paizo.com Recent Posts in Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?paizo.com Recent Posts in Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?2013-09-25T12:33:38Z2013-09-25T12:33:38ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Ilja (alias of stringburka)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#422017-12-31T03:36:21Z2013-09-16T13:48:12Z<p>Deathwatch has this in it's description:
<br />
"You instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or <b>neither alive nor dead (such as a construct).</b> " (my bolding).</p>
<p>I would let an illusion of a human be treated as a creature in this case and display as neither alive nor dead by deathwatch. Since deathwatch would alarm someone who's dressed up a medium-sized golem as a human that it's not really alive, I'd also let it discern that the illusion is not really alive.</p>
<p>Either that or have it register as dead - a golem is still fueled by an entity (an elemental spirit IIRC?) while an illusion isn't in the same way, so maybe treat it as dead, since it has a complete lack of life?</p>
<p>Not saying that's clear RAW, but it is how I'd run it.</p>Deathwatch has this in it's description:
"You instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or neither alive nor dead (such as a construct). " (my bolding).
I would let an illusion of a human be treated as a creature in this case and display as neither alive nor dead by deathwatch. Since deathwatch would alarm someone who's dressed up a...Ilja (alias of stringburka)2013-09-16T13:48:12ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Galnöraghttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#412013-09-16T13:30:12Z2013-09-16T13:30:12Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">CrazyGnomes wrote:</div><blockquote><p> So <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/e-g/eyes-deathwatch" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">deathwatch eyes</a></i> don't let you see through invisibility, but does it still negate any type of illusion of a living or undead creature? I could see it bypassing <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/silent-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">silent image</a></i> or <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/minor-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">minor image</a></i>, as they are either visual only or visual and minor auditory. Are <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/major-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">major image</a></i>, <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/persistent-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">persistent image</a></i>, <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/programmed-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">programmed image</a></i>, and <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/permanent-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">permanent image</a></i>, which include visual, auditory, olfactory, and thermal components, also negated?</p>
<p>I'm very curious, because I'm running two RotRL campaigns right now and a PC in each group has acquired this item (for completely different reasons, one is a life oracle healer and the other doesn't want to get ambushed) and I expect them to be encountering illusions in the near future.
<br />
</blockquote><p>For the same reason as not negating Invisibility, I would be inclined to not let it negate other illusion spells. If the caster created an illusion of a living creature I would have the googles see a living creature. I may be in the minority here, but Illusion is already a difficult school to adjudicate, and a lot of people tend towards unintentionally nerfing it. I would let a 2k item invalidate it.CrazyGnomes wrote:So deathwatch eyes don't let you see through invisibility, but does it still negate any type of illusion of a living or undead creature? I could see it bypassing silent image or minor image, as they are either visual only or visual and minor auditory. Are major image, persistent image, programmed image, and permanent image, which include visual, auditory, olfactory, and thermal components, also negated?
I'm very curious, because I'm running two RotRL campaigns right now and...Galnörag2013-09-16T13:30:12ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?CrazyGnomeshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#402013-09-15T16:12:12Z2013-09-15T16:12:12Z<p>So <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic-items/wondrous-items/wondrous-items/e-g/eyes-deathwatch" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">deathwatch eyes</a></i> don't let you see through invisibility, but does it still negate any type of illusion of a living or undead creature? I could see it bypassing <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/s/silent-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">silent image</a></i> or <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/minor-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">minor image</a></i>, as they are either visual only or visual and minor auditory. Are <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/m/major-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">major image</a></i>, <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/persistent-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">persistent image</a></i>, <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/programmed-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">programmed image</a></i>, and <i><a href="http://www.d20pfsrd.com/magic/all-spells/p/permanent-image" target="_blank" rel="nofollow">permanent image</a></i>, which include visual, auditory, olfactory, and thermal components, also negated?</p>
<p>I'm very curious, because I'm running two RotRL campaigns right now and a PC in each group has acquired this item (for completely different reasons, one is a life oracle healer and the other doesn't want to get ambushed) and I expect them to be encountering illusions in the near future.</p>So deathwatch eyes don't let you see through invisibility, but does it still negate any type of illusion of a living or undead creature? I could see it bypassing silent image or minor image, as they are either visual only or visual and minor auditory. Are major image, persistent image, programmed image, and permanent image, which include visual, auditory, olfactory, and thermal components, also negated?
I'm very curious, because I'm running two RotRL campaigns right now and a PC in each...CrazyGnomes2013-09-15T16:12:12ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Jiggy (RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#392013-09-14T15:03:18Z2013-09-14T15:03:18Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Seraphimpunk wrote:</div><blockquote> i took this ruling to mean that detect spells as well, like detect magic, examine what you can see ( for reading auras ). they still detect that something is in the area on the first round, but things you can't see, you can't examine like with spellcraft to determine aura and strength ( like things behind a door. the detect may pass through the door and tell you there's magic there, but you can't see it, so you can't tell where they are, or how strong they are. ) which also negates using detect magic as a radar for invisibility. </blockquote><p><i>Detect magic</i> says "If the items or creatures bearing the auras are in line of sight, you can make Knowledge (arcana) skill checks to determine the school of magic involved in each." Thus, you don't get to ID them if they're behind a door. On the other hand, the spell also says that on the third round you know the location of each aura, and contains no such caveat.Seraphimpunk wrote:i took this ruling to mean that detect spells as well, like detect magic, examine what you can see ( for reading auras ). they still detect that something is in the area on the first round, but things you can't see, you can't examine like with spellcraft to determine aura and strength ( like things behind a door. the detect may pass through the door and tell you there's magic there, but you can't see it, so you can't tell where they are, or how strong they are. ) which also...Jiggy (RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32)2013-09-14T15:03:18ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?DarkPhoenixxhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#382013-09-13T12:44:21Z2013-09-13T12:44:21Z<p>Never used that item but sounds cool. Tho i belive that it works as color vision - you cant tell how green or red creature is unless you look at it. So you cant tell alive creature is unless you focus you "life vision" on it.</p>
<p>Anyway, ppl should not be proud about breaking the rules and limiing players.</p>Never used that item but sounds cool. Tho i belive that it works as color vision - you cant tell how green or red creature is unless you look at it. So you cant tell alive creature is unless you focus you "life vision" on it.
Anyway, ppl should not be proud about breaking the rules and limiing players.DarkPhoenixx2013-09-13T12:44:21ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Seraphimpunkhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#372013-09-13T12:07:27Z2013-09-13T12:07:27Z<p>i took this ruling to mean that detect spells as well, like detect magic, examine what you can see ( for reading auras ). they still detect that something is in the area on the first round, but things you can't see, you can't examine like with spellcraft to determine aura and strength ( like things behind a door. the detect may pass through the door and tell you there's magic there, but you can't see it, so you can't tell where they are, or how strong they are. ) which also negates using detect magic as a radar for invisibility.</p>i took this ruling to mean that detect spells as well, like detect magic, examine what you can see ( for reading auras ). they still detect that something is in the area on the first round, but things you can't see, you can't examine like with spellcraft to determine aura and strength ( like things behind a door. the detect may pass through the door and tell you there's magic there, but you can't see it, so you can't tell where they are, or how strong they are. ) which also negates using...Seraphimpunk2013-09-13T12:07:27ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Shifty (alias of Nik B.)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#362013-09-12T23:38:47Z2013-09-12T23:38:47Z<p>I have no problem with the players staring at a row of statues with Deathwatch and spotting which ones are the constructs.</p>
<p>The statues aren't hiding, they are standing in plain sight and are therefore able to be examined.</p>I have no problem with the players staring at a row of statues with Deathwatch and spotting which ones are the constructs.
The statues aren't hiding, they are standing in plain sight and are therefore able to be examined.Shifty (alias of Nik B.)2013-09-12T23:38:47ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Jiggy (RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#352013-09-12T23:27:41Z2013-09-12T23:27:41Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">The Morphling wrote:</div><blockquote><p>Invisible creatures underwater are invisible for the <i>exact same reason</i> you (mistakenly) think Deathwatch can see invisible targets.</p>
<p>Know why?</p>
<p><i>MAGIC.</i></p>
<p>The <i>invisibility</i> spell doesn't adjust the speed of light traveling through a creature in order to make it travel at the same speed as air (incidentally, the speed of light through a transparent medium is why glass, water, and air are all transparent but a glass jar is visible in air and while submerged). It <i>just makes the guy un-see-able</i>. Via <i>magic</i>. It doesn't matter if he's underwater, in air, or has paint thrown onto his invisible body - he's invisible, and the <i>illusion magic</i> makes it so.</p>
<p>If <i>invisibility</i> can conceal flesh, armor, dirt on one's skin, sweat, and bleeding wounds, it can conceal the imperceptible aura of "life force" that <i>deathwatch</i> detects. </blockquote><div class="messageboard-quotee">Core Rulebook, Environment chapter, Aquatic Terrain wrote:</div><blockquote>An invisible creature displaces water and leaves a visible, body-shaped “bubble” where the water was displaced. The creature still has concealment (20% miss chance), but not total concealment (50% miss chance).</blockquote><div class="messageboard-quotee">Pathfinder Player Companion: Dungeoneer's Handbook wrote:</div><blockquote>Smog Pellet: The smoke from a smog pellet is oily, and creatures that are hit by a smog pellet or pass through the smoke are covered in thick residue. This residue makes invisible creatures visible for 1d4 rounds.</blockquote><p>The Morphling wrote:Invisible creatures underwater are invisible for the exact same reason you (mistakenly) think Deathwatch can see invisible targets.
Know why?
MAGIC.
The invisibility spell doesn't adjust the speed of light traveling through a creature in order to make it travel at the same speed as air (incidentally, the speed of light through a transparent medium is why glass, water, and air are all transparent but a glass jar is visible in air and while submerged). It just makes the...Jiggy (RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32)2013-09-12T23:27:41ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?The Morphlinghttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#342013-09-12T18:37:19Z2013-09-12T18:37:19Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Skoll wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Again the whole power lv for cost of item is ridiculous argument. Not all spells or items are balanced, most specifically not around each other. Again deathwatch is a supernatural ability or a spell....why the flying f•••• would it work just by going yup he has blood on his clothes and it looks to be his? Clearly it functions by reading the life force in individuals which would be perceived as an aura, guess what this aura would appear even if you are invisible. It's like arguing pcs can't see an invisible monster underwater...he displaces water and creates air bubbles.
</p>
Seriously. .. making deathwatch stupid and particularly useless (again most parties tend to kill things in combat or use heal checks after) </blockquote><p>Invisible creatures underwater are invisible for the <i>exact same reason</i> you (mistakenly) think Deathwatch can see invisible targets.
<p>Know why?</p>
<p><i>MAGIC.</i></p>
<p>The <i>invisibility</i> spell doesn't adjust the speed of light traveling through a creature in order to make it travel at the same speed as air (incidentally, the speed of light through a transparent medium is why glass, water, and air are all transparent but a glass jar is visible in air and while submerged). It <i>just makes the guy un-see-able</i>. Via <i>magic</i>. It doesn't matter if he's underwater, in air, or has paint thrown onto his invisible body - he's invisible, and the <i>illusion magic</i> makes it so.</p>
<p>If <i>invisibility</i> can conceal flesh, armor, dirt on one's skin, sweat, and bleeding wounds, it can conceal the imperceptible aura of "life force" that <i>deathwatch</i> detects.</p>Skoll wrote:Again the whole power lv for cost of item is ridiculous argument. Not all spells or items are balanced, most specifically not around each other. Again deathwatch is a supernatural ability or a spell....why the flying f**** would it work just by going yup he has blood on his clothes and it looks to be his? Clearly it functions by reading the life force in individuals which would be perceived as an aura, guess what this aura would appear even if you are invisible. It's like arguing...The Morphling2013-09-12T18:37:19ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Skollhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#332013-08-10T15:51:17Z2013-08-10T15:51:17Z<p>Again the whole power lv for cost of item is ridiculous argument. Not all spells or items are balanced, most specifically not around each other. Again deathwatch is a supernatural ability or a spell....why the flying f•••• would it work just by going yup he has blood on his clothes and it looks to be his? Clearly it functions by reading the life force in individuals which would be perceived as an aura, guess what this aura would appear even if you are invisible. It's like arguing pcs can't see an invisible monster underwater...he displaces water and creates air bubbles.
<br />
Seriously. .. making deathwatch stupid and particularly useless (again most parties tend to kill things in combat or use heal checks after)</p>Again the whole power lv for cost of item is ridiculous argument. Not all spells or items are balanced, most specifically not around each other. Again deathwatch is a supernatural ability or a spell....why the flying f**** would it work just by going yup he has blood on his clothes and it looks to be his? Clearly it functions by reading the life force in individuals which would be perceived as an aura, guess what this aura would appear even if you are invisible. It's like arguing pcs can't...Skoll2013-08-10T15:51:17ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Galnöraghttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#322013-08-09T19:57:31Z2013-08-09T19:57:31Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Mike Lindner wrote:</div><blockquote><p> I think he's talking about Deathwatch Eyes from Ultimate Equipment which gives the wearer <i>deathwatch</i> constant. I think the answer is found by asking the very same question already asked: would having deathwatch detect even invisible or otherwise concealed foes, thus providing an effect well above an appropriate power level for the cost of the item? Yes. So it doesn't do that. </p>
<p>Bah, I must be tired, letting ninja zombies get the better of me. :) </blockquote><p>Deathwatch doesn't duplicate the effect of life sight / blind sight. or the similar 11th level life oracle revelation.Mike Lindner wrote:I think he's talking about Deathwatch Eyes from Ultimate Equipment which gives the wearer deathwatch constant. I think the answer is found by asking the very same question already asked: would having deathwatch detect even invisible or otherwise concealed foes, thus providing an effect well above an appropriate power level for the cost of the item? Yes. So it doesn't do that.
Bah, I must be tired, letting ninja zombies get the better of me. :)
Deathwatch doesn't duplicate...Galnörag2013-08-09T19:57:31ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Redneckdevilhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#312013-08-09T19:17:04Z2013-08-09T19:17:04Z<p>Yeah I ranb that encounter this week. Was fun. When he steped out the door way and was turning both ways as if gauging which person to atk, I gotvreally funny looks about a headless skeleton being able to "see" them.</p>
<p>I responded it had blindsight which smoothed it over. Lol</p>
<p>Thanks for the response sean :-)</p>Yeah I ranb that encounter this week. Was fun. When he steped out the door way and was turning both ways as if gauging which person to atk, I gotvreally funny looks about a headless skeleton being able to "see" them.
I responded it had blindsight which smoothed it over. Lol
Thanks for the response sean :-)Redneckdevil2013-08-09T19:17:04ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Lincoln Hillshttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#302013-08-09T18:19:02Z2013-08-09T18:19:02Z<p>I've been giving the spell too much power myself, I think. A few adventures back, a powerful demon who wanted to buy a couple rounds of regeneration and SLA-buffing transformed himself into a Fine scorpion. <i>See invisibility</i> didn't pick him up, but <i>deathwatch</i> did. When in fact it looks like Perception would have been the only way to notice that the demon didn't "disappear" at all.</p>I've been giving the spell too much power myself, I think. A few adventures back, a powerful demon who wanted to buy a couple rounds of regeneration and SLA-buffing transformed himself into a Fine scorpion. See invisibility didn't pick him up, but deathwatch did. When in fact it looks like Perception would have been the only way to notice that the demon didn't "disappear" at all.Lincoln Hills2013-08-09T18:19:02ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Sean K Reynolds (Contributor)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#292015-02-25T04:42:46Z2013-08-09T18:12:15Z<p>The developer of that Carrion Crown adventure (#43, <i>The Haunting of Harrowstone</i>) almost certainly used <i>deathwatch</i> as a shortcut way to (1) make the creature workable despite its blindness, (2) rely on an existing game mechanic that everyone is familiar with, and (3) not spend 8 lines of text reinventing the wheel by explaining a new ability that's 90% like <i>deathwatch</i>.</p>
<p>Jonathan Tweet said in regard to rules design, "things should be the same, or different." In other words, it's better for the players (and GM) if the game standardizes how things work, instead of having a bunch of slightly-different variants that are hard to remember. For example, all of the PF feats for Improved [Combat Maneuvers] work the same way, in that they give you the exact same three things:
<br />
• no AOO when you perform the maneuver
<br />
• a +2 bonus to perform the maneuver
<br />
• a +2 bonus to resist the maneuver
<br />
That's consistent, and easy to remember. Everyone can just memorize one set of rules for "how the combat maneuver feats work," and they're done. If Imp Bull Rush was no-AOO/+3/+1, Imp Disarm was AOO/+5/+2, Imp Grapple was no-AOO/+1/+3, and Imp Trip was AOO/+2/+5, that would be <b>incredibly</b> hard to remember and people would mix them up all the time.</p>
<p>Same thing with the <i>deathwatch</i> monster. The developer could have created a custom ability that let it notice and pinpoint living, undead, and dying creatures within range, perhaps with a couple of tweaks to allow it to "see" creatures this way instead of merely identifying creatures it was already observing, and that rules text would borrow heavily from the <i>deathwatch</i> spell description. OR the developer could do what he did and give the creature <i>deathwatch</i> in its Senses line, and manually adjust its stats and penalties to reflect the effect that <i>deathwatch</i> has on the creature's blindness. It's a special encounter with a unique creature, and sometimes we bend the rules to make an interesting encounter.</p>
<p>Honestly, I don't think <i>deathwatch</i> lets you pinpoint anything. But I think having a headless undead monster compensate for its blindness by using <i>deathwatch</i> is a cool thing and makes for a creepy encounter, and that trumps 100% adherence to the rules. <i>GMs are allowed to bend the rules if it makes the game enjoyable and isn't done to punish the players.</i></p>
<p>And that means you shouldn't use unique, customized <i>monsters</i> in a particular adventure to justify how standard spells and abilities are supposed to work for <i>PCs</i>. Sometimes they're tweaked to make an interesting encounter. And sometimes there can be errors. I'd put the "sees with <i>deathwatch</i> monster" in the former category.</p>The developer of that Carrion Crown adventure (#43, The Haunting of Harrowstone) almost certainly used deathwatch as a shortcut way to (1) make the creature workable despite its blindness, (2) rely on an existing game mechanic that everyone is familiar with, and (3) not spend 8 lines of text reinventing the wheel by explaining a new ability that's 90% like deathwatch.
Jonathan Tweet said in regard to rules design, "things should be the same, or different." In other words, it's better for the...Sean K Reynolds (Contributor)2013-08-09T18:12:15ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Mojorat (alias of Brett Hodge)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#282013-08-09T14:52:31Z2013-08-09T14:52:31Z<p>Someone above mentioned facing. The games rules for cones already covers that. The wearer of the eyes probky has to declair where the cone is every round.</p>Someone above mentioned facing. The games rules for cones already covers that. The wearer of the eyes probky has to declair where the cone is every round.Mojorat (alias of Brett Hodge)2013-08-09T14:52:31ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Diego Rossihttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#272013-08-09T09:33:43Z2013-08-09T09:33:43Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Pathfinder Society FAQ wrote:</div><blockquote><p> How much benefit does deathwatch give you?</p>
<p>Deathwatch only analyzes creatures you're aware of. You have to be able to see the creature to instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or neither alive nor dead (such as a construct). It doesn't magically advise or let you see or know there is an invisible creature or a very stealthy creature in the area and what the health and condition of that creature is.
<br />
</blockquote><p>Weird. Why it is in the PFS FAQ and not in the CRB FAQ?
</p>
It don't seem something specific of PFS but a general ruling.</p>Pathfinder Society FAQ wrote:How much benefit does deathwatch give you?
Deathwatch only analyzes creatures you're aware of. You have to be able to see the creature to instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or neither alive nor dead (such as a construct). It doesn't magically advise or let you see or know there is an invisible creature or...Diego Rossi2013-08-09T09:33:43ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Redneckdevilhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#262013-08-09T07:11:46Z2013-08-09T07:11:46Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Redneckdevil wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Soggy8 wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Sorry to revive an old thread, but I found this in Pathfinder Adventure Path #43.</p>
<p>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-4/gurtis-vortch</p>
<p>It's a monster that's supposed to use a continuous Deathwatch ability in order to see, since it's head is missing and it's effectively permanently blind. </blockquote>Also states anyone who comes within 30 feet of him, he is aware of them. Also states in the battle stats that he can pinpoint even though hes blind and deaf from being beheaded players because of his ability. </blockquote><p>I get the official ruling. Its more akin to seeing someone with normal eyes like "mmm that person looks roughed up, I wonder if they okay" to bam, deathwatch ur eyes become like the eyes of an experienced train surgeon " that person is slowly dying, that person is mortally wounded, and those wounds are fake hes perfectly healthy.
<p>But the guy in carrion crown, yeah it stating that it is a detect ability to where a headless person can instantly know about players when they come in 30 ft of him and that hes able to pinpoint targets because of deathwatch even though hes blind and deaf.
<br />
Im guessing that was an oversight maybe?</p>Redneckdevil wrote:Soggy8 wrote:Sorry to revive an old thread, but I found this in Pathfinder Adventure Path #43.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-4/gurtis-vortch
It's a monster that's supposed to use a continuous Deathwatch ability in order to see, since it's head is missing and it's effectively permanently blind.
Also states anyone who comes within 30 feet of him, he is aware of them. Also states in the battle stats that he can pinpoint even though hes blind and deaf...Redneckdevil2013-08-09T07:11:46ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Redneckdevilhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#252013-08-09T07:06:58Z2013-08-09T07:06:58Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Soggy8 wrote:</div><blockquote><p> Sorry to revive an old thread, but I found this in Pathfinder Adventure Path #43.</p>
<p>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-4/gurtis-vortch</p>
<p>It's a monster that's supposed to use a continuous Deathwatch ability in order to see, since it's head is missing and it's effectively permanently blind. </blockquote><p>Also states anyone who comes within 30 feet of him, he is aware of them. Also states in the battle stats that he can pinpoint even though hes blind and deaf from being beheaded players because of his ability.Soggy8 wrote:Sorry to revive an old thread, but I found this in Pathfinder Adventure Path #43.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-4/gurtis-vortch
It's a monster that's supposed to use a continuous Deathwatch ability in order to see, since it's head is missing and it's effectively permanently blind.
Also states anyone who comes within 30 feet of him, he is aware of them. Also states in the battle stats that he can pinpoint even though hes blind and deaf from being beheaded...Redneckdevil2013-08-09T07:06:58ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Jiggy (RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#242013-08-07T17:43:27Z2013-08-07T17:43:27Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Skoll wrote:</div><blockquote><p>...these " don't be daft" responses are ... illogical. ...it is completely daft instead to assume...
</p>
...which is simply a laughable concept </blockquote><p>So you bumped a two-month-old thread just to point at the "don't be daft" posts and reply with "don't be daft"?Skoll wrote:...these " don't be daft" responses are ... illogical. ...it is completely daft instead to assume...
...which is simply a laughable concept
So you bumped a two-month-old thread just to point at the "don't be daft" posts and reply with "don't be daft"?Jiggy (RPG Superstar 2015 Top 32, RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32)2013-08-07T17:43:27ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?xevious573https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#232013-09-12T18:27:06Z2013-08-07T17:31:38Z<p>Don't be daft.</p>Don't be daft.xevious5732013-08-07T17:31:38ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Skollhttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#222013-08-07T17:03:44Z2013-08-07T17:03:44Z<p>I gotta agree with soggy, these " don't be daft" responses are not only unbecoming but also illogical. RAW deathwatch allows you to see invisible and stealthed creatures, it is completely daft instead to assume what deathwatch lets you just see if the creature is a little bloody. You can't really just go ahead and interpret a ruling like that.... saying why a lv 1 spell would supplant a lv2 is to imply that all spells are just as useful and powerful as others which is simply a laughable concept</p>I gotta agree with soggy, these " don't be daft" responses are not only unbecoming but also illogical. RAW deathwatch allows you to see invisible and stealthed creatures, it is completely daft instead to assume what deathwatch lets you just see if the creature is a little bloody. You can't really just go ahead and interpret a ruling like that.... saying why a lv 1 spell would supplant a lv2 is to imply that all spells are just as useful and powerful as others which is simply a laughable conceptSkoll2013-08-07T17:03:44ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Soggy8https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#212013-06-17T13:10:16Z2013-06-17T13:10:16Z<p>Sorry to revive an old thread, but I found this in Pathfinder Adventure Path #43.</p>
<p>http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-4/gurtis-vortch</p>
<p>It's a monster that's supposed to use a continuous Deathwatch ability in order to see, since it's head is missing and it's effectively permanently blind.</p>Sorry to revive an old thread, but I found this in Pathfinder Adventure Path #43.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/unique-monsters/cr-4/gurtis-vortch
It's a monster that's supposed to use a continuous Deathwatch ability in order to see, since it's head is missing and it's effectively permanently blind.Soggy82013-06-17T13:10:16ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Blueluck (alias of S)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#202013-02-02T17:16:19Z2013-02-02T17:16:19Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Irongega wrote:</div><blockquote> <div class="messageboard-quotee">Michael Brock wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
<p>This nails my response. It is intended to be used only on creatures already perceived. </p>
<p>You have to be able to see the creature to instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or neither alive nor dead (such as a construct). </p>
<p>It doesn't magically advise or let you see or know there is an invisible creature or a very stealthy creature in the area and what the health and condition of that creature is. </blockquote><p>I'm sorry to have to semi rez this, and ask a maybe dumb question but....who exactly are who?
<p>I mean I see Campaign coordinater but I'm not sure what that means as far as an 'offical ruling' goes. </blockquote><p>Click someone's name on the forum to see their profile. In his case it says, "It is a privilege to have been chosen by Paizo to oversee Pathfinder Society."Irongega wrote:Michael Brock wrote:This nails my response. It is intended to be used only on creatures already perceived.
You have to be able to see the creature to instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or neither alive nor dead (such as a construct).
It doesn't magically advise or let you see or know there is an invisible creature or a...Blueluck (alias of S)2013-02-02T17:16:19ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Irongegahttps://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#192013-02-02T16:20:18Z2013-02-02T16:20:18Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">Michael Brock wrote:</div><blockquote><br />
<br />
<p>This nails my response. It is intended to be used only on creatures already perceived. </p>
<p>You have to be able to see the creature to instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or neither alive nor dead (such as a construct). </p>
<p>It doesn't magically advise or let you see or know there is an invisible creature or a very stealthy creature in the area and what the health and condition of that creature is. </blockquote><p>I'm sorry to have to semi rez this, and ask a maybe dumb question but....who exactly are who?
<p>I mean I see Campaign coordinater but I'm not sure what that means as far as an 'offical ruling' goes.</p>Michael Brock wrote:This nails my response. It is intended to be used only on creatures already perceived.
You have to be able to see the creature to instantly know whether each creature within the area is dead, fragile (alive and wounded, with 3 or fewer hit points left), fighting off death (alive with 4 or more hit points), healthy, undead, or neither alive nor dead (such as a construct).
It doesn't magically advise or let you see or know there is an invisible creature or a very stealthy...Irongega2013-02-02T16:20:18ZRe: Forums: Rules Questions: Deathwatch--No Ambushes, Pinpoint all Invisible for 2000gp?Rogue Eidolon (alias of Mark Seifter)https://paizo.com/threads/rzs2p1t1?DeathwatchNo-Ambushes-Pinpoint-all-Invisible#182014-06-17T00:08:56Z2012-11-20T16:39:42Z<div class="messageboard-quotee">W. Kristoph Nolen wrote:</div><blockquote> ]It doesn't mean anything of the kind. An inanimate object is not - even by the most loose definition - a "creature". The spell does not discern "things". The caster can distinguish a creature that is neither living nor dead from a typical statue because the spell doesn't provide information for things that are not creatures. </blockquote><p>Not quite. As per Mike above, the spell does not give you a run-down of all creatures in the area and what their status is if you aren't already aware of their presence as a creature. Rather, it gives you the status of anything that you are aware of being a creature. You can no more auto-identify hidden constructs by Mike's clarification (by saying "I Deathwatch every statue I ever see in case there's a creature") than you can identify invisible or hidden opponents (by saying "I Deathwatch every vacant square in case there's a hidden enemy"). In all cases, you need to make the requisite skill check (probably Perception in both cases) to find the enemy—Deathwatch never does that for you, it just lets you know how alive it is once you do (which is a substantial boon in its own right when the difference between say a gargoyle and a golem is a boatload of immunities).W. Kristoph Nolen wrote:]It doesn't mean anything of the kind. An inanimate object is not - even by the most loose definition - a "creature". The spell does not discern "things". The caster can distinguish a creature that is neither living nor dead from a typical statue because the spell doesn't provide information for things that are not creatures.
Not quite. As per Mike above, the spell does not give you a run-down of all creatures in the area and what their status is if you aren't already...Rogue Eidolon (alias of Mark Seifter)2012-11-20T16:39:42Z