Sorry if this has come up before, but I can't for the life of me find any rules on it.
Are there rules to cover hitting or even intentionally crit-hitting yourself with a weapon?
The reason I ask such a crazy question is this:
I'm currently pondering a villain (or maybe even a character) that uses abilities similar to Unwilling Shield, Bestow Wounds (3.5), and gains temporary hit points to help offset the damage.
If you can auto-crit yourself as a standard action, I can get away with using a smaller, less common weapon like a katar or something but still have a threatening but rewarding encounter.
You can coup-de-grace yourself... but it requires a full round action.
Also... save or die and such...
As far as I know, by RAW, you cannot voluntarily assume the helpless state.
Edit: I guess you are entirely at your own mercy, but are you your own opponent? Anyway, this concept seems very gimmicky/rule bending anywho.
I'd say since you can voluntarily fail a will save that you can voluntarily lower your AC (except for your armor bonus, maybe). I'd also rule that any damage you do beyond your HP total with a bludgoning weapon is automatically subdual. It's almost impossible to beat yourself to death.
It is possible to hit or kill yourself but the GM has to decide under what conditions it is possible.
A suicide occurs only under special conditions .. the person is mad, depressive, under drugs etc.
Hitting yourself is easier but it should not be a common tactic for NPC or PC. Maybe with a fluffy background .. monks/clerics from a special religious group or something like that.
The big question is not "can i do it". It should be "why should i do it".
A few adventures back I had a villain that cut her throat after ten rounds of combat. No rolls because of the fluff and none of the PCs cared. They couldn't know that what shall arise from her death would be far worse.
As for your question I would simply say that you can hit yourself as if you had Dex 0 (-5 to AC). Auto-crit could be difficult because you'd have to carefully strike vital areas without killing yourself, as opposed to striking vital areas to deliberately kill yourself.
As a halfly unrelated anecdote, I was playing Final Fantasy XII one day when my girlfriend asked me if you could target youself with an attack. So I tried. And my sole character (Vaan) hit himself three times in a row (!), killing himself. Game over. Last save hours back.
It took me several days before I had the nerve to continue.
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As far as I know, by RAW, you cannot voluntarily assume the helpless state.
Edit: I guess you are entirely at your own mercy, but are you your own opponent? Anyway, this concept seems very gimmicky/rule bending anywho.
Sorry, but by that logic according RAW you cannot choose to sit on a chair or do a little dance either. Demanding an opponent is just rules malarkey.
Assuming the helpless state to receive a coup-de-grace is as simple as saying "my character willingly accepts the the blow". Committing suicide is well simulated by the coup-de-grace rule, given that you might involuntarily survive due to a Fort save. Mechanically it should be easy to allow 'normal' hits like that as well, but that is not as well-supported by the rules.
However, if you are hurting yourself with the intention of triggering some power or gaining an advantage or such nonsense, you are well advised to exercise the GM arbiter role to say NO (even to yourself). I'm thinking of a barbarian that gains rage powers from damage on self, then starts hitting himself to start the battle with powers. Situations such as the turn-undead move as posted above are acceptable.
I'd say since you can voluntarily fail a will save that you can voluntarily lower your AC (except for your armor bonus, maybe). I'd also rule that any damage you do beyond your HP total with a bludgoning weapon is automatically subdual. It's almost impossible to beat yourself to death.non-lethal damage in excess of your current hit points is transformed into lethal damage, though...
Crap. Auto stabalize, maybe? Or convert all of it to subdual if the attack would take you below 0... I'd just throw that in there mostly for a touch of realism though. If you want to off yourself, use a knife or a gun dammit. Quit playing pretend and crying for help with the alchamists kit.
As far as I know, by RAW, you cannot voluntarily assume the helpless state.
Edit: I guess you are entirely at your own mercy, but are you your own opponent? Anyway, this concept seems very gimmicky/rule bending anywho.
Sorry, but by that logic according RAW you cannot choose to sit on a chair or do a little dance either. Demanding an opponent is just rules malarkey.
Assuming the helpless state to receive a coup-de-grace is as simple as saying "my character willingly accepts the the blow". Committing suicide is well simulated by the coup-de-grace rule, given that you might involuntarily survive due to a Fort save. Mechanically it should be easy to allow 'normal' hits like that as well, but that is not as well-supported by the rules.
However, if you are hurting yourself with the intention of triggering some power or gaining an advantage or such nonsense, you are well advised to exercise the GM arbiter role to say NO (even to yourself). I'm thinking of a barbarian that gains rage powers from damage on self, then starts hitting himself to start the battle with powers. Situations such as the turn-undead move as posted above are acceptable.
Not really. Sitting in a char is not considered under the rules; there are no rules for it and the DM must make a call (what is it? A movement action? A standad action? What about AoOs?). The helpless condition is required for a coup-de-grace. Whether you can give yourself said condition is a valid rules discussion (how a DM should handle this while being reasonable is entirely another issue). Remember, this is the rules forum.
I think most GMs would rule you to be allowed to voluntarily be "helpless", by simply not moving out of the way of an incoming attack. Otherwise they won't get their BBEG to be able to sacrifice mad cultists, because the cultists would involuntarily dodge his sacrificial knife, no matter how much they want to be embraced by whatever god they worship.
Pretty sure Confused creatures can injure themselves without a check, although it's a flat 1d8+.
Pretty sure Confused creatures can injure themselves without a check, although it's a flat 1d8+.
Although thats more likely due to stumbling and/or falling on sharp pointed objects, edges or other potentially dangerous thing, rather than the Pokémon like hitting-themselves-with-their-own-attack-somehow-Confusion.
51–75 Deal 1d8 points of damage + Str modifier to self
with item in hand
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So by your logic I couldn't jump off a cliff, I would have to roll a reflex save first to make sure I didn't change my mind?
Of course you can coup de grace yourself. Seppuku is very possible.
If I were DM I would allow you to instantly kill yourself if there was no one to stop you. Otherwise I would rule you can coup de grace yourself.
I would try not to have it happen at my table unless there was a compelling story or tactic to it. If the PC was trying to make sure they didn't give up information to his/her captor I could understand that. If it was a heavy RP game and he/she suffered a major loss like Romeo and Juliet, I would allow that too.
Your mileage may vary.
I have a witch with the Blood Money spell the use of wich includes intentionally giving herself HP and STR damage to supply the blood. Therefor it's certainly possible to intentionally damage yourself. There might be some issues with being able to do full two-handed damage to yourself because of the mechanics of the swing, but if it's your own sword, you can always fall on it.
This is a RAW vs DM adjudication issue.
I would allow someone to kill themselves using a coup de grace (there is a reason the katana has the deadly quality).
If a player was trying to do some shenanigans like wyrroot (sp?) sap hitting themselves I would call foul.
First I would like to thank everyone who took the time to respond.
Second, I'm not planning on the villain committing suicide. The reason for the self-inflicted damage is they are a follower of a demented cult that delights in spreading suffering, pain and death. They will use 2 methods to do this.
The first is to create a 'link' between themselves and there victim so when they are wounded, so is there victim. In this manner, they can feel the suffering of there target.
The second is to 'share' the pain and suffering they have already experienced by spells/abilities that do hp damage to there target to heal themselves by an equal amount. Note, if they are not wounded, this kind of thing will have no effect.
Without the ability to wound itself, this villain will only have a mediocre melee attack/thrown weapons to threaten with if no link exist, and/or if they are only inflicted with non-lethal damaged.
I would also like to note, non-lethal damage will not work for any of the spells/abilities I plan to use.
Crazy? Gimmicky? Absolutely. But I feel like such an encounter will be more memorable than another crazy wizard trying to cast suggestion on the big strong dumb looking guy to "Give your caster/roguish looking buddy over there a big manly hug" followed up with nice aoe blasting or snaring type of spell.
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Hahahah! I just had a funny mental image of one of these cultists bonding themselves to a PC, using Vampiric Touch on itself, dealing half damage to the PC, half damage to itself, and gaining all the damage dealt as temporary hit points.
