I don't understand any of this.The 2k pound leg press really made me lol.
It reminds me of this old guy I'd see at the gym..literally filled the leg press with 45s and then push it like 3 inches.
Nothing more annoying than the guys who say "ya I squat like 365" and then proceed to rack it up and do quarter squats. Go deep or get out, kids. /end gym rant.
In a nutshell, if you say "I can squat 500 pounds" and by that you mean "I can move it like 3 inches once or twice on a good day" you can't squat 500 pounds.
To someone who is not religious, Pat is ridiculously extreme. Westboro is merely a difference in degree... and to non-religious, also ridiculously extreme.
There's actually a wikipedia page devoted to his controversies.
Honestly, I had to laugh seeing other headlines. My dad and my current Multimedia teacher grew up with OD&D, and they're just fine.
I can't believe that list...not that he said those thing...but that the list is so small. I would imagine it to be alot longer.
The funny thing is that he doesn't look threatening. He's a little old man, but his ideas are deadly. Let's hope he and people like him give way to a new generation of more compassionate christians.
Having just watched the documentary "Jesus Land", I doubt that will happen, but I try to remain optimistic.
The film, in case any of you are wondering, chronicles the indoctrination of a group of children into the Pentecostal/Evangelical faith. Really disturbing; I recommend it highly.
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Mr. Robertson is what the Christian community refers to as an uberchristian. For context, we put Wesboro in the same category.Now that's just offensive. I've got a lot of family who line up 90% or better with Pat's philosophies, and while I certainly wouldn't agree with them they're nowhere near Westboro's crap.
The man called my religion (Unitarian) "The spirit of the Antichrist". On national TV. In all seriousness. From where I am standing I really don't see the difference between him and the WBC.
Pat Robertson is offensive. Really--he smells.
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In a nutshell, if you say "I can squat 500 pounds" and by that you mean "I can move it like 3 inches once or twice on a good day" you can't squat 500 pounds.I don't understand any of this.The 2k pound leg press really made me lol.
It reminds me of this old guy I'd see at the gym..literally filled the leg press with 45s and then push it like 3 inches.
Nothing more annoying than the guys who say "ya I squat like 365" and then proceed to rack it up and do quarter squats. Go deep or get out, kids. /end gym rant.
I get that it is some kind of exercise, what with being in a gym, but to me squat means either 'short' or 'sitting on your heels'.
He can put 500lb on his heels? It can't be that but I don't know what it is.
To be honest, I'm not overly interested: it just struck me as strange that someone would post in such an opaque manner.
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Geraint,
Leg press is a seated exercise where you press against a metal sheet with your feet and pulleys lift the weight. Obviously moving it three inches doesn't count as a full press, or even close, unleass you're a pixie.
Squat is traditional weightlifting bar acros sthe shoulders then, with back straight, lower yourself to a just below seated position, squatting, and raise. If you just dip down slghtly and don't go to the full squat, is usually a quarter squat and considered not to count as a proper squat.
And now you know, even if you didn't really want to.
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And now you know, even if you didn't really want to.
And knowing is half the battle!
There's a big difference.
Robertson's version is a more classic donation funding scheme. He needs to keep the paranoia and fear up to keep the sense of persecution and group identity that keeps the donations flowing.
The Westboro clan's scheme is to draw attacks, physical or otherwise, and make money suing the attackers.The philosophies are largely irrelevant.
Are you saying the main difference is *how* these people go about scheming money from others?
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Are you saying the main difference is *how* these people go about scheming money from others?
There's a big difference.
Robertson's version is a more classic donation funding scheme. He needs to keep the paranoia and fear up to keep the sense of persecution and group identity that keeps the donations flowing.
The Westboro clan's scheme is to draw attacks, physical or otherwise, and make money suing the attackers.The philosophies are largely irrelevant.
Well to be honest I always thought that with these people it is all about the money. The 'religous' message is a just a means to the end. I mean how many of these relgious leaders are caught doing things that are completely counter to what they preach?
Glad to see he has such an open mind.
Does the calendar say 1982?
Reminds me of this
I was on these boards few months ago wondering if dnd was okay to playing as I am a Christian. The Paizo gang were all helpful and insightful and I even got some private messages. I am fine with it but limit the controversial stuff like demons. My conscience is clear with God.
Watching the clip of mr paterson I feel he has a point if you are confused and think rpg are evil then why take the chance. The devil will try and tempt everyone with different things - for some this may be RPGs. However I still cannot believe dnd had killed people. Please don't mention Mazes and monsters in this.
As usual good discussion. God bless you all and may your hip points run out.
As usual good discussion. God bless you all and may your hip points run out.
Wait you want us to die? That is what happens wqhen our HPs run out.
Or did you forget the word 'never in that sentence?
Valid point - never should be in there.sorry
Well technically when your hit points run out, you don't die, you just become incapacitated.
Mr. Robertson is what the Christian community refers to as an uberchristian. For context, we put Wesboro in the same category.Now that's just offensive. I've got a lot of family who line up 90% or better with Pat's philosophies, and while I certainly wouldn't agree with them they're nowhere near Westboro's crap.
He said in his Halloween video (paraphrasing) "We don't believe in haunted stuff or ghosts."This is pretty funny though, given his beliefs regarding the demonic. Who's to say that haunted house doesn't have a familiar spirit clinging to it making s#@@ go crazy :P
I'm sorry I offended you. However, I legitimately believe Mr. Robertson is a confused individual. I don't believe he has the same mal-intent as the WBC, though, so that might help clear things up.
Yeah, he recommends binding familiar spirits to sweaters. Which is funny, because that's stated in the Bible as witchcraft, which is what he's recommending to use it to combat. Oh Robertson, you so silly.
As usual good discussion. God bless you all and may your hip points never run out.
When your hip points run out, do you *become* Pat Robertson? Or do you cause some sort of cataclysmic matter-meets-antimatter explosion if you come within 100 yards of a man with an ironic moustache ? ;)
Nah, you just lose the ability to wear trousers without a really tightly cinched belt.
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Watching the clip of mr paterson I feel he has a point if you are confused and think rpg are evil then why take the chance.
No, he doesn't have a point. If you are confused and think RPGs are evil, it's probably time to figure out why you're confused about something, and start the process of un-confusing yourself.
"I don't understand it, so I'll just ignore it," is one of the absolute worst guiding philosophies you can have.
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Let's try to avoid getting too caustic in discussion of real people. You can express your disagreement with their beliefs without attacking them personally.
I'm not saying that that has happened at an unacceptable level in this thread, incidentally, just that it seems poised to go there. So please proceed with mutually-respectful caution. :-)
Thanks!
Ugg. Things like this give all of Christianity a bad name, when only a fringe element actually believes this. Its like Jack Chick running around with his head cut off because of 15 year old kids saying, "I cast magic missile, for...3 damage!"
You're totally going to be condemned to an eternity in Gehenna for having dared to say the words magic missile. I wish that these Jack Chick/Pat Robertson types would focus on more important issues.
The philosophies are largely irrelevant.
They are pretty much identical, though. The only thing that separates Westboro from Robertson, or both of them from the average antigay internet poster are tactical decisions.
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I KNEW I was a danger to myself and others!
Pat is one of the far right wingers. I am a right winger, and he is routinely chastised by the right for saying some very rediculous stuff.
If you want to see how D&D destroys lives, watch the classic Tom Hanks movie "Mazes and Monsters". I love that
(Been playing D&D since 1977 and not killed anyone in RL yet...)
Pat is one of the far right wingers. I am a right winger, and he is routinely chastised by the right for saying some very rediculous stuff.
Totally off-topic, but why do so many self-described conservatives misspell this word in exactly the same way? It seems really odd that politics would affect spelling, especially in so specific a way.
Because democrat states are "red"; everyone knows those people are red-iculous!
I stand corrected.
Because democrat states are "red"; everyone knows those people are red-iculous!Actually, the Blue states are the ones that are primarily Democrat, not that it seems to make much of a difference any more.
Detect Magic must be old. Red was actually the original color for Democrats, because of the fact that the Dems were more sympathetic toward communism. A decade or two ago, the media changed it for them, making Republicans red and Dems blue. You can read more on Wikipedia.
Anyway, it is a very typical thing for people to do. They take the one extreme example (like Todd Akin), and then use that person to paint the entire group as being "horrible people." That is what they did with the case of Bink Pulling, who committed suicide because his character died. The thing is, Bink already had mental problems. But the media and some far-out-there-in-Cthulhu-ville "Christians" used his tragic death to paint all RPGs as bad.
Typical human nature.
Actually, I'm not. I just misspoke. Oops!
Violence in sufficient quantities solves every problem.
Violence not solving your problem? Apply moar violence.
Reminds me of a pic on my computer. It's Kenpachi Zaraki beaten and bloodied after a fight with that line at the bottom.
I read this as "judging all Christians by Pat Robertson." Please tell me you don't mean that.I'm going to sum my general feelings about him up in a quote that may or may not be from Gandhi.
"I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ."
Oh no, there's plenty of horrible christians out there that one can judge christians by. But there are good ones as well. Just as with any group. I do however, believe that some groups attract more horrible people than others groups however.
In the end, it is always best to judge people on their own respects, but it is also foolish to think that you won't be judged by others based on the company you keep.
Problem is for most of us it's not the company we keep. We don't keep people like them around us and we don't subscribe to their brand of religion. If a group of vegetarians came out and started protesting funerals because we ate animals or telling people that they are hated by Mother Nature for being a flesh eating abomination you wouldn't go and assume all of the worlds vegetarians were like those people. If some gamers decided to start going out and doing violent things all over the place and getting media attention would you want to be labeled as one of them, or would you hope people would have enough sense to separate extremist from you? So why group all Christians by the ones who get the most attention?
If a group of vegetarians came out and started protesting funerals because we ate animals or telling people that they are hated by Mother Nature for being a flesh eating abomination you wouldn't go and assume all of the worlds vegetarians were like those people.
If no other vegetarians contradicted them, most people would, I think. But most of the vegetarians I know go out of their way to distance themselves and their fellow veggies from that kind of a stance, and to make extra-sure no one thinks they endorse it. And it's that action on their part that spares them the guilt-by-association you're talking about.
If some gamers decided to start going out and doing violent things all over the place and getting media attention would you want to be labeled as one of them, or would you hope people would have enough sense to separate extremist from you?
If I did nothing to show that I didn't tacitly support them, then, yes, I would deserve that.
So why group all Christians by the ones who get the most attention?
People stopped associating Westboro with "Christians" when the other churches showed up and started protesting against Westboro. That sent a clear signal to the rest of the world that, "Hey, not only are we not like that, but we're willing to actively oppose it, not just sit on the sidelines and let them speak for us." As soon as mainstream Christians start boycotting CBN ("Family Channel"/"ABC Family" or whatever it is now) and actively demanding that PTL be removed from the airwaves and Robertson be branded a loon, their denials will start ringing true there as well.
Good points Kirth and shadowcat. The real issue is that ignorance. The assumption that your with X belief until you forcibly show otherwise is a huge issue that I wish I could cure.
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Are you saying the main difference is *how* these people go about scheming money from others?
There's a big difference.
Robertson's version is a more classic donation funding scheme. He needs to keep the paranoia and fear up to keep the sense of persecution and group identity that keeps the donations flowing.
The Westboro clan's scheme is to draw attacks, physical or otherwise, and make money suing the attackers.The philosophies are largely irrelevant.
Pretty much. I view the one as taking a small group of people, consistently reinforcing their paranoia in order to convince them to let go of more money.
The other goes out of its way to be as offensive as possible to people outside it's following in order to leverage the court system to take money away from those that don't follow.
Looked at that way, the Westboro people are much smarter. They have a bigger pool to draw from, there are an infinite number of way to seriously offend people into doing somethng that lets you sue them, and they've got the weight of the judicial system to enforce their new source of income. It's despicable...but a very sustainable business model.
:(
The only way to win is not to play.
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Watching the clip of mr paterson I feel he has a point if you are confused and think rpg are evil then why take the chance.No, he doesn't have a point. If you are confused and think RPGs are evil, it's probably time to figure out why you're confused about something, and start the process of un-confusing yourself.
"I don't understand it, so I'll just ignore it," is one of the absolute worst guiding philosophies you can have.
If you're not sure if something is inappropriate, avoiding it in case it is inappropriate for you is a valid option. It may not be your preferred option, but it's an option.
I'm a Christian, and obviously have no issue with RPGs. But if I have a friend who does, I will not tell them they should participate. If they are convinced (obviously, I believe wrongly so) that it is inappropriate, then pressuring them to participate is wrong. Having a conversation and asking for the chance to explain why I don't think it's an issue isn't off the table, though.
There are a couple of passages that touch on how to deal with different understandings of what is and isn't right and wrong (Romans 14:13-23; I Corinthians 8:1-13), and how to handle being considerate of people, even if you don't agree with their understanding of things.
I have an aunt with no exposure to RPGs except the bad press. If it comes up in conversation, I won't lie about it (my mom wants me to, in order to avoid difficult conversation), but I won't go out of my way to bring it up, either.
There is some danger in role playing games - it's an intense hobby in many ways, and if there's someone already struggling with mental issues, I think RPGs are more likely than Pinochle to cause that person difficulties. There are issues of age appropriateness and difficult or triggering situations in an RPG that most other hobbies don't have to consider much, if at all.
Meh. This is getting booklike. There's my take on it, anyway.
Pat is one of the far right wingers. I am a right winger, and he is routinely chastised by the right for saying some very rediculous stuff.Totally off-topic, but why do so many self-described conservatives misspell this word in exactly the same way? It seems really odd that politics would affect spelling, especially in so specific a way.
It is a secret sign between all of us actualy sane right wingers. Well I guess now it is a poorly kept secret. Not that it matters much as the insane right wingers don't believe in the internet.