4-19 The Night March of Kalkamedes


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Grand Lodge

B3. The Lift to the Lower Level

A couple of questions about this area, because it seems I'm missing something (or several somethings):

1) On p. 13, it states that the lift lever has three positions, and moving the lever up causes the cage to rise. However, there is no description of what area or room it goes to. Is anything actually up there? It also says that there is an identical lever at the bottom, but presumably there is no "down" position since the lift has reached the bottom. I'm thinking it's clearer to have the levers only have two positions.

2) Also, did you rule that the console with the lever could be reached from the inside of the lift/cage?

3) What are those dotted lines in area B3 on the map? My guess is that the top of the chamber is square in shape, but the bottom has more of a curvy shape indicated by those dotted lines and the areas that extend north and east of the 25x25 square.

4) Not a question, but I was confused at first that the bottom of the lift area was not really described, and the text to read for the beginning of Area C (Cavern of the Black Edifice) assumes they've exited the lift and moved down the short passageway already. Someone running this on the fly might get a little turned around by that.

Thanks!

5/5 5/55/55/5

1) On p. 13, it states that the lift lever has three positions, and moving the lever up causes the cage to rise. However, there is no description of what area or room it goes to. Is anything actually up there? It also says that there is an identical lever at the bottom, but presumably there is no "down" position since the lift has reached the bottom. I'm thinking it's clearer to have the levers only have two positions.

The ground floor is up if you're in the basement.

2) Also, did you rule that the console with the lever could be reached from the inside of the lift/cage?

Sure. Shouldn't matter unless the party is running away (and if things have reached that point... )

Grand Lodge 5/5 Venture-Captain, Arizona—Phoenix aka TriOmegaZero

1. I ruled it as the lever staying in the neutral position until operated. Then it moves the cage in the desired direction until reaching the terminal point. Once the cage stops, the level returns to the neutral position.

2. I did not, so the party wizard had to stay up top while everyone else went down, then messaged them when he was in the cage. I think they were intending to mage hand the lever until they found the second lever at the bottom.

3. The dotted lines are the walls at the bottom of the shaft, which do not match with the walls at the top, as they are part of natural caverns.

4. Agreed, it is something to watch out for.

Scarab Sages 4/5

Doug Maynard wrote:
1) On p. 13, it states that the lift lever has three positions, and moving the lever up causes the cage to rise. However, there is no description of what area or room it goes to. Is anything actually up there? It also says that there is an identical lever at the bottom, but presumably there is no "down" position since the lift has reached the bottom. I'm thinking it's clearer to have the levers only have two positions.

I believe each lever has both up and down so that you can "call" the elevator if it is on a different level than you. That way you won't get stuck if you're in the basement and the elevator is on the ground floor. You would pull the lever down to get it to come back down to you, or you'd pull it up if you're upstairs and the elevator is down. So there are no additional levels.

Grand Lodge

Thanks, all, that's makes sense. And I like TriOmegaZero's idea of noting that the lever clicks back to the neutral position after the cage reaches its destination.

Another question - in the scenario the PCs find a potion of cure serious wounds in the pool where Ilvaster is, but in the items on the chronicle sheet, a potion of cure moderate wounds is listed. Is this an error, or do are the items in the scenario sometimes different in 'level' than the ones on the chronicle sheet (nowhere else in the scenario is there a CMW or CSW that I could find).

Sovereign Court 5/5 RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

I did enjoy the Taldor faction mission, especially when the other factions ran off doing their tasks.

"Once again, I must apologize for my fellow Pathfinders lack of concern about your friend as they run off again. Care to tell me more about yourself while we wait for them to get back?"

Grand Lodge

The Precipice

It's not explicit in the scenario, but I am guessing that there is no way around the canyon - in other words, it goes on for miles, or runs into other impassable barriers such as the sides of mountains?

Sovereign Court 5/5 RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

Doug Maynard wrote:

The Precipice

It's not explicit in the scenario, but I am guessing that there is no way around the canyon - in other words, it goes on for miles, or runs into other impassable barriers such as the sides of mountains?

That's how I see it. On one side, sheer cliff face, on the other, open air.

Liberty's Edge 5/5

I do find it funny though, when you are playing at tier 6-7, and nobody has any rope.

Really?!

Grand Lodge

Andrew Christian wrote:

I do find it funny though, when you are playing at tier 6-7, and nobody has any rope.

Really?!

How do you play a Tier 1-5 scenario at Tier 6-7? :P

But yes 1 of the times we've ran this they didn't have any. Good times.

Liberty's Edge 5/5

yeah, forgot it was a 1-5. But still, the same applies at sub-tier 4-5

Shadow Lodge 5/5 5/55/5 Venture-Lieutenant, California—San Francisco Bay Area North & East aka thistledown

Questions on the Gift of the Ghaele.

1. I assume that the subtier you get for it is the subtier you played the Night March on, not the scenario where you activate it. Correct?

2. One of the options at subtier 4-5 is Restoration. Does this version include negative levels from getting raised?

3. If it can restore negative levels from getting raised, can it be applied "after the mission"? Ie: During game wrap-up when prestige is used for a raise dead.

Grand Lodge 5/5 Venture-Captain, Arizona—Phoenix aka TriOmegaZero

1. Yes, the sub-tier where you earned it. The other should be lined out by the GM.

2. Probably.

3. I know of no rule stating you must use boons only during scenarios.

Liberty's Edge

I ran this last night and enjoyed GMing it as much as playing. It was tier 1-2, and nobody had spellcraft, linguistics or any knowledge skills other than nature. This made it difficult to unravel a lot of the puzzels, but my group managed with enough time. It's a clever scenario with some interesting challenges other than straight up combat. Really enjoyed it.

Grand Lodge

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I just found the perfect mini for Kalkamedes.

Seriously. I ordered it on Amazon so I can use it this Friday. :)

Gotta love Lego minifigures!

Shadow Lodge 5/5 5/55/5 Venture-Lieutenant, California—San Francisco Bay Area North & East aka thistledown

I went looking through my lego fig stockpile when I ran the game. Then I remembered that I had skipped him thinking "I'll never use that"... And only bought the head and hair.

Grand Lodge 5/5

Pathfinder Adventure Path, Companion, Rulebook Subscriber
Xuttah wrote:
I ran this last night and enjoyed GMing it as much as playing. It was tier 1-2, and nobody had spellcraft, linguistics or any knowledge skills other than nature. This made it difficult to unravel a lot of the puzzels, but my group managed with enough time. It's a clever scenario with some interesting challenges other than straight up combat. Really enjoyed it.

Hey hey hey I resemble that remark!

But we did have a horse, an angry angry horse, who did more to hold back old Kalkamedes then anything else we did.

Liberty's Edge

Galnörag wrote:


Hey hey hey I resemble that remark!

Yes, yes you do. ;-) Hats off to Horselightcombattrained for all of his contributions too.

Grand Lodge

Just a quick question, if a PC wants to take Gamin the Intelligent sword, but wants to rename him in case they stumble come across another PC who ALSO has Gamin the Intelligent sword, are they allowed to come up with a different name for him? I'm just thinking of a tactic to avoid situations where verisimilitude comes crashing down.

In my game, my poor little Halfling cavalier implicitly believed the entrapped gnome (he had a +28 to bluff, there was no possible chance even if I had maxed Sense Motive I could see through the lies!) He let him loose. One dead angel later, and my little Halfling knight now has a very pressing reason to become a powerful pathfinder. Koth'Vaul must be defeated!

Shadow Lodge

KestlerGunner wrote:
Just a quick question, if a PC wants to take Gamin the Intelligent sword, but wants to rename him in case they stumble come across another PC who ALSO has Gamin the Intelligent sword, are they allowed to come up with a different name for him? I'm just thinking of a tactic to avoid situations where verisimilitude comes crashing down.

Go for it. If someone gives you grief about it tell them it's actually a nickname because Gamin confessed to you that he secretly hates being called Gamin.

Although I do love the idea of some nut job wizard assembly-lining broken intelligent swords just for kicks.

Grand Lodge

Probably the same nut job who's breeding up faerie dragons all named Riddywhipple and letting them loose into Golarion.
Somehow I suspect this guy is a Gnome.

Sovereign Court

KestlerGunner wrote:

Probably the same nut job who's breeding up faerie dragons all named Riddywhipple and letting them loose into Golarion.

Somehow I suspect this guy is a Gnome.

Riddywhipple just really gets around and is uncreative about naming his militia of kids. I mean, what rhymes with Riddywhipple anyways?


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El Baron de los Banditos wrote:


Riddywhipple just really gets around and is uncreative about naming his militia of kids. I mean, what rhymes with Riddywhipple anyways?

Spoiler:

Tittynipple.

Sovereign Court 5/5 RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

Unknown Ediology wrote:
El Baron de los Banditos wrote:


Riddywhipple just really gets around and is uncreative about naming his militia of kids. I mean, what rhymes with Riddywhipple anyways?
** spoiler omitted **

My Reddywipple has become known as...

Spoiler:
Ruddynipple

Liberty's Edge

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My Shoanti Barbarian rescued the Gnome because that's what Pathfinders do right?, and he asked to be let out. What Bleeding Bear did not realize is that Gnomes cannot normally turn into rather large and Pincer equipped very large Gnomes. In fact he still believes now that some Gnomes have a secret power to turn into combat gnomes.

Although My best moment in the adventure was when the other Barbarian charged the Glabrezu. Balls of Steel.


Matthew Pittard wrote:

My Shoanti Barbarian rescued the Gnome because that's what Pathfinders do right?, and he asked to be let out. What Bleeding Bear did not realize is that Gnomes cannot normally turn into rather large and Pincer equipped very large Gnomes. In fact he still believes now that some Gnomes have a secret power to turn into combat gnomes.

Awesome

Grand Lodge

Both Shadow Lodge members I've had at my tables have put the screws to Sheila before she can even finish asking the players to help Kalkamedes.

It just paints Shadow Lodge as uncaring jerks, IMO. No desire to help someone, only point fingers and call names.

Scarab Sages 5/5

My apologies. I swear to you not all members of my former faction were so crass.


Hey,

If a first level caster detected magic on the intelligent sword does he get knocked out?

Our GM for this game kept this boon and it came up, crafted by a caster level 5 but is it a minor artifact?

Grand Lodge

DMFrank wrote:

Hey,

If a first level caster detected magic on the intelligent sword does he get knocked out?

Our GM for this game kept this boon and it came up, crafted by a caster level 5 but is it a minor artifact?

The scenario actually has it listed as "faint transmutation" if I'm not mistaken.

4/5

Matthew Pittard wrote:
My Shoanti Barbarian rescued the Gnome because that's what Pathfinders do right?, and he asked to be let out. What Bleeding Bear did not realize is that Gnomes cannot normally turn into rather large and Pincer equipped very large Gnomes. In fact he still believes now that some Gnomes have a secret power to turn into combat gnomes.

Combat gnome.

Liberty's Edge

heh... yeah I did think Spriggan at the time. Also Koth Vaul didnt sound like a very .. demonic name to my character. Although he had not actually met a demonic/devil type creature yet.. or a spirit circle.

There was a small gnome with bright coloured hair in danger, so Bleeding Bear helped them out. Hes very much a character with a distorted world view and perceives magic as something generally bad (Has Superstition as a Rage Power)

Bleeding Bear now has a very different view of gnomes and a lot more respect. Woe betide Varisia if more gnomes discover their secret enlarge powers.

The Exchange

John Compton wrote:
Phillip Reed wrote:
I'm a little confused about how Gamin's guidance ability is supposed to work, however. The description on page 6 says, "when held he can cast guidance on his wielder at will." The rules for an intelligent item's powers say, "All powers function at the direction of the item, although intelligent items generally follow the wishes of their owner. Activating a power or concentrating on an active one is a standard action the item takes." Does Gamin need to actually be held to use his ability, or can he use it even if he's sheathed? There's also been a lot of confusion in the past over exactly what the term "wield" means -- see all of the arguments about the Defending weapon property -- and I believe the consensus there is that you must actually attack with a weapon to be considered to be wielding it in that round.
Gamin can activate guidance at his own direction, which means the character need not use an action to command him. The guidance aspect is only possible when a PC wields Gamin, which is to say hold him in a hand. That was a development choice to keep someone from saying that Gamin just casts guidance every round of every hour of every day. My intention is not to weigh in on the definition of wield in other discussions, but this is how our friendly, flawed sword is intended to operate.

So-just being clear--as long as you're holding Gamin, he can cast guidance for you? The reason I ask is because there are certain things that would allow you to be holding Gamin (say, a prehensile tiefling tail or a monkey belt) but would not allow you to be wielding him as a weapon. So say,if a tiefling with prehensile tail is holding him with the tail, but using a bow, is Gamin capable of casting guidance on the tiefling?

Also-another question--is Gamin on the chronicle at the end an all or nothing thing? I wonder because I can easily see a scenario where you have four pcs in a group and three are respectful of Kalkamedes but one is a real jerk. It doesn't seem fair to deny the three who tried their best to be respectful access to Gamin because of the actions of one pc. It also doesn't seem to fit the text of the story that Gamin would go with the one who treated Kalkamedes like a jerk, though. Would you give access to Gamin to all, or cross it off the one player's sheet, or deny access to all in such a situation?

Shadow Lodge

teribithia9 wrote:
John Compton wrote:
Phillip Reed wrote:
I'm a little confused about how Gamin's guidance ability is supposed to work, however. The description on page 6 says, "when held he can cast guidance on his wielder at will." The rules for an intelligent item's powers say, "All powers function at the direction of the item, although intelligent items generally follow the wishes of their owner. Activating a power or concentrating on an active one is a standard action the item takes." Does Gamin need to actually be held to use his ability, or can he use it even if he's sheathed? There's also been a lot of confusion in the past over exactly what the term "wield" means -- see all of the arguments about the Defending weapon property -- and I believe the consensus there is that you must actually attack with a weapon to be considered to be wielding it in that round.
Gamin can activate guidance at his own direction, which means the character need not use an action to command him. The guidance aspect is only possible when a PC wields Gamin, which is to say hold him in a hand. That was a development choice to keep someone from saying that Gamin just casts guidance every round of every hour of every day. My intention is not to weigh in on the definition of wield in other discussions, but this is how our friendly, flawed sword is intended to operate.

So-just being clear--as long as you're holding Gamin, he can cast guidance for you? The reason I ask is because there are certain things that would allow you to be holding Gamin (say, a prehensile tiefling tail or a monkey belt) but would not allow you to be wielding him as a weapon. So say,if a tiefling with prehensile tail is holding him with the tail, but using a bow, is Gamin capable of casting guidance on the tiefling?

Also-another question--is Gamin on the chronicle at the end an all or nothing thing? I wonder because I can easily see a scenario where you have four pcs in a group and three are respectful of...

Cross it off the sheet of the jerk. Gamin can like some people without liking others.

The Exchange

pathar wrote:
teribithia9 wrote:
John Compton wrote:
Phillip Reed wrote:
Also-another question--is Gamin on the chronicle at the end an all or nothing thing? I wonder because I can easily see a scenario where you have four pcs in a
...

Thanks. That's what I think, too. Missed John saying he didn't intend to weigh in on discussions about wielding--or wouldn't have asked the other question. Not trying to be annoying--my eyes just apparently don't work. I'm really looking forward to running this scenario, though. It looks like loads of fun. Thanks, again.


So, here's a question for everyone. I've run this twice (just finishing up the second run-through). And neither party has wanted to go anywhere near the gnome.

The first set down always decides to hold down Kalkamedes until the others arrive on the lift (and they've succeeded). Koth'Vaul hollers, entices, begs, etc, but even when the entire party arrives, no one wants to go near the gnome. Instead, both parties have just gone straight towards the nearer alcove, and ended up fighting the dragon.

So, how have other GMs managed to get their players to go investigate the gnome? How do you pique their curiosity?


Unknown Ediology wrote:

So, here's a question for everyone. I've run this twice (just finishing up the second run-through). And neither party has wanted to go anywhere near the gnome.

The first set down always decides to hold down Kalkamedes until the others arrive on the lift (and they've succeeded). Koth'Vaul hollers, entices, begs, etc, but even when the entire party arrives, no one wants to go near the gnome. Instead, both parties have just gone straight towards the nearer alcove, and ended up fighting the dragon.

So, how have other GMs managed to get their players to go investigate the gnome? How do you pique their curiosity?

We just went over and talked to him. Of course, I was playing a gnome, so that might have helped.

Shadow Lodge

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thejeff wrote:
Unknown Ediology wrote:
So, how have other GMs managed to get their players to go investigate the gnome? How do you pique their curiosity?
We just went over and talked to him. Of course, I was playing a gnome, so that might have helped.

Ugh, my GM at PaizoCon kept crying out in the most annoying voice, "FREE THE GNOME!" He was wearing one of the awesome goblin hats, and I told him (both IC/OOC) that I was going to tear his ears off if he wasn't quiet while the adults talked. It was tempting to set him free just to shut him up, but luckily our sense motives were good.

Grand Lodge

Unknown Ediology wrote:

So, here's a question for everyone. I've run this twice (just finishing up the second run-through). And neither party has wanted to go anywhere near the gnome.

The first set down always decides to hold down Kalkamedes until the others arrive on the lift (and they've succeeded). Koth'Vaul hollers, entices, begs, etc, but even when the entire party arrives, no one wants to go near the gnome. Instead, both parties have just gone straight towards the nearer alcove, and ended up fighting the dragon.

So, how have other GMs managed to get their players to go investigate the gnome? How do you pique their curiosity?

I've always done things the same way.

Spoiler:
Koth'Vaul starts talking as soon I finish the box text for the players. I make him sound happy to see them, lots of pleading and begging for his freedom. If anyone mentions they want to walk away, he will address them directly and ask them how they can be so heartless. Koth is a slippery deceitful demon of treachery, he's not above twisting emotions to his needs.
If they keep walking after he starts his begging. I've had him cry out that he's afraid the players will hurt Sullinae and he summons the dragon to "protect" her.

4/5

Keep in mind how good that Gnome is at bluff, his disguise is nearly perfect. As long as no one is detecting evil it shouldn't be that hard to get people to let him go free. Its fun to free him :^)

On another note, people were shocked by the gnome, but when I GMed it I had people swearing how much they hated that old man by the end of it. True hate for an NPC they're aiding, that's when you know you've succeeded as a GM.


Thanks! I'll have to see what happens next time I run it. The bluff portion has been a problem, the players themselves just completely steer away, no matter what I do or say. The closest I came was when he promised one of the characters (who's an orphan) that he knows who his parents are. But the player still turned and walked away.

Guess I just need to pratice my sales skills a bit more!

The Exchange 5/5

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Unknown Ediology wrote:

Thanks! I'll have to see what happens next time I run it. The bluff portion has been a problem, the players themselves just completely steer away, no matter what I do or say. The closest I came was when he promised one of the characters (who's an orphan) that he knows who his parents are. But the player still turned and walked away.

Guess I just need to pratice my sales skills a bit more!

nah, we just need a few scenarios written where the "littel kid" is just a little kid. Where the prisoner in the cell asking to be let out - is a prisoner in a cell wanting to be let out.

It's gotten to be so bad that players are likely to shot at the "little children" running away - because "everyone KNOWS they're DEMONS".

The Exchange

I had a PC from the first group free the gnome right away, almost like the player knew it was going to screw everyone. The 2nd level barbarian then attacked Koth'vaul, but couldn't hit him. I was merciful and had him reposition her, ordering his undead minions to kill her. Then he took the PC who freed him over to Sulianna and ordered him to scratch out the circle. The player did so, rationalizing it was best to do as the demon said to save his own skin. Koth'vaul shredded Sulianna and then asked for his buddy's name. Then he patted him on the head, promised to look him up after seeing to some unfinished business in Varisia and teleported away. I made a note on the player's Chronicle sheet regarding Koth'vaul's 'favor'. The rest of the party arrived too late to change the outcome.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

nosig wrote:
Unknown Ediology wrote:
Guess I just need to pratice my sales skills a bit more!

nah, we just need a few scenarios written where the "littel kid" is just a little kid. Where the prisoner in the cell asking to be let out - is a prisoner in a cell wanting to be let out.

It's gotten to be so bad that players are likely to shot at the "little children" running away - because "everyone KNOWS they're DEMONS".

+1

When [redacted] was announced on the blog, I joked in the discussion thread that [redacted] was probably a [redacted] in disguise and maybe I'd just kill them on sight. If memory serves, at least two different people chastised me for dropping spoilers out in the open like that. And this was before I could possibly have read or played the scenario, so ironically those responses became a spoiler for me, shattering any doubt I may still have had. :/

The Exchange 5/5

Jiggy wrote:
nosig wrote:
Unknown Ediology wrote:
Guess I just need to pratice my sales skills a bit more!

nah, we just need a few scenarios written where the "littel kid" is just a little kid. Where the prisoner in the cell asking to be let out - is a prisoner in a cell wanting to be let out.

It's gotten to be so bad that players are likely to shot at the "little children" running away - because "everyone KNOWS they're DEMONS".

+1

When [redacted] was announced on the blog, I joked in the discussion thread that [redacted] was probably a [redacted] in disguise and maybe I'd just kill them on sight. If memory serves, at least two different people chastised me for dropping spoilers out in the open like that. And this was before I could possibly have read or played the scenario, so ironically those responses became a spoiler for me, shattering any doubt I may still have had. :/

yeah, happened more than once for me too.

I (in character) comment that we shouldn't do XXX and the judge snaps back "well, someone has be reading spoilers"! shesh... spoiled that, and made me feel bad for the rest of the game.

Though I remember your comment about the [redacted] - and the fact that I sort of dropped the ball on that adventure myself. When I played it, I figured [redacted] was a demon, and my PC arranged to splash [redacted] with holy water. No effect... "just playing my 7 CHA! sorry about that!" stock off and later ...

5/5 5/55/55/5

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Cheating! How'd you know that pile of bones in the corner was a skeleton playing dead?

Its ALWAYS a skeleton playing dead.

How'd you know the caster would be invisible?

-They're always invisible

How'd you know there would be a darkness spell?

-there's always a darkness spell

How'd you know there would be a swarm?

- There's always a swarm

While you were sleeping?

-*holds up equipment sheet, showing that there is a vial of alchemists fire hidden in the teddybear*

Freaking bedbugs...

Shadow Lodge 5/5 5/55/55/55/5 Venture-Captain, Indiana—Southern aka CanisDirus

nosig wrote:
Unknown Ediology wrote:

Thanks! I'll have to see what happens next time I run it. The bluff portion has been a problem, the players themselves just completely steer away, no matter what I do or say. The closest I came was when he promised one of the characters (who's an orphan) that he knows who his parents are. But the player still turned and walked away.

Guess I just need to pratice my sales skills a bit more!

nah, we just need a few scenarios written where the "littel kid" is just a little kid. Where the prisoner in the cell asking to be let out - is a prisoner in a cell wanting to be let out.

It's gotten to be so bad that players are likely to shot at the "little children" running away - because "everyone KNOWS they're DEMONS".

Fortress of the Nail does this, kind of.


I'll be running this saturday and I'm sure the oracle in my group is going to want this item eventually so I'm going to ask now. Is there a way to fix Gamin?

If not will there be one in the future?

As a named intelligent item it doesn't appear Gamin can be upgraded is this intentional? Or do you believe at some point in the future the repair will upgrade it to a +3 item or better.

Lastly can a +1 mithral longsword be upgraded to Gamin.

Sovereign Court 5/5 RPG Superstar 2009 Top 32, 2010 Top 8

Undone wrote:

I'll be running this saturday and I'm sure the oracle in my group is going to want this item eventually so I'm going to ask now. Is there a way to fix Gamin?

If not will there be one in the future?

As a named intelligent item it doesn't appear Gamin can be upgraded is this intentional? Or do you believe at some point in the future the repair will upgrade it to a +3 item or better.

Lastly can a +1 mithral longsword be upgraded to Gamin.

Not currently.

Maybe (I'm hoping so)

Unknown.

No.

(all IMHO)

Shadow Lodge

Undone wrote:
As a named intelligent item it doesn't appear Gamin can be upgraded is this intentional?

I agree with Matthew's answers but I don't think he addressed this sub-question, so I wanted to note that yes, this is all very intentional. If you take Gamin, you take him broken and un-upgradable. It's deliberate.

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