I mean it's obviously alpha rogue, but I can't imagine why 5 isn't the level mentioned, even if we're looking from a Skill Monkey point of view, rather than combat.
Also, btw, I should theoretically make a decent post of combos on here later tonight.
Now I agree having a Sneak Attack damage progression that does not require sneak attack prereqs is nice, and that it stacks is even better. Meaning at level 20 you are rolling 15d6 in Studied Sneak Attack damage. Adding a 1d6 roll onto attack rolls is nice, but hardly sweet as it originally costs 2 IP to use and costs a investigator talent to reduce.
Not to mention both studied combat and studied target are move actions, one of which you can drop to a swift action at level 3, but that wastes a resource just to get to manageable stacking, unless wanna wait till level 7 when it happens automatically on the studied target side.
A fun one is Barbarian 20//Maneuver Master Monk 1/Dirty Trick Fighter 17/Ragechemist 2, taking strength surge as one of your rage powers.
Bonus points if you can convince your DM to let you be an Android and take Adopted (Scion of Humanity) and Racial Heritage (Orc) for the lols. Because being able to rage cycle from level 1 for your strength surges isn't broken at all, I swear....
Alternatively you could do Lore Warden instead of Dirty Trick Fighter for your Fighter levels and be even more awesome at combat maneuvers in general, but there's something lovely about being able to blind, daze, deafen and pin an opponent with just two dirty tricks.
Another fun one is paladin//monk(monk of the empty hand/weapon master). Turns every regular brick into a +5 Vorpal Holy BrickTM!
I just hope, unless the feat for Android characters is used, you realize you won't be getting your Str/Con bump for rage. Poor Androids. :(
I just hope, unless the feat for Android characters is used, you realize you won't be getting your Str/Con bump for rage. Poor Androids. :(A fun one is Barbarian 20//Maneuver Master Monk 1/Dirty Trick Fighter 17/Ragechemist 2, taking strength surge as one of your rage powers.
Bonus points if you can convince your DM to let you be an Android and take Adopted (Scion of Humanity) and Racial Heritage (Orc) for the lols. Because being able to rage cycle from level 1 for your strength surges isn't broken at all, I swear....
Alternatively you could do Lore Warden instead of Dirty Trick Fighter for your Fighter levels and be even more awesome at combat maneuvers in general, but there's something lovely about being able to blind, daze, deafen and pin an opponent with just two dirty tricks.
Another fun one is paladin//monk(monk of the empty hand/weapon master). Turns every regular brick into a +5 Vorpal Holy BrickTM!
The bonus from strength surge is untyped though, so Androids can use that just like everyone else (except better since they can rage cycle from level 1) and they have their nanite surge on top of that, so a Level x2 +3 bonus to CMB makes for hilariously high CMB checks.
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A fun one is Barbarian 20//Maneuver Master Monk 1/Dirty Trick Fighter 17/Ragechemist 2, taking strength surge as one of your rage powers.
Bonus points if you can convince your DM to let you be an Android and take Adopted (Scion of Humanity) and Racial Heritage (Orc) for the lols. Because being able to rage cycle from level 1 for your strength surges isn't broken at all, I swear....
Alternatively you could do Lore Warden instead of Dirty Trick Fighter for your Fighter levels and be even more awesome at combat maneuvers in general, but there's something lovely about being able to blind, daze, deafen and pin an opponent with just two dirty tricks.
Another fun one is paladin//monk(monk of the empty hand/weapon master). Turns every regular brick into a +5 Vorpal Holy BrickTM!
Yeah, you can't do this. Scion of Humanity is an Aasimar racial trait, and since you don't have racial trait it replaces, you can't use it.
As a general rule: if you think Adopted does something really good, it doesn't.
Oh god i was going over a gestalt slayer/investigator and i realized how much that can wreck by 4th level.Is it the +3 to Hit +3 to damage bonus and 2d6 Studied Sneak Attack?
I know they synch well and can be very useful but I dont know why this is insanely good over just really goodI had honestly been thinking that myself. I mean it's obviously alpha rogue, but I can't imagine why 5 isn't the level mentioned, even if we're looking from a Skill Monkey point of view, rather than combat.
Also, btw, I should theoretically make a decent post of combos on here later tonight.
considering that at this point you can already have mutagen and strength based twf those accuracy boosts alone are very good, but besides studied strike you also got your 2nd level extracts coming in(bulls strength, cats grace, and foxes cunning all have various benefits.) i dont deny its power starts multiplying from there, but 4 is when big accuracy and damage boosts first appear.
Research the spell Blood Rage.
Now, I can't really agree on the build you use, because she uses mundane explosives.
Grenadier Alchemist/Brawler would be my way of representing that. ;)
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I'm currently playing a Warder/Psion in a PbP game, its been very fun and quite effective.Nice.
I'm been playing a Soulknife/Stalker, and that's been a blast.
Now that's what I call an assassin.
"Of coarse you can search me, as I said the first time, I'm unarmed" he said as he walked into the ritzy nobles masquerade ball.
I'm guessing you focus on Veiled Moon, Thrashing Dragon, and Steel Serpent.
Look look! Me ask important question for gestalt.
Look look! Me ask important question for gestalt.
Answer no. Fooey.
I'm currently playing a Warder/Psion in a PbP game, its been very fun and quite effective.Nice.
I'm been playing a Soulknife/Stalker, and that's been a blast.
Now that's what I call an assassin.
"Of coarse you can search me, as I said the first time, I'm unarmed" he said as he walked into the ritzy nobles masquerade ball.
I'm guessing you focus on Veiled Moon, Thrashing Dragon, and Steel Serpent.
Pretty much
While not super-powerful...
Barbarian/Fighter always appealed to me. Feats + Rage and barbarian class abilities are honestly awesome.
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i know one thing personally, mad magic became a big game changer for bloodrager gestalts. i gladly welcome my halforc abyssal bloodrager/ scarred witch doctor to the fray.
Bloodrager/Barbarian.
Specifically, Invulnerable Urban Barbarian/Untouchable Spelleater Crossbloded Bloodrager with the abyssal and arcane bloodlines and the superstitious, beast totem and cagm rage powers.
Controled rage stacks with bloodrage. Full DR, Fast Healing, Superstitious saves coupled with high SR, good AC, and D12 HD make you pretty much invincible. Near permanent Haste, Enlarge Person and Transformation, an enormous strenght bonus, pounce and Cagm give you more damage than you really need.
Force Commander Wizard/Lord Warden Fighter
The Chessmaster.
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The Mariachi Band: one Court Bard, one Arcane Duelist Bard, one Sound Striker Bard, one Sandman Bard. If you need a fifth, throw in a Magician Bard.
At that point it kinda doesn't matter what the other side of their Gestalted are. ;)
I'm not familiar with the 3pp psionics at all, but if you want to be an enchanter you might want to think about a Cha build... Awesome bluff/diplomacy/intimidate can be a really great tool for someone whose all about bending others to their will! A magus [eldritch scion]/sorcerer would be very similar in feel but use Cha instead of Int... Plus then you can take the sylvan bloodline for +2 to your save DCs for compulsions. You could also then make him/her a kitsune- they get a racial bonus to Cha, a racial bonus to enchantment DCs, and an awesome favored class bonus (for sorcerers).
As for alchemist/magus, it's not a particularly strong combo but if you're going to do it I like the idea of an alchemist [grenadier]/magus [myrmidon]... With ranged spellstrike you can deliver your ranged touch attack spells as a rider on your bombs :-)
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I like ranger/warpriest... Full BAB, all good saves, 6+ skills, and some wisdom synergy...
Rangers can take TWF without the Dex requirement, so you can go Str build and still dual-wield with weapons that get the scaling damage from sacred weapon! Stack that with lead blades (a 1st level ranger spell) and you'll be hitting pretty hard alright.
Hmm... The Magus / Sor isn't a bad one, I was looking for more permanent domination though. >:) being evil and all lol. Might end up more fluff than anything but dominanting your enemies and forcing them to serve you Greandel style like Wheel of Time has some very evil appeal~
Its hard to decide on an evil character setup.
Antipaladin (Lord of Darkness) / Oracle (Juju Mystery - For some undead / Dream Haunting goodness)
Magus (Ken, BB) / Alchemist (Grenadier) (Because blowing people up is fun.)
Magus / Rogue (Stabbing magical shocking goodness~)
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I like ranger/warpriest... Full BAB, all good saves, 6+ skills, and some wisdom synergy...
Rangers can take TWF without the Dex requirement, so you can go Str build and still dual-wield with weapons that get the scaling damage from sacred weapon! Stack that with lead blades (a 1st level ranger spell) and you'll be hitting pretty hard alright.
How would you build it? 25 point buy, 4 traits, 1 bonus starting feat, and everyone starts with toughness, dodge, alertness, and combat expertise(prerequisite not required).
Any of the races on archivesofnethys.com, along with any Dreamscarred Press material, is available.
I am also considering using a Path of War class to go along with Warpriest.
Starting at level 4 with average wealth by level.
Hmm.
Warlock//Oracle, I think, if I wanted to play it simple and safe. See, Warlocks don't SEEM tough on the surface, but they get to craft (starting at level 12) items as if they knew EVERY SPELL IN THE GAME. PERIOD. This means with Scribe Scroll, you can craft ANY kind of scroll, or you can craft any kind of wand, and... etc. Their blasts also aren't all that bad since you never run-out. Also, greater invisibility as an at-will infinite spell-like ability? Yes, please.
Couple all that with Oracles getting CHA to everything and it's a done deal.
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Like a tarrasque, this thread never REALLY stays down. I love it.
For the Warpriest, I'd consider the unchained Monk/Sacred fist, ESPECIALLY if you can still get MoMS on the new Monk. Gotta wait for the new Monk is the only thing. If the Monk's flurry is better now, maybe you can convince your GM to let your Sacred Fist get the new Flurry?
If you guys can pressure me enough, I've got something I've been meaning to post for a little while now. I just need a bunch of people waiting on me to post it before I'll type it up, as opposed to written on a sheet of notebook paper, like it is now.
That sounds like a nice idea for the Warpriest, but we are not using any Lawful alignment classes for players in the game.
Consider yourself pressured. What is it?
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@dragondorn- I'd help out with some specific build advice, but I'd need more info... Do you have any flavor or fluff in mind? I see you can't be lawful, do you know why (like are you all anti-government guerrilla freedom fighters or something, or common criminals)? How much do you know about the setting?
Generally speaking- in a campaign where the power level is that high, animal companions won't keep up at all... replace that. Divine tracker would be a nice archetype for that- trade the companion for 2 more of your god's blessings and twice as many uses of blessing. If there are things you know you'll be fighting a bunch favored enemy is nice, if not you may want to trade that as well... guide gets a smaller bonus that you can use against anyone you want, or wild stalker trades it (and other stuff) for rage (which could be awesome if it fits with your god and your flavor); don't give up your spells- lead blades alone makes them worth keeping (it'll bump you up to the large table for sacred weapon). For weapons, use kukris- 18-20 crit range with sacred weapon damage and they're light weapons, so good for TWF. For race, I like hungerseed tiefling (handy resistances, a good SLA, and the right stat bonuses; the unscathed trait is nice too) unless your GM wants you to spend a feat just to get the race... If that happens, pretty much anything with a Str bonus would be good. Of course, if you can take any race that's in the archive... Skinwalker and nosferatu-born dhampir (with dayborn) are both strong options too, but it's hard to go wrong with a drow noble... they're flat out more powerful than other races... the only problem is that they really favor a Dex build which pathfinder doesn't support for TWF (unless you're going mythic, or your GM allows the agile enchantment and you don't mind paying for it)...
edit: I just remembered that wild stalker replaces bonus combat feats, which you need if your doing Str-TWF... Wild hunter would probably be a better option (you don't get rage but you get animal focus as a hunter)
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@dragondorn- I'd help out with some specific build advice, but I'd need more info... Do you have any flavor or fluff in mind? I see you can't be lawful, do you know why (like are you all anti-government guerrilla freedom fighters or something, or common criminals)? How much do you know about the setting?
Generally speaking- in a campaign where the power level is that high, animal companions won't keep up at all... replace that. Divine tracker would be a nice archetype for that- trade the companion for 2 more of your god's blessings and twice as many uses of blessing. If there are things you know you'll be fighting a bunch favored enemy is nice, if not you may want to trade that as well... guide gets a smaller bonus that you can use against anyone you want, or wild stalker trades it (and other stuff) for rage (which could be awesome if it fits with your god and your flavor); don't give up your spells- lead blades alone makes them worth keeping (it'll bump you up to the large table for sacred weapon). For weapons, use kukris- 18-20 crit range with sacred weapon damage and they're light weapons, so good for TWF. For race, I like hungerseed tiefling (handy resistances, a good SLA, and the right stat bonuses; the unscathed trait is nice too) unless your GM wants you to spend a feat just to get the race... If that happens, pretty much anything with a Str bonus would be good. Of course, if you can take any race that's in the archive... Skinwalker and nosferatu-born dhampir (with dayborn) are both strong options too, but it's hard to go wrong with a drow noble... they're flat out more powerful than other races... the only problem is that they really favor a Dex build which pathfinder doesn't support for TWF (unless you're going mythic, or your GM allows the agile enchantment and you don't mind paying for it)...
edit: I just remembered that wild stalker replaces bonus combat feats, which you need if your doing Str-TWF... Wild hunter would probably be a better option (you don't get rage but you get...
We played all Lawful alignments last time, so this time we are playing the opposite, I guess. I had looked at the Divine Tracker archetype. It's probably what I'll go with if I go Ranger. I am considering Half Giant for the race to use large weapons. Lead Blades would increase the damage even more. I'm not very familiar with the Golarion gods, so I haven't rally looked at any besides Gorum for the Warpriest.
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Well, Sacred Fist doesn't have a lawful alignment requirement, and Unchained Monk will probably ditch it entirely. Uhh... Brawler could work, but I'll follow this rule AND do an actual different idea. What about...
Standard Warpriest/Inquisitor? At first glance, it's got a lot of the same for the both of them, but you'll never want for something to do with your actions, and your damage should be high. Run out of spells? Nah. And they're spontaneous and prepared. Only real thing is that you won't have 9th level spells. Want ninth level spells? Cleric is less attractive damage wise, but I mean, is it really ever a bad choice?
I've also mulled over a Undine Warpriest/Watersinger Bard. It might be better suited with Inquisitor rather than Warpriest though, for damage. And it's kinda not that synergistic. I just think the idea of it is cool. Wall off an enemy so they can't escape, then Net and Trident them. Attack from the front and back too, depending on how you rule the Watersinger's song attack works. I wouldn't allow you double attacks though. Just the regular number. But from front and behind? Yeah. Grapple em with the water if the net doesn't get em, and stab stab stab.
If you can stand the evil, there's a Neutral Evil Daemon Harbinger named Cixryon you can worship who has favored weapon Musket with Artifice, Earth, Evil, and Knowledge domains. That and Musket Master could be neat. If you're not allowed guns or evil, there's a variety of gods with favored weapon some sort of crossbow. All kinds of crossbow really. Bolt Ace is winking at you from across the room. Better than getting shot at by one. Another Edit: Looked up Musket damage. Already pretty decent. Still worth it though. Maybe Forgepriest?
Edit: I'll admit. I wasn't pressured. I had a few minutes to look up the Cixryon thing. That was way too obscure for me to know off the top of my head.
Unchained looks interesting, but it's not out yet.
I considered Cleric, but decided not too. I have played full Clerics in the past. I am going Warpriest so it doesn't take forever to get buffed for battle. I will miss the full casting though. I'm not going Inquisitor because my last character is an Inquisitor of Gorum. Going for a little variety.
I like having a Bard or Skald in the party, but I can never bring myself to play one. I've built a few, like the arcane duelist, still haven't used them.
The only alignment restriction so far is no Lawful. Not sure about worshiping non-gods yet. I did the crossbow thing with my Inquisitor, so I was planning on going melee this time.
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Gorum really isnt a bad choice at all. The glory blessing is useful but probably not a great fit for this character (I'm guessing), but destruction provides a static damage bonus (which is great for TWF), strength is only a swift action to use (which is great for rounds you're not using fervor- you'll burn through blessings quick with it, but thankfully you get two sets of uses/day), chaos adds +1d6 to every attack vs lawful (again, good for TWF), and war lets you pick your bonus each round which gives good situational flexibility (and if you take the fate's favored trait to maximize divine favor you'll doubly benefit when you choose the AC bonus). I don't see the half-giant in the Archive... is that a 3pp thing?
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Like a tarrasque, this thread never REALLY stays down. I love it.
I like this thread more than the umpteen zillion other gestalt threads it would be nice just to have one to rule them all. Hence why I did some threadomancy... xD
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This thread however is full of awesome... I love it so much! :D
Nate Lange also gives great advice IMO :)
</blush>
Wow, thanks. I don't have the time to be as active on the boards as I once was but I always enjoy helping people out with their builds when I have the chance :)
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Gorum really isnt a bad choice at all. The glory blessing is useful but probably not a great fit for this character (I'm guessing), but destruction provides a static damage bonus (which is great for TWF), strength is only a swift action to use (which is great for rounds you're not using fervor- you'll burn through blessings quick with it, but thankfully you get two sets of uses/day), chaos adds +1d6 to every attack vs lawful (again, good for TWF), and war lets you pick your bonus each round which gives good situational flexibility (and if you take the fate's favored trait to maximize divine favor you'll doubly benefit when you choose the AC bonus). I don't see the half-giant in the Archive... is that a 3pp thing?
** spoiler omitted **
The Half-Giant is from Dreamscarred Press, the Psionics for Pathfinder company. I have most of their stuff.
HERE is a link for it online.
I never though this would still be goinf, i keep thinking about starting a follow up thread.
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We should compile everything from this thread in the follow up than. Becauase I hate to lose such great discussions and suggestions. :D
which I am starting one, its not as detailed but it is an outline of the classes and quick one sentence suggestions if I can manage to cut down the posts to that. :/
When i do i already got a new challenge in mind :}