So I decided to stat up Azathoth as a deity, using Lovecraft's rendition of him. This is just a quick little thing, nothing too elaborate.
Name: Azathoth
Alignment: CE
Portfolio: Madness, music, primal evil
Domains: Evil, Chaos, Madness, Void, Darkness
Favored weapon: Quarterstaff
I gave him the Darkness domain because it is stated that darkness itself is one of his offspring. Madness is there, of course. Void is given because he is stated as existing between the realms of time and space, floating between dimensions.
So yeah, just a quick little thought exercise.
Any particular reason for quarterstaff? Not disagreeing, just wondering...
It was either that or natural weapon (tentacle). :P
But, no, really. There was no good reason, just what I consider a default clerical weapon.
Speaking of which, anyone have a better idea?
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Honestly I don't think Lovecraft ever specifically said that Azathoth was a malevolent deity. In all honesty, 99% of Lovecraft's Outer Gods were probably closer to Chaotic Neutral because they simply existed regardless of humanity. That was arguably the mythos's biggest theme. It would be like claiming that a 5 year old kid is Chaotic Evil because he stepped on an ant hill once. Only our planet's the ant hill.
As a general rule, the Old Ones tend to be more Chaotic Evil than the Outer Gods simply because they're usually aware of humanity and go out of their way to attack it for whatever reason. Point to Cthulhu, who inspires madness in humans with his dreams, or Hastur who seems to want to reduce all intelligent thought into primal, murderous rampages.
Paizo has a really great write-up of the Outer Gods in Wake of the Watchers if you want to see their take on them.
Now, an very interesting thought exercise would be in thinking of reasons why crushing an ant hill isn't Chaotic Evil for the 5 year old. Is it because that even combined, the ants' souls are insignificant compared to the little boy's? Maybe then our souls are likewise insignificant when compared with the Old Ones and the Outer Gods? Maybe their alignments don't change when they murder us because we simply don't matter in the grand scheme of things; at least.
Just like the life of an ant is a blink of an eye to the little boy, our lives are a blink of an eye to the Outer Gods. When compared to the soul of an Outer God, our souls have an ant's life to try and change the world, to bring about goodness or chaos or evil or order. The Outer Gods have power on a galactic scale (perhaps father) while most of those humans will never influence anything outside of one tiny patch of dirt on an otherwise insignificant planet. When you compare that scale, then yeah, maybe one world doesn't matter in such a grand scope; even a world like Golarion, which is being used as a prison.
Considering who his offspring are (Cthulhu, Nyarlathotep, Yog-Sothoth, Sub-Niggurath, Neg, Yeb, among others), I don't think it's much of a stretch to call him Chaotic Evil.
I understand offspring don't define the parents, I'm just saying there isn't much to say about the nice things Azathoth's done.
But Azathoth, reexamining the text, does seem to be assuredly one thing: Chaotic. In my games, there are extreme alignments, which is basically you are so /something/ that it defines you completely and statistical changes and whatnot to how you interact with other alignement spells and such, and he would fall in this. Also, holy run-on sentence, batman!
Here's Paizo's take on Azathoth.
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Azathoth is best used as a pseudo-manifest metaphor for the beginning, end and true nature of an uncaring universe. It is the void itself, the prime source and eventual entropic heat death of all principles, matter, energy and universal laws. Azathoth is a deity in the sense of what a deity would be in an apathetic universe without true gods or purpose.
In a reality like Golarion, Azathoth still retains its throne as probably the most terrible - Azathoth not only represents primal chaos, nuclear entropy and the fundamental (quantum?) churnings and changes of an infinite, cold, empty cosmos - the entire cosmos, regardless of Planes, interstellar boundaries or time.
What I would like to know, in the sense of Golarion, is how true the creators are staying to the ideas behind the Outer Gods?
It appears almost like Deities are more-or-less local, at least on a true cosmic scale, and the outer planes are centered as we know them upon beacons of intelligent life (planets like Golarion) and grow more meaningful and real close to such places (probably due to souls). Perhaps normal deities are limited in range to a galactic or inter-planetary scale, and the further you travel in space, the difference in reality/perception grows more and more alien and different?
Either way, the Outer Gods are in essence cosmic forces that represent the mechanical gestalt of a very intricate and non-human universe whose infinite levels of being manifest infinite sets of laws that only a tiny fraction are perceivable to us. It says a lot about the true importance of the Prime Material Plane, casts doubt on the omnipotence of the anthropomorphic deities of Golarion-like worlds, and makes the terror of the Outer Gods far more palpable in that fear-of-the-unknown and universal apathy way they were made to personify.
What? No, no. They are evil, they are the very definition of evil, evil to the core. They give absolutely no value to life at all, and their objectives are too alien for mortal minds to comprehend.
In fact, i dont even think it would be possible for Azathoth to grant divine powers to a mortal, but then again, the witch Keziah Mason did worship him.
EDIT:
Actually, they are so evil that we cant even measure them with aligments.
EDIT2:
Which reminds me about the azathoth card from arkham horror:
Worshippers: Since Azathoth promises nothing except destruction, only the insane worship him. However, their fanaticism gives them strength. Maniacs have their toughness increased by 1.
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Azathoth isn't even aware we exist, that is why he is nonevil. He s the child that unintentionally steps on an ant hill (we being the ant hill). He would probably destroy us unintentionally if he ever became aware of us, because his power is so great that just the act of actively perceiving us would bring unimaginable destruction, if not extinction, to humanity.
Azathoth is explicitly mindless. It's described as totally indifferent to the cosmos and it's not even certain that he's aware of his own existence. It's CN, and I would say it's N if it weren't the Primal Chaos and the Blind Formless Chaos That Lies Behind The Stars.
I would be hesitant to even assign an alignment to any of the Great Old Ones. They exist so far outside the scope of humanity that something as insignificant as morality really can't apply to them. For the most part they're just anthropomorphized pieces of reality. If a Marvel analogy helps, think of The Beyonder.
The notion of neutral assumes he can do good, and he cant. Or you guys really believe that azathoth can do good, in our notion of good?
All the outer gods are very egoistical and care little about any other life in the universe. On a few of azathoth stories it explains how he gave birth to all other gods and will devour all of them at the end.
And he isnt mindless, his mind is just so completely alien that is on another dimension, his mind isnt like ours, so we cant tell what he is thinking at all, or even if he is aware that we exist.
But keep in mind that Azathoth has created avatars that made contact with humans. Being "idiot" in that case is comparing him to the other gods, not that he is a child-like minded god.
If he is mindless, he is Neutral. Just sayin'. Same way a bear is Neutral, even if eats salmon, kills people who come too close, or dig through garbage bins.
Bears wont destroy the universe though.
Bears wont eat other bears, they might even become friendly of other wild animals, there are cases of bears walking side by side with people without attacking them.
I dont think Azathoth can be that friendly if he wanted to.
Please, dont take the "idiot god" term too literally, he isnt mindless.
EDIT
As an example:
Lemures are completely mindless and still evil to core.
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Enough bears WILL destroy the universe...
Bears wont destroy the universe though.
Bears wont eat other bears, they might even become friendly of other wild animals, there are cases of bears walking side by side with people without attacking them.
I dont think Azathoth can be that friendly if he wanted to.
Please, dont take the "idiot god" term too literally, he isnt mindless.
EDIT
As an example:
Lemures are completely mindless and still evil to core.
Lemures and other evil outsiders are made from evil souls. They are evil incarnate. Azatoth isn't. He just exists.
And remember: Destruction can also be a good thing. Take forest fires, for example.
A red giant sun doesn't go super nova because it's evil even if it is destructive and kills a lot of people. Azathoth's destruction is the same.
Neither forest fires or suns spawn evil gods into existance though.
Neither forest fires or suns spawn evil gods into existance though.
The fact that they exist so far outside the ability for a mortal mind to comprehend says that assigning them any alignment is wrong. They are completely amoral.
Bears wont destroy the universe though.
Bears wont eat other bears, they might even become friendly of other wild animals, there are cases of bears walking side by side with people without attacking them.
I dont think Azathoth can be that friendly if he wanted to.
Please, dont take the "idiot god" term too literally, he isnt mindless.
EDIT
As an example:
Lemures are completely mindless and still evil to core.
At first read (and maybe it's due to talking about bears) I thought you were talking about lemurs. And I was thinking what do you have against furry little protoprimates?
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And I was thinking what do you have against furry little protoprimates?
You dont know even half of the confusion. Lemurs are also called "Lemure" in portuguese (my native language). People on the table start singing "i like to move it move it" from madagascar.
Now, an very interesting thought exercise would be in thinking of reasons why crushing an ant hill isn't Chaotic Evil for the 5 year old.
It wouldn't be evil if the five-year-pld didn't recognise ants as living things. If the five-year-old does understand that ants are alive and don't want their anthill crushed, then not only is it chaotic evil, it's one of the three signs of latent psychopathy (cruelty to animals, fire lighting, late bedwetting).
I ran a campaign set in an Amber cosmology.
The Logrus was merely a small manifestation of Azathoth.
I have to agree with several others on this thread, Azathoth would be CN. Lovecraft talks about him in his notes as emerging from the primordial chaos at the beginning of the universe. I would probably go so far as to say he is Chaotic only, being more a force of nature than a being.