It will still be some time before I run this AP though I am encouraging my players to think about what they want. So far I have encouraged them not neglect skills. I know social skills are big play in this game. But as I envision this crew of PC's I am thinking it cooler if they are the experts at things rather than relying on NPC's. I know not everything happens on ship but I would rather for example have a PC take ranks in seige weapon crafting and mastery rather than have an NPC fill that roll.
It would be very easy for standard characters to become the bosses and have NPCs do all the work untill a fight breaks out but that takes some of the flavor out of it for me.
Am I on the right track or am I steering the PCs for a quick death because they went for more skill points when another more typical combat choice in character creation would have been something that keeps them alive?
I belive it would be better for a NPC to handle siege engines since the PCs will be off the boat rather often and then it is a wasted feat/skill.
Bah, the PC's are press ganged to start out.
This would lead them to not necessarily have appropriate skills at all at level 1. Though such things should develop organically from level 2 on up.They should be encouraged to keep that in mind.
I'd be disappointed were I GMing this, and all the players went all metagamey and came to the table with characters designed to be sailors.
I don't really see that as meta-gaming at all. They're press ganged in Port Peril - pretty much the pirate capital of the world. It would feel a lot more odd to me if a press gang crew picked up a bunch of people without any sailing experience in a place where most people have spent a good deal of time on a boat.
Regarding the OP - I think one social skill (even intimidate) and a rank in profession(sailor) are most important at level one, but not even everyone needs it. So, I'd say just let them do what they want and let the chips fall where they may.
My group are mostly sailor-types, but there's a couple who are quite the fish out of water.
As for other player investments, they just have to weigh how good they want to be at something. If you want fairly standard siege weapons and moderate attack bonuses, sure, let an NPC take care of it. If you want more exotic weapons - even cannons - and have much better bonuses for attacks, then a PC will have to make the investment for it. The gun-slinger in our group will be crafting cannons when the time comes, I'm sure.
I guess what I am thinking perhaps erroneously is that with the ship being as important as it is I would rather the PC's settle into the roles that invest in the ship and crew not just combat and dungeons.
Think of it this way if this was Pathfinder Star Trek I would hope that some PC wanted to be the Cheif engineer or computer specialist not just red shirt security types and comand crew.
Plus if they lack the Prof-Sailor,Climb(some should have this though), Swim skills then they are going to get crushed during their time at 1st level when they keep screwing up their jobs. Remember they get lashed everytime they fail at their jobs. This plus the rum will send them into a sleep-work-sleep cycle in order to keep healed and they will lose out on interactign with potential allies.
I'm starting a Skull & Shackles campaign right now, and have a similar concern. I'm solving it with a house rule that I've used before in a home-brew campaign. I'm granting all character +1 skill point per level which can only be used for craft or profession skills.
I'm starting a Skull & Shackles campaign right now, and have a similar concern. I'm solving it with a house rule that I've used before in a home-brew campaign. I'm granting all character +1 skill point per level which can only be used for craft or profession skills.
We actually did something similar - our GM gave everyone 1 skill point per level that had to be used on either Swimming or Profession: Sailor to represent the experience we gained aboard ship and in our adventures. He reasoned that it was a fair exchange for the limitations imposed on us by the nature of the campaign (multiple instances of underwater combat, few options for favored terrain, impossibility of playing certain alignments, etc.). Its worked out just fine and no one has felt that it made the AP any less challenging thus far. Indeed, its opened several players eyes as to the importance of being able to do things besides 'smash'.
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What I did was award them with free extra ranks in Profession Sailor for succeeding on the shipboard tasks during WWM.
My system was: if they beat the DC by 5 or more, they got to roll a d20 and add the amount by which they succeeded. On a 15 or better, they earned a rank of Profession Sailor. This was a quick and dirty system I came up with on the fly, so you could fiddle with it if you think it's not very balanced.
As for their combat power: If you're the GM, you can tailor the difficulty of encounters to the relative power of your party. So if they turn out to be slightly weaker in combat because they're also trying to be good at sailing, you can deal with that by softening things up slightly.
They also give you a hint in WWM on how you can use skills to gain advantages in combat. One example is the fight with Hartshorn...
There's no reason why you can't reward party members who invest in skills with chances to get a combat bonus for various reasons, or even to give the entire group a bonus from time to time. Perception and Knowledge skills in particular are good for this.
I am not steering I am considering suggesting. I guess I was thinking of it this way. I prefer for the players in any setting to become over time the real movers and shakers. In this setting part of life is the ship. Part of superiority on the water is a better ship then the other guy. Rather than have the PC's shell out cash and plunder to run around to try and get the best ship builders and pay for this and that how cool would it be they became the ones that could create the best ships, weapons for the ships and so forth. Its not necessary and I don't want to gimp them but I thought it was cool for them to do the work rather than go find and NPC.
Give them the Player's Guide for Skull and Shackles and let them go from there.
If they want to have characters native to the setting that feel right at home on the ship, the guide will steer them in the right direction. If they feel like making characters from other walks of life that are forced into piracy, let them do so. My party has a little bit of both in it, and it plays out wonderfully organically.
For my game I brought back Spot/Listen/Rope Use (as class skills) and gave them the Alertness feat as a free one.
You... actually just made it harder for your PC's.
To the OP, the command crew of ships did not necessarily have all the technological knowledge necessary to run the ship. That's what the crew was for, after all.
When I was running dagonlance campaigns for non-DL-addicts, I gave everyone a skill point at every level but it had to be spent in certain knowledge skills. I could see doing the same thing here, but maybe just for the first few levels (or as someone above suggested, give them a chance to win it through the tests on the wormwood). We're on Bonewrack Isle now and while no one has died (yet) its been brutal and hard (but mostly a lot of fun). I don't think a few extra skill points on setting-specific skills would hurt the game. Say, climb, swim, professional (sailor), craft (ships/carpentry), knowledge (local/geography)?
There are plenty of option in the way of feats, playing human or making sure to take a favored class to make certain skills class skills, get bonuses to certain skills and get extra skill points.
Just because a player wants all the cool advantages that comes with a certain race at the loss of a feat and skills for not playing human is their choice. But in the first chapter of this AP may not be the best one.
This AP is not like any I've ever seen. And players that approach it as such will be disappointed.
I took the suggestion from the Player's Guide for the AP. I stressed to players to make characters that WANT to be pirates and that would be good pirates. We start Saturday and the players have taken my advice. I think they will do fine without any bonuses handed out on my part.
To the OP, the command crew of ships did not necessarily have all the technological knowledge necessary to run the ship. That's what the crew was for, after all.
that is so embarassing to hear from a factual take on the situation, and utterly incorrect.
please, pick some book on the subject (like"seamanship in the age of sail" or any good text on the french turkish, spanish or britsh navies ) and have a quick study.
the master of a ship was always fully schooled in all aspects of ship handling ( commonly through several years and exams ), its performance a general upkeep. so were usually his mates, in many aspects the boatsswains too etc.... the one aspect badly handled in the pathfinder system as is would be deepwater/astronavigation....
nevermind that ship-based performance rolls become pretty relevant in the later parts of the AP
I was in my thinking more concerned not so much with would they have enough skill. I think they will do fine. And many of them will be devoting themselves to ship board skills.
What I wanted to open up was the PCs to become the movers and shakers and industry leaders rather than we need to find so and so to fix some to tech or magic thingy to our ship but that over time one or more of them would be the one who developed items for the ship not just relying on NPC's.
For instance. In book two the go to Ricket Squibbs. In the end I would hope someone else spent some skill points to be a shipwright themselves and how cool would it be for them to be the ones that were able to make things work.
I was in my thinking more concerned not so much with would they have enough skill. I think they will do fine. And many of them will be devoting themselves to ship board skills.
What I wanted to open up was the PCs to become the movers and shakers and industry leaders rather than we need to find so and so to fix some to tech or magic thingy to our ship but that over time one or more of them would be the one who developed items for the ship not just relying on NPC's.
For instance. In book two the go to Ricket Squibbs. In the end I would hope someone else spent some skill points to be a shipwright themselves and how cool would it be for them to be the ones that were able to make things work.
In our game Aron Ivey was rescued from Shipwrack Isle and became the ship's carpenter. After losing a leg in book three he 'retired' to become a shipwright and he oversaw the construction of the PC's new flagship aided by the Master of Gales after the PC went on a mission for him. A Hallowed ship is a thing of beauty, I must say...