Which weapon abilities are worth it?


Advice

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Chernobyl wrote:
Grizzly the Archer wrote:

Courageous is amazingly good. You get half of the weapons enh. Bonus as a bonus to ALL morale bonuses. So for barbarians, that's their rage bonuses for str, con, and will. As well as for inquisitors, and anyone else with morale bonuses.

Dueling- fg. It's not found in the ultimate equipment, like many other abilities, or items but it one of my favorites and one of the best abilities in the game.

I don't think courageous is that good. It increases the morale bonus to strength and constitution by half its enhancement bonus. Most PCs, by economy of build points, tend to have even numbered attributes. To get an additional +1 STR/CON bonus this item would need to have a +4 (+5 FOR +4 Courageous) effective bonus to have a net +2 STR/CON and a +1 on the STR and CON bonus.

Courageous is amazing for a barbarian. +2 to Str and Con is already better than a straight +1 to the weapon, since a +2 Str alone gives gives essentially the same bonus. Other morale bonuses also benefit (such as morale bonus to saves bonus from Superstition and will save bonus and Surprise Accuracy bonus). If you takle Ghost rager, your Superstition bonus is now added to your touch AC. Lastly, your max bonus is +3 (with Furious), not +2.


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gustavo iglesias wrote:
james maissen wrote:
Aelryinth wrote:

Yeah, that has been posted as one of the most underpriced items in the EG, seeing as how it's actually worth more then the Bracers of Archery.

==Aelryinth

Well Bracers of Archery are overpriced, but that item is still under-priced... Just the bonus to hit and perception would be priced around there, and the critical improvement should be the most costly ability of the three.

-James

Bracers of Archery aren't overpriced, 4000g for +1 competence to hit is fair price (the ioun stone cost double that, because it's slotless), and 1000g for a feat (bow proficiency) is neat too. The problem with the bracer of archery is it's bad designed. You pay for something (bow proficiency) that you *don't* want, for 99.9% of characters who purchase a bracer. I think you can drop the price of the bracer to 3000 or 3.500 and remove the proficiency and it'll be ok.

It's like paying extra money for air conditioning in Alaska. It's not that it is overpriced, it's just that you are paying something that you don't want.

Bracers of Archery aren't poorly designed, they're just not intended for dedicated archer characters. (Who, by the way, don't really need the extra help.) 5000g for Lesser Bracers of Archery + 2000g for a +1 composite longbow is a great deal for a character who needs a ranged combat option.


Archery-based Rogue can get some mileage out of Bracers of Archery.

Though it would be 2400gp for the +1 Comp. Longbow as it must be Masterwork.

Dark Archive

Courageous is also nice for an alchemist with permanent Good Hope.


Blueluck wrote:
Bracers of Archery aren't poorly designed, they're just not intended for dedicated archer characters. (Who, by the way, don't really need the extra help.) 5000g for Lesser Bracers of Archery + 2000g for a +1 composite longbow is a great deal for a character who needs a ranged combat option.

That's why they are poorly designed. It's a fairly expensive item that does not help to those who are willing to spend that much into it.


Azaelas Fayth wrote:

Archery-based Rogue can get some mileage out of Bracers of Archery.

Though it would be 2400gp for the +1 Comp. Longbow as it must be Masterwork.

Rogues have proficiency in shortbows (except elven rogues). So you are paying 5000g for +1 to hit and damage (average difference between d6 and d8). So yes, you are saving like 1000g (+1 bow and bracers vs +2 bow), at the expense of using a slot (bracers)


But BoA gives them Longbow Proficiency as well.

I think I say this often. Some characters have Feats to spare for proficiency others have Gold to spare.


Azaelas Fayth wrote:

But BoA gives them Longbow Proficiency as well.

I think I say this often. Some characters have Feats to spare for proficiency others have Gold to spare.

LOL, and some, like my poor archer druid, have neither...


Azaelas Fayth wrote:

But BoA gives them Longbow Proficiency as well.

I think I say this often. Some characters have Feats to spare for proficiency others have Gold to spare.

that's what I'm saying, the rogue might use the BoA, to use a longbow (d8) as well as his +1 bow, or could use the money to get a +2 shortbow (d6). There's no difference between a longbow +1 with BoA or a Shortbow +2, they both do the same damage and the same to hit. The longbow + BoA is cheaper (1000 cheaper), but use a slot (which may, or may not, be important).

In any case, an elf rogue archer does not have such need :P


I don't think anyone answered my gunslinger question. Is a plus 1 all you really need for a slinger?

I have a level seven musket master, and I think it goes something like this?

First and second shot: bab +7, dex +6, PB +1, musket +1, deadly aim -2, rapid shot -2, for a plus 11 vs touch, and that is generally a 85% chance to hit

Third shot is only +7 vs touch, but that is still a pretty high hit chance.

So each hit does 1d12 + 12, which is something like 57 average damage, but I dunno how to factor in misfire or missing ( at this point for the slinger it seems they are one and the same)

With such a high hit chance elemental seems to be the way to go, but I have no Idea!


Actually, Elemental Burst could be devastating on a Firearm...


Distance is exceptional on a firearm (since it increases the range increments it means you hit against touch at a greater distance which is almost always more valuable than another + 1 or 2 to hit (since hitting against touch is typically a LOT more than 1-2 different from hitting against regular AC.

Lucky is a nice enchantment for firearms (1 grit point in the firearm) and reliable can also be good. Any burst or "on crits" enchantment would also add a lot of damage - but worth noting that it is a rare encounter when a crit from a firearm doesn't end it already w/o additional enchantments (x4 tends to do that).


Yeah lucky is basically 100% required, but distance isn't generally an issue for musket masters, 40 ft is good and deadeye is an excellent grit reduction candidate. I am wondering past lucky is that 3.5 damage is worth it since hitting is rarely an issue


Would the Alchemist have any use for the conductive enchant?

*edit* Extracts are potion-like not spell-like and bombs have a material component, so conductive is of no use to an Alchemist, right?


Yes, it is. Especially if you have a lot of bombs.


Wow, yikes. Is there splash damage too - and if the bombs were of a specific type does that get applied too? ...say cold, or explosive...or confusion.


I don't know if you can by R.A.W. add bomb discoveries but it does splash damage but is only based on the Bomb damage alone and doesn't factor weapon damage. And you would take damage if you use a Melee Weapon.


Rage inquisitors and barbarians love courageous. It's amazing, and I can't see how people think otherwise. It's best utilized when you can get rage going, because for the extra +1 you get +2 to your enh. And your str. Is up by +2 and you gain another +1 on your attack.

And since every member of the party should have a bow of some sort, adaptive is definetly the most cost effective enhancement. 1,000 gp and your good to go from level 1-20. No longer are the days of having to buy multiple bows, over the course of your campaign. Whereas your wizards get new wands, melee types get their usual stuff and just upgrade the one or two weapons, never having to replace them usually.


Azaelas Fayth wrote:
I don't know if you can by R.A.W. add bomb discoveries but it does splash damage but is only based on the Bomb damage alone and doesn't factor weapon damage. And you would take damage if you use a Melee Weapon.

What if you had Precise Bombs?

Could you smack someone with a Bomb sword and exclude yourself from the splash radius?

Does it work with the Grenadier's Directed Blast class feature?

This opens up whole new WORLDS of Alchemy!

Dark Archive

Horacalcum deserves mention. +1 circumstance bonus on attack rolls for 6k.


Any Barbarian who doesn't get a Vicious weapon as soon as he can is a little girly-man who's cheating himself and the party!


Jadeite wrote:
Horacalcum deserves mention. +1 circumstance bonus on attack rolls for 6k.

What is that?

Dark Archive

Vestrial wrote:
Jadeite wrote:
Horacalcum deserves mention. +1 circumstance bonus on attack rolls for 6k.
What is that?

It's a skymetal, similar to adamantine. It's described in Shards of Sin.

Dark Archive

It's probably worth mention that while conductive works with bombs, it only applies to ranged attacks and is usable once per round.


I guess I should have specified by Melee I meant firing in very short range...

Especially since I am dealing with a Alchemist/Fighter(Archer) right now.

Conductive Longbow+Extra Bombs feats taken for every non-Combat Feat equals very potent mix.

Not the most optimized of builds but can deal out a lot of hurt when he needs to... Quite literally a Artillery Piece.


The value of distance for a gunslinger will vary by level and campaign style but I think by higher levels it would be exceptional. 40' may seem enough but once your foes are frequently flying and combats are outdoors or in huge spaces (or demiplanes) 40' actually won't be that much and being effective at a longer range will be very valuable.


Remember the level one deed deadeye, which lets you ignore range increments for touch. If you use the grit reduction on it, you turn into a real ranged character, attacking touch from any range

Dark Archive

CWheezy wrote:
Remember the level one deed deadeye, which lets you ignore range increments for touch. If you use the grit reduction on it, you turn into a real ranged character, attacking touch from any range

That's not quite correct:

Quote:
Deadeye (Ex): At 1st level, the gunslinger can resolve an attack against touch AC instead of normal AC when firing beyond her firearm's first range increment. Performing this deed costs 1 grit point per range increment beyond the first. The gunslinger still takes the –2 penalty on attack rolls for each range increment beyond the first when she performs this deed.

The grit reduction would only give you one extra range increment for free, so it still benefits from distance.

Grand Lodge

Conductive Net is nice.

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