Goblet of the Elements


Open Call: Design a wondrous item

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RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

Goblet of the Elements
Aura faint abjuration and transmutation; CL 3rd
Slot none; Price 2000 gp; Weight 1 lb.
Description
This golden goblet decorated with cavorting elemental creatures transmutes an alchemical grenade into protective alchemical solution.

As a standard action the barer can pour one alchemical liquid (such as alchemist’s fire, acid, or liquid ice) into the goblet and then drink the resulting liquid. The drinker gains 1d6 points of energy resistance for 1min. The type of resistance depends on the alchemical liquid used: fire resistance from a vial of alchemist’s fire, acid resistance from a vial of acid, and cold resistance from a vial of liquid ice.

The liquid can be left in the goblet indefinitely, but is not magically contained within the goblet and can be spilled as any normal liquid. If not drunk during the same round in which it was poured the liquid can be consumed as a standard action.

A separate person from the pourer can drink the liquid using a standard action, but only one person can use the transmuted liquid, as the entirety of the liquid must be consumed to be effective.
Construction
Requirements Craft Wondrous Items, resist energy, creator must have 2 ranks in the Craft (alchemy) skill; Cost 1000 gp

The Exchange Contributor; Publisher, Kobold Press; RPG Superstar Judge

Granting energy resistance is a nice trick, the goblet is a good shape and theme, and this is a cool item that doesn't rely on being uber-powerful for its coolness.

Nice work, I think this designer is onto something good.

Founder, Legendary Games & Publisher, Necromancer Games, RPG Superstar Judge

OK, I've come back to this item after letting my thoughts percolate for a while. I think it has a few mechanical flaws, but I really like what is being played with here. This is not the strongest of our top items but I really want to see what this author has for us.

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

I don't think "alchemical grenade" is a game term. I assume he means "alchemical splash weapon."

This is really weird. I'm not sure if it's better to stick with the 1d6 energy resistance or just make it 5 so it's easy to remember/math/compare to other effects.

The only flag for me is that it's usable unlimited times per day. But if you want to spend 10 gp worth of acid to get acid resistance 1d6 for 1 minute, I guess that cost works out. You could drop a ton of money on alch splash weapons and give your army 1 minute to run across a damage hazard. Which I guess is okay

I'd like to see something about spilling the alchemical stuff from the goblet counting as throwing it in your square.

Liberty's Edge Contributor , Star Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 9

Welcome to the Top 32, BobROE!

This is a nifty item, and I hope the goblet transforms the alchemical liquid into something palatable (definitely not "grape-flavored" cough syrup). This item almost gets the formatting 100% correct (the omission of commas in the prices being the only misstep I can spot). I think you could have spared a few words about the mechanics of keeping the liquid from spilling, but that's something a GM can make up on the fly (unless there are rules out there for that, in which case, mea culpa). The only other (minor) issue I have is the variable resistance; in my opinion, it would have been cleaner to go with resist energy 5 (or 3 to split the difference). Again these are minor concerns about an otherwise exceptional item.

Best of luck to you for the remainder of the contest!

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 4 , Star Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 9 aka MillerHero

Bearer not barer.
At first I thought that this wouldn’t work with alchemist’s fire, because the fire will begin to burn immediately when the bottle is opened and exposed to air, but in searching the Core Rulebook and Adventurer’s Armory I couldn’t find that stated. Ultimate Equipment; however, restored my initial reservations. See page 106. This is a fun item otherwise. Perhaps you don’t pour the alchemist’s fire into the goblet as much as just set the vial it in the cup.

Contributor, RPG Superstar 2010 Top 16, 2011 Top 32, 2012 Top 4

First of all, congratulations on making the Top 32! That in itself is a major accomplishment and it’s something you should take great pride in. You rock!

Not much left to say about this one. It's a neat concept: absorbing an alchemical item and turning it into a form of energy resistance. I like Sean's idea of leaving the resistance to 5, but that's because math hates me. I think you missed a design opportunity by limiting the effect to alchemical liquids related to a type of energy. What about other alchemical substances? Imagine drinking a tanglefoot bag to gain freedom of movement, or drinking poison to gain a neutralize poison effect? I guess that might be challenging to do in under 300 words. My tangental ruminations aside, nice work and best of luck going forward!

RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32, 2012 Top 4 aka OamuTheMonk

2 people marked this as a favorite.

This item just does too little for me. Mechanically, spending 20 GP to get fire resistance (That might be as low as fire resist 1) for a minute is probably fine, but it's only really useful to a very, very low level party, I think. And, at 2000 GP, it's probably well priced out of their range.

To anyone who could afford the item, it's not really that useful. There are better ways to spend 2000 GP.

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Marathon Voter Season 9 aka theheadkase

I like the concept, the description, and the mechanics. While 2,000 gp to buy one of these could be steep for a 1st or 2nd level, finding this in a baddy's treasure chest is completely within reason and it would be useful.

As mentioned before, bearer not barer.

I also really like the fact that it is not exclusive to alchemists or a certain class.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

I don't recall seeing that one during voting. Ah, well, one of the items that avoided me.

I admit that 1d6 points of energy resistance for one minute is not something that I'd dream of as a PC. Also, unless exposed to continuous energy damage I'd rather invest in wands of infernal healing and healed the damage.

The basic idea of goblet that transforms alchemical items into some nice buff is very nice, however.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 16 , Dedicated Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9 aka Hodge Podge

Hey, this is one I didn't see either. It's a cool idea! And I wonder if it would work with holy water or alchemist's bombs...?

I think I recall seeing a few other items that toyed around with energy resistance in a similar fashion, but this definitely pulled it off the best! Congrats, Adam!

Sczarni RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32 , Champion Voter Season 6, Champion Voter Season 7, Champion Voter Season 8, Champion Voter Season 9

Congrats Adam, this was another of my favorites!

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

Thanks for the feedback all.

A few things comments from me.

1) I was never super thrilled with the name, and after reading a post that SKR put up on his FB page, this should probably be called "Goblet of Energy Resistance" or something to that effect. Though I find that a little on the nose for my liking. Anyone have a better suggestion for a name?

2) I had alot of trouble pricing this, so I was just sort of judging by prices of other items. So I probably erred on the high side all things being equal. When trying to price it I found that there are no pricing guidelines for energy resistance providing items. Is this an oversight? Or is it just intended that one can use a spell to figure out the price adjustment.

Quote:
I'm not sure if it's better to stick with the 1d6 energy resistance or just make it 5 so it's easy to remember/math/compare to other effects.

Yeah, 5 would probably be easier to deal with, I went with 1d6 because it mirrored the amount of damage that the items would do.

Quote:
I'd like to see something about spilling the alchemical stuff from the goblet counting as throwing it in your square.

That's a neat idea, I guess if you were moving in combat an acrobatics check would be appropraite to not spill it, at least if threatened or moving in a "violent" manor.

Quote:
What about other alchemical substances? Imagine drinking a tanglefoot bag to gain freedom of movement, or drinking poison to gain a neutralize poison effect? I guess that might be challenging to do in under 300 words.

Another interesting idea. Though I'd be concerned about pricing, this provides a consistant effect for pretty similiar cost of items. If it starts providing more powerful effects for other alchemical items that are within the same ball park cost wise, would that be a concern?

Please keep the ideas coming.

Star Voter Season 6

I wasn't very impressed with this item, though I did think it was neat. However, every time I saw this item during voting, it was always better than what it was paired with. I'm a big fan of neat ideas and thinking outside the box, so I'll be looking forward to future submissions by you.

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Marathon Voter Season 9 aka theheadkase

Elemental Chalice is my vote for a name :)

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Star Voter Season 6 aka Transylvanian Tadpole

Nice to see something different being done with alchemical items. Good work.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 16 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Dedicated Voter Season 9 aka motteditor

I like Headkase's suggestion. I'm a big fan of items that don't have "of" in their name.

Champion Voter Season 6

Congratulations.

Interesting but seems like a pretty expensive niche item for Resistance 3 or 4 for a minute to deal with a minor elemental obstacle or challenge like a flaming pool or magically cold doorway.

I thought the resistance should be a little higher and fixed say Resistance 5 for 3 - 15 Minutes for more utility every time I saw it. Mostly depends on the campaign or adventure path regarding general utility. Looking forward to your archetype.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Adam,

You've presented an interesting mechanic for interaction between alchemical and magical items. I have to agree with Cheers on the numbers though. It's a pretty steep price for an item, plus the cost of the consumable, with the chance of getting resistance 1 for only a minute. Congratulations, and good luck in the next round.

Marathon Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9 aka Clouds Without Water

This was a so-so item for me. I voted for or against it depending on what it was up against.

The usefulness seemed limited, and at the same time I specifically did not like that you could store the effect for later use. I would have preferred that it be a decision that had to be made in the moment.

Dedicated Voter Season 6

I kind of waffled on this one as well. I liked some of the ideas behind it, but I felt it needed some tweaking to really pop. The mechanics are interesting, and I did think this was more interesting than many of the "insert item into this item" items.

Regardless, I think you've shown that you have an interesting approach to design, so I look forward to seeing what you have to offer in the next round. Kudos!

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

theheadkase wrote:
Elemental Chalice is my vote for a name :)

I like it, but it does have the same issue of element vs energy.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

Tels wrote:
I wasn't very impressed with this item, though I did think it was neat. However, every time I saw this item during voting, it was always better than what it was paired with. I'm a big fan of neat ideas and thinking outside the box, so I'll be looking forward to future submissions by you.

Thanks, and I made it cause I thought it was neat. I wasn't really sure how others would take it, but I appreciate the votes even if you didn't think it was super impressive.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7 aka Demiurge 1138

I wasn't a big fan of the 1d6 energy resistance, but this was a cool item that used alchemical gear in a neat way.

Congratulations and I'll see you in Round 2!


As prior entries will tell you, Template Fu is one mean point eating machine, but will also praise where praise is due.

These reviews being this in depth usually take me a while to do and they get fitted in around other demands on my time, so please bear with me if I haven’t gotten to your item yet. I will get there in the end.

There are a couple of feedback categories that are easy to score high on as I do like everyone to get a good grade somewhere, conversely, there are also some categories that will sting everyone – you have been warned ;)

Review Caveat: I try to keep things totally dispassionate and all comments herein are my own. Having not made the illustrious levels that you have achieved this year, I can only caveat that anything I propose in feedback may not be totally in line with what Paizo thinks or needs of its freelance game designers, so do consider carefully any and all feedback I make under this light.

I start your review with…

Congratulations on being selected by the public at large and then the stalwart judges!

Review Breakdown:

Template: 4/5
Hungry! Ohhhh close – ah-ha! Munch a point – comma’s in numbers of 1,000 and greater. Fed now, Fu is happy.

Spelling: 4/5
Everyone should know to use US English, so you just know that I am going to eat points for stray ‘u’ letters and similar.

Wrong word: bearer not barer – no naked adventurers please! Munch, munch, chew.

Readability: 2/5
For me, I believe the rule system target comprehension level is 11 year olds and up, so I have included this to review everyone’s entry using the MS Word Grammar scoring system which measures passivity, and the reading scores that determine age comprehension. Then using my self appointed expectation of target comprehension level, I have tried to score everyone consistently in this category as it is an area whereby I can mathematically deduce a score.[/i]

Passive Sentences 42% (- 1 pt)
There are whole threads on this and it is possible to get 0%, which is wicked, but I would expect scores of less than 20% to be around the ideal mark for item descriptions (sometimes, you need the passive, but only rarely).

Flesch Reading Ease 44.1 (-1 pt)
(0-30 best understood by university graduates, 60-70 easily understood by 13-15 year olds, 90-100 easily understood by 11 year olds)

Flesh-Kincaid Grade Level 13.0 (-1 pt)
(This equates to the grades found in the US schooling system, e,g. 8.2 means it should be understandable by the average 8th grade student)

Me as a Designer Review: 3/5
The mood setting item description ends clumsily – I think at minimum there should be an “a” between “into” and “protective”. I am not sure about alchemical grenade as a game term, is it an item in some equipment book I have missed? I wonder if you mean alchemical solution/liquid.

The default item activation action is a standard action, so most often, you don’t need to state it is a standard action, you need only state when it isn’t.

The second paragraph mentions pouring an alchemical liquid and gives the fire, acid, and ice examples, which is good, but it doesn’t say what happens if a non energy based liquid is poured in – for example, would pouring a poison grant some sort of poison immunity? What happens if a beneficial liquid is poured in, does it reverse that into a harming effect?

Ignoring the standard action already mentioned, you repeat yourself saying drinking the liquid is a standard action – it appears in paragraphs 2 and 3 – and then again in 4 – I did wonder in the fourth paragraph that you meant possibly a move action to pass the goblet over to your ally who then drinks (the already known standard action) the liquid.

I feel these questions would occur at the gaming table and so feel the item is incomplete as it stands.

Template Fu happily dines on 2 points in this category.

Overall Impression: 3/5
There was great attention to the template including the spell italicising and alphabetising the sort of them – well done on that score.

The name was purely functional and helps as a reminder to what the item does when on your character sheet, which I like.

That said, the entry, for me, is marred by the unanswered questions and potential game play issues that would crop up using this item in it’s current form.

Final Score: 16/25
I won’t give a final score comment as I haven’t reviewed all the items in this detail yet, I suggest that if it interests, you can watch as I progress through the items to see your final placement in my review scoring system.

Closing, as I started…

Congratulations on being selected!

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Dedicated Voter Season 9 aka Darkjoy

I think I've upvoted this like 20 times during the voting period, you just kept coming back for more votes.

Star Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 9

This is a very simple, yet effective item. There are obviously some concerns about unlimited uses, but being that it's powered by items with a price that will eventually matter. I like it.

My biggest concern is "1d6 resistance" It would make life easier if it were 5, or even 3 points of resistance all the time. But all things considered, that's a minor thing.

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Champion Voter Season 8, Marathon Voter Season 9 aka GM_Solspiral

Not going to bash the points already hammered, I agree with many of the points stated. Digest and learn from the feedback (I certainly will apparently the community hates variable numbers.)

Congrats on making the top 32. I upvoted this a few times it was always better than its competition.

Editor, Jon Brazer Enterprises , Dedicated Voter Season 6

1 person marked this as a favorite.

An interesting concept with good attention to action economy. I'll echo Tom Phillips' desire to see details for using other alchemical items with this item. Flat resistance 5 might work better than 1d6 for consistency's sake, since resistance is typically granted to creatures in increments of 5.

Be careful of homophones in your writing (barer vs. bearer), as Steve noted. It's always a good idea to have a strong grammarian proof your work before submission.

Also, it's preferable to spell out durations and distances completely in the item's description - 1 minute or 10 feet, not 1 min. or 10 ft.

Sovereign Court Star Voter Season 6

Template Fu wrote:


Spelling: 4/5
Everyone should know to use US English, so you just know that I am going to eat points for stray ‘u’ letters and similar.

Try as I might, I can't find any 'u' spellings variants.

Examples? Maybe I'm blind...

Marathon Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Dedicated Voter Season 9

Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Companion, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Maps, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

You lost the point for barer instead of bearer - spelling seems to be the best place to put it - hope that helps.

Star Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 8 aka Gio

I am a hardcore alchemist fan (I want to play like 12 of them!). Too bad this item didn't show up while I was voting. It is awesome, Mos of my to-be alchemist characters would definitely use that a lot!.

Congratulations!, good luck with your archetype!


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
Template Fu wrote:

Spelling: Spelling: 4/5

Everyone should know to use US English... <snip> ...Flesh-Kincaid Grade Level... <snip>

If you evaluate someone else's spelling and base your judgement upon it, it would be wise to check your own spelling.

There are other people on the world - not just AE-speaking folks.

No pun intended. ;)

Sovereign Court Star Voter Season 6

Anthony Adam wrote:
You lost the point for barer instead of bearer - spelling seems to be the best place to put it - hope that helps.

"Barer" isn't the British spelling of "bearer". It's just the wrong word.

barer comparative of bare (Adjective)
Adjective
1.(of a person or part of the body) Not clothed or covered.
2.Without the appropriate, usual, or natural covering: "bare floorboards".

I don't think there was any problem with the author not using American English.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

If you look at his other posts, it just seems to be part of the boilerplate of that section.

And it is something I try to remember. I have to write american english stuff for work all the time, so I'm usually pretty good about it.

Though it bothers me when I drop the U when I'm writing for myself.

Star Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8, Star Voter Season 9

Good theme.

Simple idea and cheap to buy or make.

I like items that can come in handy at all levels,and this one can fit the bill. Give's a good reason for a high level party to keep and use those alchemical items.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

Quote:
Give's a good reason for a high level party to keep and use those alchemical items.

That was one of the reasons I liked it.

Though with my home group they keep all their alchemical items to fight swarms...


Nasty, nasty swarms.

RPG Superstar 2011 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8, Dedicated Voter Season 9 aka surfbored

Smart choice to aim for alchemical items, as they seem to be in short supply overall. I would say this item just squeaked in though, so bring your A-game in the archetype round.

I, for one, will happily champion the random resistance value. I like when magic has variation. For it to work exactly the same way every time is boring -- my players love to roll their dice.

Of course, I didn't make the top 89, so take my advice with a grain of salt. ;)

Star Voter Season 6

This is really cool. I love how this is a low-level items that actually does something; unlike most level items which only provides a numerical bonus, this one is cool because it opens new options up to players.

I'm not sure that 'Goblet of Elements' is actually a fitting name, however; true, you can get a variety of resistances from it, but that seems to be more a property of the item poured into it than a property of the goblet to me.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Dedicated Voter Season 6, Marathon Voter Season 8

I personally am a huge fan of alchemical items. I agree with a lot of the comments here, and see a lot of potential for expanding these items. Maybe if you added more doses of the alchemical item it could increase the protection offered or the duration? Maybe you could mix two different items to get a unique effect? The core of this item is a fantastic idea.

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

THanks for the kind words.

And yeah you could do more with the core concept here, but with the work limit, don't want to try to add too much and make it hard to understand or have parts get cut off.

Designer, RPG Superstar Judge

Adam Blanchard wrote:
1) I was never super thrilled with the name, and after reading a post that SKR put up on his FB page, this should probably be called "Goblet of Energy Resistance" or something to that effect.

BTW, my post was not in response to you. I had two freelancers use "elements" that way on the same day, which prompted my post. :)

RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32 , Marathon Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Dedicated Voter Season 8 aka BobROE

Sean K Reynolds wrote:
BTW, my post was not in response to you. I had two freelancers use "elements" that way on the same day, which prompted my post. :)

I didn't assume it was directed at me... doesn't mean I didn't notice. :)

Star Voter Season 6, Star Voter Season 7, Star Voter Season 9

This item takes me back to the days of the Gauntlet arcade game where you could either throw the potion as a weapon, or consume it for protection, and that makes it cool.

Congrats.

Star Voter Season 6, Dedicated Voter Season 7, Marathon Voter Season 8, Marathon Voter Season 9

Congratulations Adam,

I remember reading this and thinking they were cool, but I dinnae move them to my keep folder. I think it is because of the name. I love the concept, the exaction was good, and I think the utility and low level makes it a great area to design in.

suggestions for later rounds: set the hook, work on names (but you knew that already :)

Nice job and good luck.

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