Whatever happened to....


Product Discussion


...the idea of a campaign-.setting spanning multi-3pp AP/module/mash-up à la Crisis of Infinite Earths?

...the second season of 0onegames' The Sinking?

...Pure Steam?

...Sagaworks Studios?

...Marc Radle's Sahuagin-module for Raging Swan?

...the Third Dawn AP?

...Frog God Games posting new their products no longer here and on OBS?

Any answers would be appreciated!

(And feel free to add your own!)

Sovereign Court Publisher, Raging Swan Press

The Sunken Pyramid (Marc Radle's module for Raging Swan) is now in next year's schedule for March. The module keeps growing and so as the workload for it increases so it keeps being pushed back in the schedule. Recent progress has been very good, however, and so I'm confident we'll hit the March date.


Wait till March? Oh man! I really hope this will be as good as it sounded! It's been more than one edition since I last had a good aquatic module!


Endzeitgeist wrote:
...Sagaworks Studios?

LPJ Design approached Sagaworks Studios on the possibility to get the incorporated under LPJ Design, but nothing ever came of it.


That's a pity. They had potential. But thanks for the heads up, LPJ! perhaps they see this post and respond?

Publisher, Dreamscarred Press

The third adventure in From the Deep is currently having cartography finished and the manuscript is in editing. All the other graphics are done. I have to clean-up the write-up on alchemy in Third Dawn, as well.

Then it goes to layout.


Oh, good to know! I'm looking forward to reading it!

Publisher, Dreamscarred Press

I'm looking forward to getting it out - the choices made in adventures #1 and #2 have actual impact in what happens in this one. I think it's a lot of fun and exciting, but I'm admittedly biased.

Contributor

Creighton Broadhurst wrote:
The Sunken Pyramid (Marc Radle's module for Raging Swan) is now in next year's schedule for March. The module keeps growing and so as the workload for it increases so it keeps being pushed back in the schedule. Recent progress has been very good, however, and so I'm confident we'll hit the March date.

That Mr. Radle does it all! I'll be on the lookout for this.


I feel pretty good nothing I am doing is on that list :)

Liberty's Edge

ChristinaStiles wrote:
Creighton Broadhurst wrote:
The Sunken Pyramid (Marc Radle's module for Raging Swan) is now in next year's schedule for March. The module keeps growing and so as the workload for it increases so it keeps being pushed back in the schedule. Recent progress has been very good, however, and so I'm confident we'll hit the March date.

...

That Mr. Radle does it all! I'll be on the lookout for this.

Heh heh ... I don't know about doing it all ... I'm not good at sleeping or NOT working, it would seem :)

I'm really excited for Sunken Pyramid to come out - I'm super proud of it! In fact, I'm putting the final touches on something (not sure if Raging Swan has officially announced it yet) that will act as sort of a supplement to Sunken Pyramid ...

OK, enough chit chat - back to work! :)

Shadow Lodge

Last word from Sellsword re: Pure Steam, dated 10/11 -

Sellsword2587 wrote:

Quick update. Alpha playtest has concluded, so we are attempting to wrap up and polish the beta playtest. Also, our sculptor has completed our first mini out of our initially planned two. Preview can be seen here.

We are also trying to come up with a list of mundane items that add a little more steam punk flair to our world. Some current items included pocket watches, spectacles (normal and multi-lens), mining hat with lamp, and a compass.

Feel free to contribute your own ideas to the list!


Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Lost Omens Subscriber
Endzeitgeist wrote:
...Frog God Games posting new their products no longer here and on OBS?

I don't understand this. I thought they posted all their products to both places. Did this chance?


Yes, Deinol. FGG's "Scorned", "Dread Saceroth", "Castle Baldemar's Dungeon" and Hex Crawl Classics 4+5, for example, are not up on OBS, while Northlands Saga 3 is not up here on Paizo.

I have been wondering about that for a while...


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I am still up for the crossover idea..I think the logistics are what makes people hesitate. BUT..this would make an amazing kickstarter...I don't see an issue with getting people to say yes, as much as deciding what when and how, with everyone working on their own projects...


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I think it would be a fantastic way to celebrate 3pp and the player culture in general.

~Red


Yeah the big thing is logistics, we all have or own production schedules which most don't allow the room for anything new. Who do you get to be the Herder of Cats, who do you trust with the money, who has final say, who don't you include. etc.


Indeed. That would be a giant can of worms. I think the smartest thing to do would probably to be the following:

-Open call for 3pp to submit their existing campaign settings.

-Have players vote on what goes in the book. Anything without X number of votes doesn't get in (or if we were to get a lot, the top X number)

-Limit entries to a few pages (3-5?) to keep the logistic side of things down to a minimum. Do it like a "conversion guide" for each campaign setting rather then a massive investment of 20-30 pages.

-Have one (or two) companies take responsibility for the development of the surrounding materials with input from additional sources (Heck, if Paizo could do that...#WishfulThinking) This is to make them "neutral ground".
Possibly a 3pp with a good track record that didn't get their campaign in the running or doesn't have a horse in the race (so to speak).

-Have each company be required to invest X amount of money into art and provide it to the neutral 3rd 3pp (say that 3 times fast :D). If the campaign setting has already been done, use existing artwork would not only be smart- but very fitting.

-I'd love to say whoever does the graphic design on it/provides additional artwork would do it for free but that's not the kind of world we live in. All contributing companies agree to pay X amount of money? (Keep it small)

-Ratification by all parties prior to publishing. A percent royalty split? A free product as a gift to the community? A patron funded project? Sold as a "new" company?

Money invested would have to be small. The more 3pp who took part the smaller it would be. To allow for oversight, invested funds could be held by a 3rd party (not the neutral party) until it was time for use. Finances could be documented in a public place (a google doc?).

Just a thought.

Edit: Count the times I said "3rd party" in some form... @.@


1 person marked this as a favorite.

..Saturday night?


The fellow who wrote "Horror at Dagger Rock" and founded Sagaworks Studios is now writing for Goodman Games, for their new RPG.

-Nate

Dark Archive

Nate Christen wrote:

The fellow who wrote "Horror at Dagger Rock" and founded Sagaworks Studios is now writing for Goodman Games, for their new RPG.

-Nate

Yup, I asked him on the Goodman Games forums and he said Pathfinder moves to fast as Sagaworks is a one man show and they cannot keep up with the changes and that Dungeon Crawl Classics is a better fit.


bigkilla wrote:
Nate Christen wrote:

The fellow who wrote "Horror at Dagger Rock" and founded Sagaworks Studios is now writing for Goodman Games, for their new RPG.

-Nate

Yup, I asked him on the Goodman Games forums and he said Pathfinder moves to fast as Sagaworks is a one man show and they cannot keep up with the changes and that Dungeon Crawl Classics is a better fit.

It is funny because we were MORE than happy to buy him out and incorporate the adventures from Sagawork into LPJ Design products. Better yet, just hire him to work freelance for LPJ Design.


That's a pity - I was looking forward to his next module. Oh well. There are enough other good modules/3pps out there.


Little Red Goblin Games wrote:

Indeed. That would be a giant can of worms. I think the smartest thing to do would probably to be the following:

-Open call for 3pp to submit their existing campaign settings.

-Have players vote on what goes in the book. Anything without X number of votes doesn't get in (or if we were to get a lot, the top X number)

-Limit entries to a few pages (3-5?) to keep the logistic side of things down to a minimum. Do it like a "conversion guide" for each campaign setting rather then a massive investment of 20-30 pages.

-Have one (or two) companies take responsibility for the development of the surrounding materials with input from additional sources (Heck, if Paizo could do that...#WishfulThinking) This is to make them "neutral ground".
Possibly a 3pp with a good track record that didn't get their campaign in the running or doesn't have a horse in the race (so to speak).

-Have each company be required to invest X amount of money into art and provide it to the neutral 3rd 3pp (say that 3 times fast :D). If the campaign setting has already been done, use existing artwork would not only be smart- but very fitting.

-I'd love to say whoever does the graphic design on it/provides additional artwork would do it for free but that's not the kind of world we live in. All contributing companies agree to pay X amount of money? (Keep it small)

-Ratification by all parties prior to publishing. A percent royalty split? A free product as a gift to the community? A patron funded project? Sold as a "new" company?

Money invested would have to be small. The more 3pp who took part the smaller it would be. To allow for oversight, invested funds could be held by a 3rd party (not the neutral party) until it was time for use. Finances could be documented in a public place (a google doc?).

Just a thought.

Or have each company take a slice of it to design..one setting, one mapping, one npcs, one creatures..depending if you were making a setting, or a large module. Or...as a setting with each company building an area of the world. Shrugs


Either or.


Just saw what the Demiplane of Gaming had to say on the project and..yeah. A kickstarter would be neat - IF enough people would really get fired up about it. Passion would be a requirement.


Endzeitgeist wrote:


Just saw what the Demiplane of Gaming had to say on the project and..yeah. A kickstarter would be neat - IF enough people would really get fired up about it. Passion would be a requirement.

Which project Endzeitgeist?


<--- overbrimming with passion


2 people marked this as a favorite.

The massive Crisis of Infinite Earths-style 3pp-crossover. Which has never been done before. Which is SUPERBLY ambitious. Which is different from any Releases ever for PFRPG.

In the end, we are the children.

Cheers!

President, Jon Brazer Enterprises

Endzeitgeist wrote:
...the idea of a campaign-.setting spanning multi-3pp AP/module/mash-up à la Crisis of Infinite Earths?

Here's a few of the bigger obstacles IMO preventing this to ever happen.

1) Control over our individual settings. One of the bigger things that Paizo editors do with the adventures is make sure they individual parts fit together well, insuring there is one continual story. So if adventure 3 in the Crisis of Infinite Settings (CoIS) was on Shadowsfall, I'd have to turn over my adventure to someone not affiliated with JBE to make sure it work together with someone adventures that do not have anything to do with my setting and basically allow them to make changes to my setting. I don't like that idea enough where it would probably be a deal breaker for me.

2) Depending on other publishers. While a few companies put out regular releases, none of us work on a single schedule. Not to mention, we all have personal lives and day jobs and so forth. A slowdown at 1 means a slowdown down the chain. So if I were working on adventure 6, adventures 1-5 would have to be on time or else, a project I worked on would be delayed due to circumstances beyond my control. Plus there's the matter of editing. Not all of us have the same level of editors. So if adventure 4 had bad editing and GM's stopped playing it, sales of adventure 5 and 6 are going to suffer. I wouldn't like this, but it is less of a deal breaker for me than the previous as long as certain precautions were taken (basically allowing non-company people to edit everyone products).

3) Distribution. Some of us are PDF only publishers. Others of us have had print books on Paizo's overall top 10 list, beating out some of Paizo's products. So if a PDF-only publisher produced adventure 2, either they would need to make a deal with one of the print publishers to get their book into print. This is doable, but it is an added complication. Plus this can be a serious point of contention since money is directly involved.

4) Who owns what? Say the adventure involves the PC's following one organization around various planes (ala carrion crown). Which of us, when it is over, owns the equivalent of the whispering way? Do we all? How about NPCs? Artwork? Doable, but another problem that needs worked out.

There are other problems but in my mind these are some of the bigger ones. While I can't speak for others, I would not be surprised if some of my fellow publishers felt similar about some of these.


I can't speak for other companies - or even 4WFG for that matter - but I've been thinking about it, and I honestly can't see much benefit for the publishers in doing something like this. It's a lot of extra work, and a lot of extra complications as Dale mentioned, with really no increased payoff. There just really isn't any profit in it. A "Crisis on Infinite Earths" was a bad attempt at streamlining multiple continuities of long-established IPs and revitalizing them. You don't have that situation here, instead this would be more like a "The Punisher Kills the Entire Marvel Universe" POS.


This isn't even Crisis on Infinite Earth because that was done within one company: DC Comics. This is more like doing the Teen Titans / X-Men crossover or JLA/Avengers which to over 20 years to get done. Just a lot of extra work with no real way to determine if this would be a "success".

Pathfinder Lead Developer, Frog God Games

Endzeitgeist wrote:
...Frog God Games posting new their products no longer here and on OBS?

I just pinged Bill for you. I'm guessing he was not aware. Thanks for the heads up.

Greg


Endzeitgeist wrote:


...Frog God Games posting new their products no longer here and on OBS?

Forgive my blondness but what is OBS? Also Liz Courts lists our new books but often there is a delay due to ship dates and availability. Anything not available on Paizo is always available on our site at www.talesofthefroggod.com

Dark Archive

Blonde Frog wrote:
Endzeitgeist wrote:


...Frog God Games posting new their products no longer here and on OBS?

Forgive my blondness but what is OBS? Also Liz Courts lists our new books but often there is a delay due to ship dates and availability. Anything not available on Paizo is always available on our site at www.talesofthefroggod.com

I think OBS=One Book Store or whatever RPGnow and DrivethruRPG uses.


Blonde Frog wrote:
Endzeitgeist wrote:


...Frog God Games posting new their products no longer here and on OBS?

Forgive my blondness but what is OBS? Also Liz Courts lists our new books but often there is a delay due to ship dates and availability. Anything not available on Paizo is always available on our site at www.talesofthefroggod.com

OBS=One Book Shelf


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
TrickyOwlbear wrote:
Blonde Frog wrote:
Endzeitgeist wrote:


...Frog God Games posting new their products no longer here and on OBS?

Forgive my blondness but what is OBS? Also Liz Courts lists our new books but often there is a delay due to ship dates and availability. Anything not available on Paizo is always available on our site at www.talesofthefroggod.com
OBS=One Book Shelf

To add some clarity, OneBookShelf is the aggregate business entity that owns RPGNow, DriveThruRPG, DriveThruComics, DriveThruFiction, etc.


Here's something I'd like to know: what happened to Blackdirge?

Aeryn “Blackdirge” Rudel used to make 3.5 and 4e booklets about templates, magic items, weapon-based prestige classes and monsters, but since Pathfinder came around, he simply vanished from the market. I know that he had troubles with 4e products because people weren't used to it at that time, but he could have made a lot of conversions for Pathfinder.

Any news about him? If it can help you, Blackdirge is also the name of his character: a human lich bard.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber
JiCi wrote:

Here's something I'd like to know: what happened to Blackdirge?

Aeryn “Blackdirge” Rudel used to make 3.5 and 4e booklets about templates, magic items, weapon-based prestige classes and monsters, but since Pathfinder came around, he simply vanished from the market. I know that he had troubles with 4e products because people weren't used to it at that time, but he could have made a lot of conversions for Pathfinder.

Any news about him? If it can help you, Blackdirge is also the name of his character: a human lich bard.

Last I heard, he was still working for Goodman Games, but that was a little while ago.

EDIT: Also, he was actually a doppelganger bard lich, if I recall correctly. He also changed the spelling to "Blackdyrge," as the original character name (with an "i") was used in a series of articles for EN World, and he was likely avoiding a conflict when he made his own small-press publishing company.


Adventure Path Charter Subscriber; Pathfinder Starfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Heck, as long as we're reaching back, whatever happened to some of my favorite small third-party publishers? Guys like Beta Bunny Publishing or Octavirate Games are companies whom I'd love to see make a reappearance.


What ever happened to Warlords of the Apocalypse? Adamant was going to release it, and people did pre-orders, right? Is that dead? Did everyone ask for refunds?


Last I saw:
GMSkarka says:
October 1, 2012 at 11:15 am
"I plan to have it out before Christmas."

I have heard a few people clambering for refunds. Some people were asking if it was dead on their site and they got this reply Dungeon Grrrl:
"No, just the victim of pretty major shake-ups here at Adamant. We lost 3 different writers on the project, and now our Art Director/Layout Guy has left, so everything is delayed as we react to the staffing changes. It will come out, though (as will FAR WEST, ICONS TEAM-UP, BUCKAROO BANZAI and TALES FROM NEW CROBUZON — all major efforts that have been impacted)."


Alzrius wrote:
JiCi wrote:

Here's something I'd like to know: what happened to Blackdirge?

Aeryn “Blackdirge” Rudel used to make 3.5 and 4e booklets about templates, magic items, weapon-based prestige classes and monsters, but since Pathfinder came around, he simply vanished from the market. I know that he had troubles with 4e products because people weren't used to it at that time, but he could have made a lot of conversions for Pathfinder.

Any news about him? If it can help you, Blackdirge is also the name of his character: a human lich bard.

Last I heard, he was still working for Goodman Games, but that was a little while ago.

EDIT: Also, he was actually a doppelganger bard lich, if I recall correctly. He also changed the spelling to "Blackdyrge," as the original character name (with an "i") was used in a series of articles for EN World, and he was likely avoiding a conflict when he made his own small-press publishing company.

I see, and you're right about the doppelganger, I thought I saw a human at first :P. That's kinda good to hear, but I would have loved to see more PrCS about weapons and more templates.

Dungeon Grrrl wrote:
What ever happened to Warlords of the Apocalypse? Adamant was going to release it, and people did pre-orders, right? Is that dead? Did everyone ask for refunds?

I recall seeing a comment about one of the authors literally losing the only text file available due to corrupted data after a transfer. If that's true, then we're not seeing that book for a while.

President, Jon Brazer Enterprises

Alzrius wrote:
Heck, as long as we're reaching back, whatever happened to some of my favorite small third-party publishers? Guys like Beta Bunny Publishing or Octavirate Games are companies whom I'd love to see make a reappearance.

Alot of companies folded once 4E was announced. Looks like these were among them.


You know who no one can find?

Tony Moseley, the guy who did Zogonia.

*poof*

On the wind.

-Ben.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Card Game, Rulebook Subscriber
Scott_UAT wrote:

Last I saw:

GMSkarka says:
October 1, 2012 at 11:15 am
"I plan to have it out before Christmas."

I have heard a few people clambering for refunds. Some people were asking if it was dead on their site and they got this reply Dungeon Grrrl:
"No, just the victim of pretty major shake-ups here at Adamant. We lost 3 different writers on the project, and now our Art Director/Layout Guy has left, so everything is delayed as we react to the staffing changes. It will come out, though (as will FAR WEST, ICONS TEAM-UP, BUCKAROO BANZAI and TALES FROM NEW CROBUZON — all major efforts that have been impacted)."

** spoiler omitted **

As probably one of the last few who haven't yet asked for my money back, I've more or less written Warlords off as a bad investment, but hold out some hope it will one day be done and that my name will still be on record as having paid for it. But over the last year or two Adamant hasn't actually met many deadline goals, or produced much actual material, and they've sold off Icons completely.


1 person marked this as a favorite.
JiCi wrote:
Here's something I'd like to know: what happened to Blackdirge?

According to his twitter account: Aeryn is the Editor-in-Chief of No Quarter Magazine for Privateer Press, writer, editor, game designer, dinosaur nerd, and obscure polearm expert.


Dungeon Grrrl wrote:
What ever happened to Warlords of the Apocalypse? Adamant was going to release it, and people did pre-orders, right? Is that dead? Did everyone ask for refunds?

Super Genius Games acquired it and plan to release it :)

More info here

Liberty's Edge

Marc Radle wrote:
ChristinaStiles wrote:
Creighton Broadhurst wrote:
The Sunken Pyramid (Marc Radle's module for Raging Swan) is now in next year's schedule for March. The module keeps growing and so as the workload for it increases so it keeps being pushed back in the schedule.

...

That Mr. Radle does it all! I'll be on the lookout for this.

Heh heh ... I don't know about doing it all ... I'm not good at sleeping or NOT working, it would seem :)

I'm really excited for Sunken Pyramid to come out - I'm super proud of it! In fact, I'm putting the final touches on something (not sure if Raging Swan has officially announced it yet) that will act as sort of a supplement to Sunken Pyramid ...

OK, enough chit chat - back to work! :)

A bit of thread necromancy to let everyone know that the Sunken Pyramid is finished and out :)

Please be sure to check it out - I'm thrilled to say the adventure has received some wonderful reviews (including one from the one and only Mr. Endzeitgeist himself :)

Sunken Pyramid

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