Firestream Spell + Bronze Armor = Molten PC?


Rules Questions


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber

I'm just curious how other DM's are ruling or would rule on this. Say you are running a bronze age game. What would be the additional effect to a character wearing Bronze armor when they get hit with a FIRESTREAM spell?

Are they covered in molten bronze that continues to deal damage?


It has the same wording as fireball.. and myself, I wouldn't impose anything against it or allow it to melt someone's armor.

The first time you let fireball melt someone's armor and weapon is the last time you catch a PC wearing bronze gear- even in a bronze age game.
Its just too common an effect.

-S


Not that the effect on mass combat wouldn't be absolutely hilarious.

"General the enemy is wearing bronze armor and wielding bronze longswords, what do we do?"

"Get the wand of fireball from my chest and give it to the wizard's apprentice. Time to win ourselves a war."

-S


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber

Ok... let me widen the question to the Fireball spell as well. I ask because I've never really run into a situation with a fireball or the firestream spell and armor that can be melted as I'm usually running in a game or running a game where steel armor is the norm.

Fireballs are also one of the spells that I've always aired on the side of caution with when I'm running and kinda glossed over allot of the fire effects.

Sovereign Court

What I've heard (but I'm unfamiliar with the actual rules on this) is that if you roll a natural one on a saving throw, then you have to roll additional saves for your items.


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber

Ah yes. Knowing where to look helps.

So items are only effected if they are non-attended or on a nat-one saving through if attended. Un-attended magic items get a save, non-magical items do not.

A PC rolling a one inside a fireball is likely to have armor, cloak, clothing, or a bag go up in smoke.

A PC being hit by a firestream and rolling a one has a good chance of taking it full in the chest or back.

Again - in the case of bronze armor getting slagged (steel will most likely just shatter or something) would the PC need to worry about molten metal?


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber

I'd like to note... that I sometimes get confused between the changes of the rules editions. Fireball has gone through several changes. At one point it could not ignite stuff at all. :)

Dark Archive

For the items taking damage on a 1 on a saving throw, they have the text and chart on the order to work through here:

Items Surviving after a saving throw

Order most likely to be affected:

Order* Item
1st Shield
2nd Armor
3rd Magic helmet, hat, or headband
4th Item in hand (including weapon, wand, or the like)
5th Magic cloak
6th Stowed or sheathed weapon
7th Magic bracers
8th Magic clothing
9th Magic jewelry (including rings)
10th Anything else

Here is the text for the rules:

Quote:

Items Surviving after a Saving Throw: Unless the descriptive text for the spell specifies otherwise, all items carried or worn by a creature are assumed to survive a magical attack. If a creature rolls a natural 1 on its saving throw against the effect, however, an exposed item is harmed (if the attack can harm objects). Refer to Table: Items Affected by Magical Attacks: Items Affected by Magical Attacks. Determine which four objects carried or worn by the creature are most likely to be affected and roll randomly among them. The randomly determined item must make a saving throw against the attack form and take whatever damage the attack dealt.

If the selected item is not carried or worn and is not magical, it does not get a saving throw. It simply is dealt the appropriate damage.


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber
Happler wrote:

For the items taking damage on a 1 on a saving throw, they have the text and chart on the order to work through here:

Items Surviving after a saving throw

Order most likely to be affected:

Order* Item
1st Shield
2nd Armor
3rd Magic helmet, hat, or headband
4th Item in hand (including weapon, wand, or the like)
5th Magic cloak
6th Stowed or sheathed weapon
7th Magic bracers
8th Magic clothing
9th Magic jewelry (including rings)
10th Anything else

Here is the text for the rules:

Quote:

Items Surviving after a Saving Throw: Unless the descriptive text for the spell specifies otherwise, all items carried or worn by a creature are assumed to survive a magical attack. If a creature rolls a natural 1 on its saving throw against the effect, however, an exposed item is harmed (if the attack can harm objects). Refer to Table: Items Affected by Magical Attacks: Items Affected by Magical Attacks. Determine which four objects carried or worn by the creature are most likely to be affected and roll randomly among them. The randomly determined item must make a saving throw against the attack form and take whatever damage the attack dealt.

If the selected item is not carried or worn and is not magical, it does not get a saving throw. It simply is dealt the appropriate damage.

I've bolded the bit I think is relevant here. I was thinking in order of layers and forgot about held items.

I'd actually think that a cloak would be one of the items at the top of the list as it is an outer garment that goes over everything else. Next would be armor as it goes over clothing. I can see how a shield would go first though as you'd be holding it up to defend yourself. A weapon or held items would be in the top four as well I guess for the same reason.

Anywho... thanks for this. :)


Time for spell research to whip up a mass heat metal spell :-)


Pathfinder PF Special Edition Subscriber

Now back to the main question. In the event of having your armor or other worn metal equipment slagged, should a PC need worry about being covered in molten metal? Do they need to remove the armor or suffer continual damage?

In the case of a clothing item failing a save, I'd say it'd be on fire. Would this also occur in the case of "soft" metal items?

Shadow Lodge

Since the spell specifically calls out bronze I would rule that it damages there armor (ignoring hardness) or the armor gets a save if magical (like shatter). If the armor is destroyed then have it melt and drip off them. MAYBE doing at most an extra d6 of damage. The spell is already powerful. don't make it OP with extra effects.


While not something expressly in the rules, in my home game if a player ended up covered in molten metal at the very least I'd have it affect them like a Heat Metal spell.

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