[Fire Mountain Games] Throne of Night


Product Discussion

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Grand Lodge

While writing the module that I'm currently working on, I came across a monster that I hadn't realized was in the Tome of Horrors from Frog God Games. I don't know if it would work for anyone, but I'd change up the monster a bit, and make it fit a little better for this campaign. Not that it's current CR is lower than anything that would be in the third or higher books, but it's the elder arcane version (sorcerer 7) that they discuss that'd truly be the terror, theoretically, but it's still yet another encounter the PCs could have to deal with while searching for their ancestral home and having to protect it.

So, what will likely be my final contribution to you guys, I present the drowblood arach.

Grand Lodge

While this project is considered dead now (14+ months of no communication dictates that it's considered dead by most publishers, editors, gaming companies, etc), and there's actual good reason to post anything on this thread, Raging Swan Press released something that could still be relevant to those who might be doing their own thing, or are ever going to have the PCs face off against aboleths.

10 Side Effects of Being Dominated by an Aboleth.

Hope everyone's been doing well. My first three adventures will be released this year. They'll be for Purple Duck Games, Playground Adventures, and Wayward Rogues Publishing. For WRP, it'll be part 6 to a small AP. Gotta start somewhere, and it was good experience to know how APs are supposed to work (ie. how Paizo does them normally).


Starting small is definitely better if you're looking to get into publishing, and I'm looking forward to their release. XD

Grand Lodge

Rednal wrote:
Starting small is definitely better if you're looking to get into publishing, and I'm looking forward to their release. XD

More so the adventure aspect. I've got five under my belt (all linked on my account), but doing adventures is more difficult than you'd think. Everyone buys bestiaries, class and archetype books, magic item and new spell tomes, and even NPC books. Adventures somehow seem harder to sell. Less people want to buy them because they do their own.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

Figured it was worth a shot, but I sent Gary a KS message on the 3rd to see if he'd be willing to at least send out the Way of the Wicked books 1-6 I added on as part of my pledge if I paid extra for the shipping on the Throne of Night books when they were ready. No response as of yet....

Grand Lodge

davrion wrote:
Figured it was worth a shot, but I sent Gary a KS message on the 3rd to see if he'd be willing to at least send out the Way of the Wicked books 1-6 I added on as part of my pledge if I paid extra for the shipping on the Throne of Night books when they were ready. No response as of yet....

Definitely wish you luck on that.


kevin_video wrote:
davrion wrote:
Figured it was worth a shot, but I sent Gary a KS message on the 3rd to see if he'd be willing to at least send out the Way of the Wicked books 1-6 I added on as part of my pledge if I paid extra for the shipping on the Throne of Night books when they were ready. No response as of yet....
Definitely wish you luck on that.

And you´ll need all the luck you can get. In fact, should you get an answer at all I´d advise you to go straight onward and buy into some lottery. Chances are you´ll win.

As far as yer adventures go Derek, looking forward to them.

Grand Lodge

Lord_Hyperion wrote:
As far as yer adventures go Derek, looking forward to them.

Much appreciated. The hard part is waiting for the release dates to appear so I can tell people about them. "2017" is the best I've got so far.

Grand Lodge

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While I should leave this thread alone, Necromancers of the Northwest released a new magic battleaxe that's perfect for all underground scenarios. I just had to share it.

Grand Lodge

2 people marked this as a favorite.
Lord_Hyperion wrote:
kevin_video wrote:
davrion wrote:
Figured it was worth a shot, but I sent Gary a KS message on the 3rd to see if he'd be willing to at least send out the Way of the Wicked books 1-6 I added on as part of my pledge if I paid extra for the shipping on the Throne of Night books when they were ready. No response as of yet....
Definitely wish you luck on that.

And you´ll need all the luck you can get. In fact, should you get an answer at all I´d advise you to go straight onward and buy into some lottery. Chances are you´ll win.

As far as yer adventures go Derek, looking forward to them.

Well, not sure on the timeline for the lone adventure that I sent in, but the book for Part 6 to an adventure path was released today. Does this mean I'm cool now? XD For those of you whom receive the weekly newsletter from Paizo, it's on there too. If I'm super lucky it'll make the Top 10 list someday.


Something like that I guess.....

Congrats in any case. The AP does sound interesting. Might get me the whole bunch. I wonder though....is there already any Guide for the Campaign world? Know anything? Their side seems to say so but I can´t find it anywhere...


@Lord Hyperion: Griffonport and Brightona re two free/PWYW-towns; The PG for the AP is free/PWYW as well. Other than that, the information is so far spread over the Cultures of Celmae and Cults of Celmae-series.

Grand Lodge

Lord_Hyperion wrote:

Something like that I guess.....

Congrats in any case. The AP does sound interesting. Might get me the whole bunch. I wonder though....is there already any Guide for the Campaign world? Know anything? Their side seems to say so but I can´t find it anywhere...

Town of Brighton

Griffonport

Player's Guide

The adventure path goes from levels 1-7.

Grand Lodge

As much as I'd like to get on the newsletter Top 10, the specific DriveThru sales actually pay me, so I'll promote that more.


I did buy it. Can't say if its good though, since I'll be a player in this one, but my GM likes it.

Grand Lodge

Oliver Volland wrote:
I did buy it. Can't say if its good though, since I'll be a player in this one, but my GM likes it.

That's great. Definitely appreciate it. I hope you enjoy playing through the adventure.


Well done on getting adventure released. Doing a KS is a good way to get an adventure out there, being your own 3PP!

Grand Lodge

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thenovalord wrote:
Well done on getting adventure released. Doing a KS is a good way to get an adventure out there, being your own 3PP!

I definitely agree with that. Unfortunately, KS isn't doing as well lately for some 3PP stuff. I'm noticing it's about 50/50 for Pathfinder related things, and only for those with a big name behind them. I've tried to be supportive, but I usually get my money returned. It seems people are holding out for the Starfinder releases. Even my publishers are doing Patreons to try alleviate costs as KS failed them on occasion, and even then it's their non-Pathfinder material that they see being supported. It's one of those things where you're not sure what to do because the timing of everything doesn't appear to be in your favour.


The first thing I published was a 4 part AP for a 3pp
I then ran a KS for an adventure and was a lot happier route for me. Have since run either KS or just published as my own 3pp. It all feels better personally and financially

Grand Lodge

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Saw this, and absolutely had to share. If someone runs this AP with dwarves, it is mandatory that the GM give this feat as a bonus feat at 1st level. The source? AEG - Feats under the Appendix for Joke Feats. Other feats such as "Keebler" (can only be taken by an elf, and it gives the +4 to Craft [baker] and Profession [cook] to bake sweet, delicious treats), Garden Gnome, Logic Hound (disbelieve that gnomes and halflings actually exist, with a penalty if the character is drunk), and Spell Turning (always spell the word "turning" correctly, but requires Int 13).

SEVEN DWARVES [GENERAL]
Prerequisite: Dwarf.
Benefit: You gain a cumulative +1 racial bonus to all Perform (ode) checks for every dwarf ally within 60 ft.

I love it.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber

This Kickstarter from AAW Games (Underworld Races & Classes -- 5th Edition & Pathfinder RPG) may be useful to running those parts of this adventure that have been released.

Grand Lodge

I might as well add the new underground dragon created by Necromancers of the Northwest.

Grand Lodge

Hey, guys. Received some "asks" today on my Tumblr blog regarding this AP. One was anonymous so I was able to respond to it publicly, but the other one the person I was asked to answer privately. Looks like the person made an account just to ask the question, as there's nothing on the account, but that doesn't always mean anything.

Anyhow, just in case the anonymous person doesn't see the response, I'll answer it here too, and while I won't name the other person, I'll make it clear so no one gets the wrong idea about my position on the Throne of Night AP.

Answers to Questions:
1) Yes, May 7th is the 4-year anniversary of when the project was funded. Yes, I realize that it's supposed to be a 5-year space between projects being funded and when you can take the developer to court, as per the KS terms on their page, however, note that there have been two such cases that were taken to court earlier and won. Why? Because the company wrote down in the timeline that their project would only take until Date X. Gary did the same thing. It's been two years since the original estimation. That's all I was pointing out. It's not like no one here wouldn't have given him the two years if he'd asked for it.

2) No, I have no inside information on Gary's health, the status of the project and if it will ever be completed, nor where in the Underdark Gary has been hiding himself (nor the drow leaders involved). Just Michael's hopes that Gary wouldn't do this to us or himself because of the backlash this would entail. As far as I'm aware the drow have no kidnapped Gary, but rather are harbouring him.

3) No, I'm not on the project. Michael Clarke did what he could to get me on the team, but I was turned down. The reasons are his own, but Michael said Gary mentioned that all of the stats were done and it was just the story that needed to be written. And no, I haven't heard of any of the other 3PP taking on the project. I've heard a rumour from one publisher that two companies tried to buy the project off of Gary and finish it themselves, but either they were unable to contact Gary or he didn't want someone else to finish his work. There's also the possibility that it's just a rumour, which is far more likely as the publishers I've discussed this with wouldn't want to touch this AP with a 20-foot pole. Instead, they're looking to do their own or already have, and are promoting that as an alternative.

4) Yes and no, I'm (not) still hopeful. Let's go for middle ground and say I'm indifferent. We've had three Darklands books come out by Paizo, including the newest one that has a drow cavalier archetype that mimics the 3pp one I used to design the spider riders. Maybe he finally has the material he needs, or maybe it doesn't matter any more. All I know is it's been nearly two years since the last update. I won't stand in the way of anyone doing what they feel is their right. Especially those who can invoke their American rights. The rest of us will watch from our own individual countries.

5) Yes, I'm still trying to get my one-shot published. For those unaware, I wrote a one-shot last year for our local convention's Pathfinder tournament. It had to be split into three individual scenarios. Unfortunately, I'm having trouble finding someone to publish it. With Starfinder coming out soon the guys I usually go through are backing off on Pathfinder content, some of them entirely, and either waiting it out until September or doing completely separate gaming systems (ie. D&D5e, DCC, or Traveller). Right now I'm just doing odd freelance work.

6) Yes, my health is balancing out. Unfortunately, I was taken off disability funding and now have to fend for myself. I guess too many people have abused the system over the decades so their screening process is much harsher this year. During my annual review it was deemed I was "healthy" enough (ie. my body hadn't degraded farther and I had the ability to use my arms again) to either live off my meager savings or go back to work and pay for own physio and treatments. Yeah, we'll see how that goes. It is what it is. I'm surviving so far. I'm doing better than some people I know who are in worse condition than I am (one friend had just finished his cancer treatments when he got laid off). It can always be worse.

But that's all I know at this time. I always welcome questions. Sorry if the answers weren't what you were hoping for.

RPG Superstar 2015 Top 16

Thanks for the overview kevin_video. Good to know. (And sorry to hear about your health issue).

On another (somewhat related) note:
The Kickstarter for "underworld Races & Classes for 5th edition and Pathfinder RPG" was successful ($50k of $1k goal).
So there will soon be lots of new racial, class, domain, equipment, and monster options.

Grand Lodge

Banesfinger wrote:

The Kickstarter for "underworld Races & Classes for 5th edition and Pathfinder RPG" was successful ($50k of $1k goal).

So there will soon be lots of new racial, class, domain, equipment, and monster options.

I saw that. Quite the impressive feat. Lots of add-ons, extras, and goals achieved thanks to that. They're going to be busy for quite a while.

Grand Lodge

And another anniversary has passed. Not sure what I expected.


its all being released tomorrow, bet on it

Grand Lodge

CWheezy wrote:
its all being released tomorrow, bet on it

Wouldn't that be my luck. Leave town and my computer, and everything be available to everyone but me until I return home again.


CWheezy wrote:
its all being released tomorrow, bet on it

*explodes*


CWheezy wrote:
its all being released tomorrow, bet on it

This 'tomorrow' takes some time, doesn't it? :-(

Grand Lodge

Oliver Volland wrote:
CWheezy wrote:
its all being released tomorrow, bet on it
This 'tomorrow' takes some time, doesn't it? :-(

Sadly, yeah. Maybe we're in the wrong multiverse or someone messed with time.


1 person marked this as a favorite.

Last night I dreamed book 3 came out. Took me awhile after I woke up to realize that it hadn't actually happened.

It's tough for me to let go of this AP. I've been re-examining the Fungal Forest to find out why - the thing I find, well, perfect is the thing where he made entire communities into Factions, and scaled NPC reactions up into a reaction from the entire Xan species and Skis'raal species. I absolutely love that, and would like to apply it to whatever other communities PCs come across, no matter the setting.

Has this species-in-a-location community-as-faction concept been explored in any other rpg product that you guys know of?

Grand Lodge

Guang wrote:

Last night I dreamed book 3 came out. Took me awhile after I woke up to realize that it hadn't actually happened.

It's tough for me to let go of this AP. I've been re-examining the Fungal Forest to find out why - the thing I find, well, perfect is the thing where he made entire communities into Factions, and scaled NPC reactions up into a reaction from the entire Xan species and Skis'raal species. I absolutely love that, and would like to apply it to whatever other communities PCs come across, no matter the setting.

Has this species-in-a-location community-as-faction concept been explored in any other rpg product that you guys know of?

Not sure about species, but the community-as-faction and evolving as you evolve was in Shackled City. At least, the hardcover reprint has it. Don't know about the original Dungeon Magazines. The hardcover had to be rewritten for the 3.5 system (originally done in 3.0 and then changed to 3.5 part way through) and they had to add in an extra module for the characters to not need a sudden level bump to continue.

And maybe come May we'll see that Book 3 come out. Gary has until then to make good on his end of the bargain before people are allowed to go headhunting.

Not going to lie, I can't get over the AP either. Still constantly check my KS app for updates or seeing if people have commented.


kevin_video wrote:
Guang wrote:

Last night I dreamed book 3 came out. Took me awhile after I woke up to realize that it hadn't actually happened.

It's tough for me to let go of this AP. I've been re-examining the Fungal Forest to find out why - the thing I find, well, perfect is the thing where he made entire communities into Factions, and scaled NPC reactions up into a reaction from the entire Xan species and Skis'raal species. I absolutely love that, and would like to apply it to whatever other communities PCs come across, no matter the setting.

Has this species-in-a-location community-as-faction concept been explored in any other rpg product that you guys know of?

Not sure about species, but the community-as-faction and evolving as you evolve was in Shackled City. At least, the hardcover reprint has it. Don't know about the original Dungeon Magazines. The hardcover had to be rewritten for the 3.5 system (originally done in 3.0 and then changed to 3.5 part way through) and they had to add in an extra module for the characters to not need a sudden level bump to continue.

And maybe come May we'll see that Book 3 come out. Gary has until then to make good on his end of the bargain before people are allowed to go headhunting.

Not going to lie, I can't get over the AP either. Still constantly check my KS app for updates or seeing if people have commented.

I've looked through Shackled City two or three times, and always gotten lost and confused. It sounds like you're talking more about the home base leveling up as you level, rather than a Faction Score that you have to earn points and avoid losing points with the various communities. Is that what you mean, or something else?

Another related thing I absolutely loved was the tease about how the PCs would be able to influence important NPCs (and by extension, entire communities)to become more and more Good or more and more Evil - I love how dynamic that makes a setting. Everything hinges on the actions and examples of the PCs, everything is dynamic, not just changeable, but shapeable, whether on purpose or inadvertently.

Finding a good dwarven city map with dozens of locations was yet another thing I just haven't seen elsewhere.

I really hope you're right about May. There was so much potential in that overview of the AP.

Scarab Sages

Guang wrote:
kevin_video wrote:
Guang wrote:

Last night I dreamed book 3 came out. Took me awhile after I woke up to realize that it hadn't actually happened.

It's tough for me to let go of this AP. I've been re-examining the Fungal Forest to find out why - the thing I find, well, perfect is the thing where he made entire communities into Factions, and scaled NPC reactions up into a reaction from the entire Xan species and Skis'raal species. I absolutely love that, and would like to apply it to whatever other communities PCs come across, no matter the setting.

Has this species-in-a-location community-as-faction concept been explored in any other rpg product that you guys know of?

Not sure about species, but the community-as-faction and evolving as you evolve was in Shackled City. At least, the hardcover reprint has it. Don't know about the original Dungeon Magazines. The hardcover had to be rewritten for the 3.5 system (originally done in 3.0 and then changed to 3.5 part way through) and they had to add in an extra module for the characters to not need a sudden level bump to continue.

And maybe come May we'll see that Book 3 come out. Gary has until then to make good on his end of the bargain before people are allowed to go headhunting.

Not going to lie, I can't get over the AP either. Still constantly check my KS app for updates or seeing if people have commented.

I've looked through Shackled City two or three times, and always gotten lost and confused. It sounds like you're talking more about the home base leveling up as you level, rather than a Faction Score that you have to earn points and avoid losing points with the various communities. Is that what you mean, or something else?

Another related thing I absolutely loved was the tease about how the PCs would be able to influence important NPCs (and by extension, entire communities)to become more and more Good or more and more Evil - I love how dynamic that makes a setting. Everything hinges on the actions and examples of the...

Check out AAW's Rise of the Drow AP. It's less AP than enormous world book set in the Underdark (or Darklands, whatever). And it has an enormous hugely populated Dwarven city with a lot of interesting culture and detail.

Grand Lodge

Guang wrote:

I've looked through Shackled City two or three times, and always gotten lost and confused. It sounds like you're talking more about the home base leveling up as you level, rather than a Faction Score that you have to earn points and avoid losing points with the various communities. Is that what you mean, or something else?

Another related thing I absolutely loved was the tease about how the PCs would be able to influence important NPCs (and by extension, entire communities)to become more and more Good or more and more Evil - I love how dynamic that makes a setting. Everything hinges on the actions and examples of the PCs, everything is dynamic, not just changeable, but shapeable, whether on purpose or inadvertently.

Finding a good dwarven city map with dozens of locations was yet another thing I just haven't seen elsewhere.

I really hope you're right about May. There was so much potential in that overview of the AP.

Honestly, it's been 10 years since I've been through that AP. I really couldn't say. I just remember the shopkeep getting better stuff and giving better deals, NPCs that you regularly conversed with getting stronger overall, and gaining team ups.

The idea of Throne of Night was inspired by the Paizo AP, Kingmaker, so it's probably something to sift through as well.


AAW is going to be kickstarting a new, revised Rise of the Drow.

Mayhap we can get the good/best parts of this AP into that? :) Altered as necessary, of course.

Grand Lodge

Monkeygod wrote:

AAW is going to be kickstarting a new, revised Rise of the Drow.

Mayhap we can get the good/best parts of this AP into that? :) Altered as necessary, of course.

Again? First they did a 3-Part that took place in the higher levels. Then they did a KS to make it level 1-15+ and one solid story with character add-ons. Now they’re revising it? Seems a bit excessive.

If they could put in ToN too, I wouldn’t argue.

Scarab Sages

Pathfinder Battles Case Subscriber
kevin_video wrote:
Monkeygod wrote:

AAW is going to be kickstarting a new, revised Rise of the Drow.

Mayhap we can get the good/best parts of this AP into that? :) Altered as necessary, of course.

Again? First they did a 3-Part that took place in the higher levels. Then they did a KS to make it level 1-15+ and one solid story with character add-ons. Now they’re revising it? Seems a bit excessive.

If they could put in ToN too, I wouldn’t argue.

Wondering if the revised RotD will be for 5e, which would make more sense that re-doing the book again for PF

Grand Lodge

davrion wrote:
Wondering if the revised RotD will be for 5e, which would make more sense that re-doing the book again for PF

That would make sense. I hadn’t thought of that, AaW has been going pretty hard core for 5e lately.


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Pretty sad how McBride was praised so much for Way of the Wicked and how it became probably the best 3rd party campaign ever, only for him to throw away all the goodwill and popularity he had because he decided to stop talking to his backers. Also, I find it really inspiring and a bit sad that kevin_video is doing more than McBride ever did to keep the WoTW/ToN community alive.

Grand Lodge

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Axial wrote:
Pretty sad how McBride was praised so much for Way of the Wicked and how it became probably the best 3rd party campaign ever, only for him to throw away all the goodwill and popularity he had because he decided to stop talking to his backers. Also, I find it really inspiring and a bit sad that kevin_video is doing more than McBride ever did to keep the WoTW/ToN community alive.

I did what I could, and would have continued, but there’s been such a bad taste left in everyone’s mouth with ToN’s delays that people eventually asked me to stop, or let me know they weren’t interested in what I was putting out anymore. There were a few people who asked me to continue for their sake so they could finish, but that’s about as far as it got. Most exchanges were done privately after that, and even those eventually fell to the wayside because the players weren’t as invested, and all the games just stopped. Most abandoned Pathfinder altogether and went to 5e.

The fact that Gary backs 1-5 projects a week on KS isn’t helping issues. I know I’m stunned each time I see the announcements regarding that. I should turn it off, but it’s an appropriate reminder that no one is infallible.

I think I’ll always feel a little hurt at the fact that Gary didn’t let me in on the project, despite asking twice (email and snail mail) and Michael asking on my behalf.

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

*offers hugs*

Grand Lodge

4 people marked this as a favorite.
Rysky wrote:
*offers hugs*

I always accept hugs. I love hugs. Makes me feel like I'm worth a damn/moderately loved.


2 people marked this as a favorite.

I'm pretty sure anyone following this thread greatly loves you and the work you've done. XD

Silver Crusade

Pathfinder Adventure, Adventure Path, Companion, Lost Omens, Rulebook, Starfinder Adventure Path, Starfinder Roleplaying Game Subscriber

Seconded.

*hugs kevin*


Thirded. Thanks for what you did here, Kevin.

Grand Lodge

Honestly I still want to play Way of the Wicked, and I have not yet had the opportunity to do so. Hopefully what has happened involving the Throne of Night kickstarter don't means I never will.

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

Jonathon Wilder wrote:
Honestly I still want to play Way of the Wicked, and I have not yet had the opportunity to do so. Hopefully what has happened involving the Throne of Night kickstarter don't means I never will.

Why would it? WotW is fully released.


I may be wrong here - I didn't back this project - but I remember hearing something about Way of the Wicked being offered to some backers (as an add-on?) of ToN, and those people not getting that even though it was already done and could easily be distributed.

For those who aren't involved with that, Way of the Wicked is fully available here on places like Paizo.com if you decide you'd like to support Fire Mountain Games.

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