Can you five foot step when flying? Swimming? Earth gliding?


Rules Questions

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the question's in the title. Can you only take a five foot step when you are using your 'land' speed? if you can move just as easily with another movement type, say you have a swim speed, fly speed, climb speed, or earth glide, can you do things like take a five foot step?


PRD: Combat wrote:
You may not take a 5-foot step using a form of movement for which you do not have a listed speed.

So yes, if you have a listed speed in some form of movement, you may take a 5-foot step using that form of movement.

Sczarni

You may take a 5-foot step using any form of movement for which you have a listed speed. If you're just a plain old human swimming in the water, no, you cannot take a 5-foot step because even though you have a swim skill, you have no swim speed like an Undine would.

Having said that, if you are a wizard or sorcerer and cast fly on a character who does not otherwise have a listed fly speed, does the spell grant them a movement speed for the purpose of the 5-foot step?


Corren28 wrote:

You may take a 5-foot step using any form of movement for which you have a listed speed. If you're just a plain old human swimming in the water, no, you cannot take a 5-foot step because even though you have a swim skill, you have no swim speed like an Undine would.

Having said that, if you are a wizard or sorcerer and cast fly on a character who does not otherwise have a listed fly speed, does the spell grant them a movement speed for the purpose of the 5-foot step?

I'd say yes, since the pc has the ability to choose where he's flying to (and is considered having this form of movement for the duration of the spell).


Note that the Fly skill restricts this somewhat:

PRD Fly skill wrote:


Linked here
Check: You generally need only make a Fly check when you are attempting a complex maneuver. Without making a check, a flying creature can remain flying at the end of its turn so long as it moves a distance greater than half its speed. It can also turn up to 45 degrees by sacrificing 5 feet of movement, can rise at half speed at an angle of 45 degrees, and can descend at any angle at normal speed. Note that these restrictions only apply to movement taken during your current turn. At the beginning of the next turn, you can move in a different direction than you did the previous turn without making a check. Taking any action that violates these rules requires a Fly check. The difficulty of these maneuvers varies depending upon the maneuver you are attempting, as noted on the following chart.

Flying Maneuver Fly DC
Move less than half speed and remain flying 10
Hover 15
Turn greater than 45° by spending 5 feet of movement 15
Turn 180° by spending 10 feet of movement 20
Fly up at greater than 45° angle 20

This has generally been interpreted by local GMs (in a sensible manner) to require a Hover check if you want to move less than half-speed (i.e. make a 5-foot step while flying). Also make sure to read carefully whatever is giving you the ability to fly, as it may change that rule.


Odea wrote:

Note that the Fly skill restricts this somewhat:

PRD Fly skill wrote:


Linked here
Check: You generally need only make a Fly check when you are attempting a complex maneuver. Without making a check, a flying creature can remain flying at the end of its turn so long as it moves a distance greater than half its speed. It can also turn up to 45 degrees by sacrificing 5 feet of movement, can rise at half speed at an angle of 45 degrees, and can descend at any angle at normal speed. Note that these restrictions only apply to movement taken during your current turn. At the beginning of the next turn, you can move in a different direction than you did the previous turn without making a check. Taking any action that violates these rules requires a Fly check. The difficulty of these maneuvers varies depending upon the maneuver you are attempting, as noted on the following chart.

Flying Maneuver Fly DC
Move less than half speed and remain flying 10
Hover 15
Turn greater than 45° by spending 5 feet of movement 15
Turn 180° by spending 10 feet of movement 20
Fly up at greater than 45° angle 20

This has generally been interpreted by local GMs (in a sensible manner) to require a Hover check if you want to move less than half-speed (i.e. make a 5-foot step while flying). Also make sure to read carefully whatever is giving you the ability to fly, as it may change that rule.

I think the rules clearly state that this would fall under the DC 10 "Move less than half speed and remain flying" category.

I mean you said it yourself: "if you want to move less than half-speed (i.e. make a 5-foot step while flying)" yet you then applied the harsher Hover DC to the check?

Consider me confused with why you chose hover for the DC.


I don't know at all Seems to me that Hovering is... included in the category of moving less than half speed and remaining flying (i.e. moving 0 is definitely < 1/2 speed). And I'm going to mention that the next time it occurs! Thanks!

Sczarni

If hovering were not specifically listed I would agree that the <1/2 speed rule would apply. Since no movement is hovering and hovering is specifically listed with a DC, the more specific listing applies.

Dark Archive

Pathfinder Companion, Pawns, Starfinder Accessories, Starfinder Roleplaying Game, Starfinder Society Subscriber; Pathfinder Roleplaying Game Superscriber

I'd go with the moving less than half speed, as hovering indicates not moving. you are moving, just under half your speed. The lower DC should apply, RAW.


I think the reason hovering and moving less than half speed are different is because one can move less than full speed by gliding, drifting, etc. - which all take far less effort to do than hovering. (The idea being that gliding all you need to do is keep wings straight or steady or whatever, while hovering requires actual activity to stay aloft.)

That being said, this theory assumes the idea that these rules were designed for creatures with natural forms of flight - i.e. wings - rather than magical.

EDIT: Ringing in on the actual question, I'd have the lower DC apply for a 5FS as well.

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