Advice on creating an elderly paladin


Advice


Hey all,

I have a nice concept for a backup character and I'd like your advice to see if it's even playable, and to make it so if it isn't.

I'd like to put together a very old (read: venerable) human woman who got the call to become a holy warrior incredibly late in life. (For reference, the stat changes for venerable are -6 Str, Dex, Con, +3 Int, Wis, Cha.)

Obviously, given the intent of the paladin class, this would be very difficult to do mechanically. But I'd settle for a style of combat/interaction that makes her useful and helpful to the party, even if she's not going to be kicking out much damage or (most likely) wearing heavy armour.

Also, I know that older characters do better as casters ... that's kind of the point. I want to see if the paladin class in particular can do something unusual or interesting with a venerable character.

Playing with the elite array (15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8), I see that it's possible to keep her Con penalty manageable or nonexistent, and that she can have some really high Wisdom and Charisma scores, as well as enough Int to qualify for any feats that need it (and getting a TON of skill points if Int goes high). She can even have no Dex penalty if done right.

But can she be useful and mechanically workable (not optimised, just playable in a party without being dead weight) as a character, levels 1-20. Advise me, Internet! I need help!

The things that are locked in stone are:

Race: Human
Gender: Female
Class: Paladin (Happy to play with archetypes, but I'd like to single-class this. I know casters, and even a monk, would be much more optimisable for her.)
Stats: Using the elite array, for convenience.
Age: Venerable (so, 70 years old). -6 all physical stats, +3 all mental.

RPG Superstar Season 9 Top 32

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Sir Ophiuchus,

Makes you pine for the days of the CharOp forums, doesn't it?

Your stats are going to be a problem, especially with a meager elite array. I'm thinking that your 14 ought go into Con and your racial bonus ought to go into Con as well. That'll leave you with a 10, and you can put your 15 into Charisma (because you're going to want to focus on spells, lay on hands, and channel energy).

If stats turn out to be a real problem (or if you really want to optimize your Charisma), you could always opt for the new human variant in which you gain +2 to two stats in exchange for your bonus feat and your bonus skill ranks.

Speaking of feats, my first thought is Guided Hand, which would allow you to use your Wisdom modifier to hit with your deity's favored weapon. You didn't specify a deity (or even a setting), so if you can scare up a deity that lists some kind of crossbow, firearm, or another non-Strength-dependent weapon as his or her favored weapon, you might actually be able to go pew-pew from your rocking chair (and your smites will actually be pretty fearsome thanks to your excellent Charisma score). Right now I'm picturing a little old lady in a wheelchair with a shotgun in her hands and a cross around her neck.

There's also Eldritch Heritage. Which one you want, I'm not sure, but EH would give you a respectable feat chain for which you actually qualify, and you'll actually be able to select new things to do in combat and new ways to put your Charisma to work. Channeling feats would also be a good investment, since you'll have a lot of uses per day.

You'll have a good number of spells per day too, so there's always buffing.

Your Con and AC will be... not good, so you'll want to use your bonded mount to stay the hell away from melee. Mounted Combat / Mounted Archery if you go the "little old shotgun (/crossbow) lady" route.

Good luck with this! Let me know how it turns out.

Daron Woodson
Abandoned Arts


Just an idea...but have you taken a look at a more Battle-oriented Oracle?

Fits with the whole 'later life calling' pretty well, and could be very paladin-like depending on how you build her.


Uh... okay. Um, let's see what can be done.

If you are looking for combat effectiveness at level one, I actually recommend taking one level of cleric first, then going Paladin X from there. It is the only way to start with Guided Hand, which allows you to use your wisdom bonus to attack with your deity's favored weapon. I would also recommend that you pick Abadar and use a crossbow so you don't have to worry about amping your strength score just to cause any damage. This would give you greater access to healing spells, and the ability to be useful as a healer at level one until you get access to lay on hands.

The Divine Hunter Archetype is good for ranged and it gives up heavy armor proficiency as well, giving you some extra feats to use while smiting, so that works out well.

I would go with...

Str 4
Dex 5
Con 7
Int 11
Wis 18
Cha 19

The Alchemist gets earliest access to Greater Age Resistance, so if you don't have anyone capable of casting it in the group, get one via Leadership. Of course, the earliest you can get it at a regular basis is at level 15, so it may not be that great of an idea. Leadership and taking the divine bond (horse) might be good ways to improve your capabilities.


Abandoned Arts wrote:
Makes you pine for the days of the CharOp forums, doesn't it?

You never said a truer word.

"Abandoned Arts wrote:
Your stats are going to be a problem, especially with a meager elite array. I'm thinking that your 14 ought go into Con and your racial bonus ought to go into Con as well. That'll leave you with a 10, and you can put your 15 into Charisma (because you're going to want to focus on spells, lay on hands, and channel energy).

Yep.

Abandoned Arts wrote:
Speaking of feats, my first thought is Guided Hand, which would allow you to use your Wisdom modifier to hit with your deity's favored weapon. You didn't specify a deity (or even a setting), so if you can scare up a deity that lists some kind of crossbow, firearm, or another non-Strength-dependent weapon as his or her favored weapon, you might actually be able to go pew-pew from your rocking chair (and your smites will actually be pretty fearsome thanks to your excellent Charisma score). Right now I'm picturing a little old lady in a wheelchair with a shotgun in her hands and a cross around her neck.

I ... did not know this feat existed. Thank you! That's exactly the sort of thing I was hoping to find. I'm now also imagining getting away with a firearm-toting elderly woman paladin, and I love it!

Yeah, it's neither setting nor deity-specific because a lot of the GMs I know homebrew their own settings anyway, so I like to have transferable character ideas.

Abandoned Arts wrote:
There's also Eldritch Heritage. Which one you want, I'm not sure, but EH would give you a respectable feat chain for which you actually qualify, and you'll actually be able to select new things to do in combat and new ways to put your Charisma to work. Channeling feats would also be a good investment, since you'll have a lot of uses per day.

Duly noted.

Quote:
Your Con and AC will be... not good, so you'll want to use your bonded mount to stay the hell away from melee. Mounted Combat / Mounted Archery if you go the "little old shotgun (/crossbow) lady" route.

I suspect her mount will be a better melee combatant than her! Strength that low basically means most armour is out, right?

Abandoned Arts wrote:
Good luck with this! Let me know how it turns out.

Thanks, will do!

Lamontius wrote:

Just an idea...but have you taken a look at a more Battle-oriented Oracle?

Fits with the whole 'later life calling' pretty well, and could be very paladin-like depending on how you build her.

Considered it, yep. But part of the reason I don't want to make a primary spellcaster is because I strongly suspect any GM would consider it ... munchkinesque ... to take venerable age for a primary caster. I know I'd be suspicious. However, if you make a 70-year-old paladin, nobody thinks you're trying to break the system! :)

Lantern Lodge RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16

I'd also look into the Hospitalier/Oath of Charity or Sacred Shield archetypes; both make great support options. Sacred Shield requires you only be strong enough to hold a shield to protect your allies and Hospitalier/Oath of Charity gives you more and greater healing options. Both are also very flavorful for an inspirational calling.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

I'm sorry, but I don't see it. Oracle, Adept, Witch, These I could see, but someone whose class is primarily about fighting... no way could I see someone who has to struggle to lift her blanket being called into battle unless she was given a She-Ra transformation.

Paladins no matter what type are called to put it on the line. For this reason, few of them live to see retirement.


She'd be awesome as a "Face" character and defensive bulwark.

Would never take stats to 4's or 5's One good poison or stat attack and you're out.

15, 14, 13, 12, 10, 8

Str 8
Dex 9
Con 6
Int 13
Wis 11
Chr 18 (with +2 for Human stat bonus)

Take the bonus HP for class every level instead of Skill point

Feats:
Combat Expertise
Toughness (you'll need it this time)

Traits
Resilient (+1 Fort Saves)
Focused Mind (+2 concentration checks)
Shining Knight Archetype.

Skill points to Diplomacy, Ride, Sense Motive

I would def go with a Mount when you get to that point and make sure it has the Bodyguard feat.

Focus on defense and fight defensively a LOT.


LazarX wrote:
I'm sorry, but I don't see it. Oracle, Adept, Witch, These I could see, but someone whose class is primarily about fighting... no way could I see someone who has to struggle to lift her blanket being called into battle unless she was given a She-Ra transformation.

It's a fair point, though I disagree. Paladins are about fighting evil in whatever form it manifests. What I'm trying to do is to create a character who fights that fight in a nontraditional way, using the resources she has at her disposal. Ideally the gods called her for a reason - because of her age and experience, not despite of them, even with her physical handicaps.

She's never going to be the greatest warrior, but I want to play around with what else is possible as a paladin.

Quote:
Paladins no matter what type are called to put it on the line. For this reason, few of them live to see retirement.

Given that the character's remaining natural lifespan could be two years ... I agree with you on this.


If you are allowed, or have access too, you might want to check out Kobold Quarterly 20. They have an article called "Putting the Band Back Together", is have a lot of information on running older characters and a lot of feats with I think might help your character. One in particular call "Love of Live" which allows you to use Cha instead of Con for HP.

Grand Lodge

Pathfinder PF Special Edition, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber
Sir Ophiuchus wrote:
LazarX wrote:
I'm sorry, but I don't see it. Oracle, Adept, Witch, These I could see, but someone whose class is primarily about fighting... no way could I see someone who has to struggle to lift her blanket being called into battle unless she was given a She-Ra transformation.

It's a fair point, though I disagree. Paladins are about fighting evil in whatever form it manifests. What I'm trying to do is to create a character who fights that fight in a nontraditional way, using the resources she has at her disposal. Ideally the gods called her for a reason - because of her age and experience, not despite of them, even with her physical handicaps.

She's never going to be the greatest warrior, but I want to play around with what else is possible as a paladin.

Quote:
Paladins no matter what type are called to put it on the line. For this reason, few of them live to see retirement.
Given that the character's remaining natural lifespan could be two years ... I agree with you on this.

Is there a particular reason you went Paladin on this? Oracle is even more of a "Answering the Call" type of class given the nature of how such powers are acquired.

The other question is "What experience makes her a subject of a call?" It's not fighting experience,given that she's first level.


LazarX wrote:
Is there a particular reason you went Paladin on this? Oracle is even more of a "Answering the Call" type of class given the nature of how such powers are acquired.

I admit it's not ideal. I have to say, I just like the idea a lot and want to see if it's possible. You're right about oracle, but I didn't want to play a primary spellcaster with this, for several reasons.

LazarX wrote:
The other question is "What experience makes her a subject of a call?" It's not fighting experience,given that she's first level.

I hope I won't be accused of dodging the question by answering: that's an excellent question, there are life experiences that are not necessarily defined by XP, and it would be something that would be written into her character background and help define what type of paladin she became.

So, suggestions include:

1) Get a mount. Have the mount protect you. Snipe from range.
2) Buffing, protecting, healing (ideally also from range).
3) Party face.

I'm thinking at this point that a mount is almost non-negotiable. Charisma and Wisdom seem to be the primary stats needed. I also love the idea of a paladin who follows Desna spinning smite-evil starknives across the battlefield.

I had considered going an unarmed strike route and picking up Crane Wing and Touch of Serenity eventually (the old woman bats away all attacks, gets close enough to slap you, and takes you out of the fight so her allies can whomp you). What do people think of it? (And yes, I know it's better to take those as a monk.)


Narrac Sarra wrote:
If you are allowed, or have access too, you might want to check out Kobold Quarterly 20. They have an article called "Putting the Band Back Together", is have a lot of information on running older characters and a lot of feats with I think might help your character. One in particular call "Love of Live" which allows you to use Cha instead of Con for HP.

Holy smokes that would super buff this character. Out of the frying pan and into full functionality...


A one level monk dip helps a Paladin quite a lot... Worth looking at after 5th (when you get mount)

Shadow Lodge

Shields, for the love of gods bring a shield.

Have you looked at the holy gun archetype (que barrage of hate). The divine defender combines nicely with the hospitaler as a nice support character.

The oath bound paladin - oath of charity is good for support as well, though you loose the divine bond.

Liberty's Edge

Try focusing as maybe a LG cleric of Iomedae, help make up for lake of muscle. Also gives you same ideas. Only lack is bonded mount, but you'll want one. Try getting Fleet in case you need to get the hell out of there, and toughness if you can't.


BltzKrg242 wrote:
Narrac Sarra wrote:
If you are allowed, or have access too, you might want to check out Kobold Quarterly 20. They have an article called "Putting the Band Back Together", is have a lot of information on running older characters and a lot of feats with I think might help your character. One in particular call "Love of Live" which allows you to use Cha instead of Con for HP.
Holy smokes that would super buff this character. Out of the frying pan and into full functionality...

There is also a feat which negates all ages penalties to one stat.

Plus the one that makes undead think you are one of them because you look so withered. XP


Try a Merciful Healer Cleric.
They play like toothless old women anyway!


BltzKrg242 wrote:


Feats:
Combat Expertise
Toughness (you'll need it this time)

Correction from Toughness to Love of Life (if your GM approves Feat from KQ)

From a -2 p/die to a +4 PER LEVEL? Hells yes.

With this change you could also skip the HP per level for Favored Class and get an extra Skill. Pick up Animal Handling so you can command your Mount when not mounted. Cover/flank/attack are all viable functions of your mount.


Guys, if I wanted to play a cleric I'd play a cleric.

There are a lot of nice paladin archetypes out there - trouble is most of them conflict with one another. Hospitaler would be lovely, as would the one that allows you to rechoose your mercies every day ... as would divine defender or sacred shield. Too many options!!


What level are the characters? There are druid spells to ignore the effects of old age.


She would be starting at a fairly low level. This isn't a build I'm actually playing yet, it's a character to bring in should my current character die / a new game start.

I wouldn't plan around having those spells available. Also, they sort of miss the point of playing her as old. :)


A -6 penalty to all physical stats is probably too much of a loss for any combat-oriented class.

I know you've heard this before, and it probably doesn't help much, but I suggest you try a LG Oracle of Battle (servant of Iomedae, perhaps?).

Or... I dunno, a LG Zen Archer Monk? Since they use Wisdom to hit, you'd at least have a nice attack roll. And focusing in ranged attacks mean your low Con wouldn't be too much of a problem.

Besides, they don't need armor... And with that Str penalty, chances are you couldn't don armor even if you wanted.


People.. He has a character in mind and he's asking for help building THAT character.

I applaud your RP choice Ophiuchus. Not every character has to be optimized. Sometimes you just have to run with an idea and the character turns out just fine. My current paladin is sub-optimal at best due to poor stat rolling and fluff choices for feats and levels but he's damned fun to play.
Somehow he even got elected to be the party leader...


Sir O, cool idea.

I second the suggestion about Sacred Shield paladin. She doesn't necessarily have to safeguard the frontline fighters; the support people and the casters in the rearguard certainly would not mind taking 50% damage when push comes to shove, I think.

Mithral shield would be a must here, but keep in mind that with a +2 mithral heavy shield and shield focus, plus your divine bond ability, you could grant a +6 shield bonus to all adjacent allies.


It looks like your best bet is to focus on buffing party members and healing. It might not be very interesting, but once you start being able to give smite evil to your allies, a fighter will start wrecking enemies more than enough to make up for your lack of damage.

Liberty's Edge

Great concept! I know you said no multi-class, but hear me out for a silly, but fun combo.

My suggestion is to start with 2 levels of Barbarian (Urban Barbarian).

Your controlled anger (making your whole body shake, and not just from the palsy) at all those young whipper-snappers, makes you wanna...shake your cane at them. Crowds part for you like the Red Sea. Your 2nd level Rage Power is: Intimidating Glare.

After a few levels the gods notice your antics and a caring deity embraces you, wanting you to live a bit longer so your anger can be channeled to usefulness.

Combine that with the cross-bow/shotgun granny. Use the rage to bump your Dex +4 to help fire your shotgun and you can still use your healing/Charisma abilities. You also have a higher starting HP, although you should take Extra Rage to get some more rounds of use.

You would also need your DM to hand-wave the ex-barbarian rule and allow your granny to use her Rage because it's the controlled version.

Fun RPing :D


This may be considered cheating for the exercise you have proposed here, but how about an item that grants benefits equal to the Greater Age Resistance spell? If that seems too powerful, it could be toned down to Age Resistance or Lesser Age Resistance.

Silver Crusade

I love this concept. Please continue to ignore the naysayers.


Pathfinder Adventure Path Subscriber

Might I suggest dipping into Ninja? As the character is older she should have a wider range of knowledge and the sneak attack + ninja tricks could represent the character compensating for her age by being wilier.

Shadow Lodge

Guided Hand will help a lot with your to-hit if you end up with a decent Wis. It'll take two feats, though, and unless you dip cleric you couldn't get it at level 1. You might be able to hit consistently without it, especially if you use a firearm within touch attack range (I like the granny with a shotgun image). Or you could forget about attacking and devote all your attention to buffing, healing, and maybe a bit of debuff (Dazzling Display, or anything else that gives you a more efficient use of Intimidate).

To help with armour wearing, consider Muleback cords, which should boost your carrying capacity to ~50lbs, enough to handle a Mithril Breastplate and Shield. It takes a shoulder slot, but if your DM allows you can add its powers to a Cloak of Resistance for only 1,500 gold.


Okay, I have futzed around with archetypes and stat tweaks for hours now, and here's what I've come up with. Thoughts and comments gratefully appreciated. It's a level one build, but the term that comes to mind is "disturbingly lethal, considering".

In fact, it only gets better for Esme. She will jump in lethality and usefulness:
- at level 2, when divine grace will give her +4 to all saves and she can lay on hands 5/day.
- at level 3, when she gets Rapid Reload, removes fatigue by touch, and gives everyone free Precise Shot.
- at level 4, when she gets spellcasting with her insane charisma. And channel energy. With her insane charisma.
- at level 5, when she can make her light crossbow a +1 magical item. If it already is +1, she can double its range or make it ignore concealment. Once per day for five minutes, but still.
- at level 6, where she can lay on hands from a distance of 30ft, which increases with her level.
- at level 7, when she gets Guided Hand. This is what we've been waiting for! Her attack bonus with the light crossbow JUMPS by a total of +6, giving her a +12 to hit at this level (+17 when smiting). Now we're cooking with charcoal!
- at level 11, she gets to raise the dead with a touch and no material component, but that's minor, right?

All level stat increases will go into Charisma.

Also, do not talk to me about encumbrance! Damn, figuring (and refiguring) that took forever!

Esme the Withered

You see an old lady wearing travelling clothes and work leathers, leaning on a cane. Her motherly face beams at you with warmth and compassion as the wind tosses her fluffy white hair. The loaded crossbow concealed beneath her shawl only becomes evident when she raises her hands and fires.

Level 1 Human Paladin (Dual Talent racial trait, Divine Hunter archetype)
Favoured class: Paladin (+1 hp/level)
Age: 70 (Venerable)

Stats

Str 6 (-2) [10 – 6 + 2]
Dex 6 (-2) [12 - 6]
Con 8 (-1) [14 – 6]
Int 11 (+0) [8 + 3]
Wis 18 (+4) [13 + 3 + 2]
Cha 18 (+4) [15 + 3]

HP: 10 [10 – 1 (con) + 1 (favoured class)]
AC: 13 [10 + 4 (hide armour) – 2 (dex) + 1 (buckler)]

Fortitude: +1 [2 – 1]
Reflex: -2 [0 – 2]
Will: +6 [2 + 4]

Attacks

Light crossbow +0, 1d8, 19-20/x2 (move action to reload) [1 (bab) – 2 (dex) + 1 (feat)]
Sword cane -1, 1d6, 20/x2 (swift action to draw from cane) [1 (bab) – 2 (str)]

Special abilities

Detect evil – at will
Aura of good – level one aura
Smite evil – 1/day Esme targets one creature. If it is evil, she gets +4 to hit and +1 damage, +4 to AC against her target's attacks, and ignores any DR they have. If they are an evil outsider, evil dragon, or undead, the first attack does +2 damage instead. This lasts until the target is dead or until Esme rests.

Feats

1: Precise Shot (divine hunter bonus feat)
1: Weapon Focus (light crossbow)

Skills

Perception: 1 + 3 (class) + 4 (wisdom) = +8
Sense Motive: 1 + 3 (class) + 4 (wisdom) = +8

Equipment

Encumbrance limits (Str 6 + 1 for masterwork backpack): 0-23 / 24-46 / 47-70.
Current encumbrance (58 lbs): Heavy (+1 max Dex bonus, -6 check penalty, 20 ft speed, run x3).

Hide armour (25 lbs) masterwork backpack (4 lbs), sword cane (4 lbs), light crossbow (4 lbs), traveller's outfit (5 lbs), buckler (5 lbs), bedroll (5 lbs), hooded lantern (2 lbs), oil (1 lb), 30 crossbow bolts (3 lbs), knitting needles and wool (no weight), 17 gp, 8 sp.

Racial trait and archetype notes

Human racial trait: Dual Talent
lose bonus feat, skill points, +2 to one stat of your choice
gain +2 to two stats of your choice

Paladin archetype: Divine Hunter
(1) Precise Shot (bonus feat). Replaces Heavy Armour Proficiency.
(3) Shared Precision. Allies within 10 feet gain Precise Shot for a round when the paladin hits on a ranged attack. Replaces aura of courage.
(5) Divine Bond must be with a ranged/thrown weapon. Allows distance, returning, or seeking, but not defending or disruption.
(6) Distant Mercy. Can burn 2 uses of lay on hands to use it at a distance (5ft/paladin level). Cannot be used to harm undead. Replaces sixth-level mercy.
(8) Aura of Care. Paladin and allies within 10ft no longer provide cover against each other's ranged attacks unless they wish. Replaces aura of resolve.
(11) Hunter's Blessing. Can burn 1 smite evil (swift action) to give paladin and allies within 10 feet Deadly Aim, Precise Shot, Improved Precise Shot for one minute, prerequisites unnecessary. Does not work on evil creatures. Replaces aura of justice.
(14) Righteous Hunter. Paladin's ranged weapons are good-aligned for purposes of overcoming DR. Ranged attacks by an ally within 10 feet likewise. Replaces aura of righteousness.

Feat choice plan

1: Weapon Focus (light crossbow)
1: Precise Shot (paladin bonus feat)
3: Rapid Reload
5: Channel Smite
7: Guided Hand (light crossbow)
9: Greater Mercy
11: Ultimate Mercy


I had a huge post composed and then... downtime. Arg.

The gist of it.

Stay full paladin. Look at these archetypes.

Empyrial Knight: You lose your healing capabilities. You gain the ability to summon. Your mount can fly. Your personal weapons can be projectile while you hold off the target of the smite evil with some summoned roadblocks.

RP style: Your god(ess) sends you aid in the form of animal friends or companions guiding you to your destination though you know not where. Play as a support and battlefield control paladin.

Sacred Servant: You reduce your smite capabilities and you don't get a mount. In exchange your spells and your healing become stronger and you can even take a Domain. (If you take Animal, you do get a mount if you like. If you take healing you get the heal spells. If you take Nobility you can take a cohort.) At 8th level you can have a planar ally as a bodyguard.

RP style: A reluctant acolyte, called to battle. An elderly priest/nun out of the convent and into the real world.

These are paladin archetypes that don't follow the norm for paladin. As an elder, you won't be entering combat until later levels, where your spells can conjure armor and weapons. Meanwhile, focus on your spellcasting ability. The lowest I'd take this would be 4th level. It will take much thought to play, but you won't be dead weight. Just don't tell your palls you're a paladin or they will be expecting things differently of you.

Also, consider talking to your DM about having you die of old age in game. It could produce a beautiful story moment if you play it well.

Edit: Arrrrg! Ah well, better late than never. >_<

Grand Lodge

Scion of Humanity Agathion-Blooded Aasimar with the Immortal Spark alternate racial trait.

Very thematic, and lessens the sting of age penalties.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Now that I have a somewhat coherent build, a character background is suggesting itself...

Esme had an interesting and enjoyable life. She never travelled very far, or did anything very significant, or even had a husband and children, but it was a productive, meaningful life nonetheless. She had looked after her house, helped with the life of her village, and worked at small farming and crafts to make ends meet until age crept up on her. She was lookng forward to a peaceful last few years in her own home, surrounded by the rewards of a life well lived.

Then Janice, her neighbour and best friend since they were girls together, was found strangled in her own kitchen. Murder was almost unknown in the sleepy little village, and there was great excitement. The lord's constables came about and asked questions and took notes, and they were very nice earnest boys, but Esme grew more and more frustrated. They weren't local - they didn't know what questions to ask, they didn't know who to talk to, and they didn't listen to her when she tried to tell them so. Though they were very polite, of course.

So Esme started asking some questions of her own. And, being elderly and harmless, nobody saw the harm in answering them. Piece by piece, she put the clues together. A labourer, discharged for theft. Janice's careless habit of not locking her door. Gossip about the pension Janice received after her husband died in the last war. A small amount of local area knowledge.

After that, it was almost trivial to take Janice's soldier husband's crossbow and head out to the forest, and it was no surprise to find the fellow hiding in the old woodcutter's shack. He didn't think she'd really fire it, and neither did she until she put a bolt through his leg. Then she tied the wound off and went to call the constables.

She attended the man's trial, and his hanging. Afterwards, his lordship asked for a private word. He'd been impressed with her skills - though, as she said, it was really just that one picks things up, living in a village for so many years - and he wanted her advice and assistance tracking down a notorious highwayman...

That was a year ago. Now Esme has a small reputation as an investigator who'll go out of her way to track down serious wrongdoers. She won't take bounties, and she won't take bribes. But she'll ask questions in her innocent little way, and put everything together in her fluffy white head - and then she'll deliver a killer or a thief to justice.

Once Esme knows her target, nothing will save them from her. Because when she looks at them with those soft cloudy eyes, it's like she sees right into their souls. And if she has to use her dead friend's crossbow to shoot an evildoer, she never seems to miss.


I thought venerable was -3 all physical stats and +1 all mental stats?


Detect Magic wrote:
I thought venerable was -3 all physical stats and +1 all mental stats?

Age penalties are cumulative, as per the CRB.

Middle age: -1 to physical, +1 to mental
Old age: -2 to physical, +1 to mental
Venerable: -3 to physical, +1 to mental

So when you hit venerable age, you've accumulated a total of -6 to your physical stats and +3 to your mental stats.

Grand Lodge

I remember when every Druid was venerable.


Ah, is that so? Learn something new everyday.

Grand Lodge

That's when Wildshape(and polymorph) was very different.

Completely changed your physical stats.

Silver Crusade

Sir Ophiuchus wrote:

Now that I have a somewhat coherent build, a character background is suggesting itself...

Esme had an interesting and enjoyable life. She never travelled very far, or did anything very significant, or even had a husband and children, but it was a productive, meaningful life nonetheless. She had looked after her house, helped with the life of her village, and worked at small farming and crafts to make ends meet until age crept up on her. She was lookng forward to a peaceful last few years in her own home, surrounded by the rewards of a life well lived.

Then Janice, her neighbour and best friend since they were girls together, was found strangled in her own kitchen. Murder was almost unknown in the sleepy little village, and there was great excitement. The lord's constables came about and asked questions and took notes, and they were very nice earnest boys, but Esme grew more and more frustrated. They weren't local - they didn't know what questions to ask, they didn't know who to talk to, and they didn't listen to her when she tried to tell them so. Though they were very polite, of course.

So Esme started asking some questions of her own. And, being elderly and harmless, nobody saw the harm in answering them. Piece by piece, she put the clues together. A labourer, discharged for theft. Janice's careless habit of not locking her door. Gossip about the pension Janice received after her husband died in the last war. A small amount of local area knowledge.

After that, it was almost trivial to take Janice's soldier husband's crossbow and head out to the forest, and it was no surprise to find the fellow hiding in the old woodcutter's shack. He didn't think she'd really fire it, and neither did she until she put a bolt through his leg. Then she tied the wound off and went to call the constables.

She attended the man's trial, and his hanging. Afterwards, his lordship asked for a private word. He'd been impressed with her skills - though, as she said, it was really just that one picks things up, living in a...

Really love it, but one suggestion. Mention her relationship with her communities children, considering her lack of a bio family. What was it like? What did she gain from it, if anything?

Great name BTW.

Shadow Lodge

You can still play a venerable druid if you're willing to burn spell slots on Age Resistance (or abuse Timeless Body).

I love the backstory. Build's not bad considering the handicaps, and should work very well once you get Guided Hand. I'm not a big fan of the Divine Hunter's auras, but they could be very handy if you have non-specialists forced into ranged combat.


Winter_Born wrote:
Really love it, but one suggestion. Mention her relationship with her communities children, considering her lack of a bio family. What was it like? What did she gain from it, if anything?

Nice idea, thanks. I'm aware that parts of the background make her come across as rather cold and relentless, and while that's definitely an aspect of her character, I'd want it to be more clear that she's a genuinely good person as well. That will help a lot, thanks again.

Weirdo wrote:
I love the backstory. Build's not bad considering the handicaps, and should work very well once you get Guided Hand. I'm not a big fan of the Divine Hunter's auras, but they could be very handy if you have non-specialists forced into ranged combat.

Thanks. Mental note: try and find at least one opportunity to organise a town militia to repel an attack through volleys of arrows. And playing through to level 7 (hell, to level 2!) will be fun if/when I get the chance. Considering taking Eldritch Heritage (Celestial) later on, but it's a feat-starved build as it is and that's an expensive chain of feats. Or possibly Accursed bloodline, if I played up the Crone aspects of her even more and perhaps had a Nemesis goddess take an interest.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Good day.

I just wanted to thank all of you nice young people for all your help. It means a great deal to me that so many of you are willing to go out of their way to assist an old lady.

Fare well, dears, and may you walk bright paths.

Community / Forums / Pathfinder / Pathfinder First Edition / Advice / Advice on creating an elderly paladin All Messageboards

Want to post a reply? Sign in.