3PPs looking for artists?


Product Discussion

Scarab Sages

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Hey guys where is the best place on the boards to post interest in doing artwork for 3rd party publishers? I thought there was a recruitment forum somewhere?
Thanks
Reebo

President, Jon Brazer Enterprises

Good question. I don't know. But while we're on the topic, do you have a portfolio?

Liberty's Edge

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Typically artists contact prospective companies directly


That might be a fun little forum to set up (either on the boards or off it). I'll echo what both Marc and Dale have said.
Most time we are contacted by people directly and they include a portfolio of works (Devinatart works great too).

-Scott

Sovereign Court

To expand on Dale's post (and put emphasis on Scott's point), including a link to your portfolio (or DA gallery ... a great resource for having your work easily accessible, I might add) would be a great idea whenever you post an inquiry along these lines.

I have seen posts made in this section of the board as well as the OTD section. But include a link to your work regardless of where you post it.


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Reebo Kesh wrote:

Hey guys where is the best place on the boards to post interest in doing artwork for 3rd party publishers? I thought there was a recruitment forum somewhere?

Thanks
Reebo

First: Have a portfolio up for 3PP to see.

Second: Email 3PP you would actually like to work for because you like what they do more than how much they will pay you.

Third: Do a free stock art PDF and give away 5 pieces of artwork. 3PP are always looking for new artist AND to save money on artwork. If we like your stock art we will come looking FOR YOU.

Hope these help.

Minister of Propaganda, Super Genius Games

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I second what LPJ said.

We're always looking for artists and our budgets are small, but if you're reliable, you'll get a lot of work thrown your way.


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You could open a thread here or on ENWolrd like Storn, Glad, ATOM did, posting a few pieces... I'm sure they did get some employment out of these.

Liberty's Edge

R. Hyrum Savage wrote:


We're always looking for artists and our budgets are small, but if you're reliable, you'll get a lot of work thrown your way.

And, they are wonderful to work with! :)


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Small products use less artwork, so the style can be just as important as the quality. Make sure your gallery shows the breadth of what you can do; the more comfortable I am that you can produce work in a style I want, the more likely I am to hire you for any specific piece.

Shadow Lodge

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Yeah, I have to agree with all of the above. For us, style is extremely important. I like hungry artists that contact us. It tells me they want work and are more likely to deliver.


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Same goes for us at Purple Duck Games/4 Winds Fantasy Gaming. I'll add that I'll leave this contact email here so people can reach us: gedakm@gmail.com

The Exchange

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For those of you who don't know, there is a (invite only) Google+ Community called "Gaming Industry Professionals" where many people post some things like "Artist available, see my work here: URL" or "I need to know where I can get decent quality custom dice. Anyone have any suggestions?" PM me with what company you're affiliated with, or if you are a solo operator (like as in, an artist or freelance writer etc.) then just say that as well.

Scarab Sages

Thanks guys, I must have mistaken it with Enworld which has/had a forum for recruitment.
I do have a deviantart account but I really need to organise some pieces better suited to the hobby.
Thanks again for the advice.
Reebo

LOOKING FOR GROUP - SYDNEY, AUSTRALIA. Looking for a regular group that needs another player with the possibility of DMing for that group in the future. PM me if interested.

VP Sales & Marketing, Frog God Games

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LMPjr007 wrote:
Reebo Kesh wrote:

Hey guys where is the best place on the boards to post interest in doing artwork for 3rd party publishers? I thought there was a recruitment forum somewhere?

Thanks
Reebo

First: Have a portfolio up for 3PP to see.

Second: Email 3PP you would actually like to work for because you like what they do more than how much they will pay you.

Third: Do a free stock art PDF and give away 5 pieces of artwork. 3PP are always looking for new artist AND to save money on artwork. If we like your stock art we will come looking FOR YOU.

Hope these help.

Also when you email a 3PP give them your rate card up front. That is always going to be the first question we ask.

Contributor

I may be in need of a few artists. Contact me at Christina AT misfit-studios Dot Com

Minister of Propaganda, Super Genius Games

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Rachel F. Ventura wrote:
Also when you email a 3PP give them your rate card up front. That is always going to be the first question we ask.

Double true. Without fail my first reply will always be along the lines of:

"Nice work! What are your rates? Please understand that our budgets are small and we put out at least a book a week, so we need a lot of art and can't spend a lot on individual pieces."

And please don't reply with "reasonable" because I'll tell you right now that my Super Genius definition of "reasonable" is going to be very different than my publicly traded computer game production day job definition of "reasonable" and both are going to be different than your definition. :)

And while we're at it, can we get rid of "full page-1/2 page-1/4 page" etc? With Photoshop those definitions don't mean a whole lot anymore.

Liberty's Edge

R. Hyrum Savage wrote:


And while we're at it, can we get rid of "full page-1/2 page-1/4 page" etc? With Photoshop those definitions don't mean a whole lot anymore.

I'd still say full page, 1/2 page and 1/4 page have value and meaning, particularly when dealing with print, although your point is well taken.

When I'm contracting for art, I always specify both the dimensions and the resolution, such as: 4C 1/2 page (5.25 x 8) at 300 dpi just to be sure there is no confusion.

Minister of Propaganda, Super Genius Games

DPI and intented use matters, I think, more so than size, since a dodgy publisher could contract for 1/4 page at 300+ DPI and resize it larger.

Contributor

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It seems like it would be easier just to say what you pay straight up. Fewer emails.

Sovereign Court

R. Hyrum Savage wrote:
DPI and intented use matters, I think, more so than size, since a dodgy publisher could contract for 1/4 page at 300+ DPI and resize it larger.

For Iron Hills Games, I do still prefer getting quotes on the three file sizes simply for the fact that intended placement can be impacted (for the 1/2 page especially ... big difference between 1/2 page 8.5"x5.5" and 1/2 page 4.25"x11"). Additionally, even with 300 dpi, if you expand an image up in size, you'll still see a loss in quality ... not huge, but there none the less.

I do agree though that if you contract for a 1/4 page illustration, you should not be blowing it up to a full page ... that's just cheap and unethical.


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Yeah, I go the other way around. Commission full page art, then reduce to fit where it needs to go - half page, quarter page or full page.


Well sometimes drawing to the edges doesn't fly with every publisher's layout. I know we have guidelines regarding that (we also don't like feathered edges on stuff, but that's just a pet peeve).


When I buy quarter page art, I'm telling the artist I don't anticipate anyone will be staring at it on the cover of a book for several minutes. I'm not saying it should be half-assed, or anything. But I'm not encouraging you to full-ass something that's only going to be five inches tall. As a rule of thumb, I don't generally ask for more than one proof for a quarter page, unless you screw something up. I understand that my ability to hold your attention is based on what I pay you. So, there's that.

When it comes to cover art, pay is basically going to have some kind of relationship with the possible sales of the book. I'm not sure there's such a thing as "too high" as long as I make my slice as a publisher. Conversely, if the book is small enough, the art budget is going to be small. The cover will be whatever I can get, maybe even a couple of "quarter page" illos on a color background.

Sovereign Court

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Full to quarter I get, it maintains the aspect ratio. But half page would result in distortion (unless you are running with an image running ~6.25"x7.5" ...).

But this is a derail from the OP.

Suffice to say different 3PP will run with different image requirements. ;)

Scarab Sages RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4; Contributor; Publisher, Legendary Games

All of the above is good advice. You also need to consider whether you want payment on delivery, on publication, paid as an ongoing percentage royalty of sales, or some combination of the above. Different publishers have different payment methods, and knowing what you want (and what you're willing to accept, even if it's not what you'd prefer) are important steps.

If you've got a portfolio to share, email me at makeyourgamelegendary@gmail.com and I'd be happy to give it a look.


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When it comes to art, LPJ Design is normally only looking for either full color full body character design or half page (8.5x5.5 inches) full color images and we pay the same amount for both. Item design and headshot character design we pay 50% of the body character design rate. Quarter page art isn't worth the cost to me and you can save money on doing a single character design images versus paying for a full page full color piece.

If you are looking to save money on artwork, look overseas. There are a lot of great artist looking for exposure in American / Canadian products. The best place to start looking for artist is on deviantart. Search fantasy in the search bar and then start looking. You are bound to find some good artist there. I have and I know the guys at SGG have also.

Liberty's Edge

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LMPjr007 wrote:
If you are looking to save money on artwork, look overseas.

This makes me sad.

Scarab Sages RPG Superstar 2008 Top 4; Contributor; Publisher, Legendary Games

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At Legendary Games, we've worked with artists from the U.S. as well as from New Zealand, Australia, Thailand, Germany, the United Kingdom, and Mexico. It's a small world with the internet these days, and people are wherever they are.

We haven't made a special effort to look for artists outside the U.S. as perhaps Louis has, but we've followed recommendations from friends, colleagues, and contacts and found people in lots of places. As long as they can turn in good work, on time, with good communication, they can be from Texas or Timbuktu.


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ShadowcatX wrote:
LMPjr007 wrote:
If you are looking to save money on artwork, look overseas.
This makes me sad.

It might make you sad but it is a fact of business. When I wanted this image created I received bids from several artist. All the artist from the US wanted $300 and up. The artist who did the work was from South America and did it for less than $75 US. When ever penny counts you go with the best deals that give you the best quality for the best price. Or would you as the customer prefer to pay three times as much for the same product due to art cost? And you think the Pathfinder Core Rulebook is expensive now.

What the sad part is that "work" of any kind is now on a global market and artwork is a commodity. If I had to depend exclusively only on US artist, the cost of my products would be more and in some case the quality would not be as good.

Jason Nelson wrote:
At Legendary Games, we've worked with artists from the U.S. as well as from New Zealand, Australia, Thailand, Germany, the United Kingdom, and Mexico. It's a small world with the internet these days, and people are wherever they are.

The world is so small now, I can assign work before I go to bed to someone overseas and when I wake up in the morning have the work to me. The power of distance and time on a business can be highly powerful and highly profitable.


LMPjr007 wrote:
It might make you sad but it is a fact of business. When I wanted this image created I received bids from several artist. All the artist from the US wanted $300 and up.

I've used one overseas artist, and the rest are from the US, and I've never paid more than $100 for even cover art, with most other below $50 for best quality work. I'm not sure where you're looking, but I haven't had such problems finding affordable artists in the US.

Contributor

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It depends on the product as to whether or not I want to spend the $300+ cover art price. If it's for print, then yes. If it's an artist with name recognition, then yes--still for print, though.

I'm gearing up to do more PDF projects in the future, though, so I need to learn from you guys! ;)

Contributor

Also, I know some of you do your own layout. If you are paying someone, what's the standard rate per page? I've been quoted from $1-$4.

Publisher, Dreamscarred Press

I've seen rates anywhere from $1 per page to $5 per page for layout, and most of the time, there's also a setup cost beyond the per page fee... which is part of the reason I still do the layout on our small releases.


We had a guy who did our layouts before I took over doing the editing. I'd have to go back and ask him. I think we ended up paying our friend like $20 for a 20-30 page product. So $1-$4 SEEMS right.

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